Legion TD Mega 3.5 (B4) + 3.41 unprotect

[mightym8]

I think that elf nature orc and mech are really strong. Dont know how to do good income with arctic but y. and beast and demi are just weak vs magic so u have a hard time with lvl 8 ^^

 

[HuanAk]

@HuanAK - Necro is not good dps anymore. Undead dragon is still good slow + dps. Pudge is so-so tank with only ~1700 hp. No one builds the T1 and T2 undead units.
Yes, Merc is not fun anymore because it's very hard to start as Merc and then change to another race permanently. If you don't change back to Merc, you will leak at the later levels.

@mightym8 - I agree that Marine is a little weak. Overall, Mech/Arctic/Orc are pretty good even up to the last levels. In most games, with those 3 races I can get to 7/10 or 7/11 by level 20. If there's some leak in the game, 7/13 is possible at 20. Shadow/Demi/and Elf are above average. I'm not so good with Nature, but I've seen some good Nature players. Goblin, Element, and Marine are OK races but they are too weak later and always need to change builder earlier. You have to fix Hybrid. There is no big advantage to using Hybrid over Prophet. It just don't make sense to pick Hybrid.

The game influenced by duration of each wave is fine I think. The noob players that just income have a hard time with the later levels and don't have enough wood to send high summons.

--Bugs-
-Moon guard mana doesn't regen.
-creep counter is wrong. All the creep can be dead, but the counter still show's 2 creep alive, and it only counts them dead like 5-8 seconds after the last creep dies.
-creeps get stuck more often now.
-one unit on level 20 team fight still runs out to die before round starts sometimes
-the west side's king disappeared at around 22. It had 0 hp (we never killed him) and the game just kept going.
-Bigfoot does NOT stun anymore. 8 Bigfoots just fought normally without one stun. The Tauren does do quake.

Beta 8 is out, all bug on your list is fixed.

except I am not sure about King disappear bug (possible fixed, I tested them in 2 game with 3v3, look like it gone, let me know if it still happen)

 

[HuanAk]

I know u are very buisy right now with fixing lot of things and improving code
but i just wanted to add some things that came to my mind.

I already mentioned marine and ghost some posts ago.
Cause i think marine is very weak. they got so weak long range. hatchling upgrade is good vs boss lvls but eggsack and bottomfeeder are just useless units. and t4 is providing a shield to a unit and the upgrade has a small healing "aoe" but if u compare it to goliath or elder witch doctor it is just a joke. like goliath is providing almost the hole team and this t4 unit only gives a shield to a single unit. same with healing aura.
The Upgrade of commodo is pretty useful cause it is tankie and got medium armor and therefore strong vs magic. But i dont feel like sea giant is useful at all. and its upgrade is hmmm ... u build it to tank a little bit. but compared to other t6 units it is trash. I think sea giant is the worst t6 unit and since this race hasnt got many good units it is just unbalanced.

There is one big problem about ghost called gravekeeper. This unit has very slow attack speed but a nice aura. But it becomes useless vs ranged units.
Pls correct me if i am wrong. but especially in the last waves like 24 28 and 29 i got the feeling that their aura doesnt affect the enemy units cause they are out of their range. Or only a few units are affected.

last but not least something i like to talk about. A game i pretty much influenced by the duration of each wave. I know both teams got the same time to lumber and increase income per round. But I really prefer games that gives more advantage to guys that spend more money on whisps and upgrades. i saw many games where noob teams had 3/0 whisp/upgrade on level 20 and just built units. so every level was pretty short. And it is very hard to manage to get like 7/9 till level 20 with so less time. and u dont got much profit from it.
I dont got a good idea how to improve it. but i really appreciate to benefit players that have a hard time with building many whisps in the beginning. e.g. for every whisp and lumber upgrade u get 2 extra gold per level. so it would affect early game quite well and has almost no influence on late game.

Hope my english is not too bad. since it is 1 o clock in the morning and i just drunk some cocktails

if beta 8 have not major bugs, then I will stop working on map for next week, so I can play some game.

making map is so boring.

