Battle System: Need Suggestions

[Drunken_Jackal]

Hey guys, im here to ask for suggestions on a battle system. This is for an RTS map. Basically I need you to tell me which is better.

I have two options for battling units:
- Default Warcraft battling
- Unit Deployment.

Now let me explain unit deployment.

When you click the ability "Attack" in your primary structure, you are asked to select a target town or base. Once selected, you are brought to a battlefield to deploy your units and select where are they to be placed. Say you have 20 footman and you place them front. Then you have 25 priests at their backs then a couple of ranged units behind the priests.

The units are lined up in regions in the map. Each battle field has two sides for each player and 3 columns for the front, middle and back. Each row has sub-rows.

After lining the units up, you activate the "Battle" ability. Once you activate the battle ability, you need to wait for the other player to finish. Then, both units are ordered Attack-Move to opposite sides of the map. You may cast units abilities in-game.

So thats how it works. If you still dont find it clear, check the battle system for Medieval 2: Total War. Heres a youtube video for it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QT9ozEWNs5Y

Its almost the same as the games battle system. The only thing different is that units are not click and drag.

 

[Hexcellion]

Hmm... Using that system would be better, plus it would be original. Wait, let's make this clear.. The battle system you are implementing is like this: have units that auto attack enemies, but be able to use skills. You are able to use skills, but not move/attack using your units?

If that's so, then that's a good idea, maybe even disable controling of footmen, archers, etc.

Just use your hero, buff him/her up, boost your allies, and win, I guess.

(I can't watch the youtube vid because I'm using a slow internet here, so clearing the concept would be nice)

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Thanks for the suggestion. You responded to my VM

Hmm... Using that system would be better, plus it would be original. Wait, let's make this clear.. The battle system you are implementing is like this: have units that auto attack enemies, but be able to use skills. You are able to use skills, but not move/attack using your units?

Yes, after you cast a spell, say defend by the footman. After it, the unit is immediately ordered to Attack-Move. Also, abilities would be casted from a sort of Control Panel. You can switch from unit to hero view. All units at war would be unselectable.

If that's so, then that's a good idea, maybe even disable controling of footmen, archers, etc.

Just use your hero, buff him/her up, boost your allies, and win, I guess.

(I can't watch the youtube vid because I'm using a slow internet here, so clearing the concept would be nice)

Thanks
Well hero just sorta supports the army.

Also, ill add something up. You may choose to go forward and attack or stay back and defend.

 

[cleavinghammer]

Hmm...

I'd go with the standard method myself, if only because I find the key to winning battles is to take out units as fast as possible, that is to say, shoot them full of arrows one after the other. This system doesn't seem to make that possible, unless you include focus fire as a command for archers.

But if you can find a way to make it work, what kind of orders would you be able to give units?

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Well their orders would be:
Cast ability, Attack Ground/Area and Use Item.

 

[Hexcellion]

Hmm...

I'd go with the standard method myself, if only because I find the key to winning battles is to take out units as fast as possible, that is to say, shoot them full of arrows one after the other. This system doesn't seem to make that possible, unless you include focus fire as a command for archers.

But if you can find a way to make it work, what kind of orders would you be able to give units?

That's the point of deploying units into battle. Choosing the right units, and using the right skills at the right time, plus some luck would turn the battle around or would give you the win. That's why using this system would be nice, and be exciting to use.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Thanks Hexcellion

Also, random events might occur. Say rain. Rain gives movement speed drop. Also hail, which gives a small dps.

Events have a 5% chance.

 

[Hexcellion]

Thanks Hexcellion

Also, random events might occur. Say rain. Rain gives movement speed drop. Also hail, which gives a small dps.

Events have a 5% chance.

Yes, that would be nice. Those will effect the outcome of the battle. An event where reinforcements arrive would be good too. Plus a morale boost when you kill an important unit of the opponent, and a lost of courage for the opponent, +dmg for those who kill important units, and -dmg for those whose important units get killed.

Meaning: kill the captain of your enemy, get +dmg; get your captain killed, get -dmg.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Reinforcements coming is done by the player. When unit count reaches below x, auto reinforcements arrive. Also the influence would be good. Ill try that.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Bump guys

Just need suggestions.

 

[cleavinghammer]

Decoy commanders: units dressed in the general's distinctive armor in order to draw fire away from him. They look like commanders (same model, preferably with a helmet for obvious reasons), have the same amount of health and armor, but deal as much damage as a standard soldier. When killed, loss of morale is barely a fraction of what happens when the real commander dies.

Alternatively, when a decoy dies only those units close to him are affected, as the rest of the army can clearly see the "real" one commanding them, the dead guy must have been an imposter.

Ransom: a special bandit that can capture enemy units. The unit is either ransomed for money, returning to the battlefield once his owner pays (more expensive units get bigger rewards, but a higher chance of failure) or killed, demoralizing the unit's army (the better the unit the higher morale damage).

 

[Chiller]

How about having the ability to control groups of units in battle by making them attack move into a specific area,hold their position, pull back?
Instead of controlling each group/unit manually like in normal W3 battles, you send orders to your men with a commander. The commander's orders could also be slower to take effect the further the units are from him.
Also, i like the idea of the commander getting killed and nearby units losing morale when it happens. However it would be nice if it was similar to M2TW(medieval 2 total war) in the way that the commander is Also part of a group (in m2tw the commander was a part of his Bodyguard squad). In that way, the player could use the commander together with his bodyguards to crush the enemy, but if he did, he would risk his commander getting killed and his troops loosing morale.
Also, having the units gain/lose dmg might not be the best, maybe make it so when unit morale gets too low, they start fleeing the battle? If they manage to leave the battlefield, make it so a few of them come back to your castle/keep/whatever your base is, while the others desert.
Another thing you could also make is units stamina, make it so the units lose stamina when they walk/fight and with low morale they might attempt to run away.
If you provided a bit more detail about what you want your map to be about,how many players it can have, how hard/complex it already is and what other mechanics it got,i could probably give some better ideas.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Everything is made by the player, including the formation.
The only orders now are attack and defend.
Other orders would be nice, but I dont know how to do a mass movement.

