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1.32.7 PATCH NOTES

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The contract will be crafted for wc3 only, not the whole Warcraft franchise.
For example by letting EA distribute wc2 on PlayStation (back in the 1990s): Blizzard did not allow them to publish and sell every Warcraft product...It was only for wc2.
This seems to have been a co-project and publishing together rather than selling the rights. Most likely it seems that Blizzard wasn't able to develop console games and was a strictly PC, so that's why they needed a partner.

And also Blizzard doesn't seem to be willing to sell the rights to distribute any of their games. We're likely never gonna see another StarCraft game, and Blizzard has no intention of selling the rights to it.
 
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This seems to have been a co-project and publishing together rather than selling the rights.
I used this to show that wc2 or wc3 is not = the Warcraft IP. If they make a deal regarding only wc3 then it will not involve WoW or Hearthstone.
also Blizzard doesn't seem to be willing to sell the rights to distribute any of their games.
Yes, it's very unlikely that they will sell the rights.
 
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We're likely never gonna see another StarCraft game
You're likely very, very wrong - I'm 99,9% sure that we'll see a new Starcraft game announced within the next 3-5 years, but... it's probably not going to be an RTS.

And... even RTS games - sure, they're pretty dead right now, but that doesn't mean they won't make a comeback in the future. Market trends change. For example, EA was very against singleplayer games and now they're suddenly interested in making them, because they took a chance recently and it turned out to be a major success.

Also, the way I remember aRPGs were in a pretty bad spot once too, but then D3 and PoE made them big. What I'm saying here is - if at some point in the future some company releases a RTS game that's a huge success, and especially if they also figure out a way to monetize it, then there's a chance Blizzard will consider doing the same. Thus I'd say that saying "never" in regards to more Starcraft RTS is a stretch.
 
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You're likely very, very wrong - I'm 99,9% sure that we'll see a new Starcraft game announced within the next 3-5 years, but... it's probably not going to be an RTS.

if a company formerly known for making great rts's made another rts sequel in a competent way, am sure that it would sell well again. i think its about what activision and blizzard formerly used to do rather than what they do now - before it was just doing a shooter of their own, and strategy games of their own, respectively. now it just turned into trend chasing. but i digress, a good strategy sequel from the former strategy makers, and i think rts would be back on the market again, instead of all the rattle boyale clones, mobile trash and tencent-funded exclusive alpha access versions.
 

Ralle

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I agree that it's an underwhelming patch. But it gives me the sense that they're aiming for stability first and features later. They want competitive gaming to be stable and then move on to modding and custom campaigns.

Also think about this. Now they have the time to refine things. They're not going to release a half-assed reintroduction of custom campaigns and other things they removed. They are putting it back when it works.

Maybe they just don't want to add more features that are half-cooked now that the game is finally out.

I understand your disappointment though, but it's not helpful. As a developer myself, I can see what they're aiming for, but I agree. If they had said what I just did, maybe everyone would be more understanding.

Actually admitting that you're imperfect and what you are trying to do is a great leveler.
 

deepstrasz

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I used this to show that wc2 or wc3 is not = the Warcraft IP. If they make a deal regarding only wc3 then it will not involve WoW or Hearthstone.
I don't think it's that simple. Characters and whatnot are shared between these games so intellectual property clashes could/would still occur.
This seems to have been a co-project and publishing together rather than selling the rights. Most likely it seems that Blizzard wasn't able to develop console games and was a strictly PC, so that's why they needed a partner.
Yeah, or how they collaborated with Sierra to release the Diablo Hellfire expansion that never remained cannon but Diablo II took lots of gameplay inspiration from it.
You're likely very, very wrong - I'm 99,9% sure that we'll see a new Starcraft game announced within the next 3-5 years, but... it's probably not going to be an RTS.
Yeah, maybe something like Call of Duty since that sells like fast food.
And... even RTS games - sure, they're pretty dead right now, but that doesn't mean they won't make a comeback in the future. Market trends change. For example, EA was very against singleplayer games and now they're suddenly interested in making them, because they took a chance recently and it turned out to be a major success.
Cheaper to remaster older RTS games, which means it's a less riskier business.
Also, the way I remember aRPGs were in a pretty bad spot once too, but then D3 and PoE made them big.
By just basically improving graphics and gameplay dynamics, not really adding anything new to the table.
Maybe they just don't want to add more features that are half-cooked now that the game is finally out.
Hopefully it's not "maybe they don't want to add more features". And this is not on the programmers but on the company.
 
