What is Blizzard's problem???

[LazyCoder]

Their stupid 1.24 patch has broken at least 75% of the maps that were even worth playing in warcraft 3. To give a few examples: Th15's tank commanders, Soldiers, metriod map (can't remember exact name) and Pyramid Escape (good ones, not that raffles crap).

One thing I notice though, is that every one of these maps was protected... and when I try to play it now, it says the map cannot be found (and I point at the screen and go THERE IT IS!!!).

 

[HINDYhat]

Blame the russians. Damn commies and their Wc3-hacking abilities. :<

 

[Cthulus]

What's wrong with communism..
Hell, the same thing happens to me.

 

[Deleted member 157129]

You didn't read the news did you. They changed some core elements in JASS. All maps prior to the latest patch (unless they only use parts of the unchanged language I guess) is dysfunctional. Blizzard even delayed the update for IceFrog to implement the changes to DotA.

You should actually thank Blizzard, because the effect of this is that you (hopefully) can no longer be hacked via the use of WC3 maps, you will not be downloading viruses when downloading maps (you could end up doing this before because of a fault in JASS). In addition, there's a lot of new functions that have been added to JASS to further improve future maps, and to replace the things you could do with the faulty code (except hacking).

 

[LazyCoder]

You didn't read the news did you. They changed some core elements in JASS. All maps prior to the latest patch (unless they only use parts of the unchanged language I guess) is dysfunctional. Blizzard even delayed the update for IceFrog to implement the changes to DotA.

You should actually thank Blizzard, because the effect of this is that you (hopefully) can no longer be hacked via the use of WC3 maps, you will not be downloading viruses when downloading maps (you could end up doing this before because of a fault in JASS). In addition, there's a lot of new functions that have been added to JASS to further improve future maps, and to replace the things you could do with the faulty code (except hacking).

But couldn't they have also worked in some reverse compatability? Just have it so it plays using the old code. Sure, you wouldn't be 'safe' playing bnet on the old maps, but at least they'd still work if the author wasn't around anymore to fix their maps.

And I couldn't give a damn about IceFrog and his Dota plague. Hell, if they'd released the patch without waiting, we'd have a dota-free battle.net for a few days, that's a + in my book.

 

[N.O]

Why do people like DotA.... even Blizzard liked it, all I got to say is Blizzard has no taste in gameing and dota is killing wc3 and made most of the Bnet people stupid... escpecially the kids.

 

[DocDude]

Blizzard likes DotA cuz it keeps wc3 alive. you should like it too for that reason and not becouse of the crappy gameplay and noobs playing it.
and really few days without DotA would have been great

 

[N.O]

DotA only keeps the kids because they don't know how to click the other maps that are there it would seem anyways...
Also why does blizzard still care about wc3?
They left it 4 years ago and now back trying to fix more stuff.

 

[Hayato_Azra]

Blizzard even delayed the update for IceFrog to implement the changes to DotA.

·Patch 1.23 changelog:
fixed specific sound errors in Dota maps

I hate everything

 

[LazyCoder]

I hate everything

I've seen that in several of their patches though. It pisses me off, they don't even NEED Blizzard's help! Geeze I hope Starcraft 2 doesn't get a DotA equivalent map or something of equal popularity.

I've met one of these kids before. All he could f***ing say was "hey let's play dota (pronounced dodda)". The kind of kid you wouldn't mind putting in a wood chipper... ok that's too far... lol!

 

[Hayato_Azra]

I hope Starcraft 2 doesn't get a DotA equivalent map or something of equal popularity.

we can dream... but the reality is: it will be, after all, dota is supposedly inspired from a SC map... which i dont know and i dont care to know...

The kind of kid you wouldn't mind putting in a wood chipper... ok that's too far... lol!

that´s not...

 

[BlackArmsShadow]

IceFrog might actually be a Blizzard employee now.