 

[Agal]

Orc T1 Units have difrent dmg
Orc Warrior building 10-10 mobile 11-13
Blood orc warrior building 50-50 mobile 45-45
Orc T5 units don't attack they just stay and shake ...
and now poisons don't kill
Night elf T5 unit don't release chain lightning when gathers 10 mana
AR mode is bugged it's like HP mode but random
Mech Zues building 450 HP mobile 350
Beast Graymane don't use it's buff
Elf Moonguard still don't regen mana
Beast Minotaur don't use skill when he gets mana

 

[HuanAk]

Orc T1 Units have difrent dmg
Orc Warrior building 10-10 mobile 11-13
Blood orc warrior building 50-50 mobile 45-45
Orc T5 units don't attack they just stay and shake ...
Mech Zues building 450 HP mobile 350
and now poisons don't kill

these are mino bug:
- stat on orc/zeus fighter is correct, need update on building
- orc T5 do attack, the graphic is too fast so you can't see it (I need to make it slower)
- Poison can't kill is correct -- avoid some bug, eg, sometime creep won't give bounty if fighter die(and corpse disappear) before creep die, game can't identify who kill it.


Elf Moonguard still don't regen mana
Beast Minotaur don't use skill when he gets mana

are you sure ? it was bug, I though fix it on beta 8

Night elf T5 unit don't release chain lightning when gathers 10 mana
AR mode is bugged it's like HP mode but random
Beast Graymane don't use it's buff

will check

keep adding more, and please write version number too so I will know if this is new bug or old.

 

[Food4Balance]

Those mana bugs seem to be fixed in B8.

 

[Agal]

Those mana bugs seem to be fixed in B8.

don't think so just played ... and they don't regen mana

 

[HuanAk]

I know why some unit move to attack in Arena before fight start.

It is because they cast spell after teleported.

here is list of unit that move before fight start (let me know if you found other unit)
- Seer of Darkness (cast mana shield)
- Phenix (cast mana shield)
- Meridian


----------

Undead's meat wagon / war machine will change:
- similar to Mecenary's 1st & 4 unit,
- more damage on normal, lower damage on splash.
- splash is very small and just a bonus.
- this unit become main dpser for Undead (like Elite archer in paladin)

 

[Food4Balance]

don't think so just played ... and they don't regen mana

I only tried a few one player games and made a bunch of units that use mana to test and they all used their magic skills and their mana regened in B8. I will try a multiplayer game and see if other players besides red have this problem.

 

[HuanAk]

I post some replay for Marine & Element

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/maps-564/legion-td-mega-3-35-b8-194224/#post1915306

for those who complaint they are too weak

 

[Food4Balance]

-Don't have mana bugs.. not sure what Agal is saying.. Maybe he sees the animation so fast now that he thinks they aren't using the magic skills? The mp regens.
-Huge bug in B8. Random units you make just disappear. I lost a Tidehunter (280g Marine) and someone on the other team lost a Ogre.
I lost my Tidehunter after level 11.
The other player on the team lost his Ogre after level 12.

 

[HuanAk]

-Don't have mana bugs.. not sure what Agal is saying.. Maybe he sees the animation so fast now that he thinks they aren't using the magic skills? The mp regens.
-Huge bug in B8. Random units you make just disappear. I lost a Tidehunter (280g Marine) and someone on the other team lost a Ogre.
I lost my Tidehunter after level 11.
The other player on the team lost his Ogre after level 12.

I watch the replay, and check my code.

still can't figure out why it happen, so it must be rare bug (like king disappear bug).

I will fix it by same method as king disappear bug.

try keep an eye for this bug again, I *think* it only happen when build in dark green area ?

 

[OsiRyS]

another bug finded on b8
Time event:in both arenas before fight start
description:seer of darkness and phenix foward to the middle of arena to fight

Another idea:can u insert the switch command(it will be very usefull when ppl leaving)
Pls rebalance young frost dragon/azure dragon and goblin tanks(steam roller and their upgs) ...they was more powerfull in pass
Wandingo are now more weaker when u change their armour medium-> heavy
and they had very fast attack if i'm not wrong
Bigfoot had big problems with air and magic attack...they are useless...lvl 21 is hard for bigfoot as tank and lvl 29 is impossible...u will leak 100%
ty

 

[HuanAk]

another bug finded on b8
Time event:in both arenas before fight start
description:seer of darkness and phenix foward to the middle of arena to fight

Another idea:can u insert the switch command(it will be very usefull when ppl leaving)
Pls rebalance young frost dragon/azure dragon and goblin tanks(steam roller and their upgs) ...they was more powerfull in pass
Wandingo are now more weaker when u change their armour medium-> heavy
and they had very fast attack if i'm not wrong
Bigfoot had big problems with air and magic attack...they are useless...lvl 21 is hard for bigfoot as tank and lvl 29 is impossible...u will leak 100%
ty

I will fix the Arena.

