The gay marriage debate thread

[Nuclear]

It sure seems like the human race is on the brink of an extinction, so gotta keep breeding.

Also, I find it stupid how people assume that if gays aren't allowed to marry, they will suddenly turn straight and go make children...

 

[GhostThruster]

@vengeancekael: whoa i always thought u were gay, but like with women not men

@nuclear:

Actually marriage has function outside of religion and involving religion in it at all is completely optional.

i've lost count of how many times i've tried to explain how marriage isnt just some obscure, exclusively christian ceremony with no social/legal consequences whatsoever. it's such a stupidly hipster argument to pursue

 

[Karassu]

Man, let them marry each other. As long as it does not kill someone or affect someone in a bad way, don't give a shit. But if you're christian maybe that's the biggest reason.

 

[youness]

Well. I just have one thing.
Gays or l*****n is illegal and isn't nature. For that why the god creat the mâle and female, that is nature, and if there was any gay in thé world, he will die in âge of 38 or less.
And if there was anyone in the hive had in his avatar two gays, pleas to remove it because there will be a True wrath in the hell,.

 

[The_Taxidermist]

lovin this guy enough 2 marry him

 

[Gilles]

Well. I just have one thing.
Gays or l*****n is illegal and isn't nature. For that why the god creat the mâle and female, that is nature, and if there was any gay in thé world, he will die in âge of 38 or less.
And if there was anyone in the hive had in his avatar two gays, pleas to remove it because there will be a True wrath in the hell,.

Exactly. I'm really glad that traditional marriage has defendants as articulate and thought provoking as you. The rest of us don't even have to bother showing up to debates, you'll take down those blimey pro-gays solo.

 

[jonhysone]

Marriage is for sex/Children/love. I am against gay marriage

 

[Nuclear]

@johnysone

Nice reasoning skills.

 

[chr2]

Marriage is for sex/Children/love. I am against gay marriage

"Marriage is for Children" -jonhysone 2014*

Anyway, are you implying that gays are incapable of loving? Your "reasons" to get married apply to homo sexuals too, you know. While the getting married for sex and love parts should be pretty self-explanatory, two people of the same gender are, as has been established multiple times in this thread already, incapable of having children. However, a prerequisite for adoption, which is one of the few options a homo sexual couple would have to establish a family, is often** that the applicants are married.


*This may or may not have been taken out of context.
**This would depend on your own country's rules of adoption, as well as the country, you're trying to adopt from, 's rules of adoption.

 

[gorillabull]

when discussing scientific topics like this make sure to closely intertwine every aspect of them with things from every known religion as this will make the topic clearer

 

[EdgeOfChaos]

Marriage is for sex/Children/love. I am against gay marriage

So if a straight couple chooses not to have children (or they can't), their marriage should be prohibited? Or are you implying gay people can't love?

 

[Tal'Rarity]

Everyone should have the right to their own opinion, people will love whoever they fall in love with. Also it was scientifically proven that you can be born gay and sometimes it isn't up to you.

I also dis-agree with you, youness. Who are you to talk for God? We have male and female for repopulation and milk. Doesn't mean anything more then that, we humans always over-do everything. Take a nice good old history lesson. This is just another lesson being written in history and we're living it.

Being gay is definitely not illegal, what its wrong to be happy? =) Don't forget your English now.

My thoughts are leave them alone and just tend to your own opinion and don't force it on others. The people that freak out are the people that fear them and feel quite insecure.

Oh, and did you know we're the only form of life/animal/mammal on our planet that is homophobic? Sure says a lot doesn't it?

 

[Gilles]

Oh, and did you know we're the only form of life/animal/mammal on our planet that is homophobic? Sure says a lot doesn't it?

No, it doesn't. We're the only life forms with reason.

As I said already, looking at the animal kingdom is a terrible place to find evidence for morality.

