Fan-made Wc3 Expansion

[GhostThruster]

Greetings, I have an idea;

It will be an unofficial 'expansion' of sorts. The plot basically would be some time-meddling crap that somehow awakens the old gods right after the events of TFT, meaning since events partake in an alternate universe to WoW it could still be considered 'canon'. However, considering that it'd only be me making it I don't really think I would make a custom campaign. Instead my potential mod would focus on updating and revitalising melee.

What I'm thinking of planning to do:

• Rebalance melee wc3 in order to distribute unit utility somewhat evenly ie) every unit/hero has an equal amount of usage potential
• Make a few custom melee maps
• Introduce 'Old God bastions', which will be explained further
• Make an .exe using another mpq for this expansion or allow easy importing so players can play the mod on any TFT melee map

Choose an Old God Bastion

Apart from some unit stat changes and maybe minor aesthetic tweaks, the major gameplay mechanic introduced will be Old God Bastions. Like tavern heroes and racial shops within TFT, this addition will attempt to evolve Wc3's metagame. Bastions are, in essence, 'mini-factions'; basically an add-on faction to your main chosen race. Town Hall buildings will initially have a 'Spellbook' ability containing options to spawn a leader (explained later) corresponding to one of three (irreversible once chosen in-game) bastion choices; C'thun, N'Zoth, and Yogg-Saron. As soon as a bastion is chosen, all the player's current and future Town Halls will have the ability removed, and instead there'll be an ability to select your leader (if alive) or an option to retrain a leader (back to level 1), if your previous one died. Your chosen bastion will be indicated in-game via an overhead attachment model (most likely a banner/flag representing the chosen Old God) on your racial altar as a means of allowing players to scout possible bastion-oriented cheese strategies. Each bastion adds to your race a special Leader unit, and a unit for each tech tier:

• Leader unit, which can be considered as an 'anti-hero' unit
• Tier 1 unit, a caster or melee unit that makes staying at tier 1 somewhat viable
• Tier 2 unit, an anti-immunity unit (will deal bonus damage to spell-immune units)
• Tier 3 unit, an anti-ultimate unit that generally excels against high magic damage, high HP flying units

The idea is to try to fix up some of the shit TFT added in. Because as it is now, most races go for any combination of T2/medium-armour/spell-immune units because their utility surpasses a lot of other units. I'm talking Spell Breakers, Fiends/Destroyers, Dryads, and Raiders. They imo stagnate the metagame so that nearly every high level match featuring their respective races also has those units. That said, introducing a T2 unit that deals bonus damage to magic-immune units might distribute the utility more as players are less inclined to use those units. These anti-immunity units will probably be themselves weak to magic or piercing to counter-balance this. The negative effect is that it promotes rock-scissors-paper gameplay, introducing another hard counter rather than resorting to Wc3's usual soft counter micro-intensive gameplay (where if skilled enough, scissors can beat rock). However, I feel like that TFT already screwed that up whilst not offering a solution to the units it introduced; for example, Spell Breakers hard-counter casters, whilst their only hard-counter are t3 melee units (which, mind you, are much less accessible than casters). My idea intends to be such a solution, albeit not being perfect so much as a band-aid.

Leaders of the Bastions

Your chosen bastion will allow you to train a 'Leader' unit from your racial altar; only 1 is allowed per player and they cannot be revived, but a new leader (starting from level 1) can be trained. The Leader unit's role is essentially to be an anti-hero; it takes reduced damage from heroes and spells. In addition, Leader units steal EXP from heroes upon attacking them (but cannot cause a hero to lose a level). This is done to add a 'soft counter' to heroes. Leader units are also mobile bases, being the key to unlocking the additional units pertaining to your chosen bastion. Leaders only gain experience from training units or stealing from heroes, and carry 2 items max. Leaders have a level cap of 5 and have 3 abilities, each of which have a maximum level of 3.

All leaders have the 'Bastion Leader' passive dummy ability, showing that they steal EXP from heroes equivalent to a % of attack damage dealt and gain EXP only from training units. All leaders have either Magic or Normal attack types.