-switch is next to impossible, because you have to move tower, wisp to correct position. (in Dota, you only need to move Hero and Item, which is easy)

every race have their own good/bad point. like Bigfoot can eat level 19, 22, like piece of cake.

for Artic, it is pretty good atm. and I want people use polarbear in early game rather than spam Wandigoo.

 

[iamthekira]

bigfoot in beta 8 is useless though. it waits almost 5 seconds before it uses the stun (after the mana is full again, that is).
i leaked at lvl 6 with a 800 value - a bigfoot included here. too damn useless, demi should be back to its 3.3 version, its weak enough on air and magic lvls, dont nerf it down :|

 

[toasted]

bigfoot in beta 8 is useless though. it waits almost 5 seconds before it uses the stun (after the mana is full again, that is).
i leaked at lvl 6 with a 800 value - a bigfoot included here. too damn useless, demi should be back to its 3.3 version, its weak enough on air and magic lvls, dont nerf it down :|

That's because of the Stun Cooldown.

 

[HuanAk]

That's because of the Stun Cooldown.

Bigfoot is a mistake, it have higher cooldown than mana.

lots of ability have cool down now. and it usually lower than default mana regen time (eg, 80% default mana regen time), so if you have mana aura from element, your mana may full before cooldown

 

[toasted]

After first arena the middle of the arena is still revealed and after the second same again but a bigger radius that parts of the opponents side are revealed, too.

 

[m05he_d4j4n]

inbalanced

played b8 like 15 times and my opinion is:
lvl 5 too strong
deathdragon bit too strong
hades still way too strong, in arena no chance against mass hades
all fortified lvls a bit too strong because there are almost no units with siege attack, when u play proph most of the time even with lots of rerolls u dont get tanks and tier1-5 units with siege dmg not strong enough

but its fun too play and much better then last one

 

[HuanAk]

played b8 like 15 times and my opinion is:
lvl 5 too strong
deathdragon bit too strong
hades still way too strong, in arena no chance against mass hades
all fortified lvls a bit too strong because there are almost no units with siege attack, when u play proph most of the time even with lots of rerolls u dont get tanks and tier1-5 units with siege dmg not strong enough

but its fun too play and much better then last one

Beta 9 will come out this weekend (if I don't get stuck in map making)

It will have race balance, as well as spell/pathing bug fix.

then I will do creep difficult adjust next, with Pro/Master title system.

 

[HuanAk]

After first arena the middle of the arena is still revealed and after the second same again but a bigger radius that parts of the opponents side are revealed, too.

just watch it

this is very weird bug

after first arena, both team can see middle arena

after 2nd arena, west team can see, while east team can't.

 

[toasted]

Maybe it's a dummy unit with a sight radius which hasn't been removed by a trigger. That would explain that only the left side can see this.

 

[HuanAk]

Maybe it's a dummy unit with a sight radius which hasn't been removed by a trigger. That would explain that only the left side can see this.

yes, that is only possible.

unit group was changed in recent beta due to new pathing code. so I may leave dummy unit out.

 

[kuahzai]

Orc wolverine has a bug. the inc attk spd is not active. thanks

 

[kuahzai]

and to add on, during the arena when its 2v3 the arena at lvl 10 the turtle doesnt walks back to the side with less players. it just got stuck.

 

[simongign]

helllo, in the b9 version, towers in the middle go straight for creeps in the middle instead of waiting near the king :s

 

[Gazelle]

B9

Yeah I noticed a few bugs, when creeps spawn, if you build far from entrance as I always do, 1 or 2 creeps walk first and sometimes split your defense and makes you leak.

Also I noticed that only with blue player for now, when leaking, all creeps will walk close to the wall instead of doing a "L".
Nice changes with marines, makes it more fun to play (if there was a delay on casting like panda's spell, highbone's spell could make hp reg more usefull when building a few highbone)

Its the first time ever I lost on lvl 18 I think xD I had a good army of hydras, which are weak at lvl 18, and all my team leaked, me included with fine value so yeah its much stronger now lol. I'm not saying to change it, just need to get use to it.

I saw many different opinions regarding mercenary, in my opinion that race should simply be removed, or make a mode ap without merc. Merc will always be "op" since it use wood to build defense, you will always be able to save alot of wood to send massive army (even if make merc more expensive, by stoping lumberjack at some point you could still save alot of wood for around lvl 20). BUT now being weaker than on 3.3, I cant save enough gold to switch race around lvl 17 (with few or no leaks), this makes merc less interresting to play.
I dont think hades is too strong now, sure they can own at arena, but its like saying that trees sucks cause they are weak at arena, each towers have their uses...But nightmare's new armor makes shadow a pretty strong race and very easy to play.
Young frost dragon on B9 cant kill with frost breath on lvl 2, I tried it and leaks more than half creeps, when usualy it was killing most or all creeps.