 

[Xonok]

Several species of spiders try to kill their males. If the male is any good, then only after mating, but usually before.
Mantis females eat the males during mating.
Most creatures do not have any kind of "faithfulness". Furthermore, it is even common for animals to commit rape as it is understood by us humans.
Animals don't follow gods as far as we know.
It used to be common for humans to eat eachother and still is in some parts of the world. Should we consider that moral too, because "it exists in the nature"?

tl;dr - As said before, animals and morals(religion) should be kept separate.

 

[takakenji]

Oh, and did you know we're the only form of life/animal/mammal on our planet that is homophobic? Sure says a lot doesn't it?

lmao bcos there r no gay animals boii and anyways animals kill eachother every day and eat eachother disgusting cannibals i dont see humans doin that they also don't have the power to post on forums and debate stuff like we do we are the master race so honestly gay marriage should be legalized we should legalize everytihn bcos the government dosnt control u, only u do. if u make a dumb decision and do drugs or watever u die and then the generation of smart ppl are born. its survival of the fittest simple this is why i'm still alive.

 

[GhostThruster]

morals and religion should be kept separate

 

[gorillabull]

what is your morals are derived from religion and religious books like a lot of people which a lot of people's are

 

[Boris_Spider]

Gay marriage should not be a problem.

I know a few gay people, and I have never heard them complain that 'straight' people exist or refer to heterosexuals as unnatural. If they mention sexual orientation it's typically a complaint that their current interest isn't being reciprocated. Many of the heterosexuals I know are genuinely obsessed with homosexuals - in that they want to crucify them (they degree of which varies slightly).

Many of these same heterosexuals are also anti-abortion. Well, who has less abortions than homosexuals? You'd think they make natural allies... We have more important things to be concerned with in the world:
1) Food supplies
2) <Fresh>Water supplies
3) Antibiotics being less effective with time
4) A world population that wants to grow exponentially
5) Lack of infrastructure (or lack of its maintenance - USA that I know of)

Yet here we are arguing that guys should not prefer guys and girls should not prefer girls. Also, for those who believe that same-sex attraction is uniquely human, we have more information indicating that homosexual animals exist than we do indicating that one of the gods (or more) will smite the planet for tolerating a handful of homosexuals. For those of you who hate wikipedia summaries, check out the reference links at the bottom of the article.

For those that argue that everything is about the bloodline - this is the year 2014 and we have a world population in excess of 7 billion and counting, reproduction is not a concern for our species.

For those that describe homosexuality as immoral, I have currently no response that you could understand. When I do I will present it - I'm not insulting you, but I won't waste your time unnecessarily.

//\\oo//\\

 

[Tal'Rarity]

Gay marriage should not be a problem.

I know a few gay people, and I have never heard them complain that 'straight' people exist or refer to heterosexuals as unnatural. If they mention sexual orientation it's typically a complaint that their current interest isn't being reciprocated. Many of the heterosexuals I know are genuinely obsessed with homosexuals - in that they want to crucify them (they degree of which varies slightly).

Many of these same heterosexuals are also anti-abortion. Well, who has less abortions than homosexuals? You'd think they make natural allies... We have more important things to be concerned with in the world:
1) Food supplies
2) <Fresh>Water supplies
3) Antibiotics being less effective with time
4) A world population that wants to grow exponentially
5) Lack of infrastructure (or lack of its maintenance - USA that I know of)

Yet here we are arguing that guys should not prefer guys and girls should not prefer girls. Also, for those who believe that same-sex attraction is uniquely human, we have more information indicating that homosexual animals exist than we do indicating that one of the gods (or more) will smite the planet for tolerating a handful of homosexuals. For those of you who hate wikipedia summaries, check out the reference links at the bottom of the article.

For those that argue that everything is about the bloodline - this is the year 2014 and we have a world population in excess of 7 billion and counting, reproduction is not a concern for our species.

For those that describe homosexuality as immoral, I have currently no response that you could understand. When I do I will present it - I'm not insulting you, but I won't waste your time unnecessarily.

