Forsaken Apothecary

[deepstrasz]

Spoiler

Grumpy old man comes back from the dead to haunt young ones reading them stories.

 

[raypack]

Honestly not the "greatest" model there is but there is absolutely no need for it to be. I think that I'm so "negative" because of the necromancer unit's lack of animations. But great model and addition nevertheless, especially for the Forsaken Army!
Strike for the Dark Lady, for Sylvanas! 5/5

 

[Footman16]

View attachment 431570

Spoiler

Grumpy old man comes back from the dead to haunt young ones reading them stories.

I think the Necromancer book has the fewest pixels spread over the largest area of any detail on a model lol.

Honestly not the "greatest" model there is but there is absolutely no need for it to be. I think that I'm so "negative" because of the necromancer unit's lack of animations. But great model and addition nevertheless, especially for the Forsaken Army!
Strike for the Dark Lady, for Sylvanas! 5/5

For sure, the whole idea was something very simple looking, the Necromancer base does definitely show as does the weirdness but at the end of the day it does ensure the model will fit in beside other Warcraft units thanks for the rating!

 

[deepstrasz]

I think the Necromancer book has the fewest pixels spread over the largest area of any detail on a model lol.

Any chance for the bird faced plague doctor version who had no idea he died of the plague in the first place?

 

[Footman16]

Any chance for the bird faced plague doctor version who had no idea he died of the plague in the first place?

Ehhhh not any time soon unless Frank is willing to whip one up

 

[Dord96]

Awmazing

 

[Vladimir Ilyich Lenin]

Very practical, but it would be even better if there were icons

 

[HuanJuan]

I've seen several types of Apothecary in custom campaigns, and here in hive. Certainly, this looks more human than what I've seen in custom campaigns. Looks nice! A bit of necromancer influence is here too.

 

[BaiyuGalan]

A great model.There is a suggestion. I think adding team colors to the shoulders. It would be better to remove the team color from the weapon.Because it looks strange at the moment.

 

[Kyrbi0]

I'm always excited to see Forsaken models, and especially SD ones designed for custom faction use. It's definitely good to see more Apothecaries, that's for sure. : )

However I'll be honest, it's not quite what I'm looking for, and even as a recreation it's somewhat lacking. The former (stuff like "using a magic crystal staff"/"magical attack/spell SFX", "looking a lot like the OG Necromancer yet less interesting") is mostly just personal taste (to me, an Apothecary is more a scientist than a pure 'mage', with potions instead of crystals & fumes instead of sparkles). But the latter (stuff like the weirdly-long face mesh & texture, the mismatch of the robe texture from mid to bottom, no TC on the body somewhere, etc) seem like strange design choices at best, missteps at worst.

I'm comfortable leaving it at that; seems like plenty of others are appreciative of & finding use in this, which is great. Just wanted to provide some constructive critique.

 

[Footman16]

However I'll be honest, it's not quite what I'm looking for, and even as a recreation it's somewhat lacking. The former (stuff like "using a magic crystal staff"/"magical attack/spell SFX", "looking a lot like the OG Necromancer yet less interesting") is mostly just personal taste (to me, an Apothecary is more a scientist than a pure 'mage', with potions instead of crystals & fumes instead of sparkles). But the latter (stuff like the weirdly-long face mesh & texture, the mismatch of the robe texture from mid to bottom, no TC on the body somewhere, etc) seem like strange design choices at best, missteps at worst.

I appreciate the feedback and understand it's not to your taste

A question I have is how as a recreation you find it lacking, since looking at it and the reference image, they seem pretty close to me other than maybe the top bit of the staff have my spikes poking inward whilst in the HD model they curve out?

As for the latter stuff, the "weirdly-long" face mesh I don't find weirdly long and is purely artistic, compare it to the head of the Zombie model in the game for example and I see no issues personally and I quite like the exaggerated proportions giving it a much more gaunt and "dead" look. The mismatch of the robe I think is also fine since the belt separates the two parts, also they are separate geosets hence why there's team colour on one and not the other, but in terms of Team colour the bottom of the robe combined with the top of the staff I think is plenty and adding it to the shoulders as suggested by BaiyuGalan would maybe be a bit excessive. Not to mention I wanted to add some colour to the texture which wasn't greys or browns so I liked being able to add some purple in there, similar to how parts of the Blood Mage are Red and not TC.

Again, appreciate it's personal taste but hopefully that explains some of the choices made in the model

 

[Dord96]

it can also by good option to use as a forsaken mage as well

 

[ILH]

A nice custom necromancer model.
Works in-game. Approved!

