Neatherland Conflict v0.34a

[Hashinshin]

Just got fatal error right as blood mage's ultimate was supposed to explode.

Is that happening for you too ?

 

[Zacharias]

Just got fatal error right as blood mage's ultimate was supposed to explode.
Is that happening for you too ?

no, just tried it, no error. Code seems ok too.

Edit: K, found it. Its just a minior bug, shouldn´t crash all the time. Anyway next update will fix that.

 

[Hashinshin]

In your next update I suggest tuning down the agility stat. Agility heroes late game become kinda ridiculous. Ezekiel especially with his ranged attack can start destroying the game if hes well played.

Blademaster, assassin, ezekiel, they all become obscene once they stack on agility. Their swing timer becomes ridiculous and their spells are probably the highest scaling ones. Assassin can pack on 4x agility in a few seconds, ezekiel has his massive ranged attack and whirlwind that scale with 1 agility per second (while the vampire still scales at 1/3 per second.)

I was thinking to myself "Man ezekiel and blademaster just become obscene late game." Then I played with the vampire and he got massive damage too, then I started to notice the pattern

So yea, I would reduce the level at which agility scales your attack speed. I would reduce the coefficient slightly on ezekiel, blademaster and assassin.

BTW: Oracle's line of fire ability does not damage on the line. It damages where she is looking. Her 2 rune ability feels sorta too much too. It can do 1000 damage if you stack intellect. If you ever try to drain her she puts 2 runes under you and nomatter your life you will generally blow up fast.

Last note: I would increase the max level of creep upgrades and speed them up too. With gold on kills and more EXP on kills creeps are slower by comparison. I've started to see heroes solo down entire lanes with ease. Kinda defeats the purpose of it being an AoS. This ESPECIALLY helps out the melee heroes who can outright ignore the soldiers and just run up to the casters later in the game. I would also take a look at reducing the power of movement speed items. Faster movement speed lets melee just outright mock casters late in the game. Blink in with a movement speed item and just start destroying them. They won't have the life or even be able to run away.

I mean I can understand if I wasn't geared for defense at all. But my oracle with 2 matter essence was still getting obliterated by the blade master. Leaps in with like 800 damage and proceeds to then get 300-400 crits on me till I die. Ezekiel is less instant death but he still gets a 400+ damage ranged ability (thats actually an AoE) which he can then combo with his whirlwind or just use those chain 400 crits. It just seems like the agility heroes are playing a different game than the other heroes where killing in 5 seconds is the norm. I realize they should kill faster, thats their thing, but notice how even late game the strength heroes and intellect heroes aren't just 1 shotting everyone and theres still lots of room to escape or fight back since their abilities full blown might bring you to 1/2 total.

 

[Zacharias]

Ok thanks, i will try to comprehend the pattern
I decreased affects of STR and INT, guess AGI is the next. AGI-heros are usually much easier to play, so no wonder if they dominate. But i´ll try to balance that.
Thx.

Edit 14.1.09
After pausing a month, i´ll update the map the map in the next days, fixing some bugs und serious imbalances. More heros and items will be implemented the next weeks.
so far, maybe cya on garena, channel europe RPG.

 

[Hashinshin]

Any updates ?

Really looking forward to a new update.

 

[Zacharias]

Any updates ?
Really looking forward to a new update.

Uploaded today. This version, 0.14d, fixes the main imbalances and bugs. New contend coming soon.

 

[Hashinshin]

You really hit some of the mage heroes hard but you didn't seem to touch on agility heroes.

 

[Zacharias]

You really hit some of the mage heroes hard but you didn't seem to touch on agility heroes.

That´s right, i´m looking for possibilities to weak them, but attackspeed e.g. is at minium.

 

[Hashinshin]

So any chance at that new content coming out soon ?

 

[Zacharias]

So any chance at that new content coming out soon ?

Yes of course, project is not abandoned at all

 

[Mitchomitch]

Yes of course, project is not abandoned at all

Good, we're all waiting for some new stuff. Btw: I <3 this map ^o^

 

[Zacharias]

Good, we're all waiting for some new stuff. Btw: I <3 this map ^o^

Always good to hear, i love it too

Currently my study comes first, so please be patient. I will unlock 4 items and maybe 2 new heros in the next version, which will be finished soon.
One of the items is my personal favourite, The Staff of the Horizon Guard, took me several hours to implement it, hope you´ll like it!