//\\oo//\\

Finally.

I have nothing more to add to that... Can only agree with it because there really is nothing to add. Pretty much a perfect statement.

 

[Xonok]

I should note that the argument about heterosexuals being obsessed with gays is still valid for one reason - It's not the heteros that are arguing about the necessity of this change and this is a very valid reason.
Not agreeing with gay marriage is a right and anyone that wants to legalize it has to justify it to the rest of the population.
From this perspective, it is not the heterosexuals that are being obsessive, but rather gays that are trying to shove their world view down other people's throats and calling anyone who disagrees a hater. Sounds familiar, doesn't it?

But instead we have some arguments about morals and other stuff.

 

[Nuclear]

From this perspective, it is not the heterosexuals that are being obsessive, but rather gays that are trying to shove their world view down other people's throats and calling anyone who disagrees a hater. Sounds familiar, doesn't it?

Yes, it does sound familiar. Like when those damn women demanded the right to vote. Or when those damn slaves wanted freedom. Or when those damn workers demanded reasonable working hours. Just people showing their world view down other people's throat, am I right?

Probably shouldn't use sarcasm on the Hive, since there are so many people who bafflingly can't seem to grasp it at all.

In case anyone has the sarcasm decoder missing from their brain: wanting to end discrimination and wanting special rights are not comparable. It is the anti-gay groups that are enforcing their world view on others.

Or should my world view be respected if I said "people called 'Xonok' shouldn't have the right to marry!'? Would it be me or you who was shoving worldviews down the other's throat?

 

[Boris_Spider]

... If they mention sexual orientation it's typically a complaint that their current interest isn't being reciprocated.

This isn't phrased very well. What I mean by current interest is 'crush.' Everyone has been in a position where they were strongly attracted to a person and said person couldn't care less. The gays that I know occasionally complain that the guys they like don't like other guys and the ones that do don't seem interested in them.

From this perspective, it is not the heterosexuals that are being obsessive, but rather gays that are trying to shove their world view down other people's throats and calling anyone who disagrees a hater. Sounds familiar, doesn't it?

So demanding basic rights is shoving their view down others' throats. Their sexual preference has no bearing what-so-ever on your existence or mine. In the USA, their are economic benefits to being married. Why can't partners ensure that their significant other will be okay if something bad happens? If they decide to raise a family, why can't they share custody of their kids (these kids are generally unwanted by the predominantly heterosexual birth-parents, by the way)? Why do opposite-sex couples get this privilege while same-sex do not? In the USA, there is a supposed separation of church and state - so religious grounds cannot be used to deny same-sex couples the benefits they could get as opposite-sex couples in this country.

People hate what they fear, and they fear what they don't understand. Since most anti-gays don't understand homosexuals they initially fear and eventually hate them (In Africa being gay is punishable by death). This is why anti-gays are referred to as 'haters.'

Now, if you were raped by a homosexual after declining a sexual advance, then said homosexual can be described as 'forcing his views down others' throats.' However, many straight women would share your victim status but they were raped by straight guys (possible exceptions, but highly unlikely for obvious reasons)...

//\\0o//\\

 

[Callahan]

Gays always had the same right as other people.They always had the right to marry a woman they just didn't want to.What they ask is a special treatement and exclusive right to gay community.

 

[Nuclear]

Gays always had the same right as other people.They always had the right to marry a woman they just didn't want to.What they ask is a special treatement and exclusive right to gay community.

What a jester. People like you piss me off.

 

[GhostThruster]

Lesbians dont have the right to marry a woman

 

[Callahan]

Lesbians dont have the right to marry a woman

They can marry a man.

 

[Tal'Rarity]

They can marry a man.

Any smart woman would know that is a bad decision and should marry a woman. Especially with this current age definitely.

Point is, homophobic people are scared and insecure so much that they feel threatened and have to re-assure themselves by saying hateful things.

