1. Updated Resource Submission Rules: All model & skin resource submissions must now include an in-game screenshot. This is to help speed up the moderation process and to show how the model and/or texture looks like from the in-game camera.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. DID YOU KNOW - That you can unlock new rank icons by posting on the forums or winning contests? Click here to customize your rank or read our User Rank Policy to see a list of ranks that you can unlock. Have you won a contest and still havn't received your rank award? Then please contact the administration.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. The Lich King demands your service! We've reached the 19th edition of the Icon Contest. Come along and make some chilling servants for the one true king.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. The 4th SFX Contest has started. Be sure to participate and have a fun factor in it.
    Dismiss Notice
  5. The poll for the 21st Terraining Contest is LIVE. Be sure to check out the entries and vote for one.
    Dismiss Notice
  6. The results are out! Check them out.
    Dismiss Notice
  7. Don’t forget to sign up for the Hive Cup. There’s a 555 EUR prize pool. Sign up now!
    Dismiss Notice
  8. The Hive Workshop Cup contest results have been announced! See the maps that'll be featured in the Hive Workshop Cup tournament!
    Dismiss Notice
  9. Check out the Staff job openings thread.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
60,000 passwords have been reset on July 8, 2019. If you cannot login, read this.

Interconecting Maps with save load system

Discussion in 'Idea Factory' started by apsyll, May 16, 2018.

  1. apsyll

    apsyll

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2015
    Messages:
    195
    Resources:
    1
    Maps:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    I had this idea a time ago thinking about not just to use the save load system for saving just the progress of one map but to conect two or many maps of different types and alternate the content.

    As an example we have a dungeon crawler map (MapA) and a boss fighting map (MapB), now when you reach in MapA a certain point data got saved and as soon you load the MapB it looks for this data and alters the items you can acces in your shop for ones you carried in MapA and vise versa when you fight and lose against a boss in MapB it will appear in MapA on the next key point.

    This whole idea is just hypothetically so any suggestions or feedback don't need to be easy to be made or even possible to be made.
    But I would like to know what you think about this and for what you would use this idea also critisism is more then welcome.
    I think the strongest contra point would be, why should you hide this content for many player who will never play the other game when you put so much effort in to creat it?
    The answer my side would be I don't know- but I would like it to actually see the maps changing when I play different other types of maps and see linkings between and quotings of other maps content while playing it.

    So I am highly interested in you thoughts and opinons please let me know what are you thinking about it.
     
  2. N3hu1s

    N3hu1s

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2009
    Messages:
    15
    Resources:
    0
    Resources:
    0
    The main problem is...when you have your hardcore group which are really high lvl and just play MapB you can't really reach new players with this. Because only MapB is hosting. You know what i mean?
     
  3. nedio95

    nedio95

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Resources:
    1
    Spells:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    This is not just hypothetically.
    There are many maps that use similar thing for transition, both single & multi-player.
    Although, only single-player campaigns would do it for small-er-ish boss fights/rooms.
    Multiplayer ones would usually go for 1:1 size & content map transitions.

    regards
    -Ned
     
  4. apsyll

    apsyll

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2015
    Messages:
    195
    Resources:
    1
    Maps:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    It shouldn't be really transitions between maps like the rexxar campain more like achievements you could also just track how often you played a map and when you played it x times you trigger a different event on start.
     
  5. nedio95

    nedio95

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2011
    Messages:
    1,055
    Resources:
    1
    Spells:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    Plenty of maps using save/load for those purposes.
    This is exactly what the system is intended for. (and more :) )

    regards
    -Ned
     
  6. apsyll

    apsyll

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2015
    Messages:
    195
    Resources:
    1
    Maps:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    Could you give me some example maps or systems how they use it, because I never got to know any map using this system like this?!
     
  7. TriggerHappy

    TriggerHappy

    Code Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2007
    Messages:
    3,668
    Resources:
    22
    Spells:
    11
    Tutorials:
    2
    JASS:
    9
    Resources:
    22
    Make all of your maps have the same object data (units, items, abilities). You can easily extract it in one map and import it to another.
     
  8. apsyll

    apsyll

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2015
    Messages:
    195
    Resources:
    1
    Maps:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    That is exactly what I don't wanted to do I thought about overmap interactions beside the transfer of units items ability from one map to another...
    More like you played the map 10 times (the amount is stored in local data) now a trigger spawns 10 instead of 5 creeps per wave...
    Or you played a moba map wich stored its data there so you can enter a secret room where you can play a mini veraion of this map inside the dungeoncrawler...

    More ideas that exactly don't just transfer unit a from map to map.
     
  9. TriggerHappy

    TriggerHappy

    Code Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2007
    Messages:
    3,668
    Resources:
    22
    Spells:
    11
    Tutorials:
    2
    JASS:
    9
    Resources:
    22
    There is currently no other way without 3rd party hacks.
     
