1. Updated Resource Submission Rules: All model & skin resource submissions must now include an in-game screenshot. This is to help speed up the moderation process and to show how the model and/or texture looks like from the in-game camera.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. DID YOU KNOW - That you can unlock new rank icons by posting on the forums or winning contests? Click here to customize your rank or read our User Rank Policy to see a list of ranks that you can unlock. Have you won a contest and still havn't received your rank award? Then please contact the administration.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. The Lich King demands your service! We've reached the 19th edition of the Icon Contest. Come along and make some chilling servants for the one true king.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. The 4th SFX Contest has started. Be sure to participate and have a fun factor in it.
    Dismiss Notice
  5. The poll for the 21st Terraining Contest is LIVE. Be sure to check out the entries and vote for one.
    Dismiss Notice
  6. The results are out! Check them out.
    Dismiss Notice
  7. Don’t forget to sign up for the Hive Cup. There’s a 555 EUR prize pool. Sign up now!
    Dismiss Notice
  8. The Hive Workshop Cup contest results have been announced! See the maps that'll be featured in the Hive Workshop Cup tournament!
    Dismiss Notice
  9. Check out the Staff job openings thread.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
60,000 passwords have been reset on July 8, 2019. If you cannot login, read this.

Direction

Discussion in 'Site Discussion' started by The World Is Flat, Jul 15, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2009
    Messages:
    5,560
    Resources:
    4
    Icons:
    3
    Tutorials:
    1
    Resources:
    4
    This is sort-of a rant thread. It's not meant to be super-organized or well layed out, so forgive me if it's a bit of a chore to read. These are just my thoughts on what i've seen the hive become, and where I see it's future brightest.

    Note, that this is in no way a commentary on recent site events. I support Ralle 100%, even If I strongly disagree with more than a few of The Dark Wizard's Bans.

    Warcraft 3's hayday was quite a bit ago. Things will only continue to go downhill for here in the Warcraft community. Starcraft 2's hayday is now, but unfortunately for us, we missed the train, and now it's long gone. The Hive cannot compete with the powerful ingrained SC2 modding communities like Sc2 Mapster (Which has curse backing.), especially not from a services perspective. (Feedback, asset generation, support for questions, tutorials, getting team members, popularity). These are facts. Modding, for THW, is only going to continue to spiral downhill.

    The hive can't afford to jump off the train late if it wants to remain as a strong, solvent community.

    One of the largest issues with most technology groups, websites, and companies, is that after the initial concept, there is often very little done to preemptively adapt to changing conditions. The same exact thing happened to the company, Research In Motion, (RIM, which produced the Blackberry.) Once holding an outstanding 50% market share, it's now plummeted down to a scant 11%, and falling, with it's major new release expected in 2013. Why did RIM fail? It didn't consider the possibility of smart-phones outside of the market that the Blackberry had made for them; non-business, entertainment, utility. Now it's far too late for the company to pick it's feet back up off the ground. I'm not saying that THW is RIM, but the same situations can apply to any industry, and any entity, with ease, and it's already happening to us.

    There are numerous examples showing us where the lack of pro-activity heralds a decline, and I've enjoyed THW (And invested in it in more ways than one), too much to not at least make a simple thread with my ideas.

    If Warcraft 3/Starcraft 2 modding is going downhill for THW, then what is the next logical step for a site whose very MO is Warcraft/Starcraft modding? We aren't Epicwar; We don't just host maps. We have a large, creative community of designers, artists, and programmers who generate very attractive assets. (Icons, Skins, Programs, Models.) If the site wants to adapt to a new environment, it needs to work to it's strengths, and that strength is it's creative usergroup. For years, users on THW have been making skins, icons, models, competing in art contests, and a whole host of other creative pursuits.

    I see THW redirecting itself towards a more generally creative thesis. The best way for the hive to move forward is to directly embrace the talents that it's existence has helped to foster.

    If we take that strong community base that we currently enjoy and apply it to a more general field that is less structured on a third party, like a game or platform, the site can avoid stagnation.

    I foresee future in creativity;

    Graphic Design
    2D/3D art
    Programming & Technology
    General Modding
    Asset-Commission

    A big part of this is that a fair-sized portion of the site's powerhouse users are getting older, and they need money (I'm sure we all do.), a community that better supports adult existence, and making the transition from what we currently do, to a broader focus on creativity and design is the way to go. The best way to get there is not to directly emulate sites like DeviantArt, because that is not an area in which you can compete, but to find a niche that can be filled without competition, and will support your users and the community, and that's what we all want.

