Jack the Footman

[Moderator]

20:24, 27th Jun 2009
Linaze: The cinematic wasn't that entertaining and the terrain lacked good tile variation. Now, I realize this mainly was about showing off your systems, but really, systems and their sample maps go in the Spell Section.

Rejected

 

[Amigurumi]

yay, you uploaded it
I think it turned out really nice.
Could be longer but it would destroy the humorous cinematic, so it' good that it is short.
Looking forward to other cinematics from you +rep

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to ap0calypse again.

-.-'

 

[Septimus]

Since this cinematic was aim for the system. Here is what I going to comment about the system.

Camera System

The camera system ain't that bad as far as I seen. It probably the best option for GUI user, but it was a complete disaster for JASSER. But that is the price you paid for using GUI.

Anyway, the only function of this camera system was to enable user to make the camera move with less camera being implement into the map. But, I don't think any beginner or even decent cinematic maker are going to used this system because.

1) You have to set a massive amount of triggering line just to make 1 camera move like 10-15 camera.
2) It took a longer time/duration to set everything up.
3) Newbie in scripting might have a hard time to understand it since there is no documentation. Even if they do, they prefer to use easy way.

Speech System

This system remind me a lot of my precise timing cinematic system. The only downside of this system would be the transmission. It would display a empty box at the bottom left despite the 0 conversation.

The only thing that makes this look better was the dialog was flash word by word instead of the entire sentences at 1 go. It might not be suitable for a cinematic with voice act on it and by comparison, it only give a little fresh look.

If I make a comparison between the subtitle system by Anitarf and speech system by ap0calypse, I definitely say the subtitle system was far better. However, that system was for advance user with JASS experience. As for this, it was GUI friendly.

Usefulness level for Camera System would be 0 due to the 3 reason I state, However it could possibly been used by some decent cinematic maker if they are really hardworking enough to do so.

For the speech system, it was average as it only give a fresh look on how a sentences was being display. Apart from that, it was just a normal transmission technique.

Regardless on how negative it sound, both of this system could be useful to somebody.

My rating is 3/5 (Useful)

 

[P@ker]

im gonna dl it and check it

 

[arthas_king]

Lets see....... The tttle looks cool and i hope the cinematic too D:

Edit:Good cinematic(i didnt got the meaning tho, i also like that you use Crisis Core music . 4/5

 

[ap0calypse]

Camera System

The camera system ain't that bad as far as I seen. It probably the best option for GUI user, but it was a complete disaster for JASSER. But that is the price you paid for using GUI.

Yep, GUI sucks when you know JASS ^^ I must admit that is true.
If you know GUI (and only GUI), you probably think that GUI can do most things JASS can, but once you learn JASS, a whole new world unveils xD

It wasn't just to use less camera's, though... as you can see, I tried to manouver between 2 trees with the systems (which take a long time) and the camera wasn very smooth - if I has used camera objects, it would've been different (you have to use a lot of camera's to get the same movement).

1) You have to set a massive amount of triggering line just to make 1 camera move like 10-15 camera.
2) It took a longer time/duration to set everything up.
3) Newbie in scripting might have a hard time to understand it since there is no documentation. Even if they do, they prefer to use easy way.

1. That's true, that's why I have called it a "crappy system" in the description myself, since I think
2. Same as 1
3. I thought it was self-explanatory, but adding documention is certainly something that is useful.

This system remind me a lot of my precise timing cinematic system. The only downside of this system would be the transmission. It would display a empty box at the bottom left despite the 0 conversation.

Thank you for those comments, the speech-system is indeed for precise timing (you can activate a trigger, show a special effect, or do anything else at any given moment in the cinematic).
I don't quite get your other point, though :s (the empty box)

The only thing that makes this look better was the dialog was flash word by word instead of the entire sentences at 1 go. It might not be suitable for a cinematic with voice act on it and by comparison, it only give a little fresh look.

For voice acts: use a sound variable with arrays and add another if/then/else in the Speech-system, which says that if the loop integer = 1, the sound[integer] will be played.
So the sound will play at the exact time of the
I liked the way it looked, since reading a whole block of text is always a bit of a downside in a cinematic.

And another advantage would be that you have no (or few) problems with the duration, some cinematic texts will go too fast, so the viewer missed a few lines (might be critical information).
And, if the text still goes too slow, you can easily adjust the speed (I will make an example of that in the next update - stay tuned )

Ohh, and pressing escape does not delete the entire message (unless it's pressed after the sentence is entirely shown), which would also be an advantage, since pressing escape (accidentaly) is a common event when I'm watching cinematics ^^

If I make a comparison between the subtitle system by Anitarf and speech system by ap0calypse, I definitely say the subtitle system was far better. However, that system was for advance user with JASS experience. As for this, it was GUI friendly.

