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Custom Hero Arena Line Wars

Discussion in 'Map Development' started by Glorn2, Nov 13, 2010.

  1. Glorn2

    Glorn2

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    Custom Hero Arena Line Wars (downloadable)

    Custom Hero Arena - Line Wars

    Background:

    - I am the creator of Custom Hero Arena Revolutions, a map which I have finally finished, and will only be performing minor work on in the future. Until SC2 gets a custom game system worth using, I am sticking to WC3, and need a new project.
    - I spent 2-1/2 years perfecting CHAR, and need a basic project that will hopefully, not take as long.
    - When CHLW first came out, I really enjoyed it. After a year or so of playing it, I determined that it was quite imbalanced, and that a single player could make or break a game. It is still a great game, however, I feel like adding some competition against it will kick baka-ranger's hiney into overdrive. Competition always makes for good maps!
    - CHA-LW will be based on Custom Hero Arena, in terms of units, items, and abilities. I want to test an idea I have about how willing people are to switch between games if they don't have to completely re-learn items, heroes, leveling, gameplay, ECT.


    General Idea for the Game:

    Creep Summoning:
    - Each "space" in the summoning shop will spawn a level of creep. That is, a random level 1 creep will be the first creep type that you spawn.
    - Every time you click it, it will spawn another random level 1 creep.
    - This will be how it levels, 11 levels per shop, 4 shops, upgraded (1 upgrade button per level) and 4 bosses at the end to spawn.


    Income:
    - One thing I hated about all hero line wars games was the insane need for an income. I was OP at most games, because I would give up 50 lives to have 2X everyone else’s income. Then, I couldn't lose.
    - Income will come from summoning only; gold from killing.
    - While the game will be reasonably fast paced, I don’t plan for people to get high incomes; creeps will give a low gold gain from being killed, and from being summoned.
    - Of course, there will be more creeps added at various levels, so at more than level 10 you can spam flying critters, with luck.


    Items:
    - Items are the 1 thing I don’t want to change. There are really about 450 items in the game that I would have to change. So, I plan to balance the gold rate of the game, around the cost of items. Call me cheap, but it is true.
    - For anyone who doesn't know the CHA item set up, there are a lot of weapons and armors, so as that any build can be fully supported by various items.
    -Peons will be able to create items and bring them to your hero while you are fighting.


    Heroes:
    - Obviously balancing will become an issue, but The only main change I plan for heroes is to make global EXP sharing (another annoying thing about CHLW was people whining that they wanted to solo a lane, because there was no EXP sharing and they could very quickly become 4X the level of their teamates) and to lower the leveling rate; so it progresses at a safe rate; on a game scale.
    - Again, balancing will have to determine specific stats, but there will be about 85 heroes to pick from; and all hero types will be equally playable.


    Abilities:
    - Of course I will have to re-scale all of these, lowering damage on a lot of spells, or giving spell reduction to a vast majority of creeps. Would be kinda OP for 4 players to pick frost fail, and stand in 1 spot all game winning.
    - Passive skills will NOT dominate the game! .. nor will summons, early game.
    - But, I plan to keep the current abilities in the game.
    - The same hero picking system will exist.
    - There are about 160ish abilities in the game.
    - Units get an offensive, defensive, misc, innate, and ultimate skill.


    PVP:
    - There will be a portal that takes you through a Yiff area, with a treasure chest. you can kill it for gold, or you can continue through another portal into your opponents base area, and can attempt to mess them up while being over there.
    - I want to add a -challenge feature, where you can challenge other players to a duel, and it takes you to an arena and you fight to the death for extra gold and to gain extra lives for your team. Of course there will be a cool down on how often you can challenge another player.
    - I am undecided yet if I want to force all players into an arena every X seconds to duke it out. I prolly will.


    Additional Information:

    Official Website: http://chao.forumclan.net
    HiveWorkshop link for CHAR: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/maps-564/custom-hero-arena-revolutions-final-181986/
    TheHelper link for CHAR: http://www.thehelper.net/forums/showthread.php?t=139884

    Currently this map is in the planning stage, and there is the most leeway for change. Within a week I plan to have a Basic outline of the map made up (Assuming I get all my college work done). Within a month I plan to have a playable version of the map.

    *Disclaimer*
    In no way do I intend to slander the current version or editor of CHLW, I believe that it is a great map. I only intend to invent my own map which shares a similar concept.

    ===========================================
    Update: 12/16/10
    ===========================================

    After a lot of work and bug fixing, I have a highly-playable version of the map. It is still lacking a few of the features I plan to have in it, but for now... yeh know...
    I try to use text throughout the game to give tips and explain the game. There is a brief intro to explain it to noobs. I am sure everyone in the world will want it removed, and then complain that new players don't know where to summon from.

    Anyway, this is a multiplayer game only. We currently do not have it on a bot either; but should within a few days. Anyone looking to try it out in a large team setting, find Wrathbot on US-East or come to channel Clan Chao and we will host one for you.


    ===========================================
    Update: 2/17/11
    ===========================================

    I kind of forgot I was working on this map. I had made a lot of bug fixes to it... and well, a lot more bug fixes. What it needs now is a lot of testing. It should be hosted in the bot TNP-Bot on all severs, for anyone interested in playing it. The download for it has also been updated.
     

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    Last edited: Feb 17, 2011
  2. Glorn2

    Glorn2

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    Just a bump to say that I am putting the finishing touches on this map. I encountered a minor problem in my kick system; so have to remake the entire thing (not too much work). I am done with college in a few days, and Plan to have a working beta version out for the public before the 17th; when a cash tourny for Custom Hero Arena is starting, and I have to give it most of my attention.