Malefic Attack and Armour

Certain bastion units will have the 'Malefic Attack' ability. This ability will be located where caster upgrades are, and allows the unit to deal bonus damage against units with Magic Immunity or 'Malefic Armour'. 'Malefic Armour' is a new armour type which takes reduced damage from Heroes and Magic Damage/Spells. Bastion leaders and T3 Bastion units will have this armour type.

The purpose of this is to add another dimension to gameplay - no more can you mass up Spell Breakers, Dryads, or Destroyers to only be countered by the hardest of counters. Units with 'Malefic Attack' punish massing these units, but not to an overwhelming extent. Meanwhile, 'Malefic Armour' is given to Leaders to emphasise their role as a counter-hero unit, whilst T3 Bastion units have this to act as a soft-counter to conventional ultimate units like Gryphons, Frost Wyrms & Chimaeras. The two basically discourage the two most common strategies within the current Wc3 metagame - a much too versatile T2 magic-immune/medium-armoured army, or more commonly in team games, the effortless massing of end-tier units - and therefore, encourage more diversity within matches whilst still allowing for micro-oriented gameplay.

Bastion of C'thun

Qiraji Prophet - caster leader, and only one whose attack type is Magic. Spawns units

• Earth Shock - deals AoE siege damage, and reduces the armour of ground units/buildings within target area
• Deception - creates an illusion of a target unit. Upon expiry, the illusion drains mana from proximate units
• Insidious Harvest - autocast on attack, drains the prophet's HP but adds bonus damage & steals an attack target's mana

Qiraji Drones - T1 swarm unit, spawns in pairs. Has Malefic Attack - passive, bonus damage to Malefic Armour and Magic Immune units
Battleguard - T2 flying caster with:

• Boneswarm Affliction - DPS to target organic flying unit. If the unit dies, a Boneswarmer takes its place (the ability is an aerial Parasite)
• Eye of the Swarm - grants enhanced vision range and True Sight to a target ally temporarily
• Imbibe Magic - removes all buffs from target unit, but heals by a certain amount per buff removed

Boneswarmer - summoned flying unit with timed life. Attacks air units only​

Obsidian Scarab - T3 giant tanky beetle. Has:

• Impaling Strike - jumps, hooks, and stuns target enemy flyer to the ground
• Obsidian Carapace - passive, absorbs a % of received Magic attack damage and adds it to this unit's mana

Bastion of N'Zoth

Warlord of Naz'jatar - agility tank leader. Channel-summons units

• Needle Spine - throws 3 ice spikes that damages and mini-stuns all organic ground foes in a line
• Abyssal Shield - activateable, Curses (% chance to miss) proximate foes whilst boosting HP regeneration. Drains mana whilst activated
• Giantslayer - passive, deals bonus damage based on a unit's HP. Half as effective on heroes

Naga Medusa - T1 debuff caster. Has:

• Ward of Corrosion - decreases the armour of enemy units within a certain range; ward is killable and visible
• Invoke Serpent - few seconds casting time; sacrifices the Medusa to summon a permanent Wind Serpent

Wind Serpent - T1 scout, only attacks air units. Has Sparkfire - attacks bounce onto nearby flying units​

Naga Incursor - T2 melee superiority unit. Has Malefic Attack and Incursion (similar to Zealot charge, but with Bleeding DPS debuff)
Leviathan - T3 disruptor. Has Tidal Surge - passive; knocks back attack targets and disables its attack temporarily

Bastion of Yogg-Saron

Faceless General - disruptor leader. Summon-builds the Saronite Spire. Only 1 Spire can be controlled per player

• Vortex of Darkness - summons a Void Vortex that pulls units towards it, and upon expiry deals AoE damage
• Saronite Malediction - deals DPS and disables target's attack temporarily (similar to Firelord's Soul Burn)
• Aura of Despair - slows the attack speed of foes within range, alongside giving them slight mana degeneration

Saronite Spire - T1 building with magic damage. Trains the T2 and T3 units. Has:

• Dark Recall - teleports the General to the Spire after few seconds casting time
• Tribute to Yogg-Saron - sacrifices target unit to grant EXP to the General. Can only be cast whilst the General is alive

Ulduar Lurker - T2 stealth siege. Has Malefic Attack and Shadowlurk (windwalk except movement is slowed)
Volitant Horror - T3 corruptor unit with no attack. Has:

• Corruption - takes control of target unit, but is not channeling so the ability can be cast in multiple instances to control multiple units simultaneously. Drains mana per unit controlled
• Horrific Gluttony - consumes corpses to regain HP and mana
• Toggle Flight Behaviour - toggle whether this unit can flee or not (since getting this unit to stand still may be problematic as it has no attack)

Well, any thoughts, suggestions needs for clarification etc are welcome, but be weary that all of this is brainstorming and conceptual.

