A New Generation of Maps

[Ratherion]

I have seen nearly everything on battle.net scince it cam out years ago, I was there when the first TD and Hero seiges came out, I've played packman and RKKR, but in my opinion. Map originality is stagnating, There are 3 types of maps on Bnet now, Hero seiges, Hero arenas, and RPG's. I realize there are many others (ex. Marine games, the occasional TD, maybe a game of Civilization Wars) but all in all the majority of the games are becoming less and less dynamic (cept the new RoTG map, that looks wicked). I am looking for anyone who has ideas for a COMPLETELY NEW type of map that they would like to present, after I have gathered the themes and anylized them all, I would like to start a hosted project for the new type of map. Any of the contributers are welcome to take part and all will be given credit. The size of this project will depend on the complexity and depth of the ideas I recive.

Dont get me wrong, I am not trying to steal anyone's ideas, I just want to help Bnet move past it's Hero Obssesion stage (not that the new game cannot be Hero-based just that it should have a different theme). Any and all contributers, no matter your rep or level of skill, are greatly appreciated. I hope many of you will wish to add your ideas, the more the better.

Best of Luck.

 

[UchihaSasuke.gr]

Riverbed

I don't know about a new generation map but if you find an idea i will gladly help you.

All I want to ask you is to give me the riverbed map(if u want)so I could help you.I am a good triggerer.

 

[l33t5up4h4x0r]

I have expressed interest in a hospital map...but it's only an idea and never went to far. Well, the basic idea is people come into the hospital with diff buffs(symptoms) and based on the buffs you will have to diagnose their disease and use the right medicine. There must be a little guide to know which diseases has which symptom and there should be extra symptoms to confuse the player in choosing their medicine. Hero skills would be surgery and stuff and decreases failure chance and casting time per level.

 

[DoOs_101]

Do you want to know what a new generation type of map is?

My map GOLDRUSH!!

Yes the goldrush... its new, I can't categorize it into any current game types (currenty put on sports/mini-game). It is original, interesting concept, but not dynamic yet, but it will be soon

 

[hit]

Hmm ...
A defence with tower and summoned unit, but the creep attack you ?
Or a campaign map same as Warcraft III campaign (1h the map ?) ?

 

[Mini-Me]

There are 3 types of maps on Bnet now, Hero seiges, Hero arenas, and RPG's.

Rly? When was the last time you logged on to bnet?
Have you heard of d-o-t-a? Yeh, pretty popular map, maybe you've heard of it, falls to the category 'aos'. Heard of TD's? Yeh they're pretty popular too.

Anyway, this thread belongs to the warcraft 3 discussion. If you get an actual project out of this then feel free to post at the map development forum (but please read the rules first).

Moved.

 

[hit]

I m agree with you Mini-Me, but i think he was speaking of the last new map (DaTa are very old and TD too)

 

[Kixer]

I like DoOs's Goldrush idea... Its not the MOST origional map but its still a very good concept.
I think its the right direction we should head in, that being a map that takes normal warcraft and twists certian aspect of it into a fun map.

 

[hit]

The same idea of me ^^

 

[Kixer]

So good examples of things to twist are:
-Borrow survivals(there are a few but its a good idea)
-Windwalk mazes, You have to avoid shades ect. And use your wind walks at the right time.
-"Poke" maps like poke the angry ogre
-Unit customizers. Use upgrades and items/attachments to build an army. Like "Pimp my Poen" found on this site.

 

[hit]

Windwalk mazes, You have to avoid shades ect. And use your wind walks at the right time.
-Good idea for my maze
For new type of map :
--A team melee map :
You choose a race, creat unit too defend your city and ally and attack an enmy same as Monolyth by blizzard (+ 1 hero only but good?)
--TD attack
A team make defence and an other team attack after
--Castle defence Attack (one of my idea)
A team defend and an other attack the castle on 36 wawe
--A mini team game
Team vs Team in mini-game ...

 

[Kixer]

I dont get the team melee bit? Isnt that just a normal melee map?

 

[hit]

Only use melee race or new race, but the same mod of melee (build a town and unit)

 

[Kixer]

Oh an altered melee? Der are quite a few of those already...

 

[Dr Super Good]

I have no idea what map your planning of making. . .
So many topics have been made about "TNG" wc3 but none of them come to anything.
Please post what your map will be before making or atleast state you need ideas or something since currently I can not differ this from all the other "The Next Generation" topics made on the board.

