Naval Tactics 2022

[Moderator]

19:14, 13th Aug 2010
ap0calypse: Approved

 

[irock9645696]

Dling and testing some other time

 

[Greetz_DK]

I tip my hat in you're direction sir, bravo!

At first i did not excpet such a gem hiding under that awful map preview! (I played full house)
Heres some suggestions:

Gameplay
I like the idea of manning sea vessels with, but alas, i was dissapionted at my selection. I know its only beta but there need to be more.

• Cannoneer: Changes the vessels damage to siege.
• Cook: Keeps morale (mana) up.
• Duelist: Adds the ability "Board ship". Wich tempoarily stuns and deals damage based on how many on board.
• Bard: Bonuses in form of % to movement, attack and defense.
• Necromancer: Makes mana useless as spells now costs health + plus small health gain from killing enemy ships.
• Royalty: The crew is in a constant state of awareness thus increasing defense.

Like the vessels make units for use in trade ports, for an example:

• Mason: Adds four towers to the port.
• Black market: Higher income, but at a slower rate.

Visually
Change the nationality of the four players, you want to feel special

Change the models of Kerrigan and Raynolds (They look the same as my old ships! Dissapointment ensues!)

About the islands, you dont want to have people looking behind objects. Some islands have tall buildings and norther beach'es beaches you can't see!

Stick to a theme for each islands. The large orc base in the middle is a prime example. Its cluttered and seemingly random. Is it a sacrificial temple? A lumber camp? Random straw land?

Ashenvale trees with palms?

And last but not less important, rotation! Some islands has multiple tents that all points in the same direction, not pretty!

Final thought
There was two missing tooltips, the pyro and navigator (fix it immediately)
Apart from what i have already said i really liked the map, it was great! But still with a lot of room for improvements and new ideas.
Its a diamond in the rough, but you seem like the man with the tool to make a truly great map.
Will definetly check it out, and give a review, when you have it updated.

 

[Hobbit_baron]

the idea is quite interesting after finishing the exams will test it and comment shurely

 

[gangu]

good game! can't wait for a next one!

 

[gangu]

hey how does the ships move and how do you make the units back into units instead of items ?

 

[irock9645696]

Dont multi-post dude use edit

you nid to load the units into the boats

 

[JansiGX]

idea is good and could turn to be a really good map but for now there are not much good points.

units as you power-ups and trade route system is grate combination.
All ships are heroes but there is no hero icons for them (awesome), how is that possible?

The worse so far are tool tips. most units/items have there default tool tips. Which are simply useless.
There's got to be more units/ships/slots. Currently combinations are not that much possible as one slot must be occupied by footman.
Also items should turn back into units if I drop them.
few rifleman are actually better than a ship! drop there hp to about 100. all units should have less hp infarct.

Both unloced ships should be different (at least in coloring).
Also good idea would be units that give better bonuses but can enter only good ships(example: Elite Rifleman-adds 50 dmg; can enter Kerrigan Frigate only)

For now I can't give rating for this map but as you will work on this map I vote for approval

 

[Maynard]

idea is good and could turn to be a really good map but for now there are not much good points.

units as you power-ups and trade route system is grate combination.
All ships are heroes but there is no hero icons for them (awesome), how is that possible?

The worse so far are tool tips. most units/items have there default tool tips. Which are simply useless.
There's got to be more units/ships/slots. Currently combinations are not that much possible as one slot must be occupied by footman.
Also items should turn back into units if I drop them.
few rifleman are actually better than a ship! drop there hp to about 100. all units should have less hp infarct.

Both unloced ships should be different (at least in coloring).
Also good idea would be units that give better bonuses but can enter only good ships(example: Elite Rifleman-adds 50 dmg; can enter Kerrigan Frigate only)

For now I can't give rating for this map but as you will work on this map I vote for approval

Thanks man. Im not surprised that people like the idea, since i have always been a concept man. Whether my abilities to carry out my idea will follow suit is another question altogether. I have limited time, but i vow there will be updates for this game. You are right that his game is very rough, and tooltips will get done in time.

Taking away the hero icons is possible by using the object editor.

I was really hoping that the footman speed bonus would stack, but because they dont, im thinking of scrapping the entire footman item altogether, that said, i will be giving a research for a battleship type unit that starts with 4 slots and upgrades to 6, so more unit combinations will be possible.

The system i used for returning items into units was really buggy, and either lost the unit altogether or gave the player two units. For this reason i decided to scrap the system until it worked. (should work in next update).

All units will be toned down yes, i pretty much neutered all thier attacks and hoped that would do the trick for the current version, but next version im gonna just remove them and make their health lowered as suggested.