 

[Chiron]

Great, got a missile for it?

 

[Varthas]

We love Forsaken models here

 

[Mortimm]

Really good!

 

[Separatista]

Upon reviewing their contributions, I noticed they don't mention the original author, "Blizzard Entertainment," but they do request attribution. However, this is simply an edit of Blizzard's Necromancer; it still uses the base model and generic animations. As site moderators, I believe the description is arbitrary.

 

[Footman16]

Lots of SD models are edits of existing Blizzard models. They don't require attribution to Blizzard. You are mistaking SD models for Ported models. Just look at the number of Footman or Paladin edits in the section, none of which we ask to include Blizzard as an author.

 

[General Frank]

Upon reviewing their contributions, I noticed they don't mention the original author, "Blizzard Entertainment," but they do request attribution. However, this is simply an edit of Blizzard's Necromancer; it still uses the base model and generic animations. As site moderators, I believe the description is arbitrary.

I don't have to because it is implied that this is an edit of a Blizzard model and not a port.

 

[Kyrbi0]

ala "When using Kyrbi0, please give credits to Me, My Mom, and My Dad"

 

[Separatista]

Lots of SD models are edits of existing Blizzard models. They don't require attribution to Blizzard. You are mistaking SD models for Ported models. Just look at the number of Footman or Paladin edits in the section, none of which we ask to include Blizzard as an author.

Both SD and ported models are the work of Blizzard Entertainment. The difference lies in the fact that ported models are uploaded while mostly maintaining the model's original state, with some modified animations or models from other games. SD models, on the other hand, undergo modifications such as texture changes, additions, and removals. The problem lies in the number of cases where proper attribution has been omitted, as you described. This is an issue that moderators and reviewers have overlooked to satisfy a small group within the community, perhaps due to nepotism. But that doesn't excuse giving proper credit to those who are supposed to enforce the site's rules.

I don't have to because it is implied that this is an edit of a Blizzard model and not a port.

It's not a given; that's just an excuse to take credit for other people's work and pass it off as your own. To use your own words: "That's the main problem, something people try to ignore. Taking credit for other people's work without giving them credit is simply disgusting.

 

[Footman16]

I don't have a clue what you're talking about. There are lots of edits of original SD models to varying degrees. This model has edits to the staff, head, arms and chest and has a custom texture. I'm not sure why you're taking an issue in this particular case and not others. But based on your other comments you seem to have some weird personal issue with me and I'm not sure why. If there are issues that have been overlooked then please bring them to our attention. All my and other staff members resources should be held to the same standard as any one else's.

 

[General Frank]

Both SD and ported models are the work of Blizzard Entertainment. The difference lies in the fact that ported models are uploaded while mostly maintaining the model's original state, with some modified animations or models from other games. SD models, on the other hand, undergo modifications such as texture changes, additions, and removals. The problem lies in the number of cases where proper attribution has been omitted, as you described. This is an issue that moderators and reviewers have overlooked to satisfy a small group within the community, perhaps due to nepotism. But that doesn't excuse giving proper credit to those who are supposed to enforce the site's rules.


It's not a given; that's just an excuse to take credit for other people's work and pass it off as your own. To use your own words: "That's the main problem, something people try to ignore. Taking credit for other people's work without giving them credit is simply disgusting.

Again. We don't have to give Blizzard credit because it is used in a Blizzard game.
It cannot be that hard to understand, can it?

Are you just trying to incite drama for the hell of it?
Last week you bitched about not seeing resources (your own fault) then you insult and try to incite an argument with Footman's model and its icons. What are you on about?!

 

[Separatista]

I don't have a clue what you're talking about. There are lots of edits of original SD models to varying degrees. This model has edits to the staff, head, arms and chest and has a custom texture. I'm not sure why you're taking an issue in this particular case and not others. But based on your other comments you seem to have some weird personal issue with me and I'm not sure why. If there are issues that have been overlooked then please bring them to our attention. All my and other staff members resources should be held to the same standard as any one else's.

There are no original models; they're all edits. We can see this to varying degrees; some edit the animations, textures, or parts of the model. That's not original work; it wouldn't be described as original anywhere. They're edits, some simple, others elaborate. But they all start from a base model created by someone else, in this case, Blizzard Entertainment. Blizzard was very clear when Reforged came out: everything related to Blizzard is their own work, and under no circumstances is it permitted to profit from the company's intellectual property. The site's rules are clear: if you're going to use a model, texture, sound, etc., you must give credit to the original user. If it has already been edited, you must also give credit to the second user. If it has been edited several times by different users, the correct thing to do is to give credit to all users, but that generated debate. It would be too much, so it was suggested that credit be given to the last user you based it on, providing a link so others can see the origin of what you used. I have nothing personal against you; if you take it that way, there's nothing I can do. It's your perception, and that doesn't reflect reality.