If it is very good, people will flock to join it.

 

[brad.dude03]

Uh... guys... let's face the facts here. There is NOT going to be a new generation of maps! It ain't happening. Why? Because Wacraft 3 is already 5 years old as it is, newer and more powerful RTS games have come out, and the ideas that gifted map makers had have gone with them into the next generation games. I don't think it's gunna happen. We just gotta be happy with the creative ideas already out there... because more aren't coming soon...

 

[Kixer]

I see your point brad. But were just brainstorming here... I remember when i was totaly over warcraft! Then along came this mystical thing called... Dota allstars 4.21
And i was hooked as were alot of ppl.
The end of dota is near (i can feel it) and if we're going to keep warcraft alive we need something new to spice it up. Im not saying we're gonna come up with it but its worth a shot!

 

[Ratherion]

Ok guys, when I said "A New Generation" I really meant more like a new type of map that people can build off of and create different versions for, like the first Aos or TD, see what I mean? I'm not expecting this to be huge, but it has the potential to be. I've made a list of all the suggestions so far, and have catagorized similar ideas together, so here is a table of what we have got (see end of post). Maybe we can compile ideas, then put forth several different project propositions and have the Hive community vote on what the think would be the most original and dynamic. (I have not had the opportunity to try out Goldrush, let me dl it and try it out, i'll comment on it after this post)

IDEA TABLE

(I only put the largest and more complex ideas in here, or compiled smaller ideas into larger ones, this map would be easier to plan and advertise if it was a bit more dynamic)

-Assault: Defensive Team vs Offensive Team. If offensive team accomplishes objective (ex. kill the king) then each person on that team gets a point (5 rounds)[same goes for defensive, if you survive, you win that round]. The strongest Hero (or highest ranking) on the winning side swaps with the weakest (or lowest ranking) on the other [for balancing purposes and diversity], then the teams seich roles (so the defending team attacks and the attacking team defends). At the end of the game, the victory can be based on single person accomplishments and Offensive/Defensive accomplishments.

This is a compilation of the attack/defend suggestions

-Altered Melee: Either FFA, Teams, or Co-op compatible. New races(/themes) controlled by players to accomplish a certain goal (ex. kill the king, defend for 30m or kill other players)

-Maze Wars: Team and FFA compatible. A huge maze (not to hard to navigate but with Escape-like challenges along the way) with spawned units attempting to reach the other side/base so they can destroy it/escape. the opposing sides of the maze could be defended by teams with units (like towers on top of the maze walls [to incorperate a TD], heroes holding the main passes [to incorperate a HD], or even custom races that would build defenders/attackers]. (I like this one)

This is a compilation of the maze/TD suggestions

Hope this helps put things into perspective, I will take a look at Goldrush and try it out, may add new catagory to the table if it looks like a good base to launch a project. Things are looking great, I especialy like the Maze Wars and Assault ideas (they are based off of what you guys entered) thanks for all the help so far

Best of luck.

 

[DoOs_101]

Hey Kixer, lol I'm hoping someone would actually categorize Goldrush into a single type of map, lol. Just like AoS...

 

[Kixer]

DoOs
I think it depends on where you go with it from now. Making it more dynamic and adding in new twists will push it in the right direction.
Rath
Some very good ideas
you could even combine the maze with the assult map.
I realy like the assult balancing side of things... You could make im point orintated so you get points for winning a round ect.

 

[hit]

We can creat a topic "Idea" for people having idea but can't creat the map ?
I think that it maybe interesting ... The name of topic will be too good ^^

 

[Rui]

DotA's end is not near, actually, if DotA goes, more than half of Battle.Net will empty, specially if Ubisoft is really going to develop a stand-alone DotA. Why? Have you looked in the DotA forums? Thousands of people online. It's sad that some people even buy TFT just to go play DotA, most of them are over 40 years old. A DotA now and then is ok, but come on, coming to battle.net specifically for playing that map is just ridicolous.

Besides, WoW has also taken a grand part of Warcraft III TFT players. WoW is even worse than DotA, I'm sorry but I don't think wasting so much money every month is worth it. It's a game and its fun, but there are many things you can do with that money.

 

[Kixer]

Well i dont know about your server but on my bnet server DOTA is becoming less and less popular. More people are hosting old maps like Dbz tribute ect. And if we lose half of b.Net we're losing a bunch of dota adicts? But lets try to stay on topic...