Since its my first time posting on this thread I could also start complaining than many towers are too weak and useless. But what is happenning right now is that you're improving towers when someone complain, then other become too weak, so you improve the other etc, soon all races will be too strong. Since new races are very strong like orc, trying to put all race to that lvl is not the right thing to do, you should make new races weaker instead. The game with armor and attack type strategy is becoming a noob game where you can mass a few units and win.
I'm playing Legion TD from about version 1.3 and back then, all races had strong point and weakness, beast was very hard at air but strong on the other waves, now... mass dragons they splash air! no need to think just makes dragons lol. But I understand that more and more people will play your version since its easier than it was, so I understand why you,re doing it.

One last thing, in x1 building tier 6 need alot of saving and are hard to get. Since x3 has become the "normal" way to play there should be either tier 7 which would cost over 600-700 gold. Or new ups on already existing units, because at lvl 30 the defenses are becoming too croudy, having stronger units would remove lag, and improve gameplay.

I hope this will help improving the game even though I complained a bit I like your work and play your versions alot, just trying to help improving it
Sorry for my bad english hope you can still understand!

Good Luck,

Gaz

 

[HuanAk]

Beta 10 is out, for quick fix on pathing issue after teleport, as well as Arena.

I will keen an eye for unit's issue.

for the game as a whole, it is hard to make every race same level. all I can do is make sure they are playable for late level.

and last 5 level should be really hard for any race.

then I make last 5 level really hard for any race

------

some minor bug still not fixed yet :
- Priest/high Priest stand still and do not heal (sometime)
- Creep spawn: only 1-2 creep move first, the rest move a few second later after first 1-2 die. (should move at same time)
- Leaked creep charge toward king and ignore fighter (happen on air, those can fly over fighter and charge king)
- Leaked king move close to wall, should move in middle

 

[mightym8]

I think it would be nice to discuss about gameplay, races and so on.
Cause there is one thing i really don understand. How do u calculate the values.
especially units that have auras.
e.g. gravekeeper:this unit costs 450 gold = 450 value
lets assume that the unit would cost 350 gold without the aura so the aura is 100 gold worth. Sure the aura's effect works percentaged.
So in lvl x the recommended value = 1000 so u invested 100 gold equals 10% and u got 9% damage reduction. lets compare this to level y with recommended value = 10000. We still got 9% damage reduction but now the aura's gold investment is only 1% of recommended value.
so in early game this is much weaker than in lategame.
And therefore the units value is increasing too.

 

[Food4Balance]

I think bugs should be stamped out before gameplay mechanics should be addressed, but small balance changes should be put into the new betas if they are easy enough to implement. There hasn't been a stable version since 3.3 and that had the king heal bug.

--B10 Bugs--
-The creep pathing is bugged. One or two units always walks about 1000 range ahead of all the other creep for the level. It causes the build formation to mess up if you build a certain way because your most front unit will attack the first creep and then only some of your units will walk forward to fight, while others stay behind.
-Leaked level 10 bosses just walks past the defending troops at the king and attack the king directly.
-It feels alot more laggy than B8. Nearly everyone we were playing with complained that they had so much lag when trying to send barrack units. You can click for 10 seconds and no barrack units will send out.

 

[HuanAk]

sorry for so many beta, here is another one

Beta 11:
- better pathing
- Priest/high Priest can heal double (cost 2x mana)
- Creep won't stuck on spawning
- Creep difficult adjusted

Warning :
- Game is much harder after level 15
- build with recommend value after level 15
- Try get higher than recommend value after level 25

- 17,18 is much harder
- 24,25,26,27 is hard too
- of course, 19/22/28 is slightly easier now

I spent whole day to test them with difference race, and it should be safe with recommend value.

-------------------

Beta should be over soon, just fixing last bit of bug, then I will release 3.25 while continue work on 3.4 with private beta.