 

[Hayato_Azra]

IceFrog might actually be a Blizzard employee now.

Possibly... but, more than a employee, i would say that blizzard is a dota supporter. And when i say supporter i mean a money-lending-for-tournaments-bitch.


Oh blizzard! you were once the greatest videogame company, and now ...
what has money done to you, blizzard?

 

[Na_Dann_Ma_GoGo]

Fail topic and fail posts.
This thread is full of stupid, ignorant and jealous fools. Ahh and rumors as well

 

[LazyCoder]

Ohhh I wish you hadn't just said that...

 

[Oziris]

My friend asked me the other day: Lets play Warcraft, i said okey. I will be a night elf, he said who is that? i lol'd. When we got in the PC gaming room, we started playing Warcraft and he said, this isn't warcraft what is this? I want to play where you have 2 bases and the trees fight with the undead ( It sounds a lot more better in Serbian ). I was all oh my fucking god, this is a nightmare. Fuck, kids think that Dota is Warcraft.

No further discussion.

 

[LazyCoder]

My friend asked me the other day: Lets play Warcraft, i said okey. I will be a night elf, he said who is that? i lol'd. When we got in the PC gaming room, we started playing Warcraft and he said, this isn't warcraft what is this? I want to play where you have 2 bases and the trees fight with the undead ( It sounds a lot more better in Serbian ). I was all oh my fucking god, this is a nightmare. Fuck, kids think that Dota is Warcraft.

No further discussion.

You kidding? That definitely warrants further discussion, or at least further complaining! I prefer the maps in warcraft 3 that actually require some technical skills to create, such as Soldiers, or Sharpshooters online, or Missile War. Not shitty maps like DotA where all he did was spawn units, make items, spells, etc. and let warcraft 3 handle everything. To hell with that! That's not modding! That's just simple map making. Say it's like a car. Instead of giving it a new engine and some shiny new rims, all he's doing is changing the paint color! (AND THEN KEYING IT!)

 

[WhitePhoenix]

DotA took more time and effort to make then Soldiers, or Missile War (Sharp Shooters, no.)
Your metaphor is also ridiculous. If Warcraft 3 is a car, and DotA is a modulation of said car, then the only similiarity is who originally made the car i.e. the brand.

DotA took warcraft 3's lore and expanded upon it. The original map was amateur and albiet boring in comparison to the current. As DotA evolved and the various spurts and complaints of map-stealing and non-model/effect crediting eventually DotA became something to which more time and effort was put into then any other map.

Do the math. 95 heroes, with 4 abilities each, that's 340 unique abilities. Not all of them are triggered, but you can be more then 50% are. As far as triggering is concerned, DotA is above average in difficulty and quality/quantity. The majority of skins and models are all the same as warcraft 3, but who cares about that? Huge file sizes are a sign of a map maker who hasn't quite learned the tricks to the trade. Not to mention the amount of balancing put into the map, and the plethora of custom made and triggered items...

There are creditable reasons why some people hate DotA because of its history, but thinking that the map sucks or is inferior to others, is inferior logic.

The majority claim behind why DotA sucks is either because of the community to which they almost always encounter when trying to play (because it is so competitive) or because of a stigma generated by people with, or without legitimate reasons who they happen to associate with. That is the truth.

 

[Hayato_Azra]

DotA took warcraft 3's lore and expanded upon it.

I lol´d. It just has the same names of some cities and people. Nothing else.

The original map was amateur and albiet boring in comparison to the current. As DotA evolved and the various spurts and complaints of map-stealing and non-model/effect crediting eventually DotA became something to which more time and effort was put into then any other map.