 

[Hashinshin]

Heroes can't be chosen at all after 1 minute.

Golden golem sometimes gets a no respawn ever again bug, related to his ultimate.

 

[Zacharias]

Heroes can't be chosen at all after 1 minute.

Fixed.

Golden golem sometimes gets a no respawn ever again bug, related to his ultimate.

Played him several times, never happened to me. When did this happen? Situation?

Edit: found an fixed.

 

[Hashinshin]

Any chance of getting those fixes in another version soon ?

 

[Zacharias]

Any chance of getting those fixes in another version soon ?

Is today soon enought?

 

[TheDivineBoss]

This sounds kinda stupid, but is the title of your name misspelled accidently or on purpose (if on purpose, I know why)?

 

[Zacharias]

This sounds kinda stupid, but is the title of your name misspelled accidently or on purpose (if on purpose, I know why)?

The map has been renamed 3 times (this name exists since v0.06), but it´s not about a dutch war, its not misspelled. I simply didn´t knew a better name then this one.

Note: 0.16 causes fatal errors in two situations, i´m currently uploading 0.16b, which should fix that.

 

[Hashinshin]

Ok this is pretty hilarious.

The vampire's 10% healing aura isn't 10% at all. Its 1000% I think. Everything around him heals 1000% of their damage. This is pretty funny.

His transmute has 20 second duration with 10 second cooldown. He can theoretically keep 2 heroes permanently locked down. I suggest making 1/3 time (when used against heroes.). As in 2 seconds, 3 seconds, 4 seconds, 5 seconds, 6 seconds. It'd still be VERY VERY good from there.

but yeah, the vampire is just hilariously overpowered right now.

As a note, I feel like the older heroes are starting to feel stale with lack of scaling abilities and whatnot.

 

[Zacharias]

Omg it´s really 1000%
Will be fixed in the next update.

There is also a bug causing Bloodmages ulti to deal.... well... much damage
Next version will include a new Hero.

 

[Hashinshin]

Golden golem still bugs a bit.

Fire mage has a lack of scaling now and seems kinda weak. His rain of fire now just seems out of character. Hes all about instant casts and blowing away the enemy, rain of fire just never gets used hardly ever. I suggest some sort of fire nova that knocks people away from him. Seems like he needs it. I've played him and others and we all feel him being on the weaker side now.
-I suggest stealing the -evil aura from the staff and giving it to the fire mage. The effect is cool as hell and totally deserving of the fire mage. Keep the the staff, just steal the animation for another ability. You can have it on 2 things, nobody will notice.

People that raise dead don't get upgrades on their creeps. Significant disadvantage late game.

mira trapper has fallen behind the other heroes. With no scaling or anything she just feels like a relic that nobody chooses.

 

[Zacharias]

Golden golem still bugs a bit.

Which? Golden golem or Corrupted Golem?

Fire mage has a lack of scaling now and seems kinda weak. His rain of fire now just seems out of character. Hes all about instant casts and blowing away the enemy, rain of fire just never gets used hardly ever. I suggest some sort of fire nova that knocks people away from him. Seems like he needs it. I've played him and others and we all feel him being on the weaker side now.
-I suggest stealing the -evil aura from the staff and giving it to the fire mage. The effect is cool as hell and totally deserving of the fire mage. Keep the the staff, just steal the animation for another ability. You can have it on 2 things, nobody will notice.

Sounds good. Will exchange the Firerain with a new evil nova (scaled and blowing away)

People that raise dead don't get upgrades on their creeps. Significant disadvantage late game.

Ok, as i´ve changed the improvements it should be possible.

mira trapper has fallen behind the other heroes. With no scaling or anything she just feels like a relic that nobody chooses.

I´ve played her several times, anyway she is not weak at all, but scaling is missing, yeah.

Thx, as always good critism.

 

[Joe-black-5]

Ok here is my review:
this is a good AOS map that was not based on dota and but it seems that it have some problems that need to be fixed
-there is no credits in the map (icons, models ....)
-Description needs more colors to attract people, abilities have direct description about what the ability does which is a good thing
-in the multiboard the good side is named "Order of the" only
-there is a weird table thing under the board that i didnt understand what it is for so you need to add help in quests to help the players and that board also can prevent players from reading description when opening the multiboard
-the creeps numbers increase very fast

a good thing i liked in the map was the repick system.

i will give you a 3/5 for now
work hard and never give up on the map, always search for new ideas to make the map more fun to play.

good luck man
i approve this map

 

[Zacharias]

-there is no credits in the map (icons, models ....)
-in the multiboard the good side is named "Order of the" only
-the creeps numbers increase very fast

Thx, will be fixed/rebalanced in the next version.