 

[noob]

It is interesting.I did not see many others wc3 mods as the wc3 modders have hight tendency when they would make an extension to just make a wc3 map and also there is no sections for them but I think it would go to tools sections.
Good luck with that project.

Would be ultimate

(If you make an extension which change the exe perhaps if you were awesome you would make that it does not unload and load all the mpq at each map loading(it is the reason of the excessive length of the loadings in wc3) if that were possible I would download instantly your mod and play only it.)

 

[GhostThruster]

I don't want to give false hope so I'll confess I've no idea how to edit ot create .exes, so I'd first make this mod in one map. If it is successful then I'd try learning how to make a custom launcher etc.

 

[Mechanical Man]

It would be something like Tales of Ravignon?

 

[takakenji]

please a less corny name

 

[PurgeandFire]

I always liked the old gods, so this sounds like a cool take on it.

I don't quite know if I would choose "time-traveling" as the reason though. You could just take from some of the lore in Northrend that justified us going to Ulduar. Afterall, Arthas is in Northrend and who knows what kinds of things he stirred up when he took the crown, so you can use that to your advantage. It is a bit difficult to tie it in with C'Thun since he is a little distant, but there are subtle connections (or you can make your own). Although, I know that isn't really your focus. You're more focused on the melee--I was just adding my 2 cents to the lore. ;P

Overall it sounds like it could be a cool mod. I agree with takakenji in that it could use a better name, though. Apart from that, there isn't too much to comment on. I'll be eagerly awaiting more info though!

 

[GhostThruster]

please a less corny name

suggestions?

It would be something like Tales of Ravignon?

It would be, as the thread's name sats, a fan-made expansion. Think of it like this, you know how The Frozen Throne was made by Blizzard and added new units, game mechanics, and campaign missions? My idea is an expansion made by me and adding new units & game mechanics, but probably not campaign missions due to time/resource/lore/laziness constraints.
I'm not sure if tales of raviganion would be similar to this.

I don't quite know if I would choose "time-traveling" as the reason though. You could just take from some of the lore in Northrend that justified us going to Ulduar. Afterall, Arthas is in Northrend and who knows what kinds of things he stirred up when he took the crown, so you can use that to your advantage. It is a bit difficult to tie it in with C'Thun since he is a little distant, but there are subtle connections (or you can make your own). Although, I know that isn't really your focus. You're more focused on the melee--I was just adding my 2 cents to the lore. ;P

Your 2 cents are welcome. What I was aiming for, you see, was to make this potential mod's lore to be 'canon-friendly' to WoW, since it is taking place on an alternate timeline much like Warlords of Draenor. I'm just a little pedantic when it comes to consistency. Also, I believe that nothing is truly random and thus any "what if" scenarios not involving an exterior intelligent influence are impossible. What would cause C'Thun to wake up in this alternate universe, but not in the official timeline, assuming no time-meddling from the likes of Nozdormu or Kairoz took place? Call me fatalistic, but I'm mentally incapable of sustaining the thought that alternate timelines just pop up for no reason. Then again, that's why I'm almost definitely skipping the custom campaign xD I'll further divulge what I had in mind for a short backstory of the events that would lead to the Old Gods awakening tomorrow or something.

Overall it sounds like it could be a cool mod. I agree with takakenji in that it could use a better name, though. Apart from that, there isn't too much to comment on. I'll be eagerly awaiting more info though!

Any suggestions on the name?