Fleeing idea is nice. Ill implement it. Since its a Sci-Fi, stamina would be a no.

About the players, battles would only be 1v1.
There would be 4 - 6 players. The map would be a Sci-Fi RTS.
The terrain would also play an important role on fighting.

 

[Kanadaj]

DJ, you could also implement stationary artillery in this system with some degree of AoE attacks (not 100% accuracy!)

Also, you can also make attacks from the outside, like calling an orbital laser strike to target location for huge amounts of money.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Decoy commanders: units dressed in the general's distinctive armor in order to draw fire away from him. They look like commanders (same model, preferably with a helmet for obvious reasons), have the same amount of health and armor, but deal as much damage as a standard soldier. When killed, loss of morale is barely a fraction of what happens when the real commander dies.

Alternatively, when a decoy dies only those units close to him are affected, as the rest of the army can clearly see the "real" one commanding them, the dead guy must have been an imposter.

Ransom: a special bandit that can capture enemy units. The unit is either ransomed for money, returning to the battlefield once his owner pays (more expensive units get bigger rewards, but a higher chance of failure) or killed, demoralizing the unit's army (the better the unit the higher morale damage).

I already thought of that ransom, but instead of getting for money, you can reveal their base/formation.

Also decoys would be bad since its a sci fi.

DJ, you could also implement stationary artillery in this system with some degree of AoE attacks (not 100% accuracy!)

Also, you can also make attacks from the outside, like calling an orbital laser strike to target location for huge amounts of money.

Cool idea! Ill place that.

 

[cleavinghammer]

Scifi? Okay, replace "decoy" with "clone".

Kill sat sounds good, but maybe add weaker-but-cheaper versions like mercenary bombing and strafing runs on predetermined locations?

As for other orders, mass retreat should be implemented.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Yes, there will be mass retreat.

Cool! Bombing aounds nice. Maybe like vehicles which drop bombs.
Im also thinking of single orders. What do you guys say? Since there would be a suicidal unit.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Hey guys, I was thinking of adding Defensive structures. Defensive structures would be like the back line of the army, they would prevent units form reaching the primary structure (destroying the primary structure would be the only way to defeat/capture a base). If you cant imagine, I have attached an image.

Towers are placed by plotting them via abilities. Say cast ability 1, a structure is built. Abilities would be based off Build Great Hall.

Tell me if I should continue with the towers.

Black = Units
Blue = Towers
Red = Primary Structures
Green = Field

 

[cleavinghammer]

Including towers means you need a unit that can take them out, like catapults or a ram.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Siege units will definitely be there.

But since its a sci-fi it would be space vehicles.

 

[cleavinghammer]

Ah yes, keep forgetting that. In that case, replace catapults with artillery and rams with some kind of short-range mounted weapon that kills stationary targets in very little time (while allowing units to simply move out of the way).

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Nice idea there!

I was thinking of a suicidal unit to counter structures for an alien race. But this idea could be for the humans.

 

[cleavinghammer]

How many factions are there?

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Three. One human race, one Zerg-like race and one star race.

Human race has all ranged and slow units, but nice armor, they also have a splash damage ability. The zerg-like race has low armor, best attack and has armor depletion. The star race has many siege units. They use mana not gold to produce structures and make units. Units are made by transforming their builders. Has good armor but low attack.

 

[Kanadaj]

Sounds like you could add a little bit of Imperium Galactica 2 to it ^^

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Haven't heard of this game.

Ill check how it goes. But, the battle system is based on Total Wars battle system, from games such as Medieval 2: Total War

 

[Kanadaj]

IG2 has space and ground combat system, focus on its ground combat system when u look it up

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

I cant find a video on its gameplay. Can you just describe it to me?

 

[Kanadaj]

1st: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73Zl0xTuJWU This video is cut, but it should give a general idea

The battle system there works like:
-your ships equiped with tanks engage the planet
-they destroy enemy ships (if present), if there are defense units on the planet like interplanetary cannons they have to deal with them at the same time
-change to planetary view, you have to set the destination where your tanks will arrive through carriers (outside city)
-your tanks have to destroy every enemy tanks and forts
-if done, you can take control of the planet

you can also decide to destroy your planet instead of being taken with a building. It's useful if the enemy attacks you and your defense line is further back, so he cant take advantage of your factories

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Well battling would be in a planet not inter planetary.

So it might now work.

 

[Kanadaj]

apart from that, the way the siege is constructed could be transformed into a form that can suit your needs

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

That could work on the humans.

 

[cleavinghammer]

^^^ But the troop landing might. I think the ability to drop troops at a certain location could be a viable mechanic, like a control point representing a landing beacon that drops troops when required.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

I prefer built in points, for balancing and fair playing.

 

[cleavinghammer]

Okay, then just a drop system (equivalent to a spell, use it to drop a certain amount of troops on a preset area) that tells your opponent you used it.

 

[Drunken_Jackal]

Thats already implemented xD