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You're likely very, very wrong - I'm 99,9% sure that we'll see a new Starcraft game announced within the next 3-5 years, but... it's probably not going to be an RTS.
Yeah, you're mostly right......But than comes a philosophical question. Will StarCraft III really be a StarCraft III if it's not an RTS, at least at it's core? I mean sure it could have shooter, racing or whatever part, but at least in it's core it "has to" be an RTS to be StarCraft III.

Of course there's always a possibility of "Do you guys not have phones?" 2 but I'd honestly prefer no StarCraft to that kinda a StarCraft. I mean the worst thins is that I would most likely end up installing it if it's free to play and playable on PC, but I wouldn't be happy about it, lmao.
 
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StarCraft III
If they do Starcraft III, it will be an RTS (perhaps with some elements of another genre), but a Starcraft game doesn't have to be called "Starcraft III". They can do another "Starcraft: Ghost" or whatever they want. My point is - Starcraft IP is too big to just let it sit and collect dust, sooner or later they will do something with it.

I'll answer the rest later... cause work :D
 
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After a campaign it still says time elapsed: 00:00:00

Edit: it probably didn't say "time elapsed 00:00:00," I canceled it out pretty quick but my time was still zero.
 
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~El

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I agree that it's an underwhelming patch. But it gives me the sense that they're aiming for stability first and features later. They want competitive gaming to be stable and then move on to modding and custom campaigns.

Also think about this. Now they have the time to refine things. They're not going to release a half-assed reintroduction of custom campaigns and other things they removed. They are putting it back when it works.

Maybe they just don't want to add more features that are half-cooked now that the game is finally out.

I understand your disappointment though, but it's not helpful. As a developer myself, I can see what they're aiming for, but I agree. If they had said what I just did, maybe everyone would be more understanding.

Actually admitting that you're imperfect and what you are trying to do is a great leveler.

My personal disappointment comes from the fact that the last 6 months of patches perfectly prove what we've all been saying all this time: this game needed at least a year more in development, more staff, or both. And it's frustrating.

All their announcements run contrary to their actions. This isn't aggressive patching. We don't know what's going on behind the scenes. There's no roadmap. There's nothing. It all boils down to "we're going to make it better, trust us, it's gonna be a great game, mmm yes". It's offensive.

There's no transparency. They don't share what roadblocks they encounter. We don't know what they're working on. We don't know what the next patch is going to be. We don't even know if they have multiple branches of development, or if this patch is everything they've managed to do this month. This complete lack of self-awareness, complete lack of understanding the importance of transparent communication, and everything else is infuriating. It's very disappointing to see one of my favourite games of all time to be opened up and then sewn back together to be yet another soulless, pointless, half-baked, half-arsed product of the endemic style of triple-A development. It sickens me. No amount of sugarcoating is going to fix that.

The problems aren't technical. They're corporate. And you can't fix corporate with any amount of patching.
 

deepstrasz

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Quake 2 shares characters, maps, and lore with Quake Champions but it doesn't cause any clashes
:peasant-sad:
q2.png
qchamp.png

Also, Epic Games was involved in both Unreal Tournament and Gears of Wars series.


There's no transparency. They don't share what roadblocks they encounter. We don't know what they're working on.
Yeah. At least that way the community could aid them...
 

deepstrasz

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And Quake 2 is open source while Quake Champions isn't.
Being open source means having access to the programming part, not everything, from what I know.
Epic sold GoW to Microsoft for less than 100 million USD.
Then you have your answer. It's sold intellectual property, wholly. Also, Gears of War is not based on the Unreal Tournament universe, but only its engine, from what I know.
 

deepstrasz

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UT3 has a lot of stuff from GoW such as character concepts.
That's like saying StarCraft has a lot of inspiration from Alien, Warhammer, Star Wars...
Then how did Nvidia make Quake RTX? They had access to assets other than the code ofc
I see. Well, in that case, they cannot go beyond what Quake II is which means they cannot use anything in Quake II to make a new Quake game without legal rights.

"A remastered version of the game, titled Quake II RTX was announced by Nvidia on March 18, 2019[22] and was released on June 6, 2019 for Windows and Linux on Steam. This remastered version requires an Nvidia RTX GPU, as it has been developed to utilize these cards' hardware ray-tracing functionality.[23][24] The game, provided free of charge, includes the three levels present in the original Quake II demo, but can be used to play the full game if its data files are available.[25]"
What advertising...
 

deepstrasz

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There is a huge difference between inspiration and reusing modified 3d art assets.
Do you know they were made by Epic Games and not sold to Microsoft?
They could also be models bought from a platform that makes them for the Unreal Engine.

