Villagerino man, you summed this up pretty better than myself.
@Villagerino @Footman16 I apologize if i did not explain to you both this, I though you know about this but seems that you are not aware at all about paid banners, I have one important update for you which further explains this situation and position I was in.
1. Regarding these banners, they are automatically renewed each month until you cancel subscription, the only one thing you can control
2. Banners are linked to account! One banner one account!
I wanted even to create second banner to pay additional funds so this one could be linked to poll itself! But its not possible. Its the same as with heroes ranks. So, I could not edit link and the picture of the banner, I could not create second one to pay further if needed, I could not do anything, I was forced to cancel it as I realized they are totally inactive and it leads to old thread as money is constantly drawn each month. Even if I could create another one at the end it would require Ralle's approval.
Do not forget that most of these banners are actually single static projects, but this one is directly linked to the contest, and as Ralle and Archian said that new threads must be opened, therefore the links should be changed, ironically, again this caused by them.
As you can see now, their system was not prepared for contests and moving links, but they behaved so far like everything works normally.
Now Footman16 and Villagerino check this
This is from PM, I wont reveal any private information from private messages of course, but this is safe and matters to you all.
@Footman16 as you can see you were never part of the plan. Now I can show other parts where he always mentioned Archian and specifically mentioned him because this involves money, he never ever mentioned you.
He left you out of this thing for a reason I believe. In order to understand this you need to understand two things first:
Usually places like Hiveworkshop get income in two ways:
1. Donations - That is voluntary, not obligation, everyone donates how he wishes. Now, Ralle removed Donate button and replaced with paid content, so I donated him via paypall. So, Ralles only obligation towards people is what he explained that donations are for. And he has no other obligations.
2. Business and market - Sites can sell stuff or offer some service for the money. There is defined cash prize amount and what you get for that. And that MUST be followed, since the place is making profit and therefore enters in market and economic laws. Basically Hive and Ralle are now under some authority that means that they must deliver what they sell and promote. And Hive currently sells shirts, cups like products, but also offers a service via banners with exact details what is to be expected in return for certain amount of money.
Now, I do not understand under which country's jurisdiction as Ralle is from Denmark in person, and Hive is perhaps registered in USA, but that does not matter much. In either way he must follow laws.
In the first case, like most of sites, he is absolute ruler and can do whatever he wishes. He can now order you to ban as many persons if he wishes, (hypothetically speaking) without any consequence. Thats his site and he pays bills and can do whatever he wishes.
But if he takes money for shirts and banners and does not deliver it after some time and orders you to ban many persons, he is violating laws, and in that case he can be reported, investigations would took, inspections, punishments from inspectors and maybe some court for fraud and hoax, depending of how many people he fooled. Maybe even Hive's host will cut Hive down, he has to change host. I was speaking hypothetically, I never said Ralle is going to do that.
So, as you see, Ralle is doing business now legally and he is in marketing sector, therefore by eyes of laws, Ralle is the only one responsible (also, there he is not Ralle, he is Rasmus with all his personal information and credit card accounts), thats why he left you out as you are not involved with his business, and therefore you did not know of any of this. So that has nothing to do against you, its just nature of how it works perhaps. Now, I am speaking from professional side as I am working for the company as team leader and my data team is linked with sales team, I have to talk to them regularly, so I know some things of that matter. Of course, that company is big, has infrastructure and hierarchy, there is no single man site like this, Ralle is weak player I assume, but that does not make him that he has no responsibility towards customers.
And now, you went into bigger issue to understand how to deal with customer type issue as you have no power or full information regarding this. But ironically, you partially fixed thing whats was up to you and leveled down damage regarding contest itself. But the core system is designed and created by Ralle and thats what caused problems here and both your and my hands were tied, thus I had to cancel subscription until they realize this and become more mature regarding this.
Now to answer to Villagerino
I read everything and I want to say that it is better to speak out and communicate than to keep everything to yourself, and this dialogue is the best proof of this, even if it is so public.
Yes, but I did not keep anything for myself for sake that I did not take anything so wrong until recently when I realized that this can go like forever and poll is running. The results will be that much less people will be aware of poll itself and especially I could not control banner to try to people get more aware of that. Then I noticed very core system falures, and I cannot waste my time on this until this gets fixed. And needed to inform people, but mostly contestants, but many of them expected this outcome, they were not surprised and they also think inactivity caused this.
I also want to say that understanding Hive users are grateful to patrons, moderators and other stuff that help keep running this place which represents the whole legacy of Warcraft for regular users. Without @MasterHaosis, a person passionate about our topic, who spent a lot of effort, attention and money, there would not be this contest, and so many entries that do benefit the site
Thanks that was my goal to benefit site, I have nothing out of it personally.
(you have damn interesting job
)
Ah you mean my job? Well, honestly nothing special, I was working with datapoints in database, spreadsheets and our partners, basically our company is working with partners whose are exchanges and casinos, they all are involved with banks, sports betting, companies, cryptocurrencies everywhere... But my job is partially to find deviations like this, or frauds somewhere, incomplete stuff etc... its literally half knowledge half experience. So not much interesting but not much even stressful, depending on the situation, temporarily stuff but I am satisfied so far.
Yes, @Footman16 didn't know he had rights to post in the main news section, however he's one of the most responsive and sensitive moderators, and he did finish the job for administrators.
KEY WORD YOU WROTE: FOOTMAN DID FINISH THE JOB FOR THE ADMINISTRATION. But he did not even know whats this about and administration setup system where only they could approve and change things
This is a place for hobbyists and thus the formal framework is blurred.
While you are right again, as I explained before he should make things more clear and fix things before he started doing business. You cannot mix members and customers like this without any ,,hotline" to talk with customers when some issue like that happens. To users yes, he has no obligations and can disappear forever without answering to anyone. But on paid stuff he cannot. Big difference! He can, but must put someone else in charge then.
May the administration allocate more power to the most active staff users for such cases and provide, say, a specific channel of communication for such cases in order to facilitate delegation over the site?
Yes you are right again, and I believe that some things could be allocated and you understood situation pretty much what I just explained in this post as this is A MUST, not if someone wishes or not. Thats why in Ralle's case I would avoid doing any paid business and content, everything would go via donations and will be much easier.
Edit: I dare say that @MasterHaosis deserves a refund or a free period for the banner in accordance with a certain period for which it was paid but was used incorrectly, i.e. was useless to achieve its advertising purpose.
Thank you, technically you are correct, and legally and morally but I do not want refund because all I did this is for Hive. All the money via donations or paid content I believe is used for the running costs of Hiveworkshop that keeps it alive and benefits users. I never had any doubt otherwise I would got give single euro. I know that man since 2007. He is father of kids as I am now so that is not in the question. Even if he did use some of my money that would be for his kids, so even then I would not be angry, but he did not do this. I think this all went on proper place to benefit site. So its not about money, it is matter of principes. Ralle has no option to use excuses like ,,I have no time" and go on hibernation, he must put someone in charge then and fix some things before went inactive.