 

[DoOs_101]

Rui ur right, even in my private server, a place where people does not even know what a map is... they know what a Dota is... I'm sick of it... ROAR!!

 

[Kixer]

Ok we all hate dota... But it is one of the best maps out at the moment? We cant argue with that!
P.S DoOs is there any chance you could release the next version of Goldrush by tuesday, so i can look at it before i go away?

 

[Blackroot]

Doodad wars!

The object of the game is to launch doodads at say ships, the larger the doodad the heavier the object (slower) but it also does more damage. The object being destroy the most ships after xx time WITHOUT using all the doodads on your side. Really simple to replicate, the mathmatics are easy and the idea is vague ;P.
6v6 map or something.

Grid defense

Defend the onslaught of terrain by clicking on it! So vague it has to be good! . (See jass -> trackables)

Totaly new genres, never been seen before! There's plenty of stuff that's never been done, just look at gem td, it got super popular even though it's just sort of new.
GL!

 

[Kixer]

Hmmm iv never heard of gem Td... U got a link to a download? Or could you attach the map?

 

[Mini-Me]

Gem TD is the best new td out there. Too bad the creator, bryvx, only seems to be familiar with one wc3 site, epicwar, so it is only available there as far as I know.

Gem TD 1.9b

 

[DoOs_101]

Yeah, apparently I'm busy making GEAR, but tommorow I'll manage my time to get Goldrush v1.7b done by Monday.

Thanks

 

[Kixer]

Ok cool looking forwared to it.
Back on topic? I really think that the best idea we've come up with is the attack defence idea... The swapping heros bit adds a brilliant twist and if done well it could turn into a realy sucessful map.

 

[DoOs_101]

Suggestion, if hiveworkshop wanted to revive the popularity of the site, they should start finding maps that have ideas like this and promote them under the name Hiveworkshop. Just a thought...

 

[Mini-Me]

I think the new generation maps in wc3 should not be anything like wc3 . Some maps that when people play it they go "this is not warcraft" but at the same time it is (*sees an opportunity to pitch in his own map*), oh and I've made that kind of map, how funny . You can find it on the resource section: Cannon Commanders 0.99

 

[Ratherion]

Allright, I think I have it, heres the project plan-

Ascendency

(10 players)

Ascendency is a AoS-type map with a massive twist, it is based in a maze, and the teams constantly change objectives and sides. With two bases located on opposite sides of the map, the main section is dominated my a massive maze of traps and neutral enemies. The center of the maze has the most deadly traps, the traps grasulay decrease in fatality the farther away from the center. So while the middle is the shortest route, it is the hardest, and the edges are practicly clear of obstuctions.

While the main fighting is hero-based, you also control a small barracks with which to build several non-combat units (ex. healers, tower builders, and maybe supporting spellcasters [ex.shamen/witch doctors/sorceresses]). The tower builders can be used to construct defensive structures stop parts of the maze, adding a TD-ish element to the defensive side, the assaulting side will have a seige constructor instead of a tower builder, allowing for the making of offensive buildings (ex. trebuchets, ballista turrents, mortar cannons).

The game is round-based, so if the assaulting team manages to accomplish it's objective (ex. kill the king) then then every player on that team is given one point. The same is ture for the defending team, if they hold out for that round, they are given a point. At the end of the round, the strongest player on the winning team trades alliances with the weakest player on the losing team, allowing for a balancing effect and more diversity in objectives. At the start of the next round, the teams change places, so the assaulting team defends, and the defending team attacks. All player units will be destroyed, and all buildings will be restored to full health, all traps reset, as if the game had started anew. The heroes will keep their experience, items, gold and score. After 5 rounds the game comes to and end, and the players are ranked according to the amount of points they have (offensive and defensive sides will also be ranked according to the number of successes on that side.)

This seems like an awsome game, and while it is not COMPLETELY original, there are so many twists and new concepts (like the player swapping). That it almost seems to be a totaly new idea. Great job brainstorming guys. This looks great. (please comment, becuase this is only the groundwork, many things still to be thought up.)

All of you who gave the ideas (specialy Kixer, hit, and DoOs 101) are invited to help me in the actual production if this project get approved. I think we should draw up a final project plan and have Hiveworkshop vote on it. If they support it and maybe lend us some developers/testers, then they would get full advertising-hosting privileges. If you guys know anyone who would be willing to test/develop or host this, please have them contact me.