ANY map stolen 3 times and updated upon 4 years OBVIOUSLY has more develompment than a normal one. Still dota has its issues that weren´t corrected in time, but YEARS later. In other words, Any other map in place of dota with the same time > dota

Do the math. 95 heroes, with 4 abilities each, that's 340 unique abilities. Not all of them are triggered, but you can be more then 50% are. As far as triggering is concerned, DotA is above average in difficulty and quality/quantity. The majority of skins and models are all the same as warcraft 3, but who cares about that? Huge file sizes are a sign of a map maker who hasn't quite learned the tricks to the trade. Not to mention the amount of balancing put into the map, and the plethora of custom made and triggered items...

Yes, and thats what most " real" maps have. And there´s a lot that have a lot else. And, seriusly, Dota took 2 years to balance things that could have been changed into 3 updates. Also, the fact that a lot of heroes were changed, and thus, imbalanced (lol, old razor and new razor ,anyone? )

There are creditable reasons why some people hate DotA because of its history, but thinking that the map sucks or is inferior to others, is inferior logic.

is not inferior. IS OVERRATED. It seems you didn´t get the point.

The majority claim behind why DotA sucks is either because of the community to which they almost always encounter when trying to play (because it is so competitive) or because of a stigma generated by people with, or without legitimate reasons who they happen to associate with. That is the truth.

To be honest, yes, the worst thing in dota is what people makes of it. That means to be an OVERRATED product.

Dota is good, and fun to play sometimes. Not. Anything. Else. Its not revolutionary (its not, they were AoS maps BEFORE dota ) is not the most beautiful map ever, is not 100 % balanced, and it has a poor excuse plot.

Its a fun map to play, but its HIGHLY OVERRATED, that´s why our negative comments seem to be "hate comments" when they are just critic.

 

[Dr Super Good]

Enough DotA slagging.... I do not think this is the topic of the thread.

All broken maps are due to usless authors, they had ample warning to fix them.

 

[Hayato_Azra]

Enough DotA slagging.... I do not think this is the topic of the thread.

Well, considering Blizzard is spoiling icefrog with exclusive updates in the patchs, i DO think is on topic.

 

[Dr Super Good]

The exclusive updates covered his lazyness and for good reason.
We the 25% of the game community who do not play DotA are not as important as the 75% of the community which do play DotA. Thus killing the map for ever a few hours from battlenet would result in over 150000 players leaving WC3 for good. Killing other maps which are near never hosted (once or twice a week) will cause like under 1000 people to leave and does not affect mappers as they can just update their code in a mater of minutes to be complient.

The patch also added hell of a good new content to WC3, so you lot should see the whole picture rather than blowing minor lumps into mountains.

 

[LazyCoder]

You really think those little freaks will leave their precious DotA for good? Nah, they'll come crawling back just as soon as IceFag releases a new version.

It would have at least been nice for blizzard to have made it so we could at least OPEN old maps in the WE. Now it complains about functions that don't exist and it doesn't load the bloody map! (Try opening up the death sheep map that comes with RoC)

 

[Reaper2008]

It loads and plays just fine, are you joking?

 

[Dr Super Good]

LazyCoder, old maps open fine as the patch did not change anything jass loading related (why should text cause maps to not load?).

The patch did break a few GUI actions though but no one making good maps use GUI nowdays so it is not even worth mentioning.
There is an unoffical fix however for this GUI load crash, which involves importing a custom action list with the missing actions included, but is uneeded for JASS maps.

 

[LordDz]

You kidding? That definitely warrants further discussion, or at least further complaining! I prefer the maps in warcraft 3 that actually require some technical skills to create, such as Soldiers, or Sharpshooters online, or Missile War. Not shitty maps like DotA where all he did was spawn units, make items, spells, etc. and let warcraft 3 handle everything. To hell with that! That's not modding! That's just simple map making. Say it's like a car. Instead of giving it a new engine and some shiny new rims, all he's doing is changing the paint color! (AND THEN KEYING IT!)

I just had to quote you..
"That's just simple map making"

Aren't ALL the maps on the hiveworkshop, simple mapmaking with that view?

And the other best part:

"Not shitty maps like DotA where all he did was spawn units, make items, spells, etc."

