My First Map

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The_Key

The_Key

The_Key

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I'm new here so i'm not sure if this is the best place to post this so let me know if i am breaking any rules :thumbs_up:


So today i sat down for a total of 9 hours, give or take a few minutes, and this was the end product, this is the first map where i have tried to make decent terrain and try a few triggers that i have not messed around with yet, can you guys tell me what i should do next to enhance my WE skills or whatever else? i have the rest of the holidays, so it would be good to know what you all think

Cheers! :cool:

_________________________________________________________________

This map was made to introduce myself to some new triggers i have not yet used and taking my editing to another level, this is a map where you have 2 heroes to choose from, a small base with 1 shop you can teleport to and from via a COP, plenty of creeps and such.

Basicly this is not a serious custom game but i have stepped up my editing on this one, i made this for 2 people to mess around on and just to get better


WC3ScrnShot_121309_131129_01.jpg

WC3ScrnShot_121309_131206_04.jpg

WC3ScrnShot_121309_131217_05.jpg

Cadaver_hive

WC3ScrnShot_121309_131326_08.jpg
 

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Ok so:
-the terrain is 95% flat - (the olnly places where flat terrain is ok is citys and dungeons,yours is a forest and it SHOULDNT BE FLAT)
-the map is 96x96 but youve used about 52x52 of the map for the arena and shops - (there's really no point of the lava/ice places,theyre not playable and they just waist the tile limit)
-it looks to crowded,theres just to many creatures for such a small area X(make the arena bigger)
-the shops just sell 1 item -
-the shop area and the hero area could have more than just the shops and heroes X (im talking about doodads)
-overall the terrain is nice + (if we forget the flatness)
-no item drops -
-bugged ramps (really if you dont know how to fix them,hide them under rocks or something
So this is it.
Its not playable but for somereason i like it.I keep my eye on you and your map,call if you need a review :wink:
 
Thank's for taking the time to actually look at it trolman

It's is not a serious map that is meant for people to download and play with friends and stuff, it was merely mean't to introduce myself to some new triggers i have not used and how to terrain better, I am completley new to making maps, so i just hope you guys can understand that when you view the map, also, what should i do next to improve my skills? same thing but on a bigger scale?
 
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Yeah same thing olnly biger and fix those thing ive said.Also i forgot to tell you that youve got the wrong hero in the selection place.The warden you've put is the campain unit not the custom hero that you did.
 
I was thinking that if i do the same thing but on a bigger scale that maybe it might become a little plain with the same tileset in it, i'll keep the forest, but any suggestions how i can incorporate different tile sets in it without it becoming all weird?
 
Cheer's, might take me a while to finish this map but if you feel like waiting a while, i'll send you a link if you would like to take a look Trolman =)
 
This seems like an awesome first map, way better than mine was :razz:
It's still far from perfect though, so I'll give you some pointers:
  • The Warden didn't seem to have an inventory, now I assume that you removed her normal abilities to remove "Shadow Meld", but it seems that you also removed the "Inventory (Hero)" ability (which grants Heroes their inventory)
  • In your "Hero Selection Triggers" it seems that you are checking whether a certain player is "Selecting" the wisp, and then creating a Hero for the player that is selecting the unit, but what would happen if, for example, Player 2 sends his Wisp towards the circle, and Player 1 is selecting his wisp? Both players would get a hero, while Player 1 still has a wisp alive and kicking to select another one. It's better to create a single trigger that functions for all players by simply creating a wisp for the "owner" of the triggering unit, like this:
    • Teleportation Spellblade
      • Events
        • Unit - A unit enters Spellblade Spawn R <gen>
      • Conditions
        • (Unit-type of (Triggering unit)) Equal to Hero Chooser
      • Actions
        • Unit - Kill (Triggering unit)
        • Unit - Create 1 Spellblade for (Owner of (Triggering unit)) at (Center of Player 1 Hero Pad <gen>) facing Default building facing degrees
        • Camera - Pan camera for (Owner of (Triggering unit)) to (Center of Player 1 Hero Pad <gen>) over 2.00 seconds
  • The same thing applies to your teleports, where you are also checking who is selecting the teleporting Hero. It'd be much better to simply check whether the entering unit is owned by player 1, as when you are checking whether they are selected creeps will be able to teleport to the plateau as well (when player 1 is selecting them).
    (This condition is named "Player Comparison")
    • Teleport player 1
      • Events
        • Unit - A unit enters P1 Teleport Pad <gen>
      • Conditions
        • (Owner of (Triggering unit)) Equal to Player 1 (Red)
      • Actions
        • Unit - Move (Triggering unit) instantly to (Center of Player 1 Hero Pad <gen>)
        • Camera - Pan camera for Player 1 (Red) to (Center of Player 1 Hero Pad <gen>) over 2.00 seconds
  • There are a lot of memory leaks in your map but I wouldn't get too worried about them until you start making bigger maps though.
If you ever need any help making triggers or something, you can always pm me :wink:
 