Don't be so scared, its not a bad or evil thing. Your the bad people in reality. If this was about ten years ago then you'd be saying this stuff near the same about darker colored humans.

When I brought up the animal kingdom it was to show you guys that it's natural and a way of life. Sure we're the dominate beast on the planet but we're the weirdest form of life on it at the same time. We don't follow like everything else does. Instead we do stuff we weren't born to do usually such as flying or swimming or going into space and considering we haven't really went far on that either.

 

[Gilles]

morals and religion should be kept separate

lol.

 

[GhostThruster]

but other people can marry women, why can't lesbians?

 

[GunSlinger]

Here's a pretty good read though.

 

[Nuclear]

Why bother rationalizing that the Bible doesn't forbid it, when we can just ignore the Bible?

 

[Karassu]

Man, it's like a Night Elf Ranger F-Bombs a Wisp. Whatta poor wisp.
(I bit lazy to put the Jon Tron meme so just imagine I put it here.)

 

[Vengeancekael]

Gays always had the same right as other people.They always had the right to marry a woman they just didn't want to.What they ask is a special treatement and exclusive right to gay community.

So wait, has any actual gay person joined in on this discussion? If not, maybe I should.

 

[GunSlinger]

Why bother rationalizing that the Bible doesn't forbid it, when we can just ignore the Bible?

Well Christians can't ignore it because it's the basis of their religion.

 

[GhostThruster]

Why bother rationalizing that the Bible doesn't forbid it, when we can just ignore the Bible?

but then we will go to hell where morgoth will consume our gay souls

So wait, has any actual gay person joined in on this discussion? If not, maybe I should.

maybe u shud stop asking for special treatment because jesus says no

 

[Tal'Rarity]

Why bother rationalizing that the Bible doesn't forbid it, when we can just ignore the Bible?

That'd be extremely stupid and ignorant. It's more of we should stop mis-reading it since we've done that for hundreds of years. I am pretty sure it doesn't forbid it.

 

[Karassu]

So Kael is gay? What kind of gay? I mean are you he-she or she-he or what?

 

[Tal'Rarity]

no, what'd be extremely stupid and ignorant is to determine what is morally acceptable based off a (highly likely fictional) book that pertains to only a certain group in an issue which is relevant throughout the entirety of humanity. we shudn't be reading it at all (in this context)

Find out at the end

Otherwise yeah I think this thread is rather useless unless Kael and certain others comment more.

 

[Deleted member 219079]

Cool that I've learned some argumenting in Philosophy

I unsubsribed this thread cuz it's stupid a while ago now I see it again ;D

So I wanna be against gays, now I try to make something sensible to back my opinion up:

"I dislike having sexual thoughts on someone that represents same sex as you, BECAUSE... um... cuz I can?"

There goes all my studying guise, try to defeat my argument "cuz I can" hueheue, get it, you can't? Because no one can say I can't!! I WIN

 

[GhostThruster]

oops accidentally deleted the comment while editing, eh u got it in quotes anyhow.
find wat out in the end?

-

go home, lay off that shit for a few weeks. ur munted af mate

 

[N.Knight]

if anybody has any doubts about animals being gay, visit a horse ranch\farm and ask them what happens if you keep two or more strapping studs together without any mares around.... xD

Takes a lot of phenol and an angry farm hand to clean the mess, can tell you that hahaha

 

[Deleted member 219079]

go home, lay off that shit for a few weeks. ur munted af mate

that's not a good argument XDD

I want better arguments to back up your statement "go home, lay off that shit for a few weeks. ur munted af mate"

 

[Tal'Rarity]

Cool that I've learned some argumenting in Philosophy

I unsubsribed this thread cuz it's stupid a while ago now I see it again ;D

So I wanna be against gays, now I try to make something sensible to back my opinion up:

"I dislike having sexual thoughts on someone that represents same sex as you, BECAUSE... um... cuz I can?"