Thanks for the suggestion to differentiate the unlocked ships, i didnt even think about that.

Im not sure on the elite units, but i was thinking of making like, more expensive combined unit type things. might integrate little of both.

 

[gangu]

Please do add an unload icon? and can you actually sell the units ?

Awesome game! But i will really hope that the item "units" can turned be into A unit ..

3/5 for now!

 

[Chizume]

I laughed when my swordmen turned into items outside the boat. Contains many bugs but it is definitely something I've never seen before. Something I'd like to point out especially is the delay when loading a unit onto a boat - it's rather annoying.

Good luck with the project, test the map a few times and check for errors!

Yours,
Chizume

 

[Maynard]

I laughed when my swordmen turned into items outside the boat. Contains many bugs but it is definitely something I've never seen before. Something I'd like to point out especially is the delay when loading a unit onto a boat - it's rather annoying.

Good luck with the project, test the map a few times and check for errors!

Yours,
Chizume

lol. that delay happens because the unit is unacustomed to making the entire journey. Normally the boat has the movements speed to be able to move over to the unit and meet it half way. Its a pathfinding thing, and i cant really do much about it. Unless i end up scrapping the entire footman item in favor of individual boat speeds. Glad to hear you enjoyed the map, will be updating it soon.

 

[Chizume]

lol. that delay happens because the unit is unacustomed to making the entire journey. Normally the boat has the movements speed to be able to move over to the unit and meet it half way. Its a pathfinding thing, and i cant really do much about it. Unless i end up scrapping the entire footman item in favor of individual boat speeds. Glad to hear you enjoyed the map, will be updating it soon.

I'm not too familiar with high-tech triggers, but can't you just totally scrap the load/unload ability and start from scratch with another one, aka channel?

And about having swordsmen for boat speed. I like the realistic, so what about you make a unit called Sailor or Crewguy or whatever which will increase movement speed (or all actual boat stats). Then give the swordsmen-item a melee phoenix fire ability? The same may go with the riflemen, giving them a ranged phoenix fire ability. Imo it could be cool, but it may be out of your concept (just tossing ideas).

Sharing is caring!

Yours,
Chizume

 

[Maynard]

The map has been updated. It is nearing a more polished game format. I would suggest replaying the game if you havent already because of the vast new changes to game strategy.

 

[JansiGX]

selection circles of all ships should be displayed on water not bellow.

In the description of Galleon it's said it has huge range but it's only 500.

All regular ships have Human frigate or transport ship model while neutral have cool locking Orc frigates... so unfair

and is there a way to revive Flag ship?

 

[Maynard]

selection circles of all ships should be displayed on water not bellow.

In the description of Galleon it's said it has huge range but it's only 500.

All regular ships have Human frigate or transport ship model while neutral have cool locking Orc frigates... so unfair

and is there a way to revive Flag ship?

i should fix the selection circles yes.

The galleon is sadly bugged. Im not sure why the range got halved like that. It should be 1000. Should be fixed in the next version.

I used different colors, but i could use like. NE ships as my models too?
and i had always envisioned custom models eventually.

The flagship revives at your central tradeport (the one that all your merchant ships return to).

 

[JansiGX]

I don't know how good you are with World Editor but if it helps:
-Look for "Art - Selection circle on water" to fix the circles
-Did you changed Acquisition Range of galleon to allow bigger range?

And also engineer still have left worker classification making all idle engineers be selectable with idle worker button.

 

[Maynard]

Alright. Thanks for all the help jansig. Ill leave a thank you in the quests menu.
=D


So, besides pointing out bugs (which is much appreciated all the same). what did you guys think of the map?
was loading units into ships a chore? Did you have fun? Did the extra unit combinations come into play at all or was it just "load bunch of rifles into the ships and googoogogogogoogo"?

 

[gangu]

Can you add a mercenary e.g. Hiring a pirate?

 

[Maynard]

Can you add a mercenary e.g. Hiring a pirate?

Ive had this in mind for a while now. And i think that it will happen soon. I am currently working on a system where pirates poach your stuff and roam around a bit. So that you arent just sitting around screwing with your enemy the entire time.

 

[Moon Lord Hawkeye]

Wow, very cool map idea, it looks (and sounds) extremly fun. i'll DL and test with my brother right away.

could i just make a suggestion?

You say that there's a unit that gives your ships immolation, correct? maybe you could implement a system where the ship actually loses health while the immolation is on it, to make it more realistic. Also, maybe you could add some type of stealth boat, without the assassin item added to it?
Maybe give it permanant Invisibility, but nerf it's health and attack, to make it more like a scout ship?