    I'd like to discuss the possibility, and how, or if, we'd go about this transformation.

    Now, again, this is just an 'off-the-top-of-my-head' rant, so take it all with a grain of salt, but of course, do let me know what you think.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2012
  2. Skycraft

    Skycraft

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2010
    Messages:
    1,345
    Resources:
    0
    Resources:
    0
    Seeing the Hive go down this path wouldn't be such a bad idea, what we 'could' have is having a multitude of different games that can be modded (Warcraft 3, Starcraft 2, anything else) in one section and another section to inspire people to work together and make their own games within the community, so that we can get the best of both worlds.

    That's just my 2 cents though.
     
  3. Darklycan51

    Darklycan51

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    1,326
    Resources:
    3
    Maps:
    3
    Resources:
    3
  4. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2009
    Messages:
    5,560
    Resources:
    4
    Icons:
    3
    Tutorials:
    1
    Resources:
    4
    Expanding the modding curriculum seems like a good idea.
     
  5. kari0003

    kari0003

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    Messages:
    843
    Resources:
    1
    Skins:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    I like the way you see it. Your ideas make great sense to me.

    Hive should be open for new directions.
    Especially like this one.
     
  6. Asomath

    Asomath

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2006
    Messages:
    1,042
    Resources:
    1
    Tutorials:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    I 100% agree with your view of things. So far, the Hive has seen far too little change far too late. If the Hive wants to continue its legacy, this direction does not seem a bad option at all.

    ~Asomath
     
  7. Sorceress

    Sorceress

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    1,024
    Resources:
    1
    Template:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    What kind of games did you have in mind to add?
     
  8. Karawasa

    Karawasa

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    328
    Resources:
    2
    Maps:
    2
    Resources:
    2
    I think the idea is to get away from modding and turn this site into creative pursuits independent of any one game. Which, by the way, is mandatory for this site to remain relevant.
     
  9. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2009
    Messages:
    5,560
    Resources:
    4
    Icons:
    3
    Tutorials:
    1
    Resources:
    4
    It really is. We need to play to our strengths.
     
  10. Sorceress

    Sorceress

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    1,024
    Resources:
    1
    Template:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    Saying 'any' game would just cause caos..
     
  11. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2009
    Messages:
    5,560
    Resources:
    4
    Icons:
    3
    Tutorials:
    1
    Resources:
    4
    I understand where this is coming from. It would be difficult to organize the site to accept 'every game.' But in reality, support comes from merit, and that process takes time.

    I'd go for support with things like Unity though.
     
  12. MGCǂSpectre

    MGCǂSpectre

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2005
    Messages:
    3,007
    Resources:
    2
    Tutorials:
    2
    Resources:
    2
    I will repeat what got deleted in the other thread (yeah I wrongly understood it was about the demotions but it also had a sc2 part), so I will repeat that sc2 part.

    First of all, me and some others have obviously woken up to realize, coming to register here to start learning war3 .. - year 2012, summer ... wait what? Just because a bunch of Asians play dota and custom maps because it is known non-Korean Asians play War3, is this a reason to keep it like that with a game that has its time gone and pretty much everyone with common sense has moved on? Even the ones who come to join are mostly Asians..

    I really never expected this place to be more sc2-ish. If anyone wants to learn the not so hard editor that allows you to do a lot of things without modeling such as the SC2 editor, come to SC2Mapster and I will see you there. I've seen enough of this illusion about starcraft 2 being done here, its popularity here is like discussing some random console game. So I think from almost leaving I will soon make one final leave, what's keeping me so far, just ponies, well I could as well post about them in some pony place, no need here.

    What does SC2Mapster have besides being completely devoted to SC2? - No silly threads and trolling unlike what's been happening here, even the offtopic threads are often asking editor question which keeps the focus entirely on mapmaking.. Seriously go see there, peopel are more MATURE at least act defiitely so, all the crap in which I was involved as well feeding some 'people' never happened on Mapster.

    What I dislike about Mapster - it's CURSE Coding... what a horrible way to use a forum, WikiCrapole - if I edit the post it, then edit it again a minute after, then edit it again, it shows the first edit, not saving my 2nd edit.. the way if you allow spaces between using BBCode codes, the text won't change at all.. and many so silly problems

    Still - the chat I use also for help with the editor. The place has nearly no other topics than SC2 editor but hey that makes it so good, so trolling free, flammers free and I feel like in a forum heaven there, damn it! So far away from the BS and awful trolls here. Why is this happening here? One explanation: SC2 community MORE MATURE and grown up than the kiddies runnin around here.