    I will be back to bump again with a version of the map for everyone to tryout! I must say though, so far, it is a lot of fun. Very difficult though; easy mode is challenging, normal is hard, hard is almost impossible; very hard requires 6 players on each team who know what they are doing; and insane is simply impossible. I assumed that 80% of pubs will pick easy mode once this goes onto a bot; and the remaining 20% will pick normal, with an average of 0% picking harder mode. this is why my difficulties are all much harder than their titles suggest.

    I will post screenies when I post the download.
     
  3. Skycraft

    Skycraft

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  4. Glorn2

    Glorn2

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    Alright, uploaded a copy of the map, free bump for people to see.

    Please give me any feedback you got!
     
  5. Glorn2

    Glorn2

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    La-la-la-la... bump again, updated edit.

    No changelog, but mostly it is bug fixes and such.
     
  6. WillofKhrone

    WillofKhrone

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    WHAT?!? Passives will no longer dominate?!? Your killing me, man! You just shot me through the heart!

    on a more serious note, since I currently can't play Warcraft...

    So, is it going to be like 10 income rounds, then hero battles for a while, then rounds, then hero battles? Well, I got a pretty easy method to win. Don't send. It'd be a decently easy problem to fix, I guess, sending small ammounts of units based upon the unit summoned most in the last minute, maybe like 4 to 20 depending on the unit?
    OHHH.
    Why would I never not want to be in thar base area? Sure, my team may be one less player, but HEY. I'm killing them. They're going to be losing lives, too. Maybe have a maximum time able to be in thar? That treasure chest, what's it's respawn time? Just spamkilling the treasure chest... -> huge income -> huge mass -> huge level creeps -> early game win
     
  7. Glorn2

    Glorn2

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    None of your strats would actually work though (from experience).

    If you dont send anything; then you... well.. wont have the income to send anything. Even if you might get the level advantage; they will have an insane income advantage. They can trade lumber for gold; or spam really strong creeps, then run over and kill you; because they dont need their whole team to block a few creeps. Teams have 300 lives; a hero killing a hero is only -5. Duels areeeee... I think every 5 minutes? Income is every 10 seconds or so.

    No creeps are your allies; so, if you go to the other side, the creeps there will kill you also. There is no healing shrine on either side. I find it hard to think that you would be able to stand up to an entire team, spawning next to you, and attacking you.

    The treasure chest is a nice gold bonus; the cooldown on him is 1 minute. However, every time you kill it and the guardian, they get a decent bit stronger. Like, stronger than you could get from spending the gold gained from killing them. Plus, your opponents could go in there and kill you, and steal the kill, if they are smart.

    The things you point out are... Not abuses at all? I mean, there is no way to actually abuse them to win the game using any of them as a strat. Sometimes it might be smart not to summon, so you can save up and spam. Some times it is good to go on their side and pressure, sometimes you are strong enough to kill the treasure in a timely manner. In no situation can you rely on any of those proposed strats to win an entire game.

    The key to victory is having a team that speaks the same language, and understands the most basic concepts of any game. Things like "We need a guy to take hits, a guy to deal a lot of damage, and a guy to keep everyone alive!" With that most basic set up, you will do ~20X better than a bunch of people going ranged agility...
     
  8. highandpawning

    highandpawning

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    I played this map once its kind of cheesy. You just get a team with one decent nuking ability like either lightning, flame strike, or frost fall and make insane amounts of cash and expereince from noobs spamming weak creeps in attempt to make insane income. The overall game experience is kind of boring the map layout leaves something to be desired. I dont like the fact that the creeps Im summoning are random. In fact I think thats what kills this game for me. Past the magic totem there isnt any kind of strategy other then pick a nuke and dominate. With random creeps you cant form any kind of real strategy to your summoning other then I need income thought process.
     
  9. Glorn2

    Glorn2

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    Isnt that really what happens in any line wars game? Unless of course you increase the difficulty, the creeps gain immunity from spell damage. If someone is spamming weak creeps, then you can kill those creeps easily. If they are spamming hard creeps, you cant.

    Not trying to reinvent the wheel here; just a different set-up of the same old line wars type game. I havent seen a new hero line wars since... 2009ish? Dying game type on a dying game...
     
  10. highandpawning

    highandpawning

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    Yes but in yours one cast can literally kill dozens and dozens of creeps early. Your passive builds with the exception of their teams arthas got completly crushed by the hordes of creeps. Passives suck and nukes are extremely op. Your summoning system as I pointed out is kind of bad. Instead of just summon random creeps you should give players the option of choosing the types of creeps they summon. For an example if your facing team completly reliant on their nukes wouldnt you like the option of being able to choose and summon spell immune creeps?
     
  11. Glorn2

    Glorn2

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    I do see your point with the summoning of specific units.

    Again, you are playing on very easy mode though. I know this because creeps gain HP and spell damage reduction as you increase difficulty. Only in very easy mode can you clear creeps with AoE nukes. a majority of our testing was done in "normal mode" and, well... Passives were actually the best. The 3 best builds we came up with were mostly passive. After that, was a summons build.

    I am glad to get some feedback on this; and will try to do something with various levels of creeps having certain abilities. Would you be willing to test the game in normal difficulty, using your spells, and tell me your opinion of that? I think a solution might be to remove easy mode. IT seems most people will only ever pick the easiest mode in any game.