1. Triumph has risen from these uncharted shores. The 34th Modeling Contest Results are out!
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Awaken what lies in the heart of your swarm. The 17th Techtree Contest has arrived!
    Dismiss Notice
  3. The Hive Workshop is launching its first HD modelling contest. How HD should it be?
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Check out the Staff Job Openings thread.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Hive 3 Remoosed BETA - NOW LIVE. Go check it out at BETA Hive Workshop! Post your feedback in this new forum BETA Feedback.
Dismiss Notice
60,000 passwords have been reset on July 8, 2019. If you cannot login, read this.

Lets talk about PvP

Discussion in 'Warcraft Discussion' started by BalanceDruid7, Mar 22, 2018.

  1. BalanceDruid7

    BalanceDruid7

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2015
    Messages:
    34
    Resources:
    0
    Resources:
    0
    [​IMG]
    PvP in Action games.

    Competitiveness, skill, challenge, the potential to outplay your opponent in fast-paced combat, action (mostly Hero Arenas). I'm not talking about strategy type like Castle Fight, Legion TD, Azeroth Wars (whatever today's kidz play) that isn't in the action category.

    Famous WC3 PvP maps?
    I can't find any maps known for their competitiveness other than DotA and Warlocks.
    Maybe WoW arena too, but its not very original and not on DotA/Warlock's level.
    Please suggest me any good PvP action maps other than the ones I already mentioned above. I'd love to check them out and be proven wrong.

    Is the PvP factor dead in Warcraft/Hive?
    I'm not that active on hive and I've seen many awesome things here but it feels as this factor is dying in both Warcraft 3 and Hive as a whole. People care about the PvP experience the least (balance aside obviously) compared to the rest. Trigger efficiency (not leaks/lag, but shorter triggers that do practically the same thing in-game) is valued higher than this, even grammar! When it comes down to rating maps, I don't see people judging on the factor for outplay potential. I wonder if people don't see it as a factor at all or don't value it as high or just happened that I haven't seen it yet, or is it only for the action games specifically.

    [​IMG]

    Its important
    Today's most famous games are the competitive games: League, Dota, HotS, CS:GO, Overwatch etc
    This factor is what makes players keep playing the game/map after few times without being bored to death since there is always something to improve on and challenge better opponents, its what creates tournaments, allows pro players to gain fame and respect, make living out of (in bigger games).


    Sorry for any grammar mistakes (this is my 2nd upload on hive)
    Any replies are appreciated.
     
  2. StoPCampinGn00b

    StoPCampinGn00b

    Community Manager

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2013
    Messages:
    2,077
    Resources:
    1
    Maps:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    Legion TD, Castle Fight, Survival Chaos, and similar PVP maps are more akin to chess. They've indeed become more popular with Warcraft 3's age. The draw to these maps is that they can be relaxing and competitive at the same time; they're rarely stressful. I personally find myself bored after playing these maps too much but they are popular for a reason.
    Large strategy maps like Azeroth Wars, Risk, Lordaeron the Aftermath are closer to diplomatic strategy games with RTS/RPG mechanics, where the combat is fast paced but some of the decision making is more macro and diplomatic based. Both of these genres are very competitive and really fun as they often serve a lot more dynamic and variety than what most Arena PVP maps WC3 has to offer. There are ton more scenarios regarding faction allegiance, trust, different tech tree paths, etc.

    The popular fast paced PVP maps aren't just DotA and Warlock. But you claim that people aren't rating them highly and the reasoning behind it that is because there's a lack of creativity and uniqueness in the genre. The arena and MOBA genre is often filled with uninspired copies of DotA and other popular maps. This market was so over-saturated that 1. people got tired of it or 2. They just stick to the familiar DotA or MOBA standalone like LoL. In addition, it's really difficult for players to invest in multiple MOBA type maps and games... because you need to put more time into it in order to not suck against people who've played them longer than you have. These games also don't play as well when there isn't an active enough community for ELO to work, for teamwork to work, for tournaments, etc. This genre has been over-saturated for the longest time on WC3 and only in the past few years have we seen other genres dominate on a more proportionate scale. All of these reasons combined are why it's hard to break into the PVP Arena genre with a new map without relying on what already exists. And when people overly rely on what already exists, the product is uninspired.

    DotA, Warlock, Battle Tanks, Horde vs Alliance, Hero Push, Pudge Wars, Battle Stadium DON, FOC Another, and Battleships, are still fairly popular. However, other maps in this genre have taken a different route and I think that's a good thing. They may not wield a competitive league or anything of the likes, but they do stand on their own. Stuff like WoW Arena, Rise of Winterchill, Infinity Anime, Cataclysm AoS, Battle for Tatooine, WoW Battlegrounds, and Revenant of Ruins I've played and are fun or I've heard are really good.
    Filtered to highest rated [x]AoS [x]Arena maps Maps | HIVE

    This isn't your main point but I wanted to touch on it : D
    Fortnight, PUBG, and Sea of Thieves are not competitive team vs team games yet they are just as popular, or even more popular in this current trend of FFA/Battle Royale-esque games. Adventure SRPGs like Super Mario Odyssey, Zelda: BOTW, and Monster Hunter World have also had ridiculous success, even after years of people saying the RPG genre is dead - they just came in a different form that aren't MMO's. And of course there are ton of other genres taking a piece of the pie.

    Don't get me wrong, I love fast pace team vs team games. I've played too many shooters for over a decade and I think Overwatch is something special. But I think your perception on the market is a little exaggerated. There's a lot more out there!
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2018