Again. We don't have to give Blizzard credit because it is used in a Blizzard game.
It cannot be that hard to understand, can it?

Are you just trying to incite drama for the hell of it?
Last week you bitched about not seeing resources (your own fault) then you insult and try to incite an argument with Footman's model and its icons. What are you on about?!

If you have to give credit because you didn't create the model—it's an edit—then, according to your logic, no one should have to give credit to anyone else because it's used in a Blizzard game. So why are we asking for credit to be given to different members of the community? You need to know the difference between the words "complaint" and "comment." I didn't say I couldn't see models; I said they were restricted or hidden. If they meet the basic requirements, you can read them again. I haven't insulted anyone at any point; you're spreading falsehoods. To the contrary, you should send a screenshot of what I said or a link to what you're claiming.

 

[Footman16]

Ok... So what you're saying is that your issue isn't with my model not crediting Blizzard, it's with the entire Hives SD repository not having Blizzard as an author? Do I have that right?

Also no one here is making profit off of Blizzards IP, I have made less than £0 with my warcraft hobby work.

The fact you're zero-ing in only on my resources says a lot about you and the motivations for these "issues" you see.

 

[Atlassian]

"As always give credits and ask permission for any radical changes or reposting, small edits are of course allowed!"

Can we see where exactly did you ask blizzard for permission to edit their asset? How can you slap some edits over their work and claim it as your own?

 

[Footman16]

"As always give credits and ask permission for any radical changes or reposting, small edits are of course allowed!"

Can we see where exactly did you ask blizzard for permission to edit their asset? How can you slap some edits over their work and claim it as your own?

We don't need to ask Blizzard for permisssion. I think we as a community have agreed on that based on how we all collectively operate and take no issue with any modeller editing Blizzard's models.

EDIT: Also I don't claim the original model was mine, this is pretty clearly an edit of the Necromancer as well as other parts. I explicitly say it's a geo-merge in the description lol.

 

[Atlassian]

Again, I don't see how editing an asset of Blizzard gives you the right to enforce any kind of ownership ?

 

[Footman16]

You know what, you're probably right, I'll change it so it just says to give credit. I personally don't take issue with people editing my work unless it was for something egregious or unethical.

Also the texture is 100% freehand, so I have a right there at least in the sense that that is entirely my own work.

 

[Shar Dundred]

This clearly proves that Footman16 neither knows the rules nor abides by them!
Unbelieveable!

He should obviously be demoted from staff and removed from this website!

Shameful, truly shameful.

 

[General Frank]

Again, I don't see how editing an asset of Blizzard gives you the right to enforce any kind of ownership ?

Because we put work into it. We transformed it and thus we now should get credit if someone uses it or edits it.

 

[Atlassian]

Please put a license on them, can't wait to see how that holds up in a court of law

 

[Footman16]

No, I don't feel the need to put a license on my hobby works that I do in my spare time for fun for a 23 year old game. Nor would I dispute it in court if someone used my creations in their map or something. All I ask is credit for the work that's been done.

Like I seriously don't understand what your problem is and why you've chosen to engage like this rather than maybe approaching it in a kinder or more thoughtful way.

 

[Atlassian]

Because your arrogance and audacity to demand people to ask for your permission to edit something you HAVE no right on is through the roof. If your BFF works at blizzard that doesn't imply that everything blizzard owns is yours. Go check with a doctor cuz you are mentally ill.

 

[General Frank]

Please put a license on them, can't wait to see how that holds up in a court of law

I put up a 'license' for my stuff so people don't distribute them without my consent. They can do whatever they want otherwise.
I had people claim my work and feels bad.

 

[Atlassian]

You are very well known Frank for your attachment to your pixels, like slapping a fake license would stop your models from being sold on a China website

 

[Footman16]

Because your arrogance and audacity to demand people to ask for your permission to edit something you HAVE no right on is through the roof. If your BFF works at blizzard that doesn't imply that everything blizzard owns is yours. Go check with a doctor cuz you are mentally ill.