-there is a weird table thing under the board that i didnt understand

Thats the main part of my map, capture-able flags. Please include that in your evaluation...

what it is for so you need to add help in quests to help the players and that board also can prevent players from reading description when opening the multiboard

Added. As the loading screen and the text in the map description says you can always type -help ingame to get usefull information, you´re not lost.

-Description needs more colors to attract people, abilities have direct description about what the ability does which is a good thing

All descriptions were colored with 3-4 colors. I don´t want squiggled rainbow tooltips, do you? Don´t know what you really want in this case. Even damage formulas where 'outlined' by brackets. Please give accurate tipps on this.


After all thx for looking on my map, but if you really want to rate my map please play it longer then just 10 minutes, if you would have done this, the flags-system would be self-explanatorious, as it is essential.
I know you don´t have much time, but if you rate it, please test it carefully.

 

[Joe-black-5]

dont worry the rating may be changed any time so just inform me when new versions come out.
for the coloring i meant it will attract the readers it is better to help the player to know for example the cooldown in a quick look
the important is not the rating but it is the approving
keep up the good work

 

[Zacharias]

dont worry the rating may be changed any time so just inform me when new versions come out.
for the coloring i meant it will attract the readers it is better to help the player to know for example the cooldown in a quick look
the important is not the rating but it is the approving
keep up the good work

Ok thx. Cooldown is colored btw, always on the bottom. Thats why i asked what you mean, i simply dont know what else to color.
There is a new version nearly every week, so.... lets wait with rating ^^

 

[Bumkt]

my machine parts for golden golem got stuck in trees and bugged me. I think lightning is broken I never saw it happen.

 

[Hashinshin]

I like the creep upgrades on raised units, definitely makes those heroes a lot more powerful. Mayhaps units that are summoned (black mage, skeleton king, the druid guy, ect) could also get upgrades through that ? Of course people who summoned a lot of people would get a lot less from the upgrades and such like that. I don't know if it doesn't work on other people, but mr. stock restock was unable to get upgrades on his stolen units.

Also, Mr. Stock restock could use some increases. I don't think his towers work, and his third ability, the one with more gold on life lost and less gold on life healed... I think you should double those numbers or at least increase them. At most that ability can maybe net you an average of 100 gold every lifebar, kinda subpar.

Skeleton king I think could use 5 seconds off his soul leech drain life ability, to a 30 seconds cooldown.

I keep noticing crashing with the gnoll, specifically it seems with his auto attack proc ability. Might be related, but not be, but i always notice it when I'm the gnoll attacking somebody.

Golden Golem's ult is still bugged... perhaps just remake it as a different ability ?

I think archangel's starfall ability could use another slight decrease. Maybe to 1.8 or 1.5 agility.

Fear's DoT should be retooled to scale. Right now it does a colossal amount of damage in the start of the match. Me and warlock could take down an enemy just with our DoTs and maybe 1 hit. We just burst down pretty much anything with DoTs.

As a suggestion for a new hero, I think the good side needs a stealthy guy. However, I think to differentiate him from the assassin he should be a ranged guy. With a model kinda like http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/resource.php?t=112412 . Some sort of ranged stun, like 100+1x agility +3 second stun, plasma grenade slowing enemies by 50%, and stuff like that.

 

[Zacharias]

I like the creep upgrades on raised units, definitely makes those heroes a lot more powerful. Mayhaps units that are summoned (black mage, skeleton king, the druid guy, ect) could also get upgrades through that ? Of course people who summoned a lot of people would get a lot less from the upgrades and such like that. I don't know if it doesn't work on other people, but mr. stock restock was unable to get upgrades on his stolen units.

I noticed a little bug, it doesnt work for now All summoned units will get upgrades, except units summoned by Black Mage, as they were already scaled.

Also, Mr. Stock restock could use some increases. I don't think his towers work, and his third ability, the one with more gold on life lost and less gold on life healed... I think you should double those numbers or at least increase them. At most that ability can maybe net you an average of 100 gold every lifebar, kinda subpar.

Will recheck that.

Skeleton king I think could use 5 seconds off his soul leech drain life ability, to a 30 seconds cooldown.

k.

