New Rig

[Gilles]

Going to buy a computer soon. I want to spend around 800, but I could wait and spend closer to 1000, so I came up with two builds.

$800

Intel Core 2 Duo E7400 Wolfdale 2.8GHz 3MB L2 Cache LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor

ASUS P5Q SE PLUS LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard

Kingston 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)

ZOTAC ZT-84SEH2P-FSR GeForce 8400 GS 512MB 64-bit GDDR2 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card

RAIDMAX HYBRID 730W SLI Ready CrossFire Ready

Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 ST3500320AS 500GB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive

NZXTComputer Case

Sony Drive

$1000

Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 2.33GHz 4MB L2 Cache LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Processor

ASUS P5Q Pro LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard

OCZ Platinum 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory)

EVGA 512-P3-N944-LR GeForce 9400 GT 512MB 128-bit GDDR2 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready Video Card

RAIDMAX HYBRID 730W SLI Ready CrossFire Ready

Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 ST3500320AS 500GB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive

NZXTComputer Case

Sony Drive

Thoughts?

 

[Dr Super Good]

Top one has a dual core. Dual cores are a dead end it would seem as all modern high end CPUs are quad cored or even oct cored (via methods like HT).
Thus I would recommend a quad core (lower one) as it should reak in great benifits with process intensive games like GTA4 and RTS games.
Also its better graphics card would give it an edge with running games.

However the graphics cards in both would probably be the limating factor far more than the processor.
Although the 400 cards can run games, they are far from a powerful card. Thus I would recommend trying to look out for a 8800GT or 9800 or 280 computer if graphics are your thing.

For a general gaming PC, it should work perfectly with current games (although on medium atmost for really modern games) but it might start to struggle with games 2-3 years from now.

 

[Gilles]

In two to three years I should have something far better.
This is a budget computer.

Duel Cores are running everything just fine right now. I see no reason why I need a quad, although I'd like one.

For graphics cards, I can always upgrade. In fact I'm thinking of leaving out the card when I first build my computer. I'm patient enough to wait for more money and get something good.

 

[Samuraid]

I think you could get better parts for that price. In a little bit, I'll make a run through newegg and come up with a list.

 

[Gilles]

Remember that it's Canadain NewEgg. And I haven't price checked elsewhere, due to lack of time.

I'm also positive that I'm now going to build it without a video card first. Save and get something good instead of wasting money on a cheap card.

I'm also leaning towards a duel core just because they are cheaper. I figure it should run everything fine until I get enough money to really upgrade. Then I'll just skip quad and get an i7, or whatever else comes out in the future (I'll probably upgrade the Mobo and CPU in a year).

 

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

You can get a quad core, 4GB Ram, 4850 video card for just 800$. You just have to buy the parts at the right place and build it yourself.

 

[Dr Super Good]

For 1700$ you can get a top range PC with I7, 6 GB ram, 2 times 1 TB HDD space and 295GTX with 2 year warentee here in the UK. In a few months it will hopefully become cheaper.

 

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Now you're bordering on the useless.

 

[Dr Super Good]

Yes, but if he is looking into the future, he should just start saving up 1700$ and then buy a system with those specs when it equals the ammount of money he has which by then should be more like 1300 or less.

With a system like that, you should be able to play every game at HD on high with highish FPS, and will definatly run games for atleast 4-5 years one would imagine (unless some major change occurs).

It all depends on how you look at it, he could pay under double more and get probably double or better the graphic preformance, or he could pay for a lowish system now and upgrade parts on demand.

It is up to him what to do in the end, and I thought that by providing the price of a top range system it would aid him in reaching a conclusion of what to do.

 

[Gilles]

Yeah, I can't afford 1700. It would take me a long time to save up for that. I want something now, I'm sick of using this piece of shit. I alreayd said I want something that will run everything really well for a year or so. I can save and upgrade to something good next year.

You can get a quad core, 4GB Ram, 4850 video card for just 800$. You just have to buy the parts at the right place and build it yourself.

Think so? I'll keep looking. Like I said, I also don't need a video card right away. I'd rather spend the 800 on everything else. Get the best I can.