  10. apsyll

    apsyll

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2015
    Messages:
    195
    Resources:
    1
    Maps:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    I think here is a small missunderstanding.
    The Idea is to use the save and load system to save data that will on the map loading of different maps alternate the game content.
    This is possible that is clear for me, the question is more for what kind of alternation would someone go.

    Let's say I would ask all creator of famous hive maps to add to their maps on the winning condition that they save in the date that their map was won by the player.
    Now I create a let's say tower defence and on load I check the data if Sunken City is won if yes I add the "sunken city fraction" on the load, then If Gaias RPG is won if yes I also make the "Gaias fraction" available for play and so on... Or I make a elemtal TD like and instead of the elemt bosses I have the Warden map bosses walking through the lines when the player played Warden untill the end.
    It is more what mixing and matching of different maps and ideas would someone like to see or just think would be fun to have like having the last played dota hero as available hero in his monster fighter map ect.,
    or when you died 100 times by a slide escape your hero in the next moba slides always instead of walking.

    It's not about bringing unitA from mapA to mapB it's more you accomplished in mapA something this has impact in mapB, mapC, mapD and mapE.
     
  11. TriggerHappy

    TriggerHappy

    Code Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2007
    Messages:
    3,668
    Resources:
    22
    Spells:
    11
    Tutorials:
    2
    JASS:
    9
    Resources:
    22
    I read your post as saying you don't want to have all your maps share the same object data. In order for the save code to work across multiple maps they must share the same object data, or you need to define a catalog for each map that can correspond with each other.

    If you want something to happen once a player has played your map X number of times, you can simply store the amount of times a player has played the map in the save code.
     
  12. apsyll

    apsyll

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2015
    Messages:
    195
    Resources:
    1
    Maps:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    The question is not for the technical side(how would you do it?) it's for the game design side(what would you do?)
    I am pretty sure how I would create this system but I would like for people to think about what can this system be used for beond the "normal" use.
     
  13. TriggerHappy

    TriggerHappy

    Code Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2007
    Messages:
    3,668
    Resources:
    22
    Spells:
    11
    Tutorials:
    2
    JASS:
    9
    Resources:
    22
    I see. I didn't notice this was in the Idea Factory.

    You can look over at China's WC3 (netease) for ideas. Many of their RPGs have persistence features like daily quests or rewards. Although they use a custom version of WC3.

    首页-魔兽争霸官方对战平台

    Soon I am going to release a hostbot which allows for some of the same features as China.
     
  14. Banelingline

    Banelingline

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2017
    Messages:
    115
    Resources:
    0
    Resources:
    0
    First off, a more streamelined save/load system that will probably work better for implementing this stuff by allowing strings of arbitrary length. Secondly, it depends on what you want as the "central" maps. To list some ideas largely at-random:

    1. An RPG character could be loaded in as a mercenary, with costs based on how high level they are and how much gear they have.
    2. Fortresses in defense maps could be imported as towns in RPGs, scaling stores and such based on the record of the fortress.
    3. An altered melee or Risk-style map could define what is present in various areas based on the situation at the end of the game.

    In particular, damage and resource expenditure tracking can be used to fine-tune the results. A berserker of a character who relies on obliterating the enemy before said enemy gets through their almost-nonexistent defenses, defined by extreme bursts in both directions, will end up with similar behavior as a mercenary, with low durability and high damage. A successful defense play that burns through enough resources on the map and spends enough of it on repairs shows up as a heavily damaged town surrounded by overharvested land. A rapid obliteration of a faction in an Altered Melee round seeds for the removal of that faction.

    The biggest thing is that all such maps need to be cooperative, so that long-term players carry new ones, instead of stomping them into the dirt.
     
  15. apsyll

    apsyll

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2015
    Messages:
    195
    Resources:
    1
    Maps:
    1
    Resources:
    1
    Thank you for this suggestion actually haven't thought at all to look in the asain comunity. Shame on me being so narrow minded.
    I will definitly take a look in this site.
    Also Thanks for your support and the systems you create. I have to say the level of your work blows my mind and I would never thought about being able to create such things but I'm happy and hyped to see what this engine is all capable about.

    This is exactly the system I was thinking about check out my first post for this^^.
    I like the Ideas you come up.
    There is no given central maps, everyone can choose what kind of maps to conect themselfe, of course something with progression works better like an rpg.
    I thought aswell about the coop vs pvp aspect, I think this would take a lot of balancing if someone would use this in a pvp scenario and it would be unfair to straight transfer the progress from one game to another so it has to unlock basic/normalized content of the same blance as the rest in the beginning like making something(A Hero, Item, ect.) available for all players in the game could help in this aspect.