Turalyon and Alleria

[Hardtime]

So... I've been curious where the two heroic lovebirds, Alleria Windrunner (Former Ranger Captain of Quel'thalas) and Turalyon (High General of the Sons of Lothar[formerly the Alliance Expedition]), have gone. Then I saw this thread over at the forums. Blizzard hinted that they might bring back these two into the next expansion. I mean, how great is that! By Elune's butt hair, that's actually the best news I've heard so far for the entire game post-Cataclysm. I just need some opinions from you guys since there are a lot, and when I say a lot, I really do mean a LOT of idiots out there who think Alleria and Turalyon would go neutral all the way if they do appear in-game. There are just about a million facts I can come up with about Turalyon and Alleria that clearly makes them more Alliance-aligned that neutral. Regardless of the changes both factions have gone through, I'm still pretty sure they're gonna remain Alliance.

Let's start of with Turalyon:

Argument

People say the Alliance that Turalyon has fought for is long gone. Well it's not. In fact, it's evolved and has opened it's arms to new races to ensure that justice and the codes of honor are upheld properly and without corruption. The thing is, CHILDREN think that Warcraft lore is all about war. Suggesting that Turalyon attacking a city full of innocent Tauren and Blood Elven children is so idiotic (post made by Svetylo in the forums) it makes me want to burn myself alive. The Alliance isn't about attacking straight forward and making aggressive moves. More so Turalyon. He wont become Neutral. I highly doubt Turalyon would openly speak with Orcs so plainly as if nothing bad happened during the First and Second Wars. If I recall correctly, it was Turalyon who was hurt the most by Lothar's death. Maybe he'd forgive and accept a few honorable Orcs such as green Jesus and Saurfang, but the entire race as a whole. Maybe he'd be like Varian who's buried all his hatred and loathing of Orcs within him, but never forgetting what happened in the past. As for the Forsaken, for crying out loud they're un-fucking-dead. Heh, even if I were a beacon and symbol of all that's honorable and holy, I'd just find the Forsaken wrong. He'd probably try to reclaim Lordaeron and Stromgarde along with Danath should he return. But I don't doubt Turalyon would pity these monstrous, well, monstrosities heh. For the Trolls and the Tauren, he may find them honorable. He might find the Blood Elves a bit ruthless and savage compared to the High Elves he remembered in his youthful days. He might reject them as a race because of what they've become. It's they're fault they became cursed, but it's how they're trying to cure the curse is their problem. Plus they fucking destroyed Theramore. Isn't that enough for crying out loud? As for the Goblins, even before the First and Second Wars began, Im sure most if not all humans loathe these annoying and talkative merchants. I mean they're just all profit. Point is, Turalyon is basically the physical representation of the Alliance as a whole. He'd never go neutral AND should he go Neutral, he'd be someone like Thrall who regularly speaks with both factions but deep inside, is still Horde-aligned.

Alleria:

Argument

Now Alleria's might be a little shorter than Turalyon's. The fact that she already hates Orcs for what they did to her homeland (the forest fire in the sacred part of Quel'thalas) and her family (the massacre of most of the Windrunner ancestry), she'd also hate the Forsaken Im sure of it. She might have pity on her sister for what she's become, but still wont accept the Forsaken with open arms because of their natural affinity with evil things and the whole 'secret plot' to wipe out Azeroth's races for Undead supremacy thing. As I've said in my previous argument, the Blood Elves have become ruthless and far too distrustful even for Alleria's personality. While all the while honorable, Alleria still has a deep hatred for Trolls. All Trolls to be more precise. Trolls are the one thing Alleria hates more than Orcs. The Tauren might be accepted because of their honorific deeds in history and their close ties to nature and the Light (well another form of the Light). Lastly, I know she very much hates Goblins. In general, arguing that Quel'thalas is no longer part of the Alliance is completely irrelevant. Alleria doesn't need Quel'thalas at all. For crying out loud, she's survived for at least 20 years in exile with nothing but scraps(probably) and you're gonna tell me she's gonna return to Quel'thalas and go neutral? There may be only a handful of high elves left but that's better than rotting corpses and a ruthless evolution of your former race. Not to mention a bad history with Orcs, Trolls, and Goblins.

Yeah I sure went through all this effort. It's just fucking retarded if Blizzard decides to kill off another two of Warcraft's greatest heroes. They alreadt ruined Hellscream for me. Please, green Jesus, if they turn these two into the shit they're coming up with now I swear to fucking Elune that I'd choke a bitch. I actually love both factions as hell but when it comes to lore, Im more into the Horde than into the Alliance. Though I do love all those wars and lore (Escape from Argus, War of the Three Hammers, War of the Ancients, Great Troll War, Split of the Arathor Kingdom, etc.) the Alliance races have but sadly those are pre-Alliance which doesn't count.