I see no issue here really unless there is obvious copyright infringement. As mentioned earlier, the rights were sold to Microsoft...
 
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Do you know they were made by Epic Games and not sold to Microsoft?
The whole GoW IP was sold to Microsoft, this [IP] includes character concepts. Still, this allows Epic to sell UT3 and Microsoft to sell GoW games, no clashes take place.
They could also be models bought from a platform that makes them for the Unreal Engine.
So, you are accusing Epic of asset flipping?
 

deepstrasz

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The whole GoW IP was sold to Microsoft, this [IP] includes character concepts. Still, this allows Epic to sell UT3 and Microsoft to sell GoW games, no clashes take place.
My dude. Is Epic Games allowed to make any other Gears of War games? I doubt the contract allows them to. Otherwise, it's something rather sophisticated and usually people don't want things to be too gray to avoid any legal issues.
Selling previously made games is something else. But Epic Games can't sell any of the previous Gears of War games can they?
So, you are accusing Epic of asset flipping?
Is that question just so you could prolong this off-topic discussion?
 
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Is Epic Games allowed to make any other Gears of War games?
Only if Microsoft gives them permission. Still, it doesn't cause clashes with UT3.
Is that question just so you could prolong this off-topic discussion?
Using models from Unreal Engine Marketplace is asset flipping.
But Epic Games can't sell any of the previous Gears of War games can they?
Yes, they cant sell as they aren't selling GoW games on the Epic Games Store. Also, I don't remember any GoW references in Fortnite.
EDIT:
Selling previously made games is something else.
That is hypocritical as you said that before:
Characters and whatnot are shared between these games so intellectual property clashes could/would still occur.
 
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I'm getting way off topic here, but anyway. I've read an article about Reforged like in November or so, and been trying to find it again today, but failed miserably, think it was PC gamer or GameInformer, but not sure. It asks the question why are RTSs dead nowadays. And says it's because StarCraft (and Warcraft to a lesser extent) basically annihilated the competition. And they said that RTS died the day StarCraft II was announced, cause the competition stoped making RTS cause they new that nothing they do could compete with StarCraft. And that's why once StarCraft II died of old age, well there was no RTS alternative to play, and RTS were forgoten.

So it comes as a paradox. Blizzard annihilating Warcraft III, cause RTS is a dead genre and there's no point to invest funds, team and love into Reforged. When Blizzard is the one "responsible" for RTS dying in the first place.
 
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I don't know. At least a sign, a little hint that they're at least planning to make map makers' lives easier. I do understand that Blizzard did almost nothing for them for those fifteen years (syntax highlight, extended editor, compilers and many other things were made by fans, not by Blizzard), but let us know if there are any plans to compensate at least something of it.
 
Amazing patch! 10/10! Sure will wait again for another month! These recent patches are giving me more and more time to play other games while waiting for a 'proper' patch. Hopefully I'm still alive next year to witness those things they promised months ago, like the new features and those features from the classic they wanted to bring back.
 
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I don't know. At least a sign, a little hint that they're at least planning to make map makers' lives easier. I do understand that Blizzard did almost nothing for them for those fifteen years (syntax highlight, extended editor, compilers and many other things were made by fans, not by Blizzard), but let us know if there are any plans to compensate at least something of it.
for sure!
Just imagine, if there are no players, you don't have to waste your time on modding. They've made mapmakers live so much easier!
 
I'm taking the unpopular opinion saying that im happy they found and fixed a desync issue. Its good they are focusing on getting the game into a more stable state before adding new features.

I just wished they were faster doing so. A lot faster.

Here I am playing the shit out of Command and Conquer Remastered. A remaster actually worthy of the title.
Its weird to see EA, a company known for butchering game studios actually honor their legacy franchises more than Blizzard entertainment, a company formerly known for their customer loyalty.
 

deepstrasz

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Its weird to see EA, a company known for butchering game studios actually honor their legacy franchises more than Blizzard entertainment, a company formerly known for their customer loyalty.
Their wrongdoing is the instability of the game and its missing features as well as the promised stuff. They lost time and resources on an unnecessary graphics overhaul. That or the higher ups were not sober and decided premature release.