And a ship that rams as it's main attack would be cool. You could have it deal large damage to enemy ships, but take damage as well when it attacks.

 

[Maynard]

Wow, very cool map idea, it looks (and sounds) extremly fun. i'll DL and test with my brother right away.

could i just make a suggestion?

You say that there's a unit that gives your ships immolation, correct? maybe you could implement a system where the ship actually loses health while the immolation is on it, to make it more realistic. Also, maybe you could add some type of stealth boat, without the assassin item added to it?
Maybe give it permanant Invisibility, but nerf it's health and attack, to make it more like a scout ship?

And a ship that rams as it's main attack would be cool. You could have it deal large damage to enemy ships, but take damage as well when it attacks.

Thanks moony, i originally planned for ships to lose health while using imo... but i havent yet found a workable system for it. working on it.
Stealth boat, possibly.

triremes are definitely in development.




In other news.... I hate to admit this, but i currently find myself without a computer. My good friend Hawk will be finished with an amazing weather system for me by sunday of this weekend, but i doubt i will be able to use it for a while.
So i suppose i will have to say, work on this project has been postponed. indefinitely. If/when i resume work you will all be informed.

IN THE MEANTIME:
some crunchy bits for you to chew on for the next update.
1.2C will be a simple update without any major changes. other than some pirate events and a more rounded system of types and quests/ learning curve type thing.

But 1.3 will be a vast and sweeping Renaissance of Naval Tactics.
-The aforementioned weather system will be in full swing, bringing weather conditions into play. and some units or ships will be more/ less affected by them. (a good example is galley slaves. during fair weather they do little, but during low wind periods, when no one can move due to the lack of wind power, they give your ship maneuverability while your opponents are rooted in place!) The lumbermill as a building will play a big role in this system, (yes, i did keep that there for a reason, it was not a bug).
-The terrain will be completely redone. Bases will be more compact, and the ocean will be expanded enough so there is room for 8 players!!! (over the current 4). Team play will also be encouraged.
-Pirate events from 1.2C will be expanded on to adjust for the larger terrain.
-Static trade as it is now is pretty broken. The map will be large enough to support 4 individual trade routs instead of 2 routes for 4 cities. (the destinations of static trade will no longer be a different Static trade port, simply a recieving trade port) I will probably make events where the static trade routes change just to make things interesting.
-the phat lewt will actually be used for something!!!
-another savage/neutral hostile base will be included in the expanded terrain.
-hero ships will be refined, and abilities will not be useless (lol@ trueshot aura)
-an actual techtree will be included. so that variations in gameplay will be more likely.

Also, my third failure to fix the item-unit transfer bug has not gone unnoticed, and i will definitely find a way to address it between now and the release of 1.3.


If/when i have 1.3 released and have a few subsequent quick fix/balance/polish versions out i will consider taking the game out of beta and releasing it As is to be reviewed.

 

[Moon Lord Hawkeye]

Hrm, i've played it... and loved it.


Combat was a little slow at first, and i thin kit would be a better idea to have tiers of units, that can upgrade from your castle, instead of upgrades from the lumber mill. The lumber mill could be used to advance tiers of units (sloop, frigate, ect) while your castle allows you to get more. Additionally, you could add a worker unit that can build additional shipyards, for specific ships.

Balancing was good, and the heroes, well you're already fixing them. I eagerly await the unveiling of this new weather system, as there's a melee map i've been making that i want to have one in, unfortunatly i'm not skilled enought to do it myself.

I'm glad that some of my suggestions could be of use, and i think i may have a way to make immolation hurt the units, but i'll have to fool around in the editor for a while, just to make sure it works.

Something legendary should be put in the middle, a big tomb or something, where the Phatest Lewt of the Phat Lewts resides...

I'm laughing at the fact that it'll have a use.

 

[Maynard]

Thank god. Work on this project will resume. =D
Expect a big update soon.

 

[The_Phalanx]

Looks like the edit in

Looking forward to playing this with you Doc, and adding another notch to the totem pole of people who've beaten you xD

 

[Moon Lord Hawkeye]

Hm, nice to see that it's been updated.

I'll dl the new one when i get the chance, which might not be too soon unfortunatly. School, and my very limited patience with writing have gotten the best of me.

But, if there is one thing i could suggest...

The change from normal boat sounds to hero sounds in the case of normal ships vs hero ships is a little wierd. Maybe if you made all of the ships have some sort of talking sound set? I'd also suggest renaming the ships, as it's a little wierd to sink a flagship named "Admiral _______." Maybe something like the SS Demonica or SS Valkyrie... or something.


