(12) Infection

[Moderator]

Vengeancekael - [Contact]
Date: 2012/Jun/15 22:21:08

Comment: [Approved]

Resource Moderation - Rules

 

[Weng]

Nice

 

[Zeatherann]

"Nice"? Simple and eloquent, thanks. Glad you like it, feel free to post comments, concerns, or suggestions.

Map is best played with lots of players,

 

[EtikS]

Ok bro i played your map and i have to say that it needs a lot of work on it..

first you should make bigger the map because the zombie spawn is close to the humans not only that the main zombie have 50 damage and 1000 hit points. he does not need the other small skeletons :/ atleast put 2 not 4 anyway. I see what you did with the terrain when you build it, it extand more and more , you should make a refund when you build your towers outside from your buildable area. you should also make a better arena because it's too easy to walk and find the human.and one more and last thing, when a player dies you should put some special-effects and a better text warning (example : Madietor has died from the Zombie ) or something like that anyway i like your idea for such a map !!. i will rate 3/5

 

[ToPsYoNe]

Ok bro i played your map and i have to say that it needs a lot of work on it..

first you should make bigger the map because the zombie spawn is close to the humans not only that the main zombie have 50 damage and 1000 hit points. he does not need the other small skeletons :/ atleast put 2 not 4 anyway. I see what you did with the terrain when you build it, it extand more and more , you should make a refund when you build your towers outside from your buildable area. you should also make a better arena because it's too easy to walk and find the human.and one more and last thing, when a player dies you should put some special-effects and a better text warning (example : Madietor has died from the Zombie ) or something like that anyway i like your idea for such a map !!. i will rate 3/5

Yeah that's true, i'll rate 3/5 too

 

[Tanasren]

A dead zombie, banshee can summon infinite zombies

the terrain "system" disappointed me at start and i thought it was bugged...

there is few things to do as human when u make the church, build towers and priests and thats all...

The zombie can't beat a lot of tower unless he makes towers himself in the enemy base.

Many tags never finished or were imbalanced...

 

[Zeatherann]

• A larger map increases the time it takes to generate the terrain, my goal is to have a 256x256 sized map in the end, I'm just working on getting the terrain engine to be smooth enough to do this.
• The stats of the main zombie are there because of prior versions of this map, before i applied the face lift.
• I will gladly improve some of the warning messages and such.
• As far as the building being destroyed when built outside of your 'blight' area I was going to provide the message along the lines of 'You building has collapsed without the proper supports!'
• Usually the zombie and human spawn isn't close: Zombies spawn on snow, while humans spawn on sand, but with enough players it'll end up being close.
• Tanasren; how did the terrain generation disappoint you?
• Madietor; How is it too easy to walk and find the humans? Usually in the end of the round we zombies have a heck of time finding that running human.

Anyways, here is a list of bugs I intend to fix:

1. Vision errors generated between rounds
2. Ability to 'see' the blight of other players in Fog of War
3. Zombie Death
4. Main Buildings needing blight to be built on.
5. Correct tech Trees for both sides regarding the main building.

 

[Tanasren]

i meant it disappointed me that u must build on blight for undead otherwise it disappears

 

[Zeatherann]

Doesn't most undead buildings need blight anyways? still making blight more user friendly.

 

[Da Fist]

Gameplay Screenshots please? But, nice game. Hosted it on Garena, everything went fine.

 

[Zeatherann]

Awesome!, how many players? Also; I'll add screenshots when I update the map. Which is after I change the tech tree a bit and get weather and fog working.

 

[wolfikun]

I like the idea about the game never ending until everyone leaves but there are still some bugs that needs fixing but still good job... I'll be waiting for the next one

 

[Zeatherann]

Can you list any bugs I haven't shared in here yet?

 

[bladerdog]

Out of all the words I can chose to describe this map only one comes to my mind and that is limited. So very limited and so very little options. The zombies don t really have a chance to fight more players the building selection is limited and the ground you can actually construct buildings gives no chance for strategy. Even if it is meant to be a mini game the game play isn t suited for that kind of map. The only nice thing was the random terrain generator .

 

[Zeatherann]

bladerdog: I've been getting that feeling, I am updating this map with a few more things, however the next version I plan on separating the Tech Trees and giving Zombies their own line of buildings and units. Right now they have a limited mirror of the Humans'.

If you meant limited in any other aspect besides buildings/units let me know!

 

[Sheep]

try playing this with full house.. impossible for zombies to kill all the humans before time runs out

 

[Zeatherann]

Not true! Once you get a few allies and in the last minute and a half when you can see everything you can usually assassinate the human builders because they are too busy building more things, or hunkered down in too small a base.

