Concept struggle..

[TheGoldenGoblin]

Hello hive! I have been thinking about an idea for quite some time now, but I don't know how I would make the concept ingame. Let me explain. I would like to make a map, alot like "The Scourge of Lordaeron" but with alot of differences. I got inspired by the new movie to make the main thing about the map be Gul'dan and his horde vs The Alliance. But I want the horde clans to be able to chose what the want to do. So that if they want to they can leave Gul'dans horde, or they can choose to have all their warriors drink the blood of mannoroth and gain strenght but also give Gul'dan alot of control over them.

The thing is that I would like it to be so that anyone can take over anything and win the war, so that the players make the story but with all the main characters. The first thing is that I don't know what kind of battlefield this would play out on. I could make the whole Eastern Kingdom and make it so that you take over every region instead of taking over cities. But it would feel better to have a region like lordearon to fight on, but since it's kind of based on the 2nd war it would not make sense battleing only there. But maby that is a bigger concern in my head than it really is.

It would also be nice to have the legion in there, but then it feels like I'm forcing every cool thing into one place.

Maby I should make an alternate universe and a story to why everyone is fighting in "said" region? I would really like to make a map like this where it feels like your decisions means something and that you can actually decide some pretty cool stuff.

I would like some ideas if you guys got some to help me out with my struggle. Or maby it's to much if I wanna follow the movie/ 2nd war theme?

 

[cleavinghammer]

I think staying in Azeroth is enough, you can have some dungeons on the side of the map like the Deadmines, Karahzan or Draenor.

You can have the orc clans being able to change leaders by having the chieftains fight, whoever's in charge can build their best units and gets a percentage of the other clans' income. If the human players decide to attack during that time, the orcs have debuffs since they don't know who's in charge.

The humans start isolated and neutral towards each other and need to be persuaded to form the Alliance (sending troops, giving money, etc.).

If you want the Legion, have Karahzan (starts as neutral hostile) and Draenor as a dungeon. If the humans take the former, they can control the Dark Portal (as a one-way WayGate, switching destinations as needed) and the orcs can take it back. By going to Draenor, the orcs can take Mannoroth's blood (and the humans can fight the Legion if they can get to them).

 

[Chaosy]

The first war takes places in the human kingdoms alone. So having a few of the nearby regions make sense.
The orcs invaded small towns before attacking Stormwind (not included in the movie) so just cities would be invalid.

The legion being there would indeed be false lore wise.

 

[TheGoldenGoblin]

I really like your ideas clevinghammer, but is there a way to make the Legion playable?

Yes I know that having the legion would be lore breaking but sargeras controls Medivh and Gul'dan so I could probably figure something out there. Like sargeras wants the invasion to start earlier or something like that.

 

[cleavinghammer]

There were demons in Medhiv's tower in the first game, when he was just an evil sorcerer. So while you wouldn't have an entire Legion army they could do their behind-the-scenes thing (like a dreadlord near Medhiv to make sure he behaves, either part of the bossfight or teleporting out just before it starts).

Consider having the possibility of negotiations between humans and orcs (movie) or none whatsoever (game).


Other Legion ideas:
* Sending cloaked demons (such as dreadlords) to influence battles. Not win them singlehandedly, but minor actions like casting Sleep on a channeling commander, causing a group of fighters to be Cursed, etc. And they could do this on both factions (if the Frostwolf clan is trying to break away, having them lose a battle or two will force them to work with Blackhand, etc.)
* Archimonde could try to get Medhiv to summon him, making Medhiv a playable character (in which case, his bossfight won't happen, and his player controls where the Dark Portal leads to) with the gimmick that he'll be periodically forced to switch sides as the Legion's control waxes and wanes.
* Northshire Abbey: The Legion tries to destroy the abbey to deny clerics to the humans. The humans can take it back. and build defenses around it.
* You could have the Draenor submap and have Mannoroth appear there. He's only neutral if one clan goes with the blood-drinking, otherwise he's hostile to everything and anyone in the area after a short time.

 

[TheGoldenGoblin]

What do you guys think about starting from when gul'dan wakes up? Then you can make alot of your own decisions and make your own allies. Like try to get the horde to join you and so on since gul'dan had noone after he woke up?

 

[Chaosy]

Sounds interesting in theory.

Obviously not as easy to pull it of and make it enjoyable though.

 

[TheGoldenGoblin]

I agree with you. In theory it would be easy to make a map where you can take over stuff and join alliances and betray eachother and so on. But it will be really hard to make a map that pulls it off unless I got some very good ideas. I feel like it would be really easy to make it feel like nothing is really happening. Like if no one joins you as gul'dan what do you do then? Maby challange an honarable leader and make that clan join you anyway? The idea is fun, but I need more to pull it off so it doesn't feel dead while playing