Craft of War - Illidan Stormrage

[lekxman22]

if this is cinematic camping why u posted it on campings???

 

[Pravda]

if this is cinematic camping why u posted it on campings???

It is not a single map so I thought it should go in campaigns. If it doesn't belong there I will remove that tag.

 

[deepstrasz]

It is not a single map so I thought it should go in campaigns. If it doesn't belong there I will remove that tag.

If it's a .w3n file then it's a campaign.

However, if this is not finished, you should put it in the Map Development forum until you finish the project.

 

[Pravda]

If it's a .w3n file then it's a campaign.

However, if this is not finished, you should put it in the Map Development forum until you finish the project.

It is complete in a way that it has all maps finished (except voice acting). I thought that I could update campaign to version 2 once everything is there. If it should be in Map Development staff will move it? (or is it my job?)

 

[deepstrasz]

It is complete in a way that it has all maps finished (except voice acting). I thought that I could update campaign to version 2 once everything is there. If it should be in Map Development staff will move it? (or is it my job?)

Wasn't really sure what you meant by not finished so I had to ask. If you say, the maps/story is complete, then it doesn't have to be moved anywhere. If there are more maps to be added to this, then yes, it should be moved there (open a thread yourself).

 

[Gottfried]

This is a cinematic campaign.

I will see your cinematics. I am curious about what you do.

 

[deepstrasz]

Everything happens so fast with little to no other explanation than what can be seen. Because of this, dialogues have to suffer; they're spontaneous and without emotion. Some of them don't even make sense as the characters ask questions as if they didn't know something but then immediately reply as if they actually did...
The plot is just confusing. It's totally random. Just meeting dudes on the way and then introducing them as being powerful warriors
Some scenes/maps last mere seconds... (and you just don't follow random dudes through the forest and through a portal)
What does Felwood have to do with Outland!?
I thought maybe at least somebody would get hurt (not to mention die) from the "good" guys when facing the demon boss but no... it's just like a lousy cartoon.
Banish shouldn't have stopped Illidan from trying to get the power of the orb (you know, it just deactivates normal attack).
Lul wut!? Vashj is in love with Illidan?
Illidan the schizophrenic.
Maiev finally got him? Didn't she tell Tyrande she'll be on her track!?
He didn't exactly have to fight through undead as the elves were already engaging them on Illidan's side. Where was Furion?

3/5 for longevity. There are some nice ideas there but overall it's really not good.

 

[Pravda]

Your point is good. And I realised how confusing it is when I reached half of the campaign, but it was too late to go back. I actually wanted to make series of campaigns following some of major characters through Craft of War. In the end you would get the whole picture. Every campaign would be like a puzzle piece. You are right maybe I should have done it like I thought in first place. And it is following major events in the story, not characters (I could do character based campaigns after that, but I guess I made a mistake...).

About that thing with portal. Illidan was punished for opening portals from which undead came. When he met Tenebris on his way to Sunken Ruins, Tenebris told him who is in command of those undead. Illidan was power-hungry madman, so he saw Antitheus as source of power. Part because he could take his power and part because he wanted to show to Tyrande how strong he is, he wanted to find him so badly. When he saw that demon, he knew it wasn't night elf, orc or human and if it isn't any of these it could be something to do with undead and ultimately Antitheus. It was meant to make you think exactly how you thought: "who the hell follows someone through a portal". But Illidan was blinded by his needs and he wouldn't stand back from anything (he thought of himself as most powerful being in universe).

Felwood and Outland thing. Outland is separate world just like Agerdor is (Agerdor - world in which are most main events set, something like Azeroth). Portal was leading from one world to another. Felwood is a region in Agerdor. I hope I made it understandable.

Demon boss - I understand your disappointment about no one died. All of those characters fighting him were important so they couldn't die, had to keep em alive. I could place some units (not heroes) so you could see that demon boss proves that he is a boss and that he actually kills someone. But I thought that more units would make more mess to the fighting scene and make it not look good.

I know what banish and shadow strike do in original warcraft game, but for the sake of cinematic and story had to give it that little stun effect.

In my story Vashj was actually in love with Illidan when they were kids but she still had that feeling deep in side her when they met on Sunken Ruins (it is one of the reasons she accepted him as her commander).