 

[GhostThruster]

Update on unit role roster:

Each bastion adds to the techtree:

• Leader unit, as mentioned before
• Tier 1 unit, most likely a caster or melee unit
• Tier 2 unit, an anti-immunity unit (will deal bonus damage to spell-immune units)
• Tier 3 unit, an anti-ultimate unit

The idea is to try to fix up some of the shit TFT added in. Because as it is now, most races go for any combination of T2/medium-armour/spell-immune units because their utility surpasses a lot of other units. I'm talking Spell Breakers, Fiends/Destroyers, Dryads, and Raiders. They imo stagnate the metagame so that nearly every high level match featuring their respective races also has those units. That said, introducing a T2 unit that deals bonus damage to magic-immune units might distribute the utility more as players are less inclined to use those units. These anti-immunity units will probably be themselves weak to magic or piercing to counter-balance this. The negative effect is that it promotes rock-scissors-paper gameplay, introducing another hard counter rather than resorting to Wc3's usual soft counter micro-intensive gameplay (where if skilled enough, scissors can beat rock). However, I feel like that TFT already screwed that up whilst not offering a solution to the units it introduced; for example, Spell Breakers hard-counter casters, whilst their only hard-counter are t3 melee units (which, mind you, are much less accessible than casters). My idea intends to be such a solution, albeit not being perfect so much as a band-aid.

Thoughts and opinions welcome.

 

[noob]

What is an anti-ultimate unit is it an unit killing T3 or an unit fighting against heroes ultimate or yet another thing?

 

[GhostThruster]

It would be an anti-ultimate unit, yes. For example, a T3 anti-ultimate might have the 'Giantslayer' passive ability, which deals bonus damage to units with more HP. Basically they would counter T3 ultimate units like gryphons, wyrms etc.

However, I might change/remove this idea because it's not like ultimate units are overpowered (except maybe frost wyrms...) and instead make the T3 units be anything.

 

[GhostThruster]

~bump~
I've decided on a simple way for models to be added; War3Patch.mpq. Hopefully, I can keep the original patch files whilst adding new files so players can just download my edited War3Patch.mpq and put it in their Wc3 folder (since it still holds all of its original files as well, theoretically replacing your original war3patch.mpq should do no harm, but I must test). The only problem is its listfile is non-existant, and might pose as a problem...

I've also somewhat finished my brainstorming on potential Bastion units (and linked potential models that I intend to use):

C'thun: (number before unit = the tier at which it gets unlocked)

• Qiraji Prophet - spawns units and has a magic attack (an egg/summoning circle immediately appears on the field, and has an expiration timer that when finished summons a unit)
• 1Qiraji Drone - spawns in pairs, 1 food each. Has 'Eldritch Attack' (deals bonus damage to spell immune units)
• 2Battleguard - flying support caster
• 3Obsidian Scarab - magic-immune giant beetle that can impale flying units to the ground

N'Zoth:

• Warlord of Nazjatar - summons units after channeling a spell for a few seconds
• 1Naga Medusa - debuff support caster
• 2Naga Incursor - melee superiority unit (basically owns units in melee range). Has 'Eldritch Attack'
• 3Leviathan - magic-immune sea serpent chained to a pool whose attacks are tidal waves that knockback units.

Yogg-Saron:

• Faceless General - summons the Saronite Spire building, but only 1 spire per player
• 1Saronite Spire - building with magic damage. Trains the later-tier units. Has 'Recall' (teleports the General to the Spire after cast time)
• 2Ulduar Lurker - stealth siege unit, with modified 'Windwalk' that slows the unit instead. Has 'Eldritch Attack'
• 3Volitant Horror - flying squid-monster that can take control of enemy units. This ability drains mana when used, and mana drainage multiplies with the amount of units being simultaneously controlled. This unit's abilities are yet to be decided, but basically I intend for it to be a cross between a Brood Lord and an Infestor (if you play StarCraft 2 you'll know what I refer to).

