Age of Empires II Total Conversion

[Katu]

As the name says, I would like to start a project in the near future that implements Age of Empires II: Age of Kings and the Coquerors Expansion into Warcraft III: Tft.

This means plus one dimension because AoK is an isometric 2D game. Mainly I choosed modding instead of mapping because the te final download will be huge (=problems with multiplayer). In short, I would like to do with AoK that Project Revolution did with Starcraft (except that all-of-the-gameCDs-needed thing).

I would do the exporting (icons, GUI images, terrain graphics etc.), the building and "doodad" modeling (but I think a bulding skinner will be needed) and the organizing tasks. I can not mod, so a "finalizer" or "programmer" will also be needed, same goes for unit modeling and skinning.

I would like to do it in a little bit higher resolution (both for models & skins) that WcIII.

I think that some things like the researches, can be done with triggers, so we'll need a blank map with all the AoK triggers.

I also plan to implement the original AoK campaigns (this can be done because the map files can be "hacked out" from the campaign files). I will also do it if nobody else wants.

We can also make a new campaign (and multiplayer maps).

Solving the implementing of the game modes (Regicide, Deathmatch etc.) will be a problem, but I think that's not so big that discourages modders to start modding

I'm busy with working (both in real life and in participating the Modeling Cometition 3) so if people interested, I can only start doing stuff in the next week.

Huh, I thin I explained every thing, so...
Anyone interested?

 

[RedBlade]

I may help u. (i mean with triggers). About the skinning, I may do a bit, but only easy ones (cuz i still dont have Photoshop and i use MS paint, that by the way I can use very well) anyway. If u want i can help u.

 

[Katu]

For the skins: the building grtaphics can be exported from AoK so you can create basic skins from it. But I think a good skinner is needed. If only the miss of Photoshop limits you, check This.

 

[Mechanical Man]

Dunno, if total conversion is a good idea. Look at PR, there are many people making it and it will never be finished. Go rather generic medieval map/mod instead.

 

[Katu]

Dunno, if total conversion is a good idea.

We shall see. It's not as tough job as PR.

 

[operator]

If I want to play Age of Empires, I'll buy it.

 

[Mechanical Man]

Age of empires 2 is just a standard RTS featuring medieval times which tries to include as much realism as possible without ruining the gameplay. So the purpose of this project would be rather creating a medieval mod which could be more fun to play and take advantage of warcraft3 engine and maybe excluding some overcomplicated features, which could not be implemented without minor lag on slower systems and render difficult AI implementation. Recreating existing games is pointless, as operator said. And remember, perfectionism ruins the modding activity.

 

[RedBlade]

Thnx Katu for the link.

What a pity Its only a tryout version ...

 

[Katu]

So the purpose of this project would be rather creating a medieval mod which could be more fun to play and take advantage of warcraft3 engine and maybe excluding some overcomplicated features, which could not be implemented without minor lag on slower systems and render difficult AI implementation. Recreating existing games is pointless, as operator said.

Hmm... What about a tuned-up version based on the old AoK? Weapons for every single unit, horse mounting, new units, maybe some new systems like morale, walkable castle walls, realistic environment (for example a cannonball impact knocks back nearby units), siege machines and weapons... wouldn't that be cool?

 

[RedBlade]

It would. About the morale, what would be the conditions to make some ones morale high/low ?

 

[Katu]

For example the death of the leader greatly decreases morale and having an artifact increases it.

Thnx Katu for the link.

Then REP ME PLZ... PLZ... PLZ... REP ME... REP ME...

Oh never mind, I joked

 

[Nuke770]

i may do some terraining for you, im pretty good at medieval type forest stuff, check out my posts in the forum terrain board >>> just research for all posts by me in my cp

 

[Chaos Overlord]

I may play with the Upgrades. I had AoE until my disc cracked so I can't play anymore, but I do have a huge strat guide that came with it so I'm good. I will see what I can do. Maybe.

 

[Gausslander]

great idea, actually the idea is excellent. AOE2 Mod is just what B.net needs.

 

[Dr Super Good]

You can not insert higher res graphics than WC3 already has. The engine starts to mess up with a lot of pollies (10000 on screen) and can crash.

Also WC3's engine is not optimum to simulate an entirly different game, especially one which has 4 recources while WC3 has only 2. Trigger emulated recources are highly unefficent especilly to make them like AoE2. Also the unit pathing systems are not perfect since AOE2 had near instant unit response yet with WC3 when over 100 units (AOE could have 200) there is a delay that causes units pathing systems to mess up and so become hard to move, especially in times of tatical need.