I keep noticing crashing with the gnoll, specifically it seems with his auto attack proc ability. Might be related, but not be, but i always notice it when I'm the gnoll attacking somebody.

A complete crash of the game? Including fatal error? Played him several times, didn´t every crashed (in 0.18).

Golden Golem's ult is still bugged... perhaps just remake it as a different ability ?

Omg... its a bug that cant be fixed so far, think its a compiler problem. Maybe i should change the ability, maybe to a normal reincernation.

I think archangel's starfall ability could use another slight decrease. Maybe to 1.8 or 1.5 agility.

Fear's DoT should be retooled to scale. Right now it does a colossal amount of damage in the start of the match. Me and warlock could take down an enemy just with our DoTs and maybe 1 hit. We just burst down pretty much anything with DoTs.

Noticed that.

As a suggestion for a new hero, I think the good side needs a stealthy guy. However, I think to differentiate him from the assassin he should be a ranged guy. With a model kinda like Tau Elite Commando - The Hive Workshop - A Warcraft III Modding Site . Some sort of ranged stun, like 100+1x agility +3 second stun, plasma grenade slowing enemies by 50%, and stuff like that.

The model is great, but far to big. I dont want to increase filesize anymore. But i like the idea.

 

[Hashinshin]

I mean the towers say +10 gold no matter what rank of the ability you have. I said that poorly earlier. It might work properly but just be a display error, either way no matter what rank I had it always just said +10 gold.

 

[Zacharias]

Ok thx. When its displayed, its payed

Edit:
I think i fixed the bugs with immortal soul and short circuit. Will rey to rebalance Stock Broker and improve the environment. I´m tinkering with the idea of reterraining the whole map (again). Now as it is winter i´d like to change into a green terrain.... should i do so?

Edit2: I added some concept arts in the social group: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/groups/neatherland+conflict/
Those were just basic sketches from the old and the new terrain i´m planning. Plz give some feedback.

Edit3: Puh, new terrain was more work than i thought (~30 hrs), hope you like it! The idea was not only to add a more detailed terrain, i also wanted to "balance" the lanes, as lanes with one flag overbalance fast if they were captured.
I also fixed the reported bugs, hope everything works fine now.

 

[f0rsAk3n]

I really enjoyed playing this map, good job , 5/5

 

[Hashinshin]

Just fought the golden golem and his machine parts worked every single time. I think it might be fixed.

I'm really missing the teleport back to base. Between small mana regen at the fountain and the minute walk back it feels like the game has started to slow down.

Warlock feel strong but with one bad thing, his ultimate is kinda gimp. Feels like it should just be some spamable ability. His wall of spirits also scales like crap.

Great version as always though.

Am noticing some crashing errors lately. Started happening since lightning gnoll.

 

[Zacharias]

Just fought the golden golem and his machine parts worked every single time. I think it might be fixed.

Well that sounds good.

I'm really missing the teleport back to base. Between small mana regen at the fountain and the minute walk back it feels like the game has started to slow down.

Hmmm the idea is to teleport to the lane and get back by scroll. Hmm... i´ll try to find an other way.

Warlock feel strong but with one bad thing, his ultimate is kinda gimp. Feels like it should just be some spamable ability. His wall of spirits also scales like crap.

Ok.

Am noticing some crashing errors lately. Started happening since lightning gnoll.

In this version too? Fixed something.

 

[Hashinshin]

Well not to rain on your parade, but the golem finally bugged after 2 games with him. At the very least its getting a whole lot less rare.

 

[Zacharias]

Well not to rain on your parade, but the golem finally bugged after 2 games with him. At the very least its getting a whole lot less rare.

Omg... I don´t know why its bugged, thats the big problem. I found out that it´s caused by machineparts created in cliffs, but i don´t know why the countdown stops then.
Anyway i´ll try to find a work around or sth like that. Anyway thx for all comments.
Plz report if the Lightning Gnoll is still bugged.

 

[Hashinshin]

Uhhhh after a few playing against actual good players I have a few notes.

I'd increase the CD on the black mage's first ability (the direct damage single target one) by a few seconds. Nothing major, just to give the enemy a few more seconds to react.

The skeleton king is kinda gimp. If I can suggest a few things: Give skeleton bomb a 3 second stun. Lower the CD on skeleton bomb to 10 seconds, lower the CD on life leach to 30 seconds.