Thank's Grade A Kill :)


by the way, anyone that happens to read this, what do you think is the best way to learn how to make good triggers?
 
These ideas are helpful for sure, anything at all, just throw it at me.

I'm new so whatever is good guys, i don't care
 
The best way to learn how to make triggers is to think of a special effect, trigger-based ability, or something else you want to incorporate in your map (Like spawn units) and can't do via Object Editor. I'm still fairly new to map making myself, and thus can only use GUI at the moment. Don't get discouraged because your stuck, take a short break and start again. I'll check out your map now...

Abilities:
-Your Storm Bolt doesn't give any damage values outside of learning it
-Use different icons for different abilities

Terrain:
-Ice/Lava doesn't make sense
-Nice use of trees/flowers, appears somewhat natural; Snow Trees don't fit
-Terrain is diversified, but doesn't appear random; genereally 3-4 tilesets should be used in any location to maintain a realistic look
-Water has rolling shores, giving a realistic appearance
-Use the raise/lower/smooth if you want a more gradual appearance for the map
-As trolman said, map is too flat; add hills and dips randomly

Triggers:
-Make sure you destroy your special effect after creating it to avoid memory leaks
-When the Hero teleports back to his base, set the camera pan to .25 seconds, unless you want to show the terrain on the barrier

Gameplay:
-Use the Quest Dialog to give people an idea of what to do
-Health Potion works well; Mana Potion desperately needed
-Perhaps have strong(er) creeps drop tomes or items?
-More items are needed, use power-ups if you want to avoid permanents
-More players!!! Unless you only want to allow duels
-Larger arena, expand it into the wasted space surrounding it

Conclusion:
For a first map, your doing pretty good. The game is still too simple, but keep working on it... I'm not a fan of Hero Arenas so I can't really help you with gameplay.

//\\^^//\\
 
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Boris_Spider said:
The best way to learn how to make triggers is to think of a special effect, trigger-based ability, or something else you want to incorporate in your map (Like spawn units) and can't do via Object Editor. I'm still fairly new to map making myself, and thus can only use GUI at the moment. Don't get discouraged because your stuck, take a short break and start again. I'll check out your map now...

Abilities:
-Your Storm Bolt doesn't give any damage values outside of learning it
-Use different icons for different abilities

Terrain:
-Ice/Lava doesn't make sense
-Nice use of trees/flowers, appears somewhat natural; Snow Trees don't fit
-Terrain is diversified, but doesn't appear random; genereally 3-4 tilesets should be used in any location to maintain a realistic look
-Water has rolling shores, giving a realistic appearance
-Use the raise/lower/smooth if you want a more gradual appearance for the map
-As trolman said, map is too flat; add hills and dips randomly

Triggers:
-Make sure you destroy your special effect after creating it to avoid memory leaks
-When the Hero teleports back to his base, set the camera pan to .25 seconds, unless you want to show the terrain on the barrier

Gameplay:
-Use the Quest Dialog to give people an idea of what to do
-Health Potion works well; Mana Potion desperately needed
-Perhaps have strong(er) creeps drop tomes or items?
-More items are needed, use power-ups if you want to avoid permanents
-More players!!! Unless you only want to allow duels
-Larger arena, expand it into the wasted space surrounding it

Conclusion:
For a first map, your doing pretty good. The game is still too simple, but keep working on it... I'm not a fan of Hero Arenas so I can't really help you with gameplay.

