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[Altered Melee] Draktars custom nerubian race (WIP)

Discussion in 'Map Development' started by Draktar, Jul 21, 2020.

  1. Draktar

    Draktar

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    Chapter I: Introduction


    I've played many altered melee maps, but... never ever found THE one!
    I CRAVE NERUBIANS!!! There are far few and between actual full on nerubian tech trees and even fever sticking to the actual lore (even loosely). It's partly thanks to the lack of the nerubian building and unit models in general. This thread will try to outline nerubian culture and it's possible manifestations in game. Lets begin!

    Basic characteristics

    Nerubians are descendants of aqir, creatures shaped from silithid by the old gods. Nerubians inherited their highly xenophobic nature, they're just slightly more "peaceful".
    -possible "racial ability": other than heroes and non-nerubian units, nerubians can't interact with any kind of shops, mercenary camps or taverns.

    Only thing capable of suppressing their xenophobic nature is their deep hate for the undead. The (former) Lich King Ner'Zhul fought them in the war dabbed "The war of the spider", which the nerubians lost and most of them got annihilated and raised as undead. Nerubians were to Ner'Zhuls surprise immune to the undead plague and even his psychic domination, which made them formidable foes. Digging too deep, they disturbed old god tendril, which in turn cost them the war. In the end, they lost due to fighting two fronts at the same time.
    -possible "racial ability": partial cc and plague like effects immunity, only for "nerubian" heroes(?) and units

    Possessing huge libraries (mainly literature, philosophy and arcane lore), nerubians developed philosophy deeming worship foolish and over time it became totally alien to them.
    -no old god alignment, unlike qijari and mantid

    Great architects, tunnelers and trappers.
    -many choices in buildings and upgrades? human like building? something entirely new?

    Nerubians feel lost without their leader(s)
    -possibly locked abilities without "leader" present


    Nerubian castes

    -nerubian king (only one)
    -nerubian queen(s)
    -seers (viziers) = priests, counselors, mages, venomancers
    -spider lords = rulers, "aristocracy"
    -warriors
    -webspinners
    -workers = food/ supplying, weaponsmithing, mining, building
    -especially strong become warriors
    -with mental talents become seers
    -exceptional weaving skills = webspinners

    =other "forms" of nerubians (aren't specified in caste system):
    -flyers = nerubians with membranes between their eight legs
    -spiderlings = there are two variations, an inconsistency created by Blizzard (I'll be using four legged spider like one to add variation).


    Beastiary (non-nerubian creatures)

    -jormungars = creatures of labor used for carving massive tunnels
    -arachnathids = scorpion like beasts used as guarding dogs
    -obsidian destroyers = enslaved tol'vir turned into obsidian "statues"
    -bone spiders = spiders that look like are made of bone (like Hadronox)


    Cities, buildings and structures (possible in-game buildings)

    Azjol'Nerub is the name of their capital city and former empire itself.

    -if used as the main building, we could split it up along this line:
    -Gates of Azjol-Nerub
    -Upper kingdom
    -Ahn'kahet: The old kingdom


    Sundered Monolith (epicenter for nerubian survivors)
    -consist of 6 levels
    -topmost lvl: soldiers
    -other 3 lvls: workers + food
    -5th lvl: seers and spiderlords
    -6th lvl: queen and other egg-laying females

    -another great candidate for main building or other structure

    Nerubian sacrificial pit/ pit of fiends
    -formerly nerubian building (later used by the Lich King) used for sacrificing enemies for luck in battle
    -could be used for the place where are tol'vir transformed into obsidian destroyers (possibly even create new "obsidian versions" of some nerubian units)

    Tomb of relics
    -formerly nerubian building, "shop"
    -just needs a little work and it'll look like it like it looked like in its glory days! (total overhaul)

    Nerubian ziggurat
    -basic structure/ nerubian tower capable of freezing enemies
    -I'd like to add more possible upgrades, like "venom ziggurat", "arcane ziggurat" and maybe "web ziggurat"?



    Chapter II: Race Design


    After listing down almost all possible inspiration, lets lay down the groundwork for this race.
    Playable races have 10 to 11 buildable structures (+upgrades).