Because.. We all do that in sleep.

 

[Hayato_Azra]

The exclusive updates covered his lazyness and for good reason.
We the 25% of the game community who do not play DotA are not as important as the 75% of the community which do play DotA.

Why? just because we dont follow the mass we are less important? Blizzard updated some programation things in the sistem, AND helped dota. They could just update the codes, but no, they HAD to wait for icefrog and do it so dota can continue

Thus killing the map for ever a few hours from battlenet would result in over 150000 players leaving WC3 for good.

You SERIUSLY think they could KILL dota? AND THE DOTA FANS LEAVE THE GAME FOR GOOD? they will go back playing as a new dota appears, the dota addicts are more stupid than you think. If the update made dota unplayable, YOU SERIUSLY THINK THEY WILL DOWNLOAD IT? no, they will be playing with the 1.23 patch the last releases of dota.

Killing other maps which are near never hosted (once or twice a week) will cause like under 1000 people to leave and does not affect mappers as they can just update their code in a mater of minutes to be complient.

And ice-mother-fucking-frog cant do it? People with less skill with coding could never recover their maps(shame of them for not knowing more, but still is not a matter of minutes, there´s something called " test" you know?), yes, they may be minority, but we are still players.

The patch also added hell of a good new content to WC3, so you lot should see the whole picture rather than blowing minor lumps into mountains.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Patch 1.24
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

PC WORLD EDITOR CHANGES

- Added new JASS hash table functions to replace the lost functionality from
fixing unsafe type casting.
- Hash Table - Save Item Handle
- Hash Table - Save Unit Handle
- Hash Table - Load Item Handle
- Hash Table - Load Unit Handle
- Hash Table - Get Handle ID

FIXES

- Fixed an exploit related to unsafe type casting that allowed users to
execute arbitrary code in maps.
- Fixed the JASS unsafe type casting exploit ("return bug").
- Fixed several World Editor crashes.

ADDITIONAL
• “Shadowing” global variables with local variables no longer is possible.
• Fixed a type conversion dealing with operators (i.e. adding a handle with an integer)
• Added the ability to store hashtable handles in a hashtable
• Added getSpellTargetX and getSpellTargetY natives
• Added a new base handle type “Agent” of which many types now extend from.
• Added a SaveAgentHandle native which can be used for saving most handle types
• Added a JASS optimization dealing with global variable change events.
• Increased max map file size from 4MB to 8MB.

In other words, changed code issues and added new ones. And the map size is just a scripted limitation, and they changed it now, but they could have changed it before, in fact, we could change it by ourselves.

Yeah, surely it added a lot of content aside of the code things.

 

[Dr Super Good]

Well, it is not my fault you fail to see how major the code change was. it completly changes the way good rigger systems are made as we can use much faster and safer natives than before.

And ice-mother-fucking-frog cant do it? People with less skill with coding could never recover their maps(shame of them for not knowing more, but still is not a matter of minutes, there´s something called " test" you know?), yes, they may be minority, but we are still players.

Any good mapper can recover their maps, poor mappers make poor maps so no one cares about them (I play their maps once or twice atmost as apposed to good maps like SWAT AM which I play 1000s of times and has been patched for 1.24 complience). Thus if they can not be bothered updating their map to be 1.24 complient, it was eithor not worth playing or they were stupid enough to leave it protected so people like me could not make it 1.24 complient.

Honestly, your slagging of DotA is pointless. You could say you are as bad as DotA players by doing so as your arguments are as shallow as a large numbers of the players (not all).

I advise stopping and thinking deeper into the subjects before discussing them. Currently I think you have jumped to a conclusion without fullying understading or knowing all the facts. For example if you knew jass you may think the patch as being better than as a non mapper. Also if you thought about the logic of DotA and its players, you would understand that all the DotA players would not be playing WC3 without it now so there would be less people and if not even fewer non DotA games than there currently is due to less people (as some DotA fans might play a different map from time to time).