And that brings me to another idea... damn, i'm cranking them out for a map that's not even mine, this is REDICULOUS!

I know it'd be crazy hard work, buuuuuut.... maybe different hero types for different bases? heck, all you'd need to do is copy paste a few, and change the model file, that'd make it cool.

And i don't know if you've done this, but different models for our ships other than the standardised human ones.


On that happy note, i have seen a oddity. A few Neutral hostile ships, look like human transport ships. Anyways, they're called orc frigates

Take from this what you will or won't, i'm just glad i could help in some small capacity.


EDIT: Ah, yet another idea. What if you gave each ship individual attack and movment speeds. granted, keep them low, but it just seems natural to me to have a high tier unit like the Kerrigan Class to have higher base attack and speed then a lowly Kael Sloop... or maybe i'm just crazy, and don't remember there being differences. Been a while since i played this game, let alone Warcraft 3.

 

[Maynard]

Hm, nice to see that it's been updated.

I'll dl the new one when i get the chance, which might not be too soon unfortunatly. School, and my very limited patience with writing have gotten the best of me.

But, if there is one thing i could suggest...

The change from normal boat sounds to hero sounds in the case of normal ships vs hero ships is a little wierd. Maybe if you made all of the ships have some sort of talking sound set? I'd also suggest renaming the ships, as it's a little wierd to sink a flagship named "Admiral _______." Maybe something like the SS Demonica or SS Valkyrie... or something.


And that brings me to another idea... damn, i'm cranking them out for a map that's not even mine, this is REDICULOUS!

I know it'd be crazy hard work, buuuuuut.... maybe different hero types for different bases? heck, all you'd need to do is copy paste a few, and change the model file, that'd make it cool.

And i don't know if you've done this, but different models for our ships other than the standardised human ones.


On that happy note, i have seen a oddity. A few Neutral hostile ships, look like human transport ships. Anyways, they're called orc frigates

Take from this what you will or won't, i'm just glad i could help in some small capacity.


EDIT: Ah, yet another idea. What if you gave each ship individual attack and movment speeds. granted, keep them low, but it just seems natural to me to have a high tier unit like the Kerrigan Class to have higher base attack and speed then a lowly Kael Sloop... or maybe i'm just crazy, and don't remember there being differences. Been a while since i played this game, let alone Warcraft 3.

Thank you so much for you continued help with this. As far as individual attack and movement speeds, look at the kael class swoop, then look at say... the goliath class galleon. You will see how ive already done this. Although i dont remember to what extent i modified the Kerrigan Class.

Eventually i would like to use Mr. Bob's ship models in this map. But for now its just function.


Wait? i thought all boats were boat soundset? i should check up on that thanks for the catch.
Different hero types? no thanks... There are 8 players, i dont want to make 8 personalized admirals. As far as the names go... i suppose i could change them from the admirals name to a ship name.

If you do try it out make sure to play the most current version. im updating about once a week now.

 

[Maynard]

Gah! sorry about this, the past two versions were bugged pretty badly, (2.0 A & B)
please download the current 2.0C because it has all of the fixes included.
(fixes include:
the upgrades for new ships are now in the lumber mill.
the starting gold is now appropriately at 300 again.
the key trade ports in the middle have been replaced with a newer correct key trade port)

 

[The_Phalanx]

You gotta get on the ball there doc!

/me hides all the fail versions of TSK XD

 

[Maynard]

O shit... i apologize to everyone this has been a bumpy road. all the bugs will be fixed and the game will soon be playable.

Edit:
the game is now fully playable, if you have a version before 2.1A, then i suggest deleting it and DLing a newer version, as the versions before were hopelessly bugged.
If you encounter problems with upgrading to a colony from a key trade port, try recapturing (attacking and destroying) the port until it is remade.

 

[Maynard]

Just updated to the final version.
Due to the nature of the warcraft three community in the shadow of Starcraft 2, i dont think it would be appropriate for me to continue working on this project. If there is a game breaking bug that needs addressing i will fix it, but beyond that do not expect any major updates from this map.
Please feel free to comment and give feedback, as there will be a good chance that i will be converting this or something similar into the SC2 editor. (im currently playing the beta).

Thank you for all of your help, suggestions, and interest. As always it is very appreciated. If your looking to find more maps from me or my clan, please visit us at
http://lsi.comxa.com/forum/portal.php

 

[Cweener]

Approve.
3.5/5
Interesting.

 

[The_Phalanx]

Congrats Doc.

 

[Maynard]

Why thank you! =D