The chaos dragon needs to use a real dragon model, its been a too long lasting joke. His fire eyes ability also should have double the coefficient. Right now its truly just a waste of mana. Does maybe 10 damage a second ? For 10 mana a second ? If you at least made it 1/2 of strength a second at max level it'd be able to do 30 damage a second or something worth while. I think you can steal the code from the black mage to scale his instant damage chaos shell ability too. I think his ultimate is pretty badass, just some scaling for late game would be awesome.

If you don't want the chaos dragon to be using the same model as the black mage's dragon you could use like http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/resource.php?t=48390&prev=search=dragon&d=list&r=20. But please, every time somebody picks him its like HAH.

Suggestions I have for the assassin who is just below par IMO. -Make evasion give a critical strike chance too, 3%/6%/9%/12%/15% at 2x damage. -Make the poison put on a 20% slow.

Ok gayas mage. The deer seem to get an odd jump in damage at rank 1 of upgrades. They go from 25 damage to 40 damage. I think if you fix that it'd fair up the guy as a whole. I say steal the code from carrion swarm for his second ability, and thorns aura is bugged. Past rank 1 only the gayas mage gets thorns aura (as in nobody arounds him gets the buff at rank 2+)

Commander's ultimate is still.... wowee. I really would rather have anything but this. I'm driven off the hero just because of nonsensical the ultimate is. Maybe something like avatar ? Maybe something where he moves 20% faster, takes 20% less damage, deals 50% less damage, but stuns on every hit.

Fire devils aren't getting the scaling bonus.

Suggestion for a hero, something like the old gayas mage. A hero who doesn't fight, but rather has a huge golem that fights for him. His talents are things that enhance the golem or heal or, or something alone those lines.

Golden golem still broken, lol.
I killed mayor and the server split immediately.

 

[Zacharias]

I'd increase the CD on the black mage's first ability (the direct damage single target one) by a few seconds.

Done.

The skeleton king is kinda gimp. If I can suggest a few things: Give skeleton bomb a 3 second stun. Lower the CD on skeleton bomb to 10 seconds, lower the CD on life leach to 30 seconds.

Done.

The chaos dragon needs to use a real dragon model, its been a too long lasting joke. His fire eyes ability also should have double the coefficient. Right now its truly just a waste of mana. Does maybe 10 damage a second ? For 10 mana a second ? If you at least made it 1/2 of strength a second at max level it'd be able to do 30 damage a second or something worth while. I think you can steal the code from the black mage to scale his instant damage chaos shell ability too. I think his ultimate is pretty badass, just some scaling for late game would be awesome.

All done.

If you don't want the chaos dragon to be using the same model as the black mage's dragon you could use like Fire Dragon Caller of Fire - The Hive Workshop - A Warcraft III Modding Site. But please, every time somebody picks him its like HAH.

lol okok, i´ve changed the model. Don´t want to use models that were not necessary (filesize).

Suggestions I have for the assassin who is just below par IMO. -Make evasion give a critical strike chance too, 3%/6%/9%/12%/15% at 2x damage. -Make the poison put on a 20% slow.

Sounds good, approved.

Ok gayas mage. The deer seem to get an odd jump in damage at rank 1 of upgrades. They go from 25 damage to 40 damage.

The deer gets +5 dmg on every update, like all other creeps.

I say steal the code from carrion swarm for his second ability, and thorns aura is bugged. Past rank 1 only the gayas mage gets thorns aura (as in nobody arounds him gets the buff at rank 2+)

Thorns aura fixed.
Leaf wave can´t get the same code as it works on a line. I will have to implement new functions for that, takes time but will be done.

Commander's ultimate is still.... wowee. I really would rather have anything but this. I'm driven off the hero just because of nonsensical the ultimate is. Maybe something like avatar ? Maybe something where he moves 20% faster, takes 20% less damage, deals 50% less damage, but stuns on every hit.

Avatar is already used by Tauren Warchief. The ulti-stun sounds good, but.... little bit imba?

Fire devils aren't getting the scaling bonus.

Done. Note: Anomalies won´t get any upgrades, as it would increase their dmg by ~100% ^^ think they were good enought.

Suggestion for a hero, something like the old gayas mage. A hero who doesn't fight, but rather has a huge golem that fights for him. His talents are things that enhance the golem or heal or, or something alone those lines.

The first Gayas mage summoned a golem, could heal it, increase its dmg for some seconds and had thorns aura. It was just boring

Golden golem still broken, lol.