 

[En_Fuego]

Having not touched Warcraft III in about a month, and having not played DotA religiously since June/July, I can pretty much deduct that everything everyone slags about DotA is false.

1) Blizzard did not wait to release the patch for IceFrog. If you recall, DotA got killed by the patch just as well. IceFrog was only a little (lol) faster than most mapmakers, seeing as he has a full team to update it.

2) DotA is indisputably the greatest WC3 map of all time. It may not be the funnest, but it's better than anything anyone else has made, seeing as it's survived through almost 6 years. If you disagree, tell me one map that has lasted longer and has such a cult following. Even Rising_Dusk couldn't match DotA (then again, Dusk's maps are relative copies of eachother).

3) IceFrog did not steal DotA from anyone. Eul, Guinsoo, and IceFrog each had permission from the original creator (his name eludes me) who created the game for his kids to play on RoC. Then he quit and gave it up as open-source. Since then, each maker has had permission to edit it. Hell, before DotA Allstars, there were over 10 versions of DotA made by random authors because Eul released an open-edit DotA map for others to carry on. I remember and still have the original DotA. It had only the original RoC heroes and I found it quite boring. Then again, it was better than playing any of the other shit maps at the time.

4) I like the patch, personally. It hasn't done much wrong, and if you blame Blizzard for getting rid of exploits that cause players problems, then you can leave. Blizzard did the right thing (except for when they messed up on getting rid of the exploit). Their hearts are in the right place, they're just bad at acting.

5) The only map that is better than DotA that I can think of, would be Wintermaul. So quit arguing.

and 6) DSG, my GUI maps rock! ^_^

 

[Hayato_Azra]

Any good mapper can recover their maps, poor mappers make poor maps so no one cares about them (I play their maps once or twice atmost as apposed to good maps like SWAT AM which I play 1000s of times and has been patched for 1.24 complience). Thus if they can not be bothered updating their map to be 1.24 complient, it was eithor not worth playing or they were stupid enough to leave it protected so people like me could not make it 1.24 complient.

Obviously. Thats why i said " shame on them", i should have explained myself better, but still, updating a map alone is, lets say... more complicated than having a team and various testers.

Honestly, your slagging of DotA is pointless. You could say you are as bad as DotA players by doing so as your arguments are as shallow as a large numbers of the players (not all).

Am i slagging dota? When i said the map was bad/not fun to play? Its the same i said before, because i critic icefrog ,or im not saying " DOTA EEZ BEST" looks like im saying something bad about the map design itself. And, man, if you play dota, its ok, i did played it too. Im referring to the massive idiocity of most dota fans who changed WC3:TFT name to " DotA"
Im not talking about people who plays dota as they play other maps, im talking about addicts who play dota and nothing else. I swear i started a melee game once and one guy that joined said " this dota sucks" and left after saying that. THATS the kind of people im referring to, you should not feel aluded if you are not one of them.

Well, it is not my fault you fail to see how major the code change was. it completly changes the way good rigger systems are made as we can use much faster and safer natives than before. For example if you knew jass you may think the patch as being better than as a non mapper.

And its not my fault if you fail to understand what i wrote, because you are implying a lot of things i didn´t say. I said it only affected codes, not that the changes in the codes were minor. When one says " a hell of new content" it should be referring at, exactly " a hell of new content". The codes for map making are just a part of how much they could update wc3.
The patch did fix a lot of problems, and prevents more problems. Where did i say the patch had bad issues ? i was pointing how blizzard had the guts to do things for dota exclusively.

Also if you thought about the logic of DotA and its players, you would understand that all the DotA players would not be playing WC3 without it now so there would be less people and if not even fewer non DotA games than there currently is due to less people (as some DotA fans might play a different map from time to time).