Also: Send in your Zombie builder, if it dies just have your ghost thing build a new one right by the Human builders. Might take 2 tries.

 

[Sheep]

i just had tons of arrow towers around my base and the zombies couldn't get to me in time

 

[Zeatherann]

Then the zombie player(s) didn't know how to play. After over a hundred games i've discovered two great strategies, one for each race.

Humans: Build a Gold Wall surrounded base, then towers and have workers, all of them, repair. Make sure you're builder is at least 750 units away from wall.

Zombies: Scout early and everywhere. Send in 24-36 units of Skeletons followed by a targeted strike of Necromancers only focused on the builder. If this fails (late in the round) send in your zombie builder to whip the humans out. If this fails then the human used my above method of protection.

Once i change the Zombie tech tree it'll be much more balanced.

 

[nafre]

Awesome world generating, but i don't understand how to play it. Could you put instructions in the Quest Log.

 

[maddeem]

This just sounds incredibly awesome. Going to play this on b.net

 

[Zeatherann]

Awesome! glad you like my generation: I understand that a Help Me quest would be great, I just need to write one. Let me fix the current bugs then I'll post an update.

A week or so after that I'll apply most or all of my planed changes and update that aswell.

BTW: the generation was using a perlin noise map, and no vJASS!

 

[war-lord]

This looks very fun ill check it out and i sent you a PM about the terrain generator? Also can you add this to makemehost please

 

[maddeem]

Awesome! glad you like my generation: I understand that a Help Me quest would be great, I just need to write one. Let me fix the current bugs then I'll post an update.

A week or so after that I'll apply most or all of my planed changes and update that aswell.

BTW: the generation was using a perlin noise map, and no vJASS!

vJass would increase speed of the generator (If you used BJs). Also, why can units run through EVERYTHING. Like you can run right on top of lakes.. o.o
Through trees.. etc.
The camera height method is ok, except that it has minor delay. I would suggest increasing the time at which you change camera height.

Terrain based on terrain height was a nice touch.
I'm guessing you used a grid for terrain creation (creating from left to right)
You might want to exclude creation in out of bounds (to save time)
Oh sometimes the water looks very choppy next to the shores.

 

[Zeatherann]

Please, maddeem, why on earth would i use vJASS, i'd rather use BJs (which as far as i know the generation doesn't)

The choppy water is War3 engine limites, the 'delay' on changing camera heights was to reduce lag. I hacked pathing a few times over, i don't doubt that all the units are 'flying' and i don't make lakes unwalkable, yet. There are 4 cells outside of the playable map area, i like those being generated as a buffer.

I used perlin noise for the generation btw.

 

[maddeem]

Please, maddeem, why on earth would i use vJASS, i'd rather use BJs (which as far as i know the generation doesn't)

Don't be silly, GUI is 100% BJs. Unless you did custom script calls for the entire trigger. Also BJs significantly slow down code. Because instead of running 1 function they are commonly linked to a native. So basically, in vJass, you code could be up to 100% faster. Not only that, but you can use timers for generation, instead of periodic triggers.
Btw did you rewrite the perlin noise algorithm in GUI? Or did you find it in a resource section? lol

 

[Zeatherann]

The core of the terrain system is normal JASS, and rewrote the perlin noise myself.

 

[FullVisor]

simple and quite but fun

 

[funAlways]

Awesome map at first, but getting boring even in the late game on first round
2/5
Reason:
Died Zombie become a ghost, but the ghost can instantly rebuild to zombie, making the whole human base useless (if the base is all covered by wall, less likely there is enough wood or time)
Died Human have removed vision of all Human, but the minimap still remain, telling the new zombie location of all human base.

Suggestion:
Make "Building" Zombie cost something or have cooldown, or even better make the base building of the zombie an altar for reviving dead zombie
Add more techtree, this map can be better with some more stuff do-able (maybe some research for both races)

 

[Zeatherann]

• Expanding the tech trees for both races (mostly zombies as they are behind) is one of my biggest priorities.
• As a ghost you can respawn as a zombie in the human base this is true; however if the humans have towers they can quickly kill you before your zombie is 'built'.
• Zombies move slower than Woodsmen.
• I can usually get enough wood to enclose myself in walls within the first 5 minutes of playing.
• I need to fix the vision of the map when you die as a human.
• Even if the base is no longer visible you can still ping it.
• As a zombie i practice assassination; using Necromancers to snipe the Woodman, or using my Zombie to two-shot the Woodman.
• A smart human has a base covered by walls/towers/priests and is large enough to be more than 600 units away from any edge.

How many players did ya play with? and how many rounds?

Edit: My reasoning behind the ghost unit was a friend of mine managed to kill every zombie building and unit. Oops.

 

[funAlways]

[*]Even if the base is no longer visible you can still ping it.