Fixed..... fixed, f**** yes Was a timer bug. As it didn´t stop it was only possible to revive once.

I killed mayor and the server split immediately.

Mayor removed. Ironheart works

 

[Psycho Ninja]

The Gayas Mage's Leaf ability

Hey, I play this map a lot with hash. Just gonna say Great map and i love to play it.

Though the Gayas Mage's Leaf ability seems really ineffective and should have either a bit higher damage or should scale with int or something. personally i use him a lot and rarely ever use the ability. My thoughts on it are just to remove it and give him rejuve like he used to when he summoned the golem.

also a quick side question, hash has made this joke to me a few times and i've gotten it from a few other too.

but yea they refer to him being the "Gay ass" mage with is whole deer thing and all but yea. just wondering if theres any choice reason you called him that.

 

[Zacharias]

Hey, I play this map a lot with hash. Just gonna say Great map and i love to play it.

I love it too thx.

Though the Gayas Mage's Leaf ability seems really ineffective and should have either a bit higher damage or should scale with int or something. personally i use him a lot and rarely ever use the ability. My thoughts on it are just to remove it and give him rejuve like he used to when he summoned the golem.

A heal? Think a dmg spell would be better, don´t want the Odd Mage back again.

also a quick side question, hash has made this joke to me a few times and i've gotten it from a few other too.
but yea they refer to him being the "Gay ass" mage with is whole deer thing and all but yea. just wondering if theres any choice reason you called him that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaia_(mythology) its a typo sry ^^


Edit:
So new version uploaded. I fixed all (2) bugs causing fatal errors, tested them several times (more then 10...) and added some safty nets in the code.
The new Commander ability can be very effective and turn the tide very quick, plz report if it its imba

Next: improve terrain, maybe add new heros, improve stun/delay effect system and finding new, fresh ideas for some gameplay improvements

 

[Hashinshin]

I keep getting "game not found" when attempting to host the map. I think something was lost in transition.

 

[aldwyn]

i can´t run your map.when i get dota map, and thenm this map, sides are the sentinel and the scourge, and then sdome other maps, but options is same as that maps i clicked on before.so i can´t run it, when i press start button, it do not start and that map will have no options(i have original version of warcraft)

 

[Zacharias]

Was a really nasty bug in the portal trigger. Works now. Sry for this.

Edit: Noticed bugs:
- portals, some kind of strange it-works-but-it-should-not-work bugs
- hermit: scroll of town portal requires a town hall X(

 

[Hashinshin]

I kinda like how portals work right now. Can we try it like this for a few patches ? Its kind of like a middle ground. When you're on the defensive you can get back to your base easy, but when you're on the offensive you still have to walk back a bit.

Hermit seems kinda worthless TBH. I'm not gonna put my gold into potions... perhaps make the potions free but on a minute respawn ? That way you actively want to get this guy for his potions but they are rationed off between your team.

I think creeps need their upgrades capped at 9. 7 seems too low when I have 2 thor's hammer and am just crushing them all in seconds. It would only effect extreme late game balance anyway.

The issue of AoEs against your soldiers needs to be addressed. By late game any AoE hero can completely decimate rows of soldiers with prejudice. Fire mage can blow lines of em away, chaos dragon incinerates them, lich freezes em all over. I think they need to get a small progressively scaling magic resist. Something like 2% magic resist per upgrade level. That way it slowly creeps up and caps at 18% at level 9 upgrades. Either that or people like the commander need an aura that gives their creeps magic resist. Right now by late game its naerly pointless to give auras because of A. Creeps don't upgrade enough to stay useful in extreme late game and B. AoE heroes just blow them all to pieces.

I bugged the chaos dragon to have fire eyes on when it was off. No mana was consumed, I did not have the buff, yet the effect kept going off and I pretty much blew away the opposition. Additionally, give the chaos dragon 0.2 less intellect per level. Yes, 0.2, I think he could use a slight mana reduction at 22 but not much. Just 0.2.

What to do about the druid ? His deer are amazingly strong and I think you should start them off with maybe 2 less damage, and get 1 less damage per upgrade. Small steps here, just 1 damage. Nothing more, the druid has been a lackluster hero for a long time and I don't wanna see him go back.

FIRE MAGE. I think this is what you should do. An AoE nova attack that is centered on the caster. It does light damage, at most 1/2 the damage of his fire wave AoE attack (1/2 the base damage +1/2 int) and push all enemies away from him. This would give him a little survivability against melee which I think he needs.

