Computer Players

[Amargaard]

I think it should be an opportunity to play with computer Player AIs as the secondary friendly hero... what you think? :]

 

[Lich Prince]

Hmmm... Wouldn't the AI be reckless and useless?

Such as Grom Hellscream in the Orc Campaign, no strategies can be planned or executed. This would also make Insane impossible.

Not to mention it ruins the purpose of the Project.

 

[McQvaBlood]

Yes, there would also be some very nasty maps where it would be nearly impossible to code an AI that does not act totally out of place. For example Under the Burning Skies.

 

[Amargaard]

Well, okay, it was just a poor sugestion. Seems to be impossible, as you said, to make for all maps. It'll sadly keep away from playing the maps, since I don't really have any friends who plays warcraft III IRL :-/

 

[rcshaggy]

Do you know how to make AI computer players actually care for their forces and learn how to expand and such like a normal player?

 

[Amargaard]

I know the basics in triggering and a little more than to be considered a noob, yet I have no idea how to control AI's in custom maps.

 

[Lich Prince]

Sorry guys, but it's virtually impossible to program an AI to act as a human player.

 

[Amargaard]

I guess so :/

 

[Dr Super Good]

It need not act like a human player, it just must help with achieving the goals.
You could also throw in control to allow human players some influence over the AI.

The key thing you must remember when making AI for a campaign is that it need not be fully intelligent. Where as a human like me or you must be able to vary our play between maps and identify and create stratergies on new maps as well as extend our unit choices based on availability, the AI just has to play that specific map.

As the map is pre defined, you can illiminate the need for excessive intelligence and instead resort to telling the AI how to act in a sort of scripted way. Yes variences are still present so some intelligence is needed for low level control but the general behaviour of the AI can be dictated in a very pre determined way.

If an area is strategic to hold (like kelthuzard summoning the portal), the AI can be instructed to build defenses there at some point as an example. Ofcourse I have little experience with the WC3 campaign so that might not be the best thing to do but you can however instruct it to do better.

The key areas needed for an AI are to behave human like in the map. Identify what humans generally do (there must be some colleration between or people who win) and get the AI to try and mimic it. As for teamwork, you could try hard codeing team stratergies into it and allowing them to be chat activated.

Ofcourse the AI need not be able to beat insane, but it could still be able to guide players trhough lower difficulties.

Ultimatly the question does get raised however.... If you want to play the campaign alone, why not play the real thing?

 

[rcshaggy]

Well can you by any chance program the AI into making the computer thinking its a human player?

I know Insane is by far the good AI controllable computer, but still I kicked its ass with better resources and such.

 

[Lich Prince]

It need not act like a human player, it just must help with achieving the goals.
You could also throw in control to allow human players some influence over the AI.

The key thing you must remember when making AI for a campaign is that it need not be fully intelligent. Where as a human like me or you must be able to vary our play between maps and identify and create stratergies on new maps as well as extend our unit choices based on availability, the AI just has to play that specific map.

As the map is pre defined, you can illiminate the need for excessive intelligence and instead resort to telling the AI how to act in a sort of scripted way. Yes variences are still present so some intelligence is needed for low level control but the general behaviour of the AI can be dictated in a very pre determined way.

The key areas needed for an AI are to behave human like in the map. Identify what humans generally do (there must be some colleration between or people who win) and get the AI to try and mimic it. As for teamwork, you could try hard codeing team stratergies into it and allowing them to be chat activated.

Have you played Wanderers of Sorceria? Are you suggesting something similar to Yue Fang's army ordering to defeat Cinder?

Ofcourse the AI need not be able to beat insane, but it could still be able to guide players trhough lower difficulties.

Ultimatly the question does get raised however.... If you want to play the campaign alone, why not play the real thing?

True.

 

[Twizter]

The AI would be a good addition to the Campaign, but as some people have already specified, it would defeat the purpose of a Co-Op campaign. Maybe add it after the maps are finished, as an extra addition?

 

[Dr Super Good]

The fact remains its only real purpose would be if eithor these missions are so much better than the orignals that it is worth playing this singleplayer rather than the included campaigns or as a showcase piece to show how awesome you are at map making.

It is possible, although largly pointless.

I know Insane is by far the good AI controllable computer, but still I kicked its ass with better resources and such.

As for your argument about insane AI, that is mostly down to unit composition. The AI has no dynamic unit composition as far as I know, as such it will keep building crap units all game instead of an army to counter you. Blizzard has always had this major flaw with thier AIs, and even in SC2 the AI will rather send weak units into your invincible defenses rather than building a fleet of battlecruisers which could physically bulldoze you in seconds due to lacking AA potential. Even if they have twice your resources and many more expansions than you, they are still limited to the same population cap you are so you just have to expend that more effectivly to win.

You must remember that campaign objectives are not controled by human players, they are predetermined. As such the AI need not learn to counter what humans make to attack them as they are only ever fighting other AI or scripted events. Thus you can just tell the AI what is best to build from the start (what humans do for best results in that mission). If the game changes in such a way that what they do is no longer good (scripted event), then you can just get that event to also update the AI so it will change to something that is good in the current situation.

Have you played Wanderers of Sorceria? Are you suggesting something similar to Yue Fang's army ordering to defeat Cinder?

Sorry, I have not.

 

[TheSpoon]

WELL, this has been requested before.
But I'm afraid it would just take too much time, and it probably wouldn't be flawless.
Plus if you wanted to play the campaigns on your own, well, you already can.

Rejected/left open for further discussion.

 

[Amargaard]

Ultimatly the question does get raised however.... If you want to play the campaign alone, why not play the real thing?

Because I have done that thoussands of times and these 2P campaigns have new things in them, never seen before in the official singleplayer campaign, an example could be the second hero...

 

[Lich Prince]

I think the 2 Player Campaign maps are unprotected. How about you edit your own campaigns by yourself, CnP the extra stuff to your own edit and then play the thing?

If you plan to upload it anywhere though, I recommend you ask Spoon for permission.

 

[TheSpoon]

Yep, free to edit them for your own pleasure.

 

[Amargaard]

As I said; I don't know how to handle AI-triggering :/

 

[TheSpoon]

Tbh, don't think I'd be able to do it either.

 

[polu]

I think it would be good though