Edit: A friend built me this. I like it. I also want to use NCIX. It's a good site, and I get free shipping.

http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=27784
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=28786
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=30418
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=26415
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=33029
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=28169
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=32234&vpn=GH22NS30 BLACK&manufacture=LG Electronics

 

[brad.dude03]

The NCIX rig looks wonderful, just perhaps let Dan add some final suggestions (Or perhaps compile some better replacements, etc).

The man knows his stuff.

 

[Samuraid]

Sorry, I forgot about this. I'll get to it very soon.

EDIT: Some of the things you posted above are good choices, but some are not necessary or overpriced. Post coming soon...

 

[Samuraid]

Ok, just a disclaimer:
- These are just some suggestions based on a rough idea of what you want. You should take the list of parts and shop around to see if any places offer them for less money.
- This is a "higher performance for less money" computer. It doesn't have top speed parts, but what it does have is sufficient to play most games a good quality settings.
- If you can spare about ~$50 CAD more, then go with a Radeon 4870.
- Also, you don't need a 750W Corsair PSU, that's horrible overkill.

Newegg.ca - LG Black 20X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 16X DVD+R DL 20X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 12X DVD-RAM 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 32X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM 2MB Cache SATA 20X DVD±R DVD Burner w/ SecurDisc Tech - CD / DVD Burners
Newegg.ca - Antec Three Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Computer Cases
Newegg.ca - SAMSUNG Spinpoint F1 HD502lJ 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - Internal Hard Drives
Newegg.ca - SAPPHIRE 100245L Radeon HD 4850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Desktop Graphics / Video Cards
Newegg.ca - CORSAIR CMPSU-400CX 400W ATX12V V2.2 80 PLUS Certified Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply - Power Supplies
Newegg.ca - Kingston 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Desktop Memory
Newegg.ca - GIGABYTE GA-EP43-DS3L LGA 775 Intel P43 ATX Intel Motherboard - Intel Motherboards
Newegg.ca - Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz 6MB L2 Cache LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor - Processors - Desktops

 

[Gilles]

As stated, I'd prefer to use NCIX, even if the price is a little higher.
Of course I'll look at what you posted.

Alright, I looked it all over. Is what you posted better than my build overall? Seems worse, and it costs more (except that it has a video card, so it's probably the same).

The power supply is what I want. I don't want anything under $100.

The case might be a bit expensive, but it's supposed to be a really good one, and it will allow for upgrades and eventual OC. The one you posted looks pretty solid though.

What is the difference between the Mobo? The one you posted, I can get for a fair bit cheaper, but is it worth it if I'm willing to spend on the other one? Is the only big difference the two PCIex16 slots?

The RAM is a fair bit cheaper, but it's also less powerful. Not sure what I would want to do.


Edit: I've decided to go with a different Mobo. I don't need crossfire support, so I went with basically the same board, but with one less PCIex16 slot.

For RAM, I went with 8000 instead of 8500. No heat sink and 66MHz less, but a bit cheaper.

 

[Samuraid]

As stated, I'd prefer to use NCIX, even if the price is a little higher.
Of course I'll look at what you posted.

Alright, I looked it all over. Is what you posted better than my build overall? Seems worse, and it costs more (except that it has a video card, so it's probably the same).

The video card runs you $170+ CAD, and since the video card is very important, I would say that what I suggested would actually still be a better deal (especially if you shop around for similar parts on NCIX)

The power supply is what I want. I don't want anything under $100.

Suit yourself, but realize that you are wasting money on a bigger supply and extra power costs. Getting such a large supply (especially when the build I specified uses only around 275W at absolute peak load) will be less efficient, as the power supply will be running around 20-30% capacity instead of the more efficient 60-80% capacity. You will spend more money on the 750W, gain nothing, and spend more money on power too.

The case might be a bit expensive, but it's supposed to be a really good one, and it will allow for upgrades and eventual OC. The one you posted looks pretty solid though.

Your choice. I just picked the Antec 300 as it has a very solid reputation (I've used a lot of Antec, including the 900 series) and has good cooling and airflow.

What is the difference between the Mobo? The one you posted, I can get for a fair bit cheaper, but is it worth it if I'm willing to spend on the other one? Is the only big difference the two PCIex16 slots?

The board you chose is an enthusiast board, and the only I chose is more mainstream. Generally, the price premium on the more expensive board does not get you much extra performance, only extra add-ons that not everyone uses anyway.

The RAM is a fair bit cheaper, but it's also less powerful. Not sure what I would want to do.