EA possibly learned from the remastering of Age of Empires and possibly from StarCraft: Remastered (as well as from other graphically enhanced/improved games).

Anyways, fans complain about C&C's AI and pathing that could have been properly "fixed"->see project OpenRA (for bonus features as well like higher field of view).
But of course compared to Reforged, the C&C: Remastered is a sort of masterpiece.
 
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Their wrongdoing is the instability of the game and its missing features as well as the promised stuff. They lost time and resources on an unnecessary graphics overhaul. That or the higher ups were not sober and decided premature release.

Well from my point of view the most likely explanation is that the higher-ups saw an opportunity for a cheap cash in. As you know, Reforged had pre-orders; now the problem with pre-orders is that the law dictates (US law at least, now sure about the laws here but I imagine they're the same/similar) they be released on the date shown otherwise its a breach of contract, I think you get a months lee-way. So by having pre-orders it ensured the game was getting released when it was released irregardless of state.

As for wasting time on the graphics overhaul, it was outsourced therefore not Blizz's dev teams time spent. However Warcraft 3 is a nearly 2 decades old game, I imagine the time taken to move it over to a CASC system; to make sense of and even start making sense of all the old code would've taken months alone. I also imagine some of their design choices didn't help to make their job easier such as a Main Menu that doesn't support 3D models etc. I also imagine the small dev team didn't help either.
 
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Are we just going to have an uproar and 50 paragraphs worth of debating every time new patch notes are released?

Oh and dont forget, Blizzard big bad ooo


*EDIT*
This is a joke, I am not saying that blizzard is blameless and yes reforged has issues (refer to reply below)
 
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Are we just going to have an uproar and 50 paragraphs worth of debating every time new patch notes are released?

Oh and dont forget, Blizzard big bad ooo

“Are we just going to have to listen to anyone defending the result we got and 2 mocking sentences not worth debating every time new patch notes are released?
Oh and dont forget, Blizzard big good ooo”
there, fixed it for you. not fun when its you on the receiving end of the pitchfork, is it?

how else do you want the company to pay attention and change, if customer feedback means nothing to it? only two things that may make it reconsider its development decisions and behavior: its current investors, and tencent money. as it seems to me, our only option is to make loud enough ruckus that the investors notice, as we have no power over china, rather the opposite.

i know there is a fine line between feedbacking and just causing unneccessary stress which is why i most of the time now only talk about this when its brought up and only in here or the discord, rather than official forums or contacting developers themselves. but if the company wont acknowledge its incompetence and blame it on the customer not having the experience that the customer expected, then the company brought all of this upon itself, willingly.
 
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how else do you want the company to pay attention and change, if customer feedback means nothing to it? only two things that may make it reconsider its development decisions and behavior: its current investors, and tencent money. as it seems to me, our only option is to make loud enough ruckus that the investors notice, as we have no power over china, rather the opposite.
I don't think behaving like a surly farm animal is the way you want to present yourself-- that gives them even more of an excuse to not listen to you.

Investors want money. They think consumers are stupid people to fleece money from. There's no reason to reinforce that viewpoint.
 
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“Are we just going to have to listen to anyone defending the result we got and 2 mocking sentences not worth debating every time new patch notes are released?
Oh and dont forget, Blizzard big good ooo”
there, fixed it for you. not fun when its you on the receiving end of the pitchfork, is it?

how else do you want the company to pay attention and change, if customer feedback means nothing to it? only two things that may make it reconsider its development decisions and behavior: its current investors, and tencent money. as it seems to me, our only option is to make loud enough ruckus that the investors notice, as we have no power over china, rather the opposite.

i know there is a fine line between feedbacking and just causing unneccessary stress which is why i most of the time now only talk about this when its brought up and only in here or the discord, rather than official forums or contacting developers themselves. but if the company wont acknowledge its incompetence and blame it on the customer not having the experience that the customer expected, then the company brought all of this upon itself, willingly.
Wasnt trying to be hostile or anything, just peeved with all of the constant controversy being brought up over and over, not saying it isnt justified, just saying it essentially drains any sort of passion or excitement of continuing my map development.
 