//\\^^//\\
Click to expand...



Thanl's Boris Spider :) that helps and i will take the advice you have given me for sure to my next map, that was great dude. :thumbs_up:
 
Your welcome! As with all things there's always more things to do, but most of them don't really apply yet. There's no need to overwhelm you with information you don't yet need. The easiest way to create maps is like this:

-Choose/create game type (I chose a Builder-Style game)
-Choose/create theme (I chose the Underground tileset with a skeleton race)
-Assemble framework for units (Includes models, abilities, etc...)
-Create approriate tooltips (Change tooltips to reflect what they refer to)
-Create a rough draft for terrain (ALWAYS build terrain around the game, never the other way around. People rarely pay attention to the terrain if they're focused on playing)
-Be creative! Original maps aren't common or easy to make, but don't copy/paste and rearrange just to create something. Seeing as to how you're new, you can get away with that... for now :p. I'm still new around here too, but THW doesn't appear to take kindly to any "half-assed" maps. ...and no, your map isn't half-assed; it's a work in progress

//\\oo//\\
 
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Goffterdom said:
Yeah, nice feedback boris_spider :-)

Cadaver avoid double posting ;)
Click to expand...

Sorry Goffterdom, i'll avoid that in the future :thumbs_up:

Boris_Spider said:
Your welcome! As with all things there's always more things to do, but most of them don't really apply yet. There's no need to overwhelm you with information you don't yet need. The easiest way to create maps is like this:

-Choose/create game type (I chose a Builder-Style game)
-Choose/create theme (I chose the Underground tileset with a skeleton race)
-Assemble framework for units (Includes models, abilities, etc...)
-Create approriate tooltips (Change tooltips to reflect what they refer to)
-Create a rough draft for terrain (ALWAYS build terrain around the game, never the other way around. People rarely pay attention to the terrain if they're focused on playing)
-Be creative! Original maps aren't common or easy to make, but don't copy/paste and rearrange just to create something. Seeing as to how you're new, you can get away with that... for now :p. I'm still new around here too, but THW doesn't appear to take kindly to any "half-assed" maps. ...and no, your map isn't half-assed; it's a work in progress

//\\oo//\\
Click to expand...

Thank's for the help man, your def an asset to this site:thumbs_up:
Thank's for those for the tips as they def help, my way of doing things of late has been like this

-Decide what type of map i want to make
-Make the basic buildings
-Work on terrain


that is as far as i have gotten so far with my new project

I have dropped the map i posted before as that was to '' break me into map making '' and now i am working on a hero arena that is based in a forest, i am hoping to get a friend of mine who is also new to map making to work with me on it so if you guys like, i can keep you updated on what is going on with the map, it will be a bit before it is finished but i am really trying on this one so hopefully you guys will be able to help me out on some thing's, maybe i should post the map for far somewhere for you to take a look at?