At stock speeds, you will be running the RAM at 800MHz anyway. No need to pay for 1066MHz DDR2 if you aren't going to use it. If you overclock your FSB to 400MHz (to get a CPU clock of 3.6GHz with a 9x multiplier), then you should be running your memory divider at 2 anyway, which puts your RAM at 800MHz still, so no need to get faster stuff.

Edit: I've decided to go with a different Mobo. I don't need crossfire support, so I went with basically the same board, but with one less PCIex16 slot.

For RAM, I went with 8000 instead of 8500. No heat sink and 66MHz less, but a bit cheaper.

Sounds like a fine choice for the motherboard. No need to get crossfire, especially if you can just get a Radeon 4850 X2, Radeon 4870 X2, or GeForce GX295 and stick it in a single slot.

 

[Gilles]

The video card runs you $170+ CAD, and since the video card is very important, I would say that what I suggested would actually still be a better deal (especially if you shop around for similar parts on NCIX)

That's true, but the plan is to wait a few weeks, maybe a month, and buy a really good card. Not waste money on something only decent. I'm willing to wait.

Suit yourself, but realize that you are wasting money on a bigger supply and extra power costs. Getting such a large supply (especially when the build I specified uses only around 275W at absolute peak load) will be less efficient, as the power supply will be running around 20-30% capacity instead of the more efficient 60-80% capacity. You will spend more money on the 750W, gain nothing, and spend more money on power too.

I've been told by a trusted friend to spend at least $100. The watts could be a bit high as you said. I'll look into quality lower wattage supplies. Also, how can you tell what watts you'll need? What hardware should I be looking at to see? Obviously the processor, what else?

Your choice. I just picked the Antec 300 as it has a very solid reputation (I've used a lot of Antec, including the 900 series) and has good cooling and airflow.

I prefer the large size, and the over-the-top cooling of the coolmaster. Although I'll look into the Antecs.

At stock speeds, you will be running the RAM at 800MHz anyway. No need to pay for 1066MHz DDR2 if you aren't going to use it. If you overclock your FSB to 400MHz (to get a CPU clock of 3.6GHz with a 9x multiplier), then you should be running your memory divider at 2 anyway, which puts your RAM at 800MHz still, so no need to get faster stuff.

Unfortunately I can't quite follow you there. I'm pretty new to this. : (
I get the gist though. So when using core duos, there's no point in getting anything above 800? When do you get something higher? Quads?

Sounds like a fine choice for the motherboard. No need to get crossfire, especially if you can just get a Radeon 4850 X2, Radeon 4870 X2, or GeForce GX295 and stick it in a single slot.

That's what I figured. Most of my friends are running single cards, and they hold up fine. I'm not trying to benchmark.

Here is what I've got now. In a bit I'll look into a new PSU and case.

PCU: http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=27784

Mobo: http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=31839

RAM: http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=26456

PSU: http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=26415

Case:http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=29812&vpn=THREE HUNDRED&manufacture=ANTEC

I switched the cases. The Antec 300 seems good. Not quite as nice as the other one, but good nonetheless. The only reason I would want the other is looking ahead for future upgrades. I think this will do though.

After checking out RAM, I don't really see anything I like. These two are about all I could find.
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=31392&vpn=KVR800D2N5K2/4G&manufacture=Kingston
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=28406&vpn=VS4GBKIT667D2&manufacture=CORSAIR
I'd save $10. I see no reason to bother with 800.

What I've got above, will cost me 800 with taxes. That's pretty damn good I think.

More updates. This post is getting long.

These are two PSUs I looked at.
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=16602&vpn=NEO HE550&manufacture=ANTEC
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=25984&vpn=CMPSU-550VX&manufacture=CORSAIR
If I'm willing to spend the extra little bit, won't it be worth it to just get a 750watt? It's one less thing to upgrade later. My friend just ran into PSU trouble. He can't use his new PCU because his computer is underpowered.

 

[Gilles]

Double post.

Some stuff happened, and I can get a video card now. I may also be able to upgrade some other stuff, but it's unlikely.

Here are a couple of cards I was looking at.