 

[HuanAk]

I think it would be nice to discuss about gameplay, races and so on.
Cause there is one thing i really don understand. How do u calculate the values.
especially units that have auras.
e.g. gravekeeper:this unit costs 450 gold = 450 value
lets assume that the unit would cost 350 gold without the aura so the aura is 100 gold worth. Sure the aura's effect works percentaged.
So in lvl x the recommended value = 1000 so u invested 100 gold equals 10% and u got 9% damage reduction. lets compare this to level y with recommended value = 10000. We still got 9% damage reduction but now the aura's gold investment is only 1% of recommended value.
so in early game this is much weaker than in lategame.
And therefore the units value is increasing too.

you should try out this forum for discuss, because it is hard to talk in this single thread.
http://legiontd.in-goo.com/f14-legion-td-mega

for fighter : Value = gold cost
for creep : it require lots of test with tester unit (chao damage/unarmor unit)

 

[simongign]

i made 2 LegionTD B11 games, and both times a dino stuck at the beginning at the game..

 

[Food4Balance]

Like simongign says, B11 can't be played. The dino summon gets stuck if you don't kill it. It stops right before the green land. Anti-stuck doesn't work. Anti-stuck makes the dino just walk forward 100 range and walk back to stuck position.

Another bug, the units you build at the beginning just walks to fight the creep without even seeing them. If you build on the green, as soon as the round starts, your units will walk right up to the creeps to fight.

 

[HuanAk]

ok, I just release Beta 12: (last beta for this weekend)

Beta 12:
- fix pathing on dark green area
- leaked creep will have +2 armor
- creep enter dark green area will have 0 collision. (collision is back to normal after enter hall)

 

[simongign]

I had an issue with creep blocked on B12 version

 

[OsiRyS]

Another bug finded on b12:

Pls restore the movement speed of units who foward to the king...they have very fast movement speed...this is insane...e.g: 4 Dark Draenei leaked and they advnce to the king with max speed(they had slow movement spd)... in this scenario(wich i often encounter) u dont have time to upg ur king or kill them...and usually it will be game over....any leak was an enjoy for me and other cuz u can store wood...u destroy entire game with all units have max spd...pls restore all the spd....and dont listen to all nabs who have no patience to play a strategy game.... let them all to play mario but pls dont destroy this game...cuz all of nabs who has urged to u increase spd(cuz of their impatience)they ussually have 0 income...or they dont care about income.The income is like a complement for a pro player but never for a nab... I dont know if u noticed that nabs are very anxious

 

[HuanAk]

I will undo the collision & speed changed tonight.

 

[Agal]

i still haven't played B12 but on B11 there ware a lot buggs where creeps stuck and you can't move them or on Arena Match where i see 1 unit VS 58 units but there are no other units (it was at the end of the arena and my team won with 1 last unit but still the counter said that there are 58 more enemy units and the arena battle didn't ended) and i had some buggs with creeps just passing by my units or my units just start to move to the king w/o atacking or when they are ported in the middle they want to return to their start locations it's realy annoying i played more than 20 games and i finished 3-4 because of those buggs
and i think Level 7 is too strong some times you have the value but you just can't kill them with your units they are just too small and too many and do too much and they have 213 HP ... level 9 have less HP and 12 too ... but i think level 12 they are just too many and level 13 are too less (yes they have lot more HP and dmg but still ... )
and i think that you should do better antistuck or something because this is not working fine sometines i had problem with 4 murlocks stucked and the whole triyed and nothing ... just another rmk
and i found some annoying bugs with the combinated mods like arcl or sdcl ... i didn't saw anywhere that CL reveals the whole map and that Limited income it's LOL 350 value for worker and 350 for upgrade you should make it like 500 worker and 600-700 for upgrade and of course it needs to increase with every level that you pass for example
level 1 500 worker 650 upgrade
level 2 600 worker 700 upgrade
level 3 700 worker 750 upgrade
or something similar it's easy to get 7/2,3,4 with almost any race (i am not such good player i still lack few races) till lvl 10 and w/o any problems to kill everything including bosses and i still think Marine and ghost are a bit weaker if you compare them to Mech,Actric on bother T1 units are almost equal but T2 units ... or T3 units and what about that hydra 1600 HP lol i know it attack 3 targers with hight dmg but still this Doomsday machine it has lot of dmg lot of HP lot of attack speed and have good armor those dragons they have splash dmg + frozen armor better HP and better armor ... and about those T5 units on marine they are just too expensive they have low HP low atk speed and the only good think that they do is to keep enemy units for few seconds

 

[HuanAk]

I will release beta 13 tonight. (beta will finish, after fix current bug)

I know lots of people got piss off with so many buggy version. just remember this is my first try on public beta, with fast beta release. (normally I send them to private tester, and release 1 beta every 1-3 days for them to test).