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the investors have noticed the 0.6 alongside all the articles and “newsbreaker youtuber” videos, and they dont obliviously approve of anything the company does. am sure of that, about as much as you are that they think and behave the way you say they do. the company barely listened before, and if, then only to large content creators. what do i or anyone else care about how we come off to them if that is their stance on feedback? besides we did not start being surly farm animals, as you so put it, out of nowhere. we only started after the company amplified its tone-deafness, and that is after the fact that large content creators publicly disliked the game. the same people that they come to for feedback for the title that they make content for, and who they chose to not listen to when it got inconvenient about reforged.

no hostilities meant to either of you.
 
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They fixed like two things and felt the need to tell everyone about it. Wow.

When's the patch where they fix the issue of the game being a bloated, inferior bastardization of one of the best games of all time that selfishly tries to usurp it by retroactively applying itself to all versions of the previous, better version? Where's the patch where they add an executable for the older version of the game just like Titan Quest, Mafia 2 and every other goddamn PC remaster ever made did?

Where's the patch where they rework the campaign like they started to with those three maps before they quit? Where's the patch where they add those four hours of actual cutscenes? Where's the patch where they actually deliver on the very basic features they promised at the start? Where's the patch that justifies the existence of this bloated piece of crap glorified HD mod?

Where's the patch where they turn the game into something other than a cheap and predatory way to squeeze more microtransaction money out of gullible Chinese players who don't know better?

Wasnt trying to be hostile or anything, just peeved with all of the constant controversy being brought up over and over, not saying it isnt justified, just saying it essentially drains any sort of passion or excitement of continuing my map development.
The problem is that, unfortunately, there's not much to talk about except the controversy. There's little if anything about Reforged that's good, and Acitivison isn't really doing anything that significantly improves the problems. What am I supposed to say about "The score screen for campaign missions now accurately displays time elapsed during that mission"? Who the fuck cares about the time elapsed on a score screen when the game disconnects every five minutes?
 
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I'm starting to figure out the pattern here: Blizzard promised to release monthly patches, and they're doing the bare minimum to keep up with it. So next time, instead of bemoaning the pitiful state of the new patch, I'm going to just discount it because it only exists to keep up with a verbal contract.
 
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I agree that it's an underwhelming patch. But it gives me the sense that they're aiming for stability first and features later. They want competitive gaming to be stable and then move on to modding and custom campaigns.

Also think about this. Now they have the time to refine things. They're not going to release a half-assed reintroduction of custom campaigns and other things they removed. They are putting it back when it works.

Maybe they just don't want to add more features that are half-cooked now that the game is finally out.

I understand your disappointment though, but it's not helpful. As a developer myself, I can see what they're aiming for, but I agree. If they had said what I just did, maybe everyone would be more understanding.

Actually admitting that you're imperfect and what you are trying to do is a great leveler.

My thoughts exactly. They don't want to kick the beehive so to speak. A bold new patch that breaks many things will cause even more turmoil. Slow motion is better than no motion.

One other thing to consider, is that they may be working on big features that aren't finished yet. This patch might have a lot of ground work for a future patch, or maybe they spent half this last month trying solutions for custom campaigns. Of course, this is likely just optimism. This game has been out for about 8 months now, it really shouldn't take this long.

Are we just going to have an uproar and 50 paragraphs worth of debating every time new patch notes are released?

Oh and dont forget, Blizzard big bad ooo

I'm sorry that whiny posts have upset you enough to make one of your own. Thank you for your contribution to this conversation.

They fixed like two things and felt the need to tell everyone about it. Wow.

When's the patch where they fix the issue of the game being a bloated, inferior bastardization of one of the best games of all time that selfishly tries to usurp it by retroactively applying itself to all versions of the previous, better version? Where's the patch where they add an executable for the older version of the game just like Titan Quest, Mafia 2 and every other goddamn PC remaster ever made did?

Where's the patch where they rework the campaign like they started to with those three maps before they quit? Where's the patch where they add those four hours of actual cutscenes? Where's the patch where they actually deliver on the very basic features they promised at the start? Where's the patch that justifies the existence of this bloated piece of crap glorified HD mod?

Where's the patch where they turn the game into something other than a cheap and predatory way to squeeze more microtransaction money out of gullible Chinese players who don't know better?


The problem is that, unfortunately, there's not much to talk about except the controversy. There's little if anything about Reforged that's good, and Acitivison isn't really doing anything that significantly improves the problems. What am I supposed to say about "The score screen for campaign missions now accurately displays time elapsed during that mission"? Who the fuck cares about the time elapsed on a score screen when the game disconnects every five minutes?

@Hazop Read this if you don't understand why Blizzard putting out a half-assed patch doesn't cut it.
 
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