Feedback welcome on unit ideas and model choices. If anyone knows a good Faceless One hero model (with two legs and less that 3000 polys [that's why I ruled out Vezax -.-]) please do tell ^^

 

[noob]

It seems there is enough concepts for making soon an alpha version.
I do not like the magic immunity on obsidian scarab and leviathan as they are T3 it would be hard to balance as casters which are some of the best units against T3 (with things like slow or curse or others kind of spells) would not work.
Also I fear to see another state of metagame stagnation for example Naga Incursor is able to defeat magic immune and contact units, combined with leviathan (seems to be an ultra effective caster killer with its description) and some ranged anti air like crypt fiends it risks to make an devastating army.
it will surely take time to balance (as it adds 9 potential units to all races and two news concepts it can always react violently with the usual small 12 units per race) but once balanced it would stop metagame stagnation.

 

[GhostThruster]

Thank you for your comment noob, and please anyone else who happens upon this thread I'd be glad to receive your input as well.

Well, the T3 units are meant to counter high hp, high magic damage flying units. You are correct though, and casters definitely do not need another hard counter. So what about this: T3 Bastion units have 'Malefic Armour', which takes reduced damage from Heroes and Magic? So in other words, spells like curse and slow still affect the T3 units, but frost wyrms and the like will do significantly less damage. This also changes T3 units into soft-countering ultimate units, which I definitely think is a plus for micro-oriented gameplay.

Regarding me actually starting the mod, I've done some extra research (ie. scrolled through "heaven's fall"'s map thread) and found out how to make my own .exe alongside a custom MPQ. I might ask Retera how he created a custom launcher. However, I'm also incredibly busy right now. For now, you can settle for the finalised techtrees (added into the updated OP).

 

[noob]

T1 ranged have often usefull abilities against T3 flying and have the good damage and armor types against those T3 flying combined with casters and some others things they would be good counters exept what happens is that when a player spams T3 flying having to do casters, T1 ranged and some others units for countering seems too much complicated comparated to spamming an T3 flying unit together with some casters or units with net and abilities of the same kind.
But creating T3 units for countering those T3 flying seems wierd.
Obsidian scarab seems to work like a crypt fiend or raider against flying (bringing the unit to the ground and hitting) and would be nearly redundant when beeing undead (exept that the OS would be also like a knight or a tauren) but some races does not have an net using unit.
the Levihathan looks like an T3 support for flying as countering T3 flying is done with many T1 ranged and casters and an aoe knockback attack would help fighting an hudge army of low life units.
Volitant horror would be interesting as there is currently no T3 casters.

 

[GhostThruster]

countering seems too much complicated comparated to spamming an T3 flying unit

Exactly, the input required for pulling off a 'mass t3 air' strat is much less than the input required to counter such a strat. By adding a t3 counter-ultimate unit, this becomes less of an issue. Of course, I don't want this to result in the same thing, whereby the T3 bastion units cannot be easily countered themselves. They'd serve only as soft-counters to heavy air, whilst melee, ranged, and casters can still beat them.

Yes, though the air unit will stick to the ground for only a few seconds (3-5), and be stunned for less (1-2). The ability will have a cooldown close to its duration though (so like 5-7 seconds), provided there is enough mana. Or I could come up with a more original ability, like a locust swarm that hits air units only...

The Leviathan is good for pushing back an army, but not necessarily killing it. I was thinking it would have little-to-no AoE damage, whilst still knocking back units. It'll most likely have magic attack type.

 

[noob]

Maybe just add spells wich does not stack easily (like aoe debuff or buff) to T3 flying and reduce theirs stats making of them units wich needs micro management and who does not give an increasing bonus when spammed.

 

[GhostThruster]

~update~

i haven't given up on this. i've changed the 'tidal surge' ability to only affect a leviathan's single attack target, but it also disables the target's attack temporarily. now it is more effective against t3 ultimate units rather than smaller, weaker units. i'm gonna prepare a map within 2 weeks (maybe).

i don't want to change the current wc3 tft units' attributes too much, and besides the whole point of t3 flying is for them to be effective even with an attack-ground command.

EDIT: added potential subtitle list

 

[GhostThruster]

i've stuck with 'Wc3: Darkness Rising'

edit:

a (non-final) logo

edit 2: refined it a bit more

 

[GhostThruster]

soz for double post, but eh who cares

i think i'm going to have each race's town hall building be able to train the bastion leaders. at the start of the game, the player's town hall will appear to be able to train 3 dummy units that correspond to each bastion. this unit will cost gold & lumber, and once it is trained a bastion leader will spawn, and the player cannot reverse his bastion choice. should be much less work than a trackable menu, and more intuitive too. players can opt to delay choosing a bastion this way, in order for short-term resources or denying the opponent knowledge of which bastion he will go for.