 

[simongign]

we all appreciate your work

 

[HuanAk]

Beta 13 is out.

let me know if any more bug.

this is possible last beta, all I need to do is add W3MMD

 

[iamthekira]

could u please erase those lines when the lvl changes...
--------- <- those. they're annoying the crap out of me, leave that message as it was in 3.3
and also, you're not helping good players whatsoever. the income system really screws you, if you have something like 7/5 on lvl 13 its like having 7/1 cause you dont get income-or too little-for that lvl, and since you made some lvls harder now, its so hard to research and get better income :| from 11 to 20 you only stay undervalue, from 20-25 a little overvalue then if u try researching in this time you'll fall undervalue, better just screw it and play for value and save up for a demon at a tricky lvl and gg. that's what i call getting the game retarded, i dont like playing like that, i like my income and the endgame.
didnt notice any bugs in beta 13 yet.
the pathing is a bit odd-used to the one in 3.3-have to rethink the way i build the towers, cause the focus on the units isnt the same now.

 

[HuanAk]

if you good at math, you will know each research take 8 level to make profit.

that is why you are screw if you try research after level 20.

also, research is max at 7/7, but "Pro" ask for more, so I add 7/15 for anyone who can reach it before level 22.

so if you can't do it, then don't try go higher than 7/7.

 

[HuanAk]

... i didn't saw anywhere that CL reveals the whole map and that Limited income it's LOL 350 value for worker and 350 for upgrade you should make it like 500 worker and 600-700 for upgrade and of course it needs to increase with every level that you pass for example
level 1 500 worker 650 upgrade
level 2 600 worker 700 upgrade
level 3 700 worker 750 upgrade

you can find those "combine" mode on Page 1 (under Hostbot or Mode0, or inside game --> Quest->mode.

and for -li mode, it have "requirement" for first 3 or 4 level, (eg, up to 1200 value). most people only see first one, if you try for pure income, you will see you the first 4 have requirement.

for Mech, it is the most OP race atm, and the race is made by LISK, that is main enough reason to leave it as it is so old player won't piss off.

 

[Saucer]

Good job man.

after king die, players have 30 seconds before game disconnect

Thank you, thank you, thank you

Rewrite the code for -votekick (or -kick) <--need feedback

(in case you didnt consider / fix this already)

Votekick/kick commands are of course great for normal-hosted games However, bot-hosters do absolutely NOT want their own votekick/kick system bypassed by a map command.

Easy for you to solve though:

- Map should disable -votekick and -kick if HCL command detected (only bots use HCL)
- Add a "dummy" HCL command that does nothing (the bot owner may then use this as default HCL command)

Problem solved.

I used the single-character command "0" (zero) as a kind of dummy HCL command in 2.7c, but you may of course use whatever you feel like. Just make sure to let us know what the command is.

By the way, and I will never use map-based votekick system myself, but... If you add a -kick command for Red player (its fair to assume that Red is host in a normal-hosted game), then I suggest that you also add some kind of vote-cancel command for Red player ("-cancel" perhaps) and put a timer on the votekick, so that you provide Red player with enough time to cancel a votekick if necessary.

this is possible last beta, all I need to do is add W3MMD

Well, W3MMD would be pretty sweet. Make sure to include all the Legion TD stats, and also (just off the top of my head) which race(s) played and highest level (game round) reached. The more stats, the better.

 

[HuanAk]

Good job man.




Thank you, thank you, thank you





(in case you didnt consider / fix this already)

Votekick/kick commands are of course great for normal-hosted games However, bot-hosters do absolutely NOT want their own votekick/kick system bypassed by a map command.

Easy for you to solve though:

- Map should disable -votekick and -kick if HCL command detected (only bots use HCL)
- Add a "dummy" HCL command that does nothing (the bot owner may then use this as default HCL command)

Problem solved.

how often do they use HCL when play game from hostbot ? I think this HCL+disable votekick is help but won't solved 100%

if I change my command to -kick, do it still interface with hostbot's command? t

I used the single-character command "0" (zero) as a kind of dummy HCL command in 2.7c, but you may of course use whatever you feel like. Just make sure to let us know what the command is.