 

[Hjorleif]

Turalyon couldn't be neutral. If Blizzard decided to do that, they would once again completely ruin lore and go completely against a character's personality and personal lore. Turalyon was called the Silverhand, which had to do with his closeness with the Light. Orcs, despite not actually being the "bad guys" are affiliated with evil and/or darkness. You are right, Lothar's death really hurt Turalyon, that was like his mentor and father - that's something I highly doubt someone would forgive, especially with the things the Horde has done since then. As per each race, you're pretty much on track. Though, he would hate Trolls as much as Orcs since they were a major part of the Second War, he would detest Forsaken quite a lot.

Now of course, I am slightly biased as Turalyon is one of my favorite Warcraft characters - Grommash Hellscream being my absolute favorite and Thrall being a close second.

Alleria - I don't really care about if I'm honest. The other two Windrunner sisters kind of killed my outlook on that family as a whole. I mean, it would be pretty cool if she came back because regardless of my feelings towards her, she's a badass Troll killing machine. I'm more interested in what Danath Trollbane would do if his old friend Turalyon came back.

 

[Hardtime]

Yeah exactly my point. People on the forums think they know what these characters are like and what they've been through but they probably just read Turalyon's and Alleria's history on the spot while making the comment. God, it just annoys me that know-at-all children think they know what they're doing when in reality, they're just trying to act mature and all that shit.

And the Horde isn't bad nor are they the bad guys the Orcs aren't associated with any sort of evil in general though there have been encounters with ROGUE(not part of the Horde) Orcs who still worship the demons such as the old Burning Blade Clan who's still trying to revive their old religion. As for the Trolls, Turalyon wouldn't hate on them that much since the group of Trolls within the Horde now had nothing to do with Second War. The Trolls that fought during the war were the Forest Trolls under Zul'jin. The Trolls we know today are Jungle Trolls and this specific group is the most honorable out of all the groups. As for Alleria, it's impossible for her to go neutral. Point taken.

Ohhh Im also excited about what Danath would do. There would probably be some kind of expedition where Danath'll lead Alliance forces into reclaiming Stromgarde from the Forsaken, then a confrontation between the last of the Trollbane ancestry would take place between Danath and Galen. Then maybe the Forsaken would unleash some sort of plague against the invading Alliance forces then an all-out war would spark out again? Who knows? Or maybe, once we return from Draenor we find out that the Naga had managed to bring in the Legion into Azeroth. IDK, so much possible things to happen. God dammit if Blizzard doesn't give us something good I'd jump off a cliff.

 

[chr2]

Well, since this forum post is from MoP, that would mean that this 'next expansion' would be WoD. Interestingly, I had a theory back when WoD was originally announced that the portal Alleria and Turalyon escaped through when Draenor exploded was going to lead them to alternate-Draenor. If that turns out to be the case, and we meet them at some point during WoD, that would explain why Blizz chose to bring in Khadgar for this (with his current neutral status and his history with the two, Blizz could (ab)use him as the factor that would convince the two to become neutral). Obviously this is just a theory, and I feel like it'd be a bit too convenient for those two to show up in this very dimension and time that we also happen to be visiting, but I still can't help but feel that this is the type of crap Blizzard would pull (Khadgar in particular stands out to me. I'm a bit suspicious why they chose to use him now of all times).

Anyway, from a lorewise perspective I could never see those two being neutral, but for gameplay reason I am quite convinced they will be (or one would be Horde, the other Alliance, which is even worse). Blizzard seems to think that there has to be a balance with all decisions they make, so they wouldn't just pull out two of the most beloved characters in all of the lore and give them to the Alliance (even if that would be the more fitting option), unless the Horde got something equally awesome (and I can't possibly see what that would be).

 

[Razosh]

As for Alleria I somehow doubt she'll just be like, yep I'm going to color the lands of Quel'Thalas with the blood of my own people. You make it sound like the first thing Alleria's going to do is slaughter every Horde character in her path. And your argument that Quel'Thalas is irrelevant is inaccurate at best as they are part of the Horde. Also there are a few things about your arguments that I question. Alleria was quite known for hating orcs there's no doubt about that and she might very possibly do so still. That she hate trolls I have found no source for if you have one please share, she has fought the Amani but if she hates all troll tribes has yet to be revealed.

And if she's distrustful of the Blood Elves because they have absorbed fel magic then she could ask her sister just how easy it was to resist. In Night of the Dragon Vereesa is quite open with the fact that had she not had one of the most powerful mages helping her out she herself would have been a blood elf. In addition we do not know if her grandfather is a blood elf or high elf, considering statistical chance I would say blood elf. And vowing to fight and kill your grand father is not something you just decide in an instant. Your entire argument seems to be circulating around the fact that she hates orcs so much that anyone in an alliance with them even if it were her own people are equally guilty for the destruction of Quel'Thalas. And that is pretty unlikely considering that the leader for one of the races fought against the orcs during their invasion of Quel'Thalas.