    I agree that this place CANNOT BE SC2 place, though it should move on. Making it a more GENERAL ARTIST place is a good idea, TWIF, however no reason for me to stay, this time for real. eSports? - I have a place not even a forum, Ponies? I should use another forum, SC2 editor - already have. Thank you.

    And my name is weird e stands for eSports, ImtoR is an abbreviation of my full nickname!!! That's the mystery.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2012
  13. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2009
    Messages:
    5,560
    Resources:
    4
    Icons:
    3
    Tutorials:
    1
    Resources:
    4
    I appreciate the post, but I want to keep talk of trolling, recent events, and other such things out of this thread. This is for discussing proposals.
     
  14. MGCǂSpectre

    MGCǂSpectre

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2005
    Messages:
    3,007
    Resources:
    2
    Tutorials:
    2
    Resources:
    2
    ...

    Have I mentioned anyone related to the recent events? I was discussing why sc2 has no place and is time to move from war3 on, and pretty much the situation with the games NOT anyone from the staff.... See what's wrong with HiveWorkshop? Everyone brings self-importance in his posts (very much such attitude the post above), I can't say one thing here without turning out bad - by someone else who makes me look bad... who makes assumptions about something I never meant..

    That will always be the difference between the more mature communites I mention and these, here. Why do you think we never discuss attitude in Sc2Mapster? Ok with this last day of the week, I am out of here too. Every time, you can't make 1 proper conversation here and this happens nowhere else. And here everyone's like under 20, seems the age does speak.

    As for proposals, my proposal is change your own attitude and grow up if you want this thw community to be less awful. To you I only look awful because I argue about things that I never had to argue about on other places, so guess where it comes from? Not from me. Good luck with that, and eliminating Self-Importance look on the forum.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2012
  15. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2009
    Messages:
    5,560
    Resources:
    4
    Icons:
    3
    Tutorials:
    1
    Resources:
    4
    I didn't say you did. :)

    I didn't say you meant anything. I thanked you for your post, I agree with parts of it.

    You appear to have over-reacted and taken my comments around a park that I did not intend for them. I certainly meant no offense, I simply do not want to see the conversation turn into... well... this. Let's keep things on target is all I ask.

    I don't understand how you got to thinking this, but it's not true at all. Let's just continue to discuss the sites DIRECTION. Not what has been going on with the staff reformation, or with users trolling or maturity - those are hot topics, and I don't want a discussion to be tainted with it. That's all I'm asking. I'm sorry if they came off as offensive.
     
  16. Gyrosphinx

    Gyrosphinx

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2007
    Messages:
    1,742
    Resources:
    6
    Models:
    6
    Resources:
    6
    Good to see that there are people thinking forward! That really helps! :D

    The Hive sits with a solid base of skilled and creative minds, and I agree, that is what the site should build upon. Seeing sections devoted to the creation of games and similiar projects would certainly be nice. The artist's discussion forums seems like a good place to start.

    Also, I could see a database, not only of models or skins, but also consisiting of music, sound, storyboards and similiar stuff, to greatly benefit the Hive in general. Perhaps evolve into a hub where one can find people interested in ones projects!

    I could certainly use such a Hub, I have a great deal of ideas, but I'm lacking in most areas, as I know little 3D modelling and Scripting.
     
  17. Ralle

    Ralle

    Owner

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2004
    Messages:
    11,227
    Resources:
    22
    Tools:
    3
    Maps:
    5
    Tutorials:
    14
    Resources:
    22
    I think focusing on modding games in general would not really work without picking out one specific game at a time, focusing hard on it for a long time, to make the site almost built for that game. You know I will build smart systems to share things you make for the game and so on.
    I don't think this would be relevant for discussion anytime yet, as SC2 still needs a lot of attention.
     
  18. Sorceress

    Sorceress

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    1,024
    Resources:
    1
    Template:
    1
    Resources:
    1

    Well said, and i totally agree.
    This site 'gamebanana.com' started out as a counter-strike modding site for some years before it went modding for almost every steam-game.
     
  19. Karawasa

    Karawasa

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    328
    Resources:
    2
    Maps:
    2
    Resources:
    2
    The whole point of this discussion is that you've missed the boat for SC2 a long time ago...and the WC3 one is almost at the bottom of the sea.
     
  20. Sorceress

    Sorceress

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    1,024
    Resources:
    1
    Template:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    God it's been down for ages, we are the ones who keep it up..
    Also, NO! SC2 Boat IZ NAT GONE.
    People are as far as i know working on making tools to make it easier to mod for Sc2.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.