    Main building:
    1st stage = Gates of Azjol-Nerub
    2nd stage = Upper kingdom
    3rd stage = Ahn'kahet: The old kingdom
    -each stage reflex its location visually

    -trains: nerubian worker

    • -ability to transform to:
      webspinner, warrior or seer

    • Nerubian.jpg


    Altar of the spider:
    • "The nerubian king/ spider lord/ swarm lord"
      -STR hero
      -possible abilities:
      -wc3 crypt lord abilities: Impale, Spiked Carapace, Carrion Beetles and Locust Swarm
      -hots Anub'arak abilities: Scarab Host, Impale, Harden Carapace, Burrow Charge, Locust Swarm and Cocoon
      -wow Anub'arak(2) abilities: Carrion Beetles, Impale, Leeching Swarm, Pound / Freezing Slash, Leeching Swarm, Penetrating Cold

    • Nerubian_Spiderlord.png
    • "The nerubian queen/ spider queen"
      -INT hero
      -possible abilities:
      -Carrion Swarm (classic nerubian queen)
      -Cocoon: wraps enemy in cocoon, after cocoon "digests" it, heals near by units (freeable by destroying the cocoon)
      -Unholy Aura (classic nerubian queen)
      -Younglings: passive, periodically spawns egg sacks that can be turn to nerubian units ("one use barracks")

    • WIP
    • "The herald of vengeance"
      -AGI hero
      -possible abilities:
      -Leech Poison: melee drain life + adds poison
      -Acid Cloud: placable "plague cloud", sprayed on ground
      -Web Grab: pulls enemy target towards him using web
      -Jaws of Vengeance (Pierce Armor): reduces armor of the enemy target by 50% until either of them dies

    • 800px-Hardronox_HS.jpg
    • WIP


    Nerubian Ziggurat
    -provides food
    -upgradable
    • =equivalent to undead nerubian tower
    • -inspired by nerubian venomancers, inflicts poison
    • =equivalent to human arcane tower
    • -has auto-cast web ability and no attack


    "Basic Barracks name placeholder"
    -will use one of the two nerubian buildings concept arts as model
    -trains:
    • -can learn burrow and how to catch its pray in webs = basic web and web trap ability (invisible single target trap rendering enemy unmovable for a short time)
    • webspinner.png
    • -spawns spiderlings after death
      -armor upgrade to get that wow look
    • armored.png Kilix_TCG.jpg
    • -flying unit only capable of attacking air, can learn upgrade allowing it to attack ground
    • flyer.png


    Empire Library
    -building for upgrades

    Throne of Aristocracy
    -will use "" retextured model
    -trains upper class of nerubian society:
    • classic nerubian seer for time being
    • WIP
    • classic nerubian spider lord for time being
    • scarablike.png


    "Beastiary name placeholder"
    -trains:
    • -can learn burrow and "tunnel" (creates two connected points, "holes" = usable for travel, one person a time, each travel has 5 sec. cooldown. destroying one hole destroys both)
    • jormungar.png
    • classic arachnathid earth-borer for time being
    • Aracnathid.jpg
    • quick unit, can be used for spying or rituals as sacrifice
    • Tol'vir_brothers.jpg


    Sundered Monolith
    -a late game building like chimera roots/ boneyard or tauren totem
    -trains:
    • classic nerubian queen for time being


    Pit of Fiends
    -building using tol'vir slaves as resource (for heals, etc.)
    -trains:
    • Reworked ground version of the classic obsidian destroyer
    • WIP


    Royal Treasury
    -shop, tomb of relics overhaul

    I'll be adding pictures shortly. Please share your opinions and ideas in the comment section bellow!
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2020
  2. Storm Knight

    Storm Knight

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    I had a read through this, gotta say i learned quite a bit from your knowledge of Nerubians. i was also shocked that the Obsedian statues were of Nerubian origin.

    I'm remaking 4 of the original war3 races with almost completely overhauled core gameplay, and this time around i'm tossing out all the side races from the main races, so the Undead will have their Nerubian units and links cut out. (same with the rest of the 3)

    Furthermore, i have to warn you about something, you do seem to have some solid initial ideas. so sharing any new ideas can be difficult for people, just telling you so you won't end up like me wondering why people don't respond without realizing i actually left no room to comment xD

    In any case, i have an idea for your Tomb of Relics:

    - Make it so its not a shop, since you already mention that part. but a place that grants heros instant buffs that either have a specific effect that expires after its triggered, or a buff that lasts for a duration, preferably longer then regular items since they can't carry them.
     
  3. Draktar

    Draktar

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    Thank you for finding your time and reading the whole thing. Regarding "the tossing out of the other races from the main ones", undead become an enigma really fast. Every one of them was different race once alive, so...
    Anyway, lets continue.

    To be more precise, it's all the lore there is to them (excluding the island sub-faction). Nerubians just enslaved/corrupted them, they are tol'vir in origin. Nerubians overthrew their population with titan facility in Northrend and consumed them along with their culture (that's why we have ziggurat shaped structures, base came from tol'vir). I studied hard, so I can capture the essence of this race with the right feel (too hard, I can't think of anything else).

    Yeah, I wanted to lay solid groundwork, so it may seem a little packed, with no room to breathe. Still, most of the units are blank slates and even written ideas aren't written in stone. Rather, I think I'll scare them just by the sheer amount of text :,).