I mean... I have changed what it says because you were right, that when typing up the description I didn't put much thought into it really and didn't expect someone like yourself to attack me in such an aggresive and unconstructive way. I also don't think it's helpful to accuse me of being mentally ill because of a poorly worded model description on a hobby for a 23 year old game.

But you and Seperatista seem to be operating under some weird assumption that I'm claiming stuff that's mine which isn't. At no point have I claimed the original Blizzard models are mine, the edits however and textures are my work. Wouldn't you agree?

 

[General Frank]

You are very well known Frank for your attachment to your pixels, like slapping a fake license would stop your models from being sold on a China website

I don't see you creating something worthwhile for the community. All you do is waste oxygen and make bad vibes.

 

[Atlassian]

What's the point of trying to play the victim now @Footman16 ? "I'm sorry I didn't know", what happen here is just one of the many examples of how this site is run, I can show many more examples where members of the staff claim blizzards work as their own

 

[General Frank]

What's the point of trying to play the victim now @Footman16 ? "I'm sorry I didn't know", what happen here is just one of the many examples of how this site is run, I can show many more examples where members of the staff claim blizzards work as their own

None.
All they claim is the work and credit for the work they put it.

 

[Footman16]

What's the point of trying to play the victim now @Footman16 ? "I'm sorry I didn't know", what happen here is just one of the many examples of how this site is run, I can show many more examples where members of the staff claim blizzards work as their own

Oh I'm definitely not a victim, I was just countering this notion that I'm some evil, cackling person who sits thinking "In my hubris I shall pretend I created all the original blizzard models mwuhahahah!" Where as it's more just a case that I didn't put much thought into it and when you pointed it out you were right to and I've now changed it I'm just a regular guy and I make regular mistakes from time to time.

Sure if you have more examples of staff claiming Blizzards work as their own then please send it on. Preferably in Staff Contact or DMs so as to not derail this thread.

 

[deepstrasz]

Both SD and ported models are the work of Blizzard Entertainment. The difference lies in the fact that ported models are uploaded while mostly maintaining the model's original state, with some modified animations or models from other games. SD models, on the other hand, undergo modifications such as texture changes, additions, and removals. The problem lies in the number of cases where proper attribution has been omitted, as you described. This is an issue that moderators and reviewers have overlooked to satisfy a small group within the community, perhaps due to nepotism. But that doesn't excuse giving proper credit to those who are supposed to enforce the site's rules.

My AI lover user and only kind of artist (because I see nothing from you but AI slop; good you deleted it by the way, thanks), if you credit every instrument used when writing a score then you'd also need to credit the trees and materials they were made of, and last but not least, not to forget the chemical elements, atoms and pre-Big Bang particles.

What are you on about?!

Correction: "What are you, a bot?"

 

[Separatista]

My AI lover user and only kind of artist (because I see nothing from you but AI slop; good you deleted it by the way, thanks), if you credit every instrument used when writing a score then you'd also need to credit the trees and materials they were made of, and last but not least, not to forget the chemical elements, atoms and pre-Big Bang particles.


Correction: "What are you, a bot?"

My icons had a primary purpose, and since that purpose has been fulfilled, it wasn't necessary to keep them. Thank you for being so attentive; I appreciate the attention I receive from you. My fans are always welcome. I'd say the same about your maps. To be a map moderator, you should be skilled at map creation and contribute something interesting to the community. Your maps are very simple. You give good feedback to others, which is easy to do; we can see your numerous comments on most models, textures, maps, etc. Honestly, your opinion always seemed like a "huh.

 

[deepstrasz]

My icons had a primary purpose, and since that purpose has been fulfilled, it wasn't necessary to keep them.

HIVE is not a temporary files transfer service. Do that again and you might get a ban. Just a heads up.

I'd say the same about your maps. To be a map moderator, you should be skilled at map creation and contribute something interesting to the community.

I contributed with my crappy maps more than you did in mere seconds also harming the environment. I actually worked on them and they are not as bad as you want to make them be. Just check the comments on them.

You give good feedback to others, which is easy to do;

I don't see you sharing any of your time to help the community. If it's that easy, be a map reviewer and help out. Currently you're wasting everyone's time being despicable and whoring attention.

 

[Kyrbi0]

HIVE is not a temporary files transfer service. Do that again and you might get a ban. Just a heads up.

(Everything is temporary Also what about the Pastebin? )

 

[deepstrasz]

(Everything is temporary Also what about the Pastebin? )

Some unwarranted comments seem to last forever.
Pastebin doesn't have rules like the, and is not one of the Resources sections.