Of course I did not want to create an advanced system and, on top of that, I'm still learning JASS ^^
I believe that any user can edit this cinematic, you need to know little about GUI, since everything is there ("Text", "Duration", "Unit" are all very clear).
Of course, for more advanced cinematics, the event-trigger needs to be good as well, for that you need GUI-skills.
I have made the speech-system in a few minutes and set up the required variables in about an hour (checking for typo's, checking duration and checking all units took a while).

Edit: Ohh, and 3/5 is a good pretty good rating for a moderator, I thought I would receive about 2/5 from you ^^

Edit: Good cinematic(i didnt got the meaning tho, i also like that you use Crisis Core music . 4/5

Thank you ^^ (I love crisis core music, it just fits with almost all cinematics...).

Too bad you didn't get the meaning, but I must say: I have a twisted mind and the 'bigger idea' behind it isn't something an avarage guy can discover
I doubt if anyone will ever figure out the message, but if someone does (or has an idea), I would like to hear it, everything is welcome

 

[arthas_king]

An insane of topic postlay ''price of freedom'' when jack dies lol

 

[ap0calypse]

An insane of topic postlay ''price of freedom'' when jack dies lol

My favourite song of FF: Crisis Core and my favourite game-song... ever :O
But that would increase the file size too much ^^ (and his death is actually not really sad xD).

When Zack dies (Lol, just noticed that there's only 1 different letter, Jack <-> Zack), you see all those sad movies, The Price of Freedom really fits there

My new version is almost ready, it contains enough information and a trigger that plays sounds when someone says anything.
(no sounds, though, only the trigger to use sounds )

 

[cookies4you]

this cinem is so funny. LoL when jack dies and how the bandit talks about his suicide attempts failing xD. dude, this map is epic! i'd say 4/5.

 

[ap0calypse]

Update:

I have added a lot of information, considering everything that has to do with implemention and changing the system.
You can now use sounds when using this system (it's really easy), information for either 3D- and normal sound has been added.

 

[Anti_Bodies]

w00t 5/5 +rep

 

[ap0calypse]

w00t 5/5 +rep

Your humor sucks



I hope you got my point, lol... don't take me serious, I actually lolled when I read your post.

 

[Linaze]

All right, the cinematic itself wasn't so entertaining and the terrain wasn't that good either as it lacked good tile variation and could use some more doodads. The music choice was nice, though. Anyways, I realize this was about testing your systems, but I am fairly sure you could do that someplace else than the Map Section, try the Triggers & Scripts forum or the Spell Section.

Voted for disapproval.

 

[cookies4you]

and who are you to say that? you lack sense of humor =(

 

[Anti_Bodies]

and who are you to say that? you lack sense of humor =(

haha no i laughed.

lolz

If you didn't pick up, we both quoted his initial comments on not saying "w00t 5/5 +rep" and "Your humor sucks"

Anyways if you fix up this little system to make it more friendly to outside viewers, this could be a cool system to add to the "Spells" section

 

[Septimus]

It wasn't just to use less camera's, though... as you can see, I tried to manouver between 2 trees with the systems (which take a long time) and the camera wasn very smooth - if I has used camera objects, it would've been different (you have to use a lot of camera's to get the same movement).

JASS could do better than that, but that is the best you could effort in GUI. Your description did't mention it make the camera more smooth. However, no matter how smooth it could be; it cannot be perfect at GUI.

Read anitarf cinematic system to know what I mean.

Thank you for those comments, the speech-system is indeed for precise timing (you can activate a trigger, show a special effect, or do anything else at any given moment in the cinematic).
I don't quite get your other point, though :s (the empty box)

Look at the bottom left of the screen when there is no character was doing a talk to know exactly what I mean.

For voice acts: use a sound variable with arrays and add another if/then/else in the Speech-system, which says that if the loop integer = 1, the sound[integer] will be played.
So the sound will play at the exact time of the
I liked the way it looked, since reading a whole block of text is always a bit of a downside in a cinematic.

Even if you do that, it won't be good. Considering the sound done by voice actor might be speak it out in fast/slow pace, thus your text might appear too fast or too slow for it.