We also have your claim that she'd be distrustful of the forsaken since they are undead... The forsaken undoubtedly has free will Lillian Voss is one example a second one is that players are allowed to do whatever they want and doesn't have to give two sh!ts about Sylvanas. And when Alleria meets Sylvanas and Sylvanas says "What would you want me too have done, slit my own throat as soon as I regained control, is what I look like really all that matters to you?" Do you expect there's any scenario where Alleria would say "Yes, you are no longer my sister!" Considering the fact that Vereesa obviously meant much to Sylvanas in War Crimes I do not think Alleria will see her sister as pure evil.

Blood Elves have become ruthless and far too distrustful even for Alleria's personality.

I am happy you brought this up. You think that the Blood Elves are ruthless? In patch 5.1 the sin'dorei attempted to rejoin the Alliance and Lor'Themar personally met up with King Varian. With this I can only assume that the high elves would have been welcomed back into Quel'Thalas as they too are members of the Alliance. How did the humans react to this? One of their highest ranked leaders used the actions of a few individuals to condemn the entire blood elf race. Even Varian thought she had gone mad, and you might say that was just the actions of Jaina but that argument is invalid as long as Varian allows her to keep her power and have an influence over the Alliance. We also had the human prince Arthas who got a bit mad and despite what you say if Alleria is trully the racist you depict her to be isn't she going to see him as a human? Then we had Garithos that was fun. The man who also condemned the sin'dorei to die, I'm just going to let Valeera Sanguinar speak here. "My whole race was nearly exterminated by the Scourge. Those who survived and fought in partnership with the Alliance were betrayed. Was it so wrong, then, to ally with Illidan and the naga... to save the few who remained?"

You so eagerly say that her hatred clouds her judgment and lets the actions of a few blind her vision for the entire race, but why then shouldn't the same happen for the Alliance races? What in your opinion makes the Alliance paragons of good judgment. As I see it the only way Alleria could ever side with the Alliance in a heart beat is if she does not even give the sin'dorei or Sylvanas (and potentially her grandfather) the chance to explain their point of view but just acts like a mindless brute, which is the argument she uses to hate orcs. So unless she is the biggest idiot on the face of Azeroth she's at least going to travel to Quel'Thalas to hear her people out before mindlessly starting butchering them. And yes maybe she wont strike directly at Quel'Thalas but it wount be long until she encounters her own people on the battle field.

I just need some opinions from you guys since there are a lot, and when I say a lot, I really do mean a LOT of idiots out there who think Alleria and Turalyon would go neutral all the way if they do appear in-game.

Now it's a bit hard to know what you mean with this one, do I think that they will be 100% neutral and that they don't have opinions of which side is more right, no. But I do believe that they will see the factions in black and white. Had it not been for the blood elves I would have agreed that any hope of them being neutral would have been ridiculous but seeing as her entire race is aligned with the Horde I think she's going to hear them out.



Alright that was Alleria. As for Turalyon he's a paladin of the Silver Hand and they are neutral. I'm sorry I have too much respect for them both to believe that their bigotry is going to just make them mindlessly join a cause they have no idea of what it is. Oh and lets not forget one tiny thing, the Alliance and the Horde are not actually in war, that is kind of required to be against someone.

 

[Zaramorus]

Well if we ever see them i guess it would in an Argus expansion. My theory is that they have just been captured by Burning Legion, but while think of it. How many years ago they went lost? Like 20 years ago. Turalyon is probably like a really old man now, but for alleria i dont know since elves live longer anyway. But Blizzard can make Turalyon look young i mean look at Khadgar. He is i think like 64 years old, but looks like 30.

 

[chr2]

Well if we ever see them i guess it would in an Argus expansion. My theory is that they have just been captured by Burning Legion, but while think of it. How many years ago they went lost? Like 20 years ago. Turalyon is probably like a really old man now, but for alleria i dont know since elves live longer anyway. But Blizzard can make Turalyon look young i mean look at Khadgar. He is i think like 64 years old, but looks like 30.

Khadgar was even aged with magic. Personally, I think he looks around 50-ish, but with Medivh's curse + the many years that passed since the spell was applied, he should look 100+ IMO.
Age shouldn't matter too much for Turalyon though. Look at Tirion - he's a badass Paladin even in his old age, and Turalyon is probably around his age, if not a bit younger.

 

[Sylvie]

Turalyon is a man who respects his enemies, and shows this. He would probably never have fought the Horde, had they not been as vile and aggressive as they were during the First and Second war. Since the influence of the Legion is over, this will probably not be the case in WoD, now that Garrosh is gone.
Turalyon is not the aggressive type, sorry to say guys, he fights when innocent blood is on the edge, he does not fight to conquer, and as such, he will probably be put as a more neutral character.
Alleria is a High Elf, or maybe a Blood Elf. She probably considers herself a High Elf still. But she is obiviously tainted by fel magic, how could she survive all this long without neither the Sunwell or fel?
Alleria surely wouldn't make herself fight neither of her kin, Blood Elf nor High Elf. So she too, will surely remain neutral, seeing as the Blood Elves are now allied with the Orcs, but not without reason, the Alliance have betrayed the Blood Elves, several times.

Yup, both of them will most likely go neutral, because their characters very much fits a neutral position.