How many players did ya play with? and how many rounds?

Well it is less likely someone can remember everyone base (especially if its scattered)
played with around 6 players, 2 round and ragequit, never played again

 

[maddeem]

Please don't let this map rot, I really got a sense of uniqueness from this and I'd hate to see this fade. Seriously, if you need testers or ideas, or even coding help.. I'm right here. Negative reviews doesn't make it a bad game, no, it just leaves room for improvement. Right now I see basic gameplay mechanics, but honestly not too much more. I would like to see you add more content, so that more strategies are possible. I hope you have not left the warcraft scene, there are so few of us left.

 

[Zeatherann]

I am working on it, i've gotten 99% of the dust off this map now. I've been cleaning code up by a lot, and tweeking the terrain generator to make even more epic terrain (faster too).

I've made the zombies have a much better tech tree. Now i need to fix the humans a bit.

Gotta clean tree creation for mills... It's not what i want it to be.

Negative reviews shows me what i need to fix, i love them!

maddeem; continue to test and give me feedback as needed hehe.

 

[maddeem]

I need someone/people to test with t.t lol

 

[Zeatherann]

This is true, but i hear no one plays anything on bnet anymore unless it's dota

 

[maddeem]

Ok so I just played this with a ton of clanies, around 5-6 with some pugs. If you'll allow me to make a couple suggestions then here they are:

Tower are extremely powerful, 3 towers can hold off a newbie to the game for an entire round no problem. 20 towers and the zombies can't win.
However swarming seems to take care of a small amount of towers. Also, if a zombie invests time into upgrades they're going to lose. So getting necromancers, while good for towers is out of the question.

Another thing is: you need to reduce the unit cap to around 100. Why? If you go over this limit as a player, and order all those units to move... You get delay. Lots and lots of delay.

But I cannot stress enough how imbalanced towers are. 75 wood for a tower that will likely kill 500 wood in undead units. And if the towers are upgraded it becomes virtually impossible to kill them!
I think you should consider adding meat wagons :3

If you could make the time infected are given into a vote, that'd be awesome. More often than not 20 minutes is not enough for infected.

Other than that, the game was overall very smooth and easy to learn.

 

[Zeatherann]

Hehe, i've always viewed (and in the many games i've played with 3-5 people) towers to be weak.

Admittedly i haven't tested the upgraded tower yet (fer shame on me). However, i'm working on the tech tree for the humans, the zombies already have their new tech tree, including abomination which are designed as perfect building slayers.

I will lower the food cap back to 100.

You mean vote to dictate how long the round is? That'd be pretty cool. (and easily doable since the round code only procs when the round timer expires).

 

[funAlways]

I forgot some suggestion:
Make Dead player become observer until next round begin (who want to see the whole map become FoW when die..?)
Increase the radius of the terrain changing (the floor tiled terrain when a human building is built) for some building, because i cant expand a lot when the game just starts

and also, what is the point of the lumber mill? it only creates tree randomly around it and making walls using trees are very hard this way, and if i use this for woodcutter, it spawns too slow that it is useless

 

[Zeatherann]

• I will correct the sight issue with dying (it's probably just a swapping of two lines of JASS).
• I will consider making the starting tile radius larger.
• Lumber mills are great for tree walls and wood. You need like 10 of them though.

 

[Zeatherann]

Version 1.061813

Gameplay

• Shortened out some more triggers.
• Added a destroy building button to all buildings, kills them without refunds.

Terrain Generation

• Made the generator create an island with a mountain in the middle.
• Deep water (black tile) is unwalkable/unbuildable.
• Added randomly generated gold mines! Each tile has a 1% chance to spawn a gold mine containing 10-50 gold.
• Removed trees from layers 0 and 1 (deep water/shallow water)