 

[noob]

Noobs.
It is cool that you continue this mod.
Did you tested and tried some values and started to balance or is there is not yet an mod?

 

[GhostThruster]

not yet, and perhaps not for a while because i've got school coming up.

but i've finalised the method in which players will choose a bastion; a spellbook ability given to town halls (0,1 or next to workers' button position) will contain options to spawn a leader, and whichever ability is used corresponds to the (irreversible) bastion choice. as soon as a bastion is chosen, all the player's current and future town halls will have the ability removed, and instead at (0,1) there'll be an ability to select your leader, if he's alive, or an option to retrain a leader (back to level 1), if your previous one died.


now, some non-final balance changes that i plan to make on the default races;
blood mage; +1 base armour
guard/arcane tower; fortified armour, 400hp, base armour 2 (before you go crazy that the tower is fortified, hear my intent; to motivate players to actually use siege weapons when attacking a base. the reduced armour and HP means that regular units will still be able to take towers down)

blademaster; -1 base armour, 300 move speed, mirror image mana cost 100
far seer; wolves +2/4/6 base damage
shadow hunter; serpent ward +5 base damage, big bad voodoo mana cost 135
batrider; unstable concoction does 520 single target damage, but 220 AoE damage

death knight; 300 move speed, death coil range 650
crypt lord; 290 move speed, impale mana cost 90, locust cooldown 60 seconds (lol default is 3 min for such a shitty ability)
necromancer; skeletal mages +5 base damage
banshee; +2 base damage, possession mana cost 150
frost wyrm; 250 move speed, cold attack slow lasts 5 seconds instead of 10
sacrificial pit; lumber cost 120
orb of corruption; -4 armour effect, 365 gold cost

demon hunter; immolation activation mana cost 30/20/10
kotg; 1.85 base attack speed, treants +30 base speed (with natures blessing it goes up to 300)
potm; 1.94 base attack speed
glaive thrower; 3.0 attack speed
hippogryph rider; mount/dismount cooldown 7 seconds (down from ridiculous 30 seconds), 770hp
chimeara; 270 move speed

 

[noob]

I will not go crazy about the fact it is fortified but about the fact all units with normal damage will kill em even faster (fortified multiply only by 0.7 the normal damage but with this reduce in life and armor it reduce the total normal damage they can take) it does not make siege better it makes it even more unnecessary.
Also are necromancers summons something really useful?
By buffing their damage players will think it might be useful and this is an hard to see trap because by using skeletons instead of others spells you give more XP to enemy heroes and the frenzy and cripple spell of the necromancer are very powerful(cripple is all the anti T3 you will ever need and frenzy is all you need for buffing your own T3 making of the necromancer one of the most useful caster when spamming T3 or even for helping your heroes and army)maybe reduce xp gain from skeletons (else many of the intuitive tactics like staying far and sending skeletons are just making the enemy stronger)
In fact one or two necromancers and banshees really help against T3 flying making of undead the ones with the less problems against T3 flying(if they can bring their casters to the good place which is possible only if there is zeppelins)and hero debuff all that needs undead for being complete is an anti anti-caster

 

[GhostThruster]

not really. good luck diving all ur melee units into a base that is properly walled off.

the point of the buff is to make necro summons more useful. i dont want to decrease EXP gain because that means not rewarding an opponent who successfully scouted and got dispel.
btw, fiends + adept banshee is much more potent (& cost-effective) than anything necros cud ever do to t3. anti-magic shield + web combo is just OP.

i've always wondered if moving the obsidian statue to the temple of the damned wud incentivize getting casters more. what'd you think?