Ohh, and pressing escape does not delete the entire message (unless it's pressed after the sentence is entirely shown), which would also be an advantage, since pressing escape (accidentaly) is a common event when I'm watching cinematics ^^

This is another weakness of the speech system compare to subtitle system. At subtitle system, no matter how many times you click ESC. The text won't be remove.

Edit: Ohh, and 3/5 is a good pretty good rating for a moderator, I thought I would receive about 2/5 from you ^^

Giving it 2/5 just because it doesn't seems to be useful would look bias and discrimination have occur. As long as the scripting/triggering is safe, the system is useful. My rating doesn't based on my own taste. Just because it doesn't look useful to me, it won't be useful to other.

 

[ap0calypse]

All right, the cinematic itself wasn't so entertaining and the terrain wasn't that good either as it lacked good tile variation and could use some more doodads. The music choice was nice, though. Anyways, I realize this was about testing your systems, but I am fairly sure you could do that someplace else than the Map Section, try the Triggers & Scripts forum or the Spell Section.

Voted for disapproval.

In my opinion there was nothing wrong with the terrain. If you can point out what exactly is wrong with the tile variation (give me a screeny or something)
Also, this is a cinematic - no matter how you look at it, it is and stays one, so this is the right section.
It's like I have said: it's a non-action cinematic, do not compare it with any cinematics that make you grip your seat because of the action (which would be referred to as "entertaining").

My guess: you do not like my humor (doesn't matter, if everyone liked the same things, this would be a boring world), nor do you get the 'bigger idea' of this cinematic.
It's actually a pretty sad cinematic, but of course, the way I created it, it isn't noticable (I think I've made it in a good way, showing that even a cinematic with a sad idea can be turned to this).

(Or you just watched the first few seconds and then quit, then of course everything sucked
but the intro was, like I've said in the description, a comment against the lower-quality maps.)

 

[arthas_king]

but the intro was, like I've said in the description, a comment against the lower-quality maps.)

I think he said that you suck at mapping.

 

[Linaze]

I know the bad terrain at the beginning was meant to be a joke. I'm referring to the huge areas where only the Lumpy Grass tile is being used, around the bandit camp, for example.
Anyways, I am aware that this is a cinematic, but think about it this way, all spells have an example map, none of which belong here.
Also, the most important element of a cinematic, or any map at all basically, is the element of entertaining, so don't just say this lacks it, do something about it, until then, my rating stays.

 

[ap0calypse]

around the bandit camp, for example.

He calls this "A village"? Probably that damn map creator can't even create an actual city, so he makes a small bandit camp instead.

Yet again, it was meant ironically (I can create a city, cities are actually pretty easy, but it would be way too predictable when he enters a city... so I created a half-assed bandit camp, with only 1 bandit in it (don't you think that's strange? "the village has been attacked", yet there is but a single bandit and none of the tents are on fire?)
And if I can create a nice looking terrain for the credits, then I should be able to do it around the bandit camp as well.

I don't mind that you don't like it, though... it's impossible for everyone to like the same thing, I've said that before.
Some people like it, some don't... I create maps for fun, not because I want to 'attract people' (and I think everyone who creates maps to attract people is not on the right track).

You obviously don't like my humor, well... I'm sure you enjoy other maps then ^^
My humor is very... strange, I do things the way I like them and if I enjoy my own map, I'm happy - what other people say is their opinion, luckily there are enough people who can also enjoy this.

Your rating can stay, since I will not change anything you have said (sorry, I love unpredictable, weird things... that's just my style, if I would change it the way you want it, it would be a better cinematic, that's true, but I wouldn't enjoy it).

I have also said that this was originally meant to be a test-map for the systems, yet I don't think that the spell-section has a lot of use for this... it fits better in the map-section.

I think he said that you suck at mapping.

he'd better not do that
Mehh, I've put this together in 1-2 days, though

 

[lord_ken]

Im gonna guess its a humor cine. Since it's name kinda implies it. For every humor i see a name like " Jack " . *Sigh*

4/5

I can't really think of anything to say about it, But this. >.<

At that start thought made me a little angry. I was about to scream at the terrain and the story, But then suddenly, THE CHANGE!! It made me scream to let out my anger and let in a breath of satisfaction.

 

[arthas_king]

I mean that Jack things that you suck at mapping ^^.

 

[ap0calypse]

I mean that Jack things that you suck at mapping ^^.

Ohh, lol ^^
Yeah, Jack was really rude against me

For every humor i see a name like " Jack " . *Sigh*

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