Lich is giving debug messages when he uses his stun. His stun is incidentally hotkeyed to C, and not whatever it's proper one should be.

 

[Zacharias]

Well i will change those things mentioned, some good ideas though.
I want to implement an other idea, did you ever thought about flooding the vallay.... just as an idea

Edit: The Firenova of the mage: I cant get used to it, it would make him imba (2 instant aoe spells +push away), he could only be pwned by mages and or ranged units.

Edit: There is no option for decreasing spell-dmg, anyway i suggest to downscale some aoe abilities.

 

[Hashinshin]

Well I know you're gonna hate me for this, but I just don't see how to get instant damage to be balanced for the chaos dragon. He AoEs enemies down but then can drop a very big instant damage spell so the enemy has to run away after every chaos or risk death, just doesn't seem fair. I was talking to my friend and we said a medium kinda wind move that knocked back was the best idea. The dragon seems very focused on flashy attacks that dominated groups of enemies but left himself open.

Something very flashy, a minute or so cooldown massed knockback. Possibly leaves a small DoT on enemies. Something as a last resort ability to just keep people away from the dragon, but not low enough cooldown to keep saving him. But definitely bright and flashy because thats the chaos dragon's style.

IF you don't want to though I can understand, I suggested a lot for the chaos dragon lately.

For the fire mage, possibly make it a 40 second cooldown with just minor knockback to balance it out.

I think you could give creeps maybe 10 more life per upgrade then to offset AoE damage, AoEs need to do their damage for hero vs. hero.

 

[Zacharias]

His stun is incidentally hotkeyed to C, and not whatever it's proper one should be.

You mean his Frost Fault? Its hotkeyed to W, tried it out :S

Well I know you're gonna hate me for this, but I just don't see how to get instant damage to be balanced for the chaos dragon. He AoEs enemies down but then can drop a very big instant damage spell so the enemy has to run away after every chaos or risk death, just doesn't seem fair. I was talking to my friend and we said a medium kinda wind move that knocked back was the best idea. The dragon seems very focused on flashy attacks that dominated groups of enemies but left himself open.

This wind should replace the Dark Shell or the Chaos spell? I know he is very good, with 3 AoE spells. I thought about tuning down Chaos, less meteors and maybe channeling, that would make him very vulnerable during this attack.

Something very flashy, a minute or so cooldown massed knockback. Possibly leaves a small DoT on enemies. Something as a last resort ability to just keep people away from the dragon, but not low enough cooldown to keep saving him. But definitely bright and flashy because thats the chaos dragon's style.

IF you don't want to though I can understand, I suggested a lot for the chaos dragon lately.

The idea is very well considered, thx, both.

For the fire mage, possibly make it a 40 second cooldown with just minor knockback to balance it out.

Hmmmm that sounds good, i will implement it, let us try it out

I think you could give creeps maybe 10 more life per upgrade then to offset AoE damage, AoEs need to do their damage for hero vs. hero.

Already done before you posted it, 9 upgrade lvls with each +35hp (+5).
AoS is to be considered hero vs creeps, but i could implement some AoS that scales by the enemy units life stats or something like that in future.

 

[Hashinshin]

Well I meant replace dark shell. I find the chaos dragon is vulnerable enough to use chaos because he has to go into the enemy to get it to full effect. I often take 1/4 or 1/2 my life trying to position a good chaos.

I just think it becomes unfair once dark shell comes into the picture. I don't use dark shell just because I consider it a little unfair. Enemies have to avoid your AoEs and then if they did they can still get blown up by a direct damage attack.

 

[Zacharias]

Well I meant replace dark shell. I find the chaos dragon is vulnerable enough to use chaos because he has to go into the enemy to get it to full effect. I often take 1/4 or 1/2 my life trying to position a good chaos.

I just think it becomes unfair once dark shell comes into the picture. I don't use dark shell just because I consider it a little unfair. Enemies have to avoid your AoEs and then if they did they can still get blown up by a direct damage attack.

Ok thats makes sense, will reconsider it. Everything else is already done, so update will be published soon.

 

[Hashinshin]

I just enjoy how the chaos dragon is so epic.

His ultimate and chaos, especially when used at the same time, absolutely torch everything near him. Nobody comes close to the spectacular visuals the chaos dragon has.

Though I'd say publish it now if its just the chaos dragon holding you back