Best of luck

 

[hit]

I m agree with that project, i can help you

 

[Kixer]

Wow i brilliant combination of all the well known maps with its own twist .
Id be glad to be apart of this project. My best aspects of map making are :Triggering, spell/system making, hero/item ideas and creativity.
Contact me at [email protected] or pm me.

 

[Ratherion]

@Kixer+hit- I sent you guys e-mails to confirm your official acceptance into Project Ascendancy! Thanks for all your support, i'm drawing up a project plan and checklist right now, so any more ideas/changes will have to come really soon or right when we are developing that aspect.

My skill is terraining-doodading, i've got mad skill for making wicked looking maps, and was wondering, what tileset should we make this on? And how big should it be?

Other than that everything looks good, i'll draw up a floorplan for the map and scan it in so you guys can look/comment/change it.

I am also very good at hero development, i've created uncountable number of custom heroes over the years and can currently bust out a diverse, themed, playable and totaly custom hero (abilities and all) in under 2 hours.

I can basicly make the map on my own, I just don't have TIME. Co-development with you guys would make the project much smoother and faster. Tell me what aspect of the map you guys would'nt mind me leaving to you, and i'll get started on the terraining aspects.

 

[Kixer]

I wouldnt mind haveing the gameplay/trap triggering left partialy to me. That would be things like Round timing, player swaping, ect. Id also like to be involved in item design and the item combination system. This would fit in perfectly with my current problem. I will be unable to acess WE for two weeks as of friday. So once the terrain ect is done i could get started on the triggers.

 

[hit]

I can do terrain, but you can do it if you want Ratherion (And other things ^^)

 

[Kixer]

Two terrainers... Well at least the map will look good . How appropriate that i suck at all things terrain (as hit has picked up). Also if you guys wouldnt mind i would like to handel trap ideas.
@Rath - dont finalize the terrain untill we've finished planning, that being units, traps ect. We should build the terrain for the gameplay not build the gameplay into the terrain.

 

[MAP MASTER]

How about Hero Destiny, The heros have there own destiny and they must forfill it

 

[hit]

It would be necessary to make a plan of the map is going to be :S
"Team1>-Center-<Team2" ? or "Team1=Center=Team2"

 

[Kixer]

@Map Master - Good idea, im not sure if you are thinking it would fit in in Ascendency, but if so i doubt it. Then the map would become a bit too complicated.
@hit - if by "team1>-center->team2" you mean two lanes branching into two entrances to bases and only one entrance to the maze, then i think thats the best idea. It allows for a very defence orientated game.

 

[hit]

Exactly, its a defence and attack

 

[Kixer]

Guys i need to know what you think... How are we gonna pull off the maze? I mean are we going to have both teams sending units into the maze, the attackers trying to get past the defenders and destroy something, and the defenders trying to stop them? I just want to know what you guys are picturing.

 

[brad.dude03]

Gem TD is an alright td, pretty creative idea with combining towers and everything... and yeah, dota... dota.. dota... dota... *shakes head* a dota every now and then is alright by me, but I just don't see the mass appeal, it really isn't all that fun.... oh well...

 

[hit]

I think attacker send unit and have a hero and a base and they attack defenders
Defender can buy defender unit (Healer etc), have a hero and can build tower too defend, they can just defend

 

[Kixer]

Ya, but if we do that whats the point of having a maze? Its just an annoyance for the attackers? I think that both teams should have to brave the maze... So lets say the defending team has to defend a building or lets say a king thats at the very edge of the maze?

 

[hit]

Attackers can build offensive building and the TD can be destroy by attackers

 

[Kixer]

Huh? Im lost? That post didnt make sense to me...

 

[Ratherion]

Wait guys hold on, hold on. You have to remember that is game is AoS based, both teams have waves of unit rushing at eatch other. The defensive team uses the maze to it's benefit by using bottlenecks, forcing enemies through traps and whatnot. The attacking team uses the maze to move about unseen and hide it's offensive forces, but is hinderd by the traps. The difficulties of the attacking team is balanced by the larger amount of units they have.The defending base is built into the maze (when I finish the floorplan this will make sense) the maze is a part of the entire map, so no matter where you go or who you are, it both hinders and helps you.

I'll go get to work on the floorplan, hope this helps !