Zombies

• Recreated nearly the entire zombie tech tree.
• Zombies now have four tiers, up from three.
• Zombies have several new units to attack with:
  • Skeleton Archer (Tier 2): Basic ranged unit, deals 10 more damage than skeletons.
  • Ghoul (Tier 2): Fast melee unit that can gather resources faster than skeletons.
  • Abomination (Tier 3): The long awaited anti-building unit! It will crush walls/towers fairly quickly.
  • Acolyte (Tier 3): Non-combat units that gather resources faster than ghouls do.
  • Shade (Tier 4): Sacrifice an acolyte to become a shade and spy on the humans!
• Unit Changes:
  Skeleton:
  • Lumber cost changed to 25, down from 50.
  • Skeletons now decay and can be raised!.
  • Reduced the melee attack range down to 32.
  • Changed attack damage to 1-10 instead of 10-10.
  Necromancer:
  • Lumber cost changed to 10000, up from 100.
  • Gold cost changed to 200, up from 0.
  • Health reduced to 50, was 100.
  • Movement speed reduced to 150.
  • Attack range changed to 750.
  • Damage increased to 50-170, was 1-100.
  • Attack is now instant, was a projectile.
  • Moved to tier four, up from tier two.
• New Buildings:
  Tier 1:
  • Gravestone: Raises skeletons.
  • Pile of Bones: Drop off point for resources.
  • Symbol of Undeath: Building that doesn't need/make blight that slows nearby enemies down.
  Tier 2:
  • Crypt: Raises ghouls.
  • Frost Tower: Upgraded from the spirit tower, offers a slightly stronger attack for burst damage, doesn't attack buildings.
  • Graveyard: Summons skeletons, and skeleton archers, upgraded from Gravestone.
  Tier 3:
  • Fleshworks: Stitches together abominations.
  • Symbol of Evil: Improved symbol of undeath, makes nearby enemies even slower.
  • Unholy Ritual: Recruits acolytes.
  Tier 4:
  • Death Tower: Fear this tower, or die! Attacks buildings, upgradeable from spirit tower.
  • Sacrificial Pit: Turns acolytes into shades.
• Building Changes:
  Spirit Tower:
  • Changed resource cost to 10 gold, 500 lumber.
  • Health raised to 250.
  • Attack range raised to 900.
  • Doesn't attack buildings.
  • Changed attack damage to 4-10.
  Infected House:
  • Changed name to infected house.
  • Moved to tier 3.
  • Changed resource cost to 0 gold, 1250 lumber.
  • Health changed to 150.
  Infected Mansion:
  • Name changed to infected mansion.
  • Moved to tier 4.
  • Resource cost changed to 0 gold 2500 lumber.
  • Raised life to 300.
  Unholy Shrine:
  • Resource cost changed to 100 gold, 5000 lumber.
  • Health raised to 1500.
  • Moved to tier 4.
• Changed how zombies are created/respawned. They no longer turn into ghost when they die, instead you can train a new one at your main building.
• Spawned main building is unbuildable, but is unkillable.

This half of the expected version change (the humans are next). Expect this second update tomorrow or the next day!

 

[maddeem]

Your changelog is very detailed and nicely presented. I will pull together some people tomorrow and test this new version.
Also I have a quick question: What if the zombie dies, along with all of his structures/units?
I have yet to see this happen, but I am curious :3

Speaking of lumber mills though, that was definitely one feature in the game that I adored. You could setup a base, put up two or three of em and you're set. No need to leave your walls to go choppin for wood. On a side note, I'd really like to see some sort of gate added.

 

[Zeatherann]

Thank you, took me an hour to make the design, still working on it. I will post version changes in the thread too to separate posts relating to older versions.
Zombies can't loose their main building anymore , and this building can summon more zombies for free, limit one.
Zombie Corrupted mill was the only unchanged building in the prior update lol. I thinking of making mills only spawn trees in a square around them (9 trees in total). The code would be a lot longer, but the trees would be less messy. Do you like the current ring of trees?
I will add the gate next version, as i needed to think up of a new building for humans (Need to make them have 15 buildings, 5 for each tier).

Zombies' main buildings count as 1 of the 5 for each tier, even though you can't build it.​

 

[maddeem]

Gates would be nice, i'll add em! next update.

Since the main building of the zombie is invulnerable, you'd have a hard time seeing it die.

It can summons more zombies for free (limit one)

Lol well, that was an awfully stupid question of mine.

 

[Zeatherann]

Reread the edit of the post you quoted lol.

 

[maddeem]

Ok I reread it, I has an idea :3
So for the tree generating around the lumber mill you can really reduce the code down if you do something like this: Have a dummy building the same collision size as the trees. Hide it, and move to to check pathing. Literally all you'd have to do is move that unit to the position of your mill and it will do offsets for you, then all you have to do is place the tree on the dummy building.
Tis what I used to check pathability in MineralZ lol
But you have to SetUnitLoc, buildings don't like being moved with SetUnitX/Y
If you're using GUI it should be all fine and well and you won't have to worry about this.

But you don't have to change the tree generation at all in my opinion, I liked it just fine how they spawned around lumber mills.

 

[maddeem]

Goldmine spam disallows players to build tents. A way to fix this is to remove the collect gold ability from the unit. Once the tent is built however, add the ability back to the unit.

 

[Zeatherann]

This is the answer to my prayers!

 

[maddeem]

Ok so a potential bug in the current version: When a player is killed and converted into a zombie they disconnect. This only happened once, but it happened right as my friend sheep100 died.

 

[Zeatherann]

Odd, i've played with several people (including MAC) and no one dropped out. Was it only you and your friend?