There goes all my studying guise, try to defeat my argument "cuz I can" hueheue, get it, you can't? Because no one can say I can't!! I WIN

Actually we can all say your ignorant and rather rude and you win at that. What you don't understand you hate. Though yeah this thread is stupid. Well with your logic "cuz I can" You can't defeat my argument either. However if you dislike having thoughts on someone same gender as yourself then keep it to yourself and refuse the offers.

 

[chr2]

Otherwise yeah I think this thread is rather useless unless Kael and certain others comment more.

Considering some of the reactions this thread has already received, I wouldn't be surprised if those certain others wouldn't dare sharing their view points.

Going back to the Bible comments:
There is a verse in the Bible (Levictus 18) that says something along the lines of "Man shall not lie with men, as they do with women". But then again, the bible is, fortunately, open for interpretation. This could mean something entirely different.
Still, I find it mind-baffling why anyone bothers listening to a thousand year old book anyway, but that's just me.

I wanna end with a quote:
'I hate the word homophobia. It's not a phobia. You are not scared; you are an asshole.' - Morgan Freeman impostor

 

[Rui]

(...) Also it was scientifically proven that you can be born gay (...)

You shouldn't say this. I got trolled for 2 years the last time I did.

No, it doesn't. We're the only life forms with reason.

As I said already, looking at the animal kingdom is a terrible place to find evidence for morality.

Very well said

Gays always had the same right as other people.They always had the right to marry a woman they just didn't want to.What they ask is a special treatement and exclusive right to gay community.

Lol, smartass =P +rep

 

[Tal'Rarity]

I don't fear trolls, it's up to them to be jerks. Rui =)

The bible is one of the only books that actually makes any sense chr2. I myself know it isn't a lie however it is different for everyone.

I think the world should just wake up for once instead of being asleep for thousands of years as it still is currently. Though it's on the verge of waking up.

 

[Adaethus]

As a gay person, I find some of the comments on this thread really quite shocking...
I mean, what is there to discuss at this point?

 

[Deleted member 219079]

As a gay person, I find some of the comments on this thread really quite shocking...
I mean, what is there to discuss at this point?

I don't know if you're just testing us, I don't trust ppl on internet XD

The nazi mods on hive have taught me well - not to tell your own opinion if it differs from theirs - so I'm just gonna say it's great you're open about your sexuality !!!

 

[Adaethus]

What would I accomplish by "testing you"? o:

I'm openly gay.

 

[Vengeancekael]

Alright, there are a lot of arguments to back up my opinion that gay marriage is in no way actually harmful, but I'll just talk about one or two reasons since I don't wanna write too much.

I think the main thing humans struggle with and have been struggling with since centuries is tolerance, or actually intolerance.
The thing is, a lot of people say that humans are all equal in terms of rights - Something very logical and acceptable in my opinion. However, that doesn't mean that everyone has the same view on the world. Human opinions clash in every aspect of life, whether it's religion, skin color, etc.
What a lot of people don't understand is, they can have an opinion that may perhaps be seen as offensive or racist, but then tolerance comes into play - Do not voice your opinion on some matter when you're against it.
In this case, homosexuality (gay marriage) - The person is different from you because he likes people of the same gender, yet how could that possibly harm you? You should just take care of your own life and problems than to make a fuss over some "homo". It's your opinion, but the gay person also has his own opinion and with the fact that all humans are equal, you don't have the right/advantage of isolating that person and neglecting their opinion.

ALRIGHT I'M STARTING TO RANT HERE - Point is, keep your opinion to yourself, you don't have to change it, but just tolerate other humans around you.

Also, some people in this thread have said that gay marriage would devalue a straight person's marriage, because the gay couple would be in the same group as every other "married couple". That's a bit odd, because I doubt you would have gotten married in the first place because of some pride to uphold, but rather to create this stronger link in your relationship, which would thus not have anything to do with other married people.


/Well/, I just realized how bad I am at voicing my view on something. Heh. Ah well, this thread's been pretty hilarious.