I havn't try yet, but you can find out which command will cause invalid mode and force to use default. I think it already work like this :
- mode trigger start when red enter "-" in chat
- if player enter -abcderf, it will become default mode immediate.
- if player enter "- " , it should trigger tha mode, then mode become invalid and automatic use default mode ? (any 1 character after "-", since HCL automatic add "-" to front, so you can try it out)

By the way, and I will never use map-based votekick system myself, but... If you add a -kick command for Red player (its fair to assume that Red is host in a normal-hosted game), then I suggest that you also add some kind of vote-cancel command for Red player ("-cancel" perhaps) and put a timer on the votekick, so that you provide Red player with enough time to cancel a votekick if necessary.

try out my votekick system. I think it is more useful than other vote kick :
- It popup menu for select which player (include a "cancel" button)
- every player get pop up menu for "yes", "No" and "I dont' care"
- pop up expired after 20 seconds
- vote only success with more than 50% success vote
- success vote = "yes" - "no"
- everyone can vote (include the person you want to kick)
- red can open vote for unlimit time
- everyone else can only fail one (so they can't spam votekick after fail one)

for example:
in 8 player game (4v4)
6 yes, 2 no = 4 positive vote = kick success
5 yes, 2 no, 1 don't care = 3 vote = fail
(remember, the person you want to kick always vote "No")

or 6 player game (3v3)
4 yes, 2 no = 2 positive vote = fail
4 yes, 1 no, 1 don't care = 3 positive vote = pass

Well, W3MMD would be pretty sweet. Make sure to include all the Legion TD stats, and also (just off the top of my head) which race(s) played and highest level (game round) reached. The more stats, the better.

W3MMD should include in next Beta, let me know if work or not (because I can't test them). I will try finish W3MMD tomorrow.

if W3MMD work without bug (after a few day), then I will release 3.4, then take a break before working on next version.

 

[Saucer]

how often do they use HCL when play game from hostbot ? I think this HCL+disable votekick is help but won't solved 100%

Basically all hostbots today have the HCL command, unless they (1) run a very outdated version of GHost++, or (2) use something else than GHost++, but thats rare.

In almost every case, the bot will have HCL support. Many people don't use it, but the bot supports it and they could simply add the "dummy command" to the HCL default setting to solve the issue.

The only problem with the solution I propose, is a minor cosmetical annoyance: When the game has just started, the GHost One bot (a bot based on GHost++) will announce to red player:

"-0 auto set, no need to type it in PlayerName"

(in that example, the HCL command has been set to "0")

That message is not a big deal, and better than having a map-based votekick that you're forced use - at least you have a choice. Personally, I can just edit out that announcement from the bot source code anyway, but not all people is able to do that of coourse.

With that little announcement-message in mind, yeah, its not 100% perfect solution, but otherwise I'd say its damn close to 100% Better than no solution.

if I change my command to -kick, do it still interface with hostbot's command?

the standard "trigger" on hosting bots is the ! symbol, so thats !votekick.
but some bots may choose to use different trigger, like . or - and then yes, a conflict is possible.

!votekick is used by the bot votekick system
!kick is used by bot admins

But, and I can't stress this enough, a map-based votekick should NOT be active when hosting with bot. In other words, there should never be any conflict anyway

I havn't try yet, but you can find out which command will cause invalid mode and force to use default. I think it already work like this :
- mode trigger start when red enter "-" in chat
- if player enter -abcderf, it will become default mode immediate.
- if player enter "- " , it should trigger tha mode, then mode become invalid and automatic use default mode ? (any 1 character after "-", since HCL automatic add "-" to front, so you can try it out)

What I meant, is that you should add a mode command that did not do anything at all.

If you write (example) the command -0 (or just "0" in HCL) it should simply ignore it, and not pick the default mode or do anything. Red player should be able to type in a mode like usual.

This allow the map to detect that HCL is present (and therefore know that a bot is hosting), but otherwise not interfere with the behaviour of the map.

In other words, I suggest that some specific dummy command (like "0" in my example) behave exactly like an empty HCL, and allows red to type in a mode immediately after the game has loaded.

If any HCL string is present (bot detected), then -votekick is disabled.

if(HCL == "") then enable votekick, and allow Red player to type in a gamemode
if(HCL == "0") then disable votekick, and allow Red player to type in a gamemode
if(HCL == "apgmcl") then disable votekick, and run the gamemode from HCL

Or, in other words:

if(HCL != "") then disable votekick
if(HCL == "0") then ignore this HCL command, go on with your business as usual

try out my votekick system. I think it is more useful than other vote kick :

Sure, I will try it out It sounds very neat. Visually it can do things that the bot-based votekick system can not, with the pop-up menu and all.

