The Islands

[Moderator]

00:11, 9th Sep 2011
Vengeancekael:
Status: Rejected

Memory leaks are not destroyed: Leaks tutorial

Contact Me

 

[Weyird]

Well, that was pretty interesting... I was quite impressed, except for the fact it's unplayable.

1) Font
Firstly - Whats the font? I loved it! I've read before that you can change the font, but i never realized it could make it look so much better!
2) Camera
I never knew you could have a "bird's eye" camera like that, it was interesting for a minute or so but pretty soon the camera seemed to sink into the ground, and i couldn't see much besides the sky below the ground (you know how world-editor works). And then it became impossible to move around at all.. I'd order to move up the hill, and he'd turn around and walk for miles in the opposite direction.. You mentioned there's other camera options, but there's no info anywhere on how to achieve this.
3) Miscellaneous Details
You should really put your name into the author slot of the map (at the moment it's sitting at "Unknown". Also, only one player can play but the game says suggested players - any.
4) "Known issue - Broken turtle shell icon."
I never got so far as to see this in game, since I quit after 2min and not having found more than 5 crabs, but have you imported the DISBTN icon, and made sure both the BTN and DISBTN have the correct imported paths?

EDIT: Btw you didnt need to add more crabs, its not that I couldn't find them, its that i gave up on the movement system at that point.

 

[waveseeker]

1) The font is Akbar, Google it. I saw it on my computer, and just thought "this would be so perfect.." and i had to use it. I'm glad you like it.

2) You are referring to the normal game camera... right? or the third person mode? and did you type "Help" at any time? the hill is a problem, that i leave to be fixed by the arrow keys. what is happening is the camera is underground, when you right-click where you want to go, you are clicking the transparent side of the ground right infront of the camera. not what you see. no way to fix that other then making third/first person camera looking straight down on you. if i did that, the first and third person cameras will have no use.

At any time, you can type "Help" and it will tell you what to do.

3) Oh, thanks for the tip. it's fixed now.

4) it doesn't have a DISBTN slot... just the Art - Interface Icon

Lastly, how is it unplayable? there are tons of crabs... around 20... before i added more.
and why was it rejected...? Kobas, please explain?

 

[-Kobas-]

There wasn't author name at first place. DISBTN icons have wrong path. No quest log ingame (no credits, hints and so on).
1st person camera isn't really great. (Can lag on high ground).

 

[waveseeker]

Name is fixed. DISBTN there isn't a visible option to fix it, and loads of maps here have broken DISBTN icons... i have a quest log, the credits are in the beginning. what says i need hints/credits in the quest log? everyone sees the credits in the beginning. and you can always type "help". yeah, 1st person camera can lag, but thats why there is multiple cameras. i only made camera 3 for the players enjoyment. it's an addition...

anything else?

 

[-Kobas-]

Pending once again, please do not make same errors again.
Good luck with project. Have a nice day.

 

[Weyird]

OK here goes attempt 2 at playing it:

Rant

1) Noticed there's no map description... Also, the title has a full stop after it? Looked a bit weird
2)I started off, and typed "help", nothing. "-help"... Nothing. I tried with info, tips, and any other information yielding request i could think of, with and without a line in front. Oh well, nothing... Guess I have to get used to this system of movement...
3) MOVEMENT: I had a long rant typed out here, but realized there's not much you're going to change about it anyway.. But could you reduce the angle turned with the side arrows to less than 90 degrees? And is there NO way you could just raise the camera viewpoint in 1st person? It really is a bit hard moving when your point of view is 3cm above the ground (usually), sometimes below the ground, and other times it seems to be flying at above tree level... Oh, and when the game starts, trigger so that the hero is selected at start.. Maybe inform players on load screen them that arrow keys and right click can be used for movement, instead of having them fumble around, getting annoyed at start. Moving on (no pun intended...)
4) So i collected my