I recomend waiting till StarCraft2 since there the engine is made to handle high res graphics quickly and have 100s of units on screen at once. Also the game has built in physics and thus the projectiles like cannons and arrows do not need to be simulated making lag but instead work fast as they are hard coded. And the game will probably have better AI support and triggers.

 

[Chaos Overlord]

Well Dr. Super Good just made a load of sense. I think that we should wait now that I think about it. Of course I still will atempt the upgrades if you need them.

 

[Katu]

great idea, actually the idea is excellent. AOE2 Mod is just what B.net needs.

You can not insert higher res graphics than WC3 already has. The engine starts to mess up with a lot of pollies (10000 on screen) and can crash.

Also WC3's engine is not optimum to simulate an entirly different game, especially one which has 4 recources while WC3 has only 2. Trigger emulated recources are highly unefficent especilly to make them like AoE2. Also the unit pathing systems are not perfect since AOE2 had near instant unit response yet with WC3 when over 100 units (AOE could have 200) there is a delay that causes units pathing systems to mess up and so become hard to move, especially in times of tatical need.

I recomend waiting till StarCraft2 since there the engine is made to handle high res graphics quickly and have 100s of units on screen at once. Also the game has built in physics and thus the projectiles like cannons and arrows do not need to be simulated making lag but instead work fast as they are hard coded. And the game will probably have better AI support and triggers.

My conclusions:

1. If the modder team is a maximalist one, we should wait until Sc2. And buy a new computer.
2. But, people (like me lol) are starving for AoK or at least a good medieval mod.
3. AoK allows 200 units at a time and 40 units selectable together. The strategy sometimes needs a load of units fighting together in one screen. So, an extermely good-looking AoK mod in Wc3 is nearly impossible.
4. We still don't know when Starcraft2 will launch, I personally think that it won't be complete before Chritsmas 2008, but at least Christmas 2007.

So... I recommend:

1. Instead of creating a medieval mod which would take longer to make than an AoK Total Conversion (TC), make a relatively low-poly version AoK TC which can be played before Sc2 comes out. We will have a good base for...

2. ...creating a medieval mod for Sc2 when it comes out. (Hopefully we all will have a computer that can run Sc2.)

All thast we need now:

1. a good unit modeler
2. a good animator. DO YOU HEAR THIS CHRIZ.?
3. a good skinner
4. Mappers and beta testers.
I can do the rest: exporting, terrains, triggering, building modeling.

Your opinions?

P.S. for ChaosOverlord: I can handle the researches.

 

[Mechanical Man]

New skins will not be that much needed, there are many useful textures in warcraft and the models could be done with some work with vertex modifier.

 

[Katu]

New skins will not be that much needed, there are many useful textures in warcraft and the models could be done with some work with vertex modifier.

Hmmm.. I just wanted to (ask someone to) make custom skins to make the mod more like AoK. For the model: I won't do the units, so I don't care what program will be user for them. But I think I will use gmax for the buildings (I already made some sketches lol

 

[Mechanical Man]

If you will be making structures, try to match blizzard style as much as possible, so the existing models will fit yours. This means importing those building animation geosets like planks and the basement. Similar to my stable model, but this model sucks for some obvious reasons, so i hope you will make better.

 

[Craka_J]

If you need a Terrainer, I may want to join this mod. Sounds promising and like a good idea.

 

[Nuke770]

me and craka l can terrain for you, you can check my stuff out at the terrain forum, craka is really good at terraining citys and urban areas, i can do the forest part

 

[Chaos Overlord]

Na katu, I will do those for you. Organizing a mod is hard and you will need some help and I really am not working on anyhting too important right now.

 

[wugiboy]

I believe there were 10+ factions in age of empires, how are you gonna implement it in WC3?

 

[Chaos Overlord]

That might be a problem..... but there has to be some easy way of doing it. Worst comes to worst, we just have someone remake every building for each team with its special stuff.

 

[Katu]

If you will be making structures, try to match blizzard style as much as possible, so the existing models will fit yours. This means importing those building animation geosets like planks and the basement.

Because this mod will be a total conversion, I think that's unneeded because we will modificate almost every aspects of the game, so we can form its "shape" into anything we want. This means removing the Blizz atmosphere and adding an AoK one.