I also like the way that you have configured it. Above 50% make sense in my opinion (but bot owners have different preferences on this setting). The anti-spam votekick detail is good also.

However, its technically impossible to achive the same things that you get from the bot-based votekick system. Sorry, but it will just never be a suitable replacement for bots. Let me explain.

For one thing, the bot !votekick system respects the access levels of the bot, exempting admins from being votekicked, and allowing admins to cancel a votekick, or locking the votekick command from being used at all while the admin is in the game.

(Also keep in mind, that bot hosted games have random people in all slots. Red player is just some random person)

Your map has no knowledge of who is bot admin(s), and who is not. Because this is maintained entirely on the bot-side of things, in its database.

Another issue is that.. technically speaking, from the bot side of things, we can't distinquish between a player leaving voluntarily or being votekicked by the map -votekick command. The host bot only knows that "player left the game".... However, if (1) connection drops or (2) game crashes or (3) the bot !votekick system was used to disconnect a player.. well, then, the bot will know that. And the bot can distinquish between such events and the "player voluntarily leaving" event. But this gets ruined by the -votekick command.

And why is that important? Well, the map-based votekick command effectively puts the auto-ban-leaver system out of business, because we can no longer rely on the "player has left" status.

We just got that fixed with the "after game 30 seconds disconnect" feature, now its all ruined again! lol

If I were crazy enough to enable it anyway, then the map -votekick would simply become a -voteban system. This, I do NOT want.

And yeah, different bot owners have different preference for votekick percentage. Personally, I have mine set to effectively a "majority vote" (anything above 50%), just like your map setting... This works for me, but not for everybody.

Bot owners can even modify their bot code and change their votekick system to their liking, adding new features, etc. They want freedom to do that, and not be dependent on a map that they can not, and do not want, to edit to make such changes.

Don't get me wrong, I think the -votekick and -kick commands is great for normal-hosted games, and I think you got the right idea on how to make it work well.

But its just not useful for bot hosts

W3MMD should include in next Beta, let me know if work or not (because I can't test them). I will try finish W3MMD tomorrow.

if W3MMD work without bug (after a few day), then I will release 3.4, then take a break before working on next version.

All right, cool.. I'm a rather busy myself this week, but I'll have a word with Morijarti. He could probably do some testing on this.

 

[iamthekira]

if you good at math, you will know each research take 8 level to make profit.

that is why you are screw if you try research after level 20.

also, research is max at 7/7, but "Pro" ask for more, so I add 7/15 for anyone who can reach it before level 22.

so if you can't do it, then don't try go higher than 7/7.

i usually play with 7/6, i keep pushing it forward for that pro title, to see if i could make it, even if it's not 3.4
the point is, if the title were in 3.3, it would've been easy, but here you get close to 0 gold per lvl if your research is too high for that lvl (7/5 at lvl 13 for example). its crazy hard to get back to value after 7/6 unless your team leaks.

 

[HuanAk]

Beta 14 change log :

Unit changes:
- Lower damage on Finishing blow ( can kill level 10 in one hit, but need 2 hit for kill levle 20)
- Thrall damage type change: Chaos -> Normal
- ogre : 2 second delay -> 1 second delay, same dps
- lvl28 : reduce dps by 8-9%

lvl28 will have siege damage (90% to all, except fortified armor)
fortified armor have not risk for whole game, so it should take some risk in 2 level.

Bug fix:
- Holy Light can heal on king (if king is selected by youself)

Hostbot
- add W3MMD for hostbot
- hcl command will disable -votekick or -kick
- hcl with "0" won't trigger hcl command

===============

here is detail for W3MMD stat :


"player_name" // set up at beginning, never update again (do I need update it ?) all stat below are update 2 time every wave

"race" //string
"value" // everything from here are "int"
"income"
"kills"
"leaked"
"leak_caught"
"gold_total"
"gold_income"
"lumber_total"
"wisp"
"lumberjack"
"food_used"
"summons_sent"
"king_upgrade"
"level"
"time" // total game time minutes, I can do seconds if you think it is better.

FlagPlayer: FLAG_LOSER, FLAG_WINNER, FLAG_LEAVER, FLAG_PRACTICING

===========

Value is update when:
- wave start
- wave end
- player leave event (include vote kicked)
- Game end (after display message "the highest value is : HuanAK")

for Flag:
- leave before Game end = FLAG_LEAVER
- update every wave = FLAG_PRACTICING
- Game End final update : either FLAG_LOSER or FLAG_WINNER