    I think you misunderstood. Either way, it would be interesting if heroes weren't able to interact with even items. I thought about this restriction before... but came to decision not to. It would create many gameplay problems like need to destroy dropped items and balancing issue of geared and unequiped.

    Your idea sounds interesting non-the-less. It could be like black market with random items (treasures) that are powerful items, but act like runes (one-use-items), used instantly after buying. Other than one hero ability and "bury" (which I need to add to most of the nerubians) there's no healing. So occasional healing artifact/ buff could help. :thumbs_up:

    Or I could replace "the reliquary/treasury" with the building for upgrades, "empire library". This way, you could buy books with different effects (rune like) or even tomes. Would work like BM too.
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2020
  4. SgtWinter

    SgtWinter

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    For a racial ability, I would just suggest Burrow as their main form of health regen. If this is a custom race meant to be played with the other 4 main races, then I recommend not using abilities used by other races such as Web, Carrion Swarm or Raise Dead without any changes. As you may notice, each race is unique and do not share abilities with other races. They also do not share units, so I highly recommend making up your own Obsidian Statue instead of just copying the Undead Scourge's techtree.

    Webspinners could have a Web that deals damage over time or they could be able to attack air by throwing webs at their enemies, slowing the enemy over time with each attack up to the point that they are no longer able to move and are ensnared to the ground.

    Flyers could have a bouncing attack similar to the Zerg Mutalisks in Starcraft, or the Night Elf Huntress. Or perhaps a life steal against enemy air units.

    Seer ability ideas. I assume he's a spellcaster.
    Insight - Gives True Sight and increases health regen of a target friendly unit.
    Darkening Vision - Reduces sight range of enemy units in an area and causes them to miss.
    Confusion - Causes enemy units to fight each other.
    Cure - Dispels buffs from target, including Disease Cloud.
    Weaken - Reduces the armor of enemy units in an area.

    That's all I have for now. If you'd like, you can copy some ideas from my unfinished Nerubian tech tree. Just make sure to change a few things so the teachers don't know that you're copying from my homework, wink wink~
     

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  5. cleavinghammer

    cleavinghammer

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    Facehuggers: Targets an enemy unit with the Web debuff at melee range, giving them the non-dispellable Broodlings buff which increases movement and attack speed. After the buff has been active for X seconds, the unit explodes, spawning a permanent Nerubian warrior (Nerubian flyer if the target was an air unit) from the corpse.
     
  6. Storm Knight

    Storm Knight

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    Very true, but i think i can manage to strike what i have in my mind. like, look at a unit like the Abomination or many of the skeletons in the undead ranks. they all obviously have a past that's connected a specific race. but inside the undead ranks they look like no specific race. because of the huge changes they go through that make them unrecognizable.

    So when some can focus on a more zombie-eque part of the Undead to clearly show what each unit/creature belongs to, i'm more in favor of creating an Undead faction that is more raw mix of other creatures and different constructions of skeletal figures and such.

    I also want to give them their own unique looks for their buildings, in the base version they are a bit too dependent on Nerubian Architecture.


    Your text size was actually quite reasonable in terms of size, its just that they were solid and filled in the right spots.
    Also woah, even MOAR spicy lore about what and how they went about doing things.


    I was thinking of some of the people i watch in the heat of melee. like Wtii. i don't really think killing items is going to be an issue, really just a minor annoyance. but what you could do instead, is make it so workers can carry items, or hero's if you don't really want to go away too much from base melee. but they can't really interact (use) the items they carry. so they have to bring them back to the Tomb of Relics for some sort of converted reward.

    Using the buffs granted by the Tomb of Relics can potentially use mana instead. the buffs they grant are very powerful but have long cooldown times between each use and require mana which means one can't just spam take all Buffs in one go. bringing back items and "Selling" them to the Tomb can either reset cooldowns or give mana to te Tomb, or both.
     
  7. Draktar

    Draktar

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    Thanks for your time and interesting suggestions (played your tech tree for hours btw :wink:).

    "Racial ability talk" = Burrow will be surely included in good chunk of nerubians and non-nerubian units (excluding nerubian flyers, seers?, viziers, queens, bone spiders, tol'vir slaves and obsidian destroyers). Nerubians are born with (mostly) predetermined roles. So magic casters solely created to lead, conjure spells and fight would't be able to dig like workers or spider lords. Hence I excluded them, meaning burrow doesn't qualify (entirely) as a racial ability.
    What I wanted was a passive that could be added to every (nerubian) unit. My idea was to capture their xenophobic nature gameplay vise by limiting their choices reflecting their actual choices during the war of the spider (highly proud and xenophobic nerubians would never request help from other races, hence they lost). Its name could be something like "Spider in Body and Soul", making them unable to use shops, taverns or mercenary camps + making them immune to mind control and disease like abilities (still a WIP, most likely will exclude heroes)

    Lore wise "web" is mostly nerubian ability and even in warcraft 3 most of the nerubians use it. I know I'll be scolded a lot for doing so, but still (I'll try to modify the look of the ability to have a white web, so it's not entirely same + your suggestion of web attacks sounds interesting). "Carrion Beetle" has it's alternatives (definitely be changing that), but "Locust Swarm" is an iconic ability for spider lords and crypt lords alike (this one will take time). Don't worry about "Raise Dead", for unlike the nerubian creeps nerubians do not use necromancy (there's only one exception in RPGs).