 

[noob]

You are probably right with towers as reinforced is so much good against piercing and magic.
I forgot that antimagic shield worked against magic attacks then it is sure banshees are better against T3 than necromancers.
Perhaps it would increase the use of casters (as the caster support would be easier to access) And it might also end up reducing the use of the meat wagon and abomination(probably not as the only ground unit with loads of hp is the abomination and he stays in bundle with meat wagon)
But at the same time an player deciding to have casters build his two T2 buildings and can build at the same time his necromancers and banshees and in parallel his obsidian statues and other stuff so it helps having an well balanced army to have the obsidian statue in T2 siege production.
Do not forget the necromancer gains usefulness with T3 C'thun and T3 N'Zoth for which he is useful with unholy frenzy or cripple (the group disperser gets a lot more useful when he attacks 1.75 times more often and the scarab might be useful to debuff or buff(If he have enough damage))

 

[GhostThruster]

the only issues i foresee is maybe t1 human tower rushes can be OP vs orc, who dont have t1 siege (undead dont either, but their bases are god-like anyway). tho considering melee will still deal the same amount of damage (i'll have to find the right hp-armour ratio) it shudnt be a problem. i might buff headhunters to be more viable too.

i agree, i was just brainstorming since statues trained at temples makes much more sense and has actual synergy.

 

[noob]

The two training places for obsidian statues have sense(it is mechanical and mystic)
Also I do not have really an idea of the efficiency of the morphed form of the obsidian statue how much are they currently present in the meta-game?
I remember (SC1) having seen an player saying he never knew how to obtain guardians because it was too much complex.

 

[GhostThruster]

in 1v1 fiends + destroyers is standard. they are efficient in certain situations, but in plain combat they're not very powerful unless the enemy is going heavy caster buffs. generally they're used more to deny enemy spells than to supply the controlling player with more dps (like fiends)/add sustain (like statues).

 

[Garodar]

... so far, only fanmade I know is http://wcunderground.freeforums.org...f81.html?sid=44bcbf60698a40cef8576112e0577ecb

 

[Tal'Rarity]

This is looking to be a good project/expansion, keep it up and complete it. I would like to see it. =) Some good idea's as well expanding on the lore and not killing it off is something I approve of.

Off-Topic/ For you GhostThruster

This would greatly benefit from http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/...r-bypassing-8mb-file-size-limitations-253288/ because it would allow players to play your fan-made expansion in official Battle.net instead of a custom .exe therefore allowing for more people to play your work and able to find others easier.

 

[GhostThruster]

thanks but ill probably use an edited mpq since its more accessible

 

[Chaosy]

will this include a texture upgrade? Like new textures and/or models for units. New default tilesets and UI etc?

or is it only gameplay improvements that's planned so far?

 

[GhostThruster]

only gameplay improvements. im not interested in a graphic overhaul.

 

[Tal'Rarity]

thanks but ill probably use an edited mpq since its more accessible

You kind of have it mixed around. . . the edited mpq is the harder to access one. Still good luck.

 

[noob]

You can with local files just have an extract in WC3 folder installation easily but you will need an uninstaller for removing the multiple files.
With custom MPQ you can just copy it when you want and uninstall by removing one file and putting the old mpq.
So in ease of creating the custom MPQ is the best as you will not need to create an unistaller who remove multiple files.
Also as the files will be in the MPQ it takes an smaller place if you decide to have one install for each mod because it will be compressed.
It is easy to say that one is better than the other but none is purely better or worse than the other.
Local files are far more modular it is it's main advantage the users can import the data they want when they want and also it is compatible with Bnet but still it is not purely better on each point.
And if you want to change the rules local files are no longer Bnet compatible

 

[Tal'Rarity]

Yeah, I guess.

 

[GhostThruster]

can 'war3' .txt files stored in war3patch.mpq overwrite default ones? because i'll need to import custom triggers and custom user interface/gameplay constants.

also forgot to mention this multiplayer mod will at most be 6mb lol since all im importing is like 12 custom models + icons + war3mapskin/bunch of other .txt files. the reason i wanted an .exe wasn't to avoid the 8mb limit, but to allow players to easily activate the mod and play it instead of tft on any map, much like how tft has its own .exe separate to wc3 roc.

 

[Daffa]

Talk to Retera, he has an exe mod for his Heaven Fall, I recall he use some tools to make it.