NCIX.com - Buy BFG GeForce 9800GTX+ OC REV.B 760MHZ 512MB 2.25GHZ GDDR3 PCI-E Dual DVI-I HDCP HDTV Out Video Card - BFGE98512GTXPOCBE In Canada.

http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=34549&vpn=512-P3-N879-AR&manufacture=eVGA

 

[Samuraid]

No offense meant to your friend, but having a "$100 minimum" for a PSU does not automatically mean you will get a good power supply. As I mentioned before, it's actually worse to overbuy.

Corsair makes excellent power supplies, but you wouldn't need 750W+ unless you were running something really heavy like SLI/Crossfire with 2-3 really high-end cards.

The 400W PSU I suggested above would power almost any single video card on the market (including hybrid cards like the 4870 X2 and GX295) with the other components you selected.

A 500W-550W Corsair PSU could easily power a midrange SLI/Crossfire configuration, like dual 4850's or dual GX260's.

As for the graphics card choice, you might want to check this article for some suggestions so you can make the most of your money:
Best Graphics Cards For The Money: Jan. '09 : Best Cards For The Money: December Review/January Updates - Review Tom's Hardware

 

[Gilles]

I imagine my friend simply meant that as a guideline. He said in the first few PCs he built, he went cheap on the power, and it came back to haunt him. He knows his stuff, he's a fair bit older than me, and he's been through university for computers. No offense intended to you Sam, but I'd trust a personal friend over someone on the internet, I'm sure you understand. : )

However, after looking around on forums and guides, you are right after all. I'll probably go with a 500 since I might get a 4780 X2, and I plan on upgrading to quad core eventually.

How about something like this?
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=26660&vpn=NEOPOWER 500&manufacture=ANTEC
Or
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=35940&promoid=0

Do you have a preference between the 4780s and the GX200 series?

As well, would a 4870 series card run most games coming out on high (only one, and not X2)?

 

[Samuraid]

I imagine my friend simply meant that as a guideline. He said in the first few PCs he built, he went cheap on the power, and it came back to haunt him. He knows his stuff, he's a fair bit older than me, and he's been through university for computers. No offense intended to you Sam, but I'd trust a personal friend over someone on the internet, I'm sure you understand. : )

I understand completely. (for what it's worth though, I do have a university degree in computer engineering)

I assume our MSN conversation covered any remaining questions. As for your question about video card preference, I would pick a Radeon 4850 or 4870 over a GX260 or GX280 for price/efficiency reasons. But I would pick a GX295 over a 4870 X2.

 

[Gilles]

Alright, I'll bear that in mind. Thanks for all the help.

 

[thelifelessone]

Quad-core AMDs. Best thing you can do for your computer.

1. Quad-core = faster
2. AMD = cheaper

 

[Gilles]

I'm going with Intel.

Alright, here is my final build.

NCIX.com - Buy Samsung Spinpoint T Series HD501LJ 500GB SATA2 7200RPM 8.9MS 16MB 3.5IN Hard Drive OEM 3YR MFR Wrnty - HD501LJ In Canada.

NCIX.com - Buy LG GH22NS30 Black DVD+RW 22X8X16 DVD-RW 22X6X16 DL 16X/12X 2MB SATA OEM - GH22NS30 BLACK In Canada.

NCIX.com - Buy ASUS P5QL Pro ATX LGA775 P43 DDR2 1PCI-E16 2PCI-E1 3PCI SATA2 Sound GBLAN Motherboard - P5QL Pro In Canada.

NCIX.com - Buy G.SKILL F2-8000CL5D-4GBPQ PC2-8000 4GB 2X2GB DDR2-1000 CL5-5-5-15 240PIN Dual Channel Memory Kit - F2-8000CL5D-4GBPQ In Canada.

NCIX.com - Buy Antec Three Hundred Mini Tower Gaming Case 300 ATX 3X5.25 6X3.5INT No PS Front USB & Audio - THREE HUNDRED In Canada.

NCIX.com - Buy PC Power & Cooling Silencer 610W EPS12V ATX V2.2 24PIN SLI Ready Active PFC 80MM Fan Power Supply - S61EPS In Canada.

NCIX.com - Buy Sapphire Radeon HD 4870 512MB GDDR5 PCI-E 2XDVI-I Video Card - 11133-03-20R In Canada.

NCIX.com - Buy Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition OEM - N09-01153OEM In Canada.

NCIX.com - Buy Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Dual Core Processor LGA775 3.0GHZ Wolfdale 1333FSB 6MB Retail - BX80570E8400 In Canada.

Final price of $1,200.