I dont think the dota fans im referring to play something that is not dota or dota related...
And, to be honest, i dont feel like the dota fans play "the warcraft 3 map: Defense of the ancients". I feel like they play " DotA" and nothing else.

I advise stopping and thinking deeper into the subjects before discussing them.
Currently I think you have jumped to a conclusion without fullying understading or knowing all the facts.

I advice stopping to read and comprehend what the other is trying to imply with its post, and i also think you have jumped to a conclusion without fullying understading or knowing all the facts aside of what you know. You may be surprised on how many people act as i said.

I can pretty much deduct that everything everyone slags about DotA is false.

I wish it was.

1) Blizzard did not wait to release the patch for IceFrog. If you recall, DotA got killed by the patch just as well. IceFrog was only a little (lol) faster than most mapmakers, seeing as he has a full team to update it.

Actually, dota was updating the map before the patch came out. That´s why they did not release anything new until the patch came, and thats why they were so "fast" , i may be wrong thougth, but im pretty confident of what im saying.

2) DotA is indisputably the greatest WC3 map of all time. It may not be the funnest, but it's better than anything anyone else has made, seeing as it's survived through almost 6 years. If you disagree, tell me one map that has lasted longer and has such a cult following. Even Rising_Dusk couldn't match DotA (then again, Dusk's maps are relative copies of eachother).

Dota is the most popular map in wc3 and the most longlived, no more, no less.

IceFrog did not steal DotA from anyone. Eul, Guinsoo, and IceFrog each had permission from the original creator (his name eludes me) who created the game for his kids to play on RoC. Then he quit and gave it up as open-source. Since then, each maker has had permission to edit it. Hell, before DotA Allstars, there were over 10 versions of DotA made by random authors because Eul released an open-edit DotA map for others to carry on.

That´s new to me, thanks for the data.


Anyways, warcraft 3 is 6 years old, and blizzard still updates it.
Thumbs up for blizzard for updating the game.
But the fact that blizzard changed things in some patchs only for dota still pisses me off a little.
But i think this discussion wont lead to anything better than what it is rigth now.

 

[Reaper2008]

Actually, dota was updating the map before the patch came out. That´s why they did not release anything new until the patch came, and thats why they were so "fast" , i may be wrong thougth, but im pretty confident of what im saying.

The beta patch was out months before, and it had the new natives, so why would any mapmaker not have a (beta) new code compliant map?

 

[Dr Super Good]

It takes a few hours to update a map to be compatible, and minimal testing is needed.

 

[En_Fuego]

Yes, Blizzard gave map makers a chance to update their maps almost 2 months before they released it. As long as you belonged to a modding community/Blizzard community you would've gotten the memo.

And yes, DotA was incompatible at first with the new patch. Why do you think people all over the place were hosting the older version of DotA that they fixed for a temporary set-back (they went from like 6.61b -> 6.61 ->6.62).

 

[LordDz]

But the fact that blizzard changed things in some patchs only for dota still pisses me off a little.
But i think this discussion wont lead to anything better than what it is rigth now.

With that attitude, we should fuck Valve for making Day of Defeat to Dod:Source, we should fuck them for Making CS into CSS.
My point is: So what if they updated it only for DOTA? (No source) If it helps the rest of the people, then let it be.

 

[matmat01]

The patch crashes my map. I never use JASS. It's full of GUI. But 2 years of work is gone now. I have an idea on what to do but I don't have a clue on where to start. This patch affected WEU's functions. So I think the map is cancelled and I will have to start all over again using the patch's WE or Just make another project. As far as I predict, 2 years from now, warcraft III will die and all these resources (models, skins, tools, maps.) will be put to dump and Modders will start from level 0 again.

GUI is soooo for philosophers.

 

[En_Fuego]

WEU has always been labeled as glitchy and has always been capable of wrecking a map. It's your fault for using it, despite the warnings.

 

[LazyCoder]

Don't use WEU. Learn JASS and do it the ballsy way.