Illidan stayed pretty much what he was in original story power-hungry madman (yep maybe I made him more mad than he actually is in original warcraft story).

Maiev told that she will hunt both of them. Illidan because it was her duty and Tyrande because she freed Illidan (Maiev was also in love with Illidan. Yes I know - Illidan the Don Juan). You got that impression that she is only talking to Tyrande because of the their position in cinematic but she was actually talking to both of them.

I am not sure I understand you about that last thing, but it was meant to be like undead got night elves pinned down so Illidan helped them survive. Tyrande used this so she could reach demon lord and kill him. Then he fought his way toward her. And with his help tables turned and night elves were then stronger than undead. You can see Furion trapped inside the prison at the end of final chapter. Yes I understand that it is totally unexplained how he got there but that is because campaign followed character not overall story.

Again I am sorry this is confusing. As a standalone campaign it needs a wall of text with it so you can get the whole picture. I will repeat that I made a mistake, not making campaign that follows major events at first, and then do character based campaigns.

Oh, and thanks for reply.

 

[deepstrasz]

About that thing with portal. Illidan was punished for opening portals from which undead came. When he met Tenebris on his way to Sunken Ruins, Tenebris told him who is in command of those undead. Illidan was power-hungry madman, so he saw Antitheus as source of power.

Well, see, proper explanations are needed. Mind reading helps only when things are intuitive not when we can't know what you/the characters were actually thinking. Moreover, that demon just suddenly got into the story. Why was he powerful, how did Illidan know him? (well, OK, maybe War of the Ancients or something, I dunno but still, very ambiguous).

But Illidan was blinded by his needs and he wouldn't stand back from anything (he thought of himself as most powerful being in universe).

Well, we can see his thirst for power but it isn't obvious that he is quite the junkie you want us to think he is.

In my story Vashj was actually in love with Illidan when they were kids but she still had that feeling deep in side her when they met on Sunken Ruins (it is one of the reasons she accepted him as her commander).

Funny thing is she could steel feel love for him although now mostly a fish.

Illidan stayed pretty much what he was in original story power-hungry madman (yep maybe I made him more mad than he actually is in original warcraft story).

You made him very unpredictable and not only that but if I were Kael or somebody supposedly following him, I would be asking a lot of questions: orbs? What orbs? Where did that come in from all of a sudden? It feels as if his assistants kind of read his mind on his actions.

You got that impression that she is only talking to Tyrande because of the their position in cinematic but she was actually talking to both of them.

Blame English for the yous. Well, we didn't see any Maiev vs Tyrande action Wasn't the warden nearer to Tyrande in terms of location?

And what also bugged me was the fact that Illidan did not know what the blood elves were but knew they were addicted to magic (well, he assumed that because belves come from the highborne). I understand for those who know the lore it is OK, but for a character assuming something like that without some evidence is weird. I mean, they even changed their skin, hair and eye colour. How does Illidan know they did not find a way to cure their magic addiction?

 

[Gottfried]

I also finished the campaign, but deepstrasz already told everything, which needed.
However I also say some information:
- The title is catchy! I needed to watch tons of series, read a lot of books... now I have the skill to give title to my work.
Why Orcs and Humans attacked the Night Elf lands instead of demonic beings? (This is a weird thing)
And what's up with Gul'dan? (the mere player can ask it) He surely not 10000 years old.
Though it is little things, I felt it was worth to mention.
Let's see some larger:
Certain maps only lasts 10 seconds... this is lack of creativity. I mean if you create a huge map, you can even make three big cinematic part in one map. One map had a lot of space.
It is a positive thing to see Maiev in the Barrow Den Prison, in the original only Califax are there. I always thought, that Maiev only was a later idea.
When the "heroes" met Gul'dan and threaten him, that have a sick feeling of 80's action movies (like Beverly Hill Cop, or that mama shoot thing). Very unusual and cheap.
The fight with the Magtheridon replacement demon seems pointless.
The 12th map has some weak dialogue lines... :/ However the usage of the word of whore was good. I mean there are some stories, but all of them copied warcraft dialogue line or written in 21th century civilian style? The words have no weights in some campaign.
Although the plot was average, the last line was strong (by storyteller means):

Hahahaha. Fool! Even now when you are dying she is leaving you to see Malfurion! She broke your heart again... I almost feel sorry for you...