    "Obsidian Statue": OS will resemble its counterpart just a little bit. They'll be created by sacrificing "tol'vir slaves" (like shades with acolytes) and unit itself will be ground unit. Abilities are WIPs, probably want to rework og OSs abilities or create similar ones (same mana/ buff stealing stuff, just different execution).

    "Flyers" having life steal against flying units sounds about right (and unique in classic melee). I'll add it to the list, just not sure of how to make it work in the game.

    -Seer ability ideas:
    "insight" = Love this ability! Just the fantasy around it is briliant! Instantly became one of my FAVs while playing your map (100% will add it)
    I'll definitely consider others based on the whole techtree.

    My feedback:
    Your "egg" system works similarly like my queen/ broodmother system. Really love the way how you train them (it's just pain in the ass when training mass workers, mostly in regards to them being used in the process of building itself, why?), thinking hard about using similar same training system.
    Impaler is little fun idea, just add at least a little bit of attack to that poor thing (changing model to centipede like nerubian with a horn would do the trick too, sadly there's none)
    There's so much i could write about, this will be it for now (I'll write the full list later, when I have time).

    Thanks again ;)
     
  8. Draktar

    Draktar

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    Someone here seems to like Alien! :goblin_yeah:

    One of the obsidian alternatives (idk, obsidian infector?) could use that ability (or something similar).
     
  9. cleavinghammer

    cleavinghammer

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    That, and since it was seen happening in the Undead expansion with riflemen, it might as as well be an actual ability rather than a one-time event.

    Queen could have an ability that spawns egg sacs, where the eggs spawn Nerubians if left to hatch by themselves (and killing/hatching them prematurely produces a unit with low health and debuffs).
     
  10. Kyrbi0

    Kyrbi0

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    This is still on my (long, long) list of Topics to Respond On, but... Just wanted to say I generally love the way you're taking the Nerubians. I'm a big believer in the Lore-based approach & you're really working hard at that, which I appreciate. : )
     
  11. Draktar

    Draktar

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    Oh! Big ol' Kyrbi came to pay me a visit! What a honor!
    For real, thanks. I've been brainstorming for some time and came up with at least one new flavorful unit (and maybe redid most of the things ^^)

    "Nerubians practice mummification. By whom one might ask, I have no idea. " - and the basic idea of a unit was born.
    -he would use bandages as a weapon in attack animation (they levitate)
    -core ability: entomb corpse (visually, sarcophagus would eat the corpse and drag it under the ground), destroys the corpse and adds mana to the caster
    -other two are more basic, bandages that heal / damage targets (both destroy beneficial and bad effects on the target before being applied)

    I'll update the page with all the ideas and models, so you'll have fun analyzing it ^^
     
  12. cleavinghammer

    cleavinghammer

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    That's an idea: An ability based on Black Arrow or Entangle where the target is covered in webs and immobilized rather than damaged, and if they die under its influence they're transformed into a Nerubian unit that can't do anything except be eaten by fellow Nerubian units for health. Maybe some kind of storage system for such cocoons too so they can be used to quickly heal heroes.
     
  13. Draktar

    Draktar

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    I had similar idea for the cocoon. The caster would play animation similar to "Life Drain" (more of a web like texture, would slow the target) + it would spawn a cocoon unit at the target unit location that would automatically devour the target. Upon digesting the target, the cocoon would explode and heal near by friendly units or will have an options, an ability to explode whenever you like (with it being possibly a temporary unit and exploding every time before death if it did digest the target unit beforehand).

    Man, what an idea!!! A cocoon bearer unit sounds really interesting, what an inspiration!

    If not for a new unit, one of these (or all) could possibly take that role: nerubian webspinners, nerubian warriors, nerubian spiderlords?, jormunjars?, tol'vir slaves or obsidian destroyers (the custom ones)?
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2020
  14. cleavinghammer

    cleavinghammer

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    Webspinners I guess, if they're frail casters.

    You could make a combo move where the webbed unit takes more damage from certain spells if it fits the theme of "wrapped bug gets its innards liquefied by spider and sucked dry" like Shadow Strike, Life Drain, etc.
     
  15. lichao001486

    lichao001486

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    I like the race very much. I'm looking forward to it.
     
  16. Draktar

    Draktar

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    Thanks a lot! ^^