@Craka & Nuke: Actually, I wieved both of your terrains and I was satisfied... whoa, it will be a pleasure knowing you in the modding team ranks

@Chaos Overlord: Okay, research triggers are yours. And we will NEED to make for each faction its own building and units, ecpecially because of the different sound sets.

Hmmm, for the organizing part: I've done my work (it was seasonal), so I can work on the mod. We can begin now!
I plan a huge post tomorrow what will describe the tasks, what-to do-s, methods, ideas etc. May I create a new thread or just post it here?

 

[Mechanical Man]

So you have the plan to change tilesests, doodads, interface, etc. ? Dunno, medieval mod is one of few mods which can be implemented without massive conversion.

First of all, I think, you should post info in map development forum, but better read rules before, I'm always seeing Mini-Me telling everyone posting in map development about reading the rules.

 

[Katu]

Okay. Expect a post tomorrow (or a day later)

 

[Chaos Overlord]

Going to Pirates at Worlds End right now so i can't work... when we get back I have to teach my dad how to play C&C3 online so I won't be able to skin so you may have my undivided attention on this map after the movie. BTW, I don't think most upgrades will have to be triggered. SOme will, but not most.

 

[Katu]

BUMP: I changed my mind and started planning a demo map that can be submitted to encourage people to join.

 

[Craka_J]

Well if my services are ever needed for this mod, you can PM me and let me know.

 

[Chaos Overlord]

Oh god, I forgot all about this. I havent even done anything yet..... don't hate me I will try to do something although I have like no free time for a while... you may want to get someone else.

 

[Katu]

I started working on it.

ChaosOverlord, can you make a map with some custom building/units in it? Just the main melee buildings with no factions. For testing.

 

[Craka_J]

I won't start terrain though until all doodads, tilesets, etc. are imported, being that this is a total conversion, I can't use any WC3 models so starting with just a couple things won't really give me much variation to terrain with. PM when the campaign/map has everything imported and with a link of a rapidshare.de hosted file of the map.

 

[Katu]

So you mean that I must upload to rapidshare.de? I hate that site.

 

[Craka_J]

No, no, doesn't have to be there. Can also be megaupload or w/e you want. Just a referance incase you didn't know any others.

 

[Katu]

Okay...

 

[Chaos Overlord]

K so what you need? Just make all the units like a generic team with all things able to be built? Yeah, do you want all the stats to be in place too? I could, now that school is over and I will stop putting it off and being lazy.

 

[Gausslander]

Let's Start Porting - Family Guy, Hacker Guy (Episode #0??)

 

[Katu]

Waht do you mean Scyth?

Anyway, ChaosOverlord, yes, all the stats would be fine. I'm working now on he doodads (but I have some problems with animating in gmax lol)

And we still need an Organic Stuff Modeler because I ain't gonna model any units. (I'll try plants). Also we need a good animator.

 

[Chaos Overlord]

KK you guys will have to get together and determine armor and build time. For range, they are measured in tiles. Like an archer has 4 tile of range. How much should I count one tile as? 125 range? And there is only five different movement speeds in the game: Very slow, slow, medium, fast, very fast. I will do those and you can mod them at will. And lastly, I am taking stats DIRECTLY out of the game. Nothing is my own. You can mod them as you wish, but you may ruin the balance the game already has.

 

[Katu]

OK. Still have to found out some solution for the armor system anyway... I mean in AOK the armor means "Dmg reduced by 6" not "dmg reduced by 12%".

Anyway, I think 1 aok tile shall be 1 warcraft tile (in medium grid) so thats 64 I suppose...or 128.

 

[Chaos Overlord]

128 sounds right. i will go with that for now. If it doesn't seem rigt, I will change it.

 

[Katu]

News!

I said 1-2 times that I'm working on something. Here it is: a Teutons' barracks. It's stil WIP.

 

[Mechanical Man]

Do not forget to make the basement and build props (planks, girders and stuff), which appear in building animation.

 

[Katu]

I won't animate.

 

[Mechanical Man]

Actually, this is not animating. If you look at the warcraft buildings, all of them have sort of planks and stuff.

 

[DoOs_101]

So is this a mod like Starcraft coversion on wc3?

 

[Craka_J]

Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne.

 

[Hydralisk]

Will the textures for the ground be ripped from AOK or will they be made from scratch?