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What a cool Challenge! As of the time of this writing I don't know the final results, but it's been a lot of fun. I would love to see more of these happen (Challenges or even Contests). But for now, we're all just here for the Results... So let's get to it.
VOTING
Initial Poll Results: View attachment 253737
Removing both of the self-votes & the Judges' test vote, we have:
Archdruid (Direfury)
10
Crusader (Kyrbi0)
13
JUDGING
Rufus said:
Divergence
Both entries are very different from what they were in their original form. Both entries get full score in this field. 10/10
Balance
Both entries are a tiny bit too powerful I'd say.
Archdruids ultimate is a very strong summon. In most melee maps the summons are weaker, but lasts a longer duration. I felt like this ultimate was really strong, even if the duration was short. The cluster rockets ability felt a bit underwhelming for its mana cost. 8/10
Crusader had a bit too much healing, and 15 extra damage available at level one, with a healig ability on top of that is pretty strong too. 9/10
Theme
The new heroes was cool and thematic, and fit their own concept, aswell as a melee map, well. Archdruid gets full score here. 10/10
The ultimate ability of the crusader would fit better if it buffed allies instead, as that would fit the hero theme, as a support and healer, and the name of the ability. 9/10
Aesthetics
I liked the archdruid a tad more because of it being able to transform like it did, adding a mount. The ultimate summon was also cool, but I do question the forest spirit model. Isn't there something better you could've used? 9/10
While being thematic and having abilities that fit his character, the crusader didn't have the same visual appeal in his abilities. Hard to add too, I understand. The icons weren't harmonic, as the colours didn't match, and the holy smite and recruit icons didn't feel like they fit the hero. 7/10
Creativity
Undead Dark Ranger --> Human Crusader
Goblin Tinker --> Night Elf Druid
Spells are also twisted against their nature, making the heroes feel like completely new units.
Both entries gets full score here. 10/10
So, adding those all up & collating it together (Refer to the attached "Voting Calculations" Spreadsheet (Image for those without Microsoft Excel (you can always open an account via SkyDrive & get free Web-Office apps, by the way), we have... *drumroll*
Score
Rep
Entry
Name
73.26
+15
Crusader
Kyrbi0
68.74
-15
Archdruid
Direfury
The winner is Kyrbi0!!! To the victor go the spoils; 15 Reputation is removed from Direfury and given to Kyrbi0. This Challenge is concluded!
"Thanks Kyrbi0" *shakes hands with Kyrbi0*
"You're welcome, Kyrbi0. Here's your trophy." *hands over trophy to Kyrbi0*
"How cool, Kyrbi0! And might I add what a dashingly handsome Host you've been, Kyrbi0?" *Kyrbi0 blushes*
"Why, Kyrbi0... I don't know what to say..." *Kyrbi0 puts his fingers on Kyrbi0's lips*
"There's no need to say anything at all... Kyrbi0...
I'll do the best I can to avoid a conflict of interests/sounding whiny (I did win, after all). However, as I'm really taking a moment to actually read the Judging I'm seeing a few issues.
One issue isn't really a complaint so much as an observation (since I did put "???" and tell you to "pick whatever"); you assigned '10' to each category. Personally, I think Divergence & maybe Creativity could be, like, 5 (Divergence maybe 3: basically "not divergent - kinda divergent -very divergent"). Balance, Theme (Form) & Role (Function) were the more important; 10 was probably fine but maybe 15 for some?... Honestly, I'm beginning to wonder if we don't just habitually pick values that are too high in general on the Hive Contests. What do we really need 10 points for, when everyone seems to stick to the top 3-5 points (i.e. only giving 6, 7, 8, 9 out of 10)? I'd be interested to see if Judging couldn't be made a little tighter & more meaningful with a smaller range. (5 gives you 0 (horrible), 1 (poor), 2 (below average), 3 (above average), 4 (great), 5 (perfect). Do we need more? Hm...)