It is both sour and downer, give it a kafkasque ending to the whole story.
Just because of the ending (because you are not hopeless) I give you 4/5

 

[Pravda]

To deepstrasz:
As I already said I messed up because I created the character campaign instead of events based one. There is where all confusion comes. I can write about background of demon and where all his power comes from but it is a bit longer text (if you are willing to read I will gladly write it).
They say love has no bounds, I guess Vashj's love was stronger than what Illidan made her into.
About that Kael thing. Like the background story with demon I can write about orbs and so, if you are willing to read it of course.
Yes it is confusing thing with "you", in English . No Maiev vs Tyrande action because story focuses only on Illidan (if I ever do Tyrande or Maiev based campaign that will surely be there). Yes she was closer to Tyrande that's what I meant when I mentioned their position in cinematic. (she meant "you" in plural)
Tenebris (his silent companion) told Illidan about everything that happened while he was in prison. I maybe should have done a map in which two of them meet each other. When Illidan asked about who is that elf with Vashj, he actually knew who they were (because Tenebris told him). His question was more of "breaking through ice", because he wanted to get information on location of orb of blood.

To Gottfried:
Before demons came to Agerdor there were only orcs, humans and night elves. Well of Eternity also had a role of protecting Agerdor from other worlds. By consuming it Illidan destroyed that shield and that's how demons came to Agerdor. Orcs and humans attacked night elves because their leaders wanted power of the well.
When Illidan consumed the well those who were near it were also affected, not nearly as much as Illidan was though. It stopped Gul'dan and Medivh from aging, as they were most intelligent there, along with Malfurion. The well affects each individual differently, well, almost every (Gul'dan and Medivh got same power). That is how Gul'dan survived for so long.
That map with Illidan chasing demon through a portal is short. I thought about it when I made it, but if I merged it with next map I couldn't put all tiles I did. (I'm not using Ultimate world editor).
I don't know what to say about that conversation with Gul'dan thing, but your point is good.
English in not my native language so I am not quite sure about what you meant with using the word whore. Did you really mean it was good or was it sarcasm?

Again, thanks for replying and feel free to ask anything that you don't understand, I will gladly answer everything.

P.S. Next time I'll do major event campaign so story wouldn't be this confusing. I actually don't know why I did it this way, guess it was supposed to be a test...

 

[deepstrasz]

P.S. Next time I'll do major event campaign so story wouldn't be this confusing. I actually don't know why I did it this way, guess it was supposed to be a test...

You can always update. Plus you could use some text on (black) screen at the start and end of maps to clarify some things like that with the well affecting those other two and stuff.

 

[Gottfried]

Agerdor

Wow! You changed the name of Azeroth! Bold move I admit.

When Illidan consumed the well those who were near it were also affected, not nearly as much as Illidan was though. It stopped Gul'dan and Medivh from aging, as they were most intelligent there, along with Malfurion.

It is alright... though it is the most weird fanfiction of the Warcraft, which I ever saw. (It could be only weirder, if all Azeroth controlled by spiders and the spiders used the gremlins and gnomes as worker class to run fly and insect farms in order to fed the whole spiderland. - This is only an example, not plot advising)

couldn't put all tiles I did. (I'm not using Ultimate world editor).

I also not... however this thing requires a lot of creativity (tile choosing). :O

English in not my native language so I am not quite sure about what you meant with using the word whore. Did you really mean it was good or was it sarcasm?

Do not ask it... but it is really exceptional (and good).

guess it was supposed to be a test...

Just use the WE, you will be advancing.

 

[Pravda]

When I was creating the story I thought how fascinating it was that Medivh was like some being that always looked at you from somewhere. I guess I got that from warcraft 3 region of chaos tutorial. And I always thought that he is hundreds of years old (I don't know much of warcraft lore, very little actually). So I made him a being thousands of years old. And as balance I thought it would be good to do the same with Gul'dan. So Medivh, Gul'dan and Malfurion are like a representatives of their races (as most powerful mages). If you compare it to original story it is deffinatly weird, but I made it in my own way (guess it is because I don't know almost anything about warcraft lore outside of warcarft 3). In conclusion, maybe it is best if you could look at this story separately from original.

 

[Rufus]

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