Also, here is where i am up to in the map

I'm still fleshing out the terrain but i am adding in areas on the map where there is like a dark ritual going on where you can kill a boss for treasure and another couple areas with water bosses but my main concern is that how is this a hero arena if people are off fighting creeps and not each other?
how do i make them want to come to the arena in the middle of the map?
what do you guys think?

also, here is my code for a couple region teleport spells to get to and from first base

  • Base 1 Teleport
    • Events
      • Unit - A unit enters Region 000 <gen>
    • Conditions
      • ((Triggering unit) is A Hero) Equal to True
    • Actions
      • Camera - Pan camera for (Owner of (Triggering unit)) to (Center of Region 001 <gen>) over 1.00 seconds
      • Unit - Move (Triggering unit) instantly to (Center of Region 001 <gen>)

  • Base 1 Teleport 2
    • Events
      • Unit - A unit enters Region 001 <gen>
    • Conditions
      • ((Triggering unit) is A Hero) Equal to True
    • Actions
      • Camera - Pan camera for (Owner of (Triggering unit)) to (Center of Region 000 <gen>) over 1.00 seconds
      • Unit - Move (Triggering unit) instantly to (Center of Region 000 <gen>)


these are seperate triggers to get down to the creeping area from first base and a trigger on getting back, are these conflicting / leaking?
 
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Yes, you have a leak with both your unit and region. I don't think they are major leaks but they have the potential to build up over time.
========================================
TRIGGER:Teleport 1
Event:
Unit - A unit enters Region 000 <gen>
----------------------------------------------------
Actions:
Set TEMPHERO = Units in Region 000 <gen> owned by Player 1 (Red) of type hero
Set TEMPREC = Region 001 <gen>
-If: (triggering unit) is equal to a hero
Then: Move TEMPHERO instantly to TEMPREC
Else: Do Nothing
Custom Script: call DestroyGroup (udg_TEMPHERO)
Custom Script: call RemoveLocation (udg_TEMPREC)
========================================
Memory leaks are caused by variables not being destroyed; by creating a variable and setting it equal to what you want it to be, you can then use the custom script, which is the only way to destroy variables with GUI.
This is the most helpful website Crabby and I have yet found on identifying memory leaks: http://www.thehelper.net/forums/showthread.php?t=27219
Also, open up my map and look at the triggers to get a better idea of what I'm talking about. It's time consuming, but it allows lag-free (or close to it) gameplay.

//\\oo//\\
 
Some people are going to have a whine over this but i really don't care, when you get the time ,can you tell me specifically, what is a leak, how do they happen, how do you stop them, and how do you recognize them, so by the next you have posted in this thread i know the basics of stopping leaks,

I know it may seem like a lot to ask but it really isn't, i learn best this way since this is a modding community, i think it genrally goes that modders help modders out?

=)
 
A leak:
When the game creates a unit at region "REC" using the satandard GUI interface, after creating the unit the game forgets where REC is. Essentially the game will forget any variable that isn't destroyed after it is used. As the leaks build up, lag becomes increasingly promininent
What is a variable?
-Any referenced unit, unit group, player, player group, region, special effect that is referenced to/created and not destroyed.
 
Boris_Spider said:
A leak:
When the game creates a unit at region "REC" using the satandard GUI interface, after creating the unit the game forgets where REC is.
Click to expand...
The "Region" does not leak, but the "Point" (Center of Region) laggs. Any preplaced region does NOT leak.
Boris_Spider said:
Essentially the game will forget any variable that isn't destroyed after it is used. As the leaks build up, lag becomes increasingly promininent
Click to expand...
Actually, this is wrong, the game does not "forget" the stored value, but it remembers it, which is the problem. The game "remembers" the value you used and does not destroy it afterwards, meaning it will remain inside of the memory (hence it is called a "memory leak"). As you can imagine, these leaks add up as they are used more, creating lagg over time unless you destroy the values.

If you wish to learn how to destroy them, I recommend you check out this thread.

As for learning how to trigger, I recommend creating trigger enhanced spells and looking at how the spells are made, which should teach you the basics about triggering. You can check out this thread for a lot of trigger enhanced spells and ideas for spells which you can attempt to program.
 
Make a map similar to This one my first map that really introduced me to gameplay. It's supposed to be roc but i messed up something and now it's tft. anyways, if my idea fixes your game so you can play single player, then try it out. Then try to make a similar map. It's easy to make as you don't have to worry about other players, only one. To that end I suggest you follow my example and try making one of these. Good Luck!
 
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