The other issue is a little more, though. As can be seen here (& hidden below), the Design Criteria were "Theme, Role, Balance, Creativity, Divergence". It may be that your Judging has shown that "Creativity" & "Divergence" are too similar to be separated (because (see below) I was concerned with how similar they are in your Judging). But also, where's Role? Where's the analysis of our Hero's tactical synergies & gameplay functions? You seemed to kinda talk about it in... "Theme"? But then talked about "Theme" stuff in "Aesthetics". Muy confusado. Balance was pretty straightforward, though, and Creativity & Divergence were fine (if overlapping a bit, see above).
Design Criteria
Theme:
How well the skills, aesthetics & design fit together in a thematic manner such that they feel like they belong on the given hero (i.e. frost mage with frost spells, warrior with martial abilities, etc). Well-fitting & polished aesthetics which complement a cohesive Theme will be graded well; poorly-considered or lacking Thematic elements will result in a poor score.
???
Role:
How well the skills of the hero work together to achieve the tactical synergy & gameplay style the hero has (i.e. ranged assault, tank, support caster, etc). Comprehensive, well-though-out Roles which complement a cohesive Faction will be graded well; ill-considered, insufficient or over-compensating Roles will lose points.
???
Balance:
Includes how well the hero's Theme, & Role fit into the melee environment in terms of balance, theme, style, complicatedness, and so forth. Overpowered or Underpowered Heroes will result in a poor score; properly balanced elements will mean a good score.
???
Creativity:
How original the design of the hero is in terms of creative ideas, clever implementations, or new concepts. Innovation and creativity will be rewarded; re-use of existing elements & poor originality will result in a poor score.
???
Divergence:
A measure of how dissimilar your Hero is from it's base origins, both in terms of Theme (aesthetics) and Role (gameplay). For example, turning an Orcish Far Seer into an Orcish Necromagus is one thing, while turning a Tauren Chieftain into a Pixie Princess is quite another. Great divergence will result in a good score; little divergence will result in a poor score.
???
Total points:
???
[/quote]
Any way, on to the Judging.
Judging said:
Divergence
Both entries are very different from what they were in their original form. Both entries get full score in this field. 10/10
Balance
Both entries are a tiny bit too powerful I'd say.
...
Crusader had a bit too much healing, and 15 extra damage available at level one, with a healig ability on top of that is pretty strong too. 9/10
Theme
The new heroes was cool and thematic, and fit their own concept, aswell as a melee map, well. ...
The ultimate ability of the crusader would fit better if it buffed allies instead, as that would fit the hero theme, as a support and healer, and the name of the ability. 9/10
Yeah... I could see that. Of course, then I could only use the "+ MS", "+ AS" parts of Silence; would miss out on giving a miss chance & removing attack/spells from them. Giant AoE +MS/+AS? Meeeeh...
Judging said:
Aesthetics
...
While being thematic and having abilities that fit his character, the crusader didn't have the same visual appeal in his abilities. Hard to add too, I understand. The icons weren't harmonic, as the colours didn't match, and the holy smite and recruit icons didn't feel like they fit the hero. 7/10
Hm. While I can appreciate that some of the icons might not have fit a Crusader, have you seen the standard Hero ability icons? Priestess of the Moon (gray-red-white-purple)? Blood Mage (red-blue-green-red)? Goblin Alchemist (purple-green-purple-yellow)? Some are very aesthetically cohesive, but several are not.
Judging said:
Creativity
Undead Dark Ranger --> Human Crusader
Goblin Tinker --> Night Elf Druid
Spells are also twisted against their nature, making the heroes feel like completely new units.
Both entries gets full score here. 10/10
Thanks for the judging of the judging!
I defenitely see most of the point you are making, but I'm too lazy to answer to them at the moment.
Let's just make it short: You're right.
I've defenitely learned a few things from this challange, and will probably be able to host better ones in the future.
Nice working with both of you!
Congratulations to both of you because it is amazing what you can do with object editor only. I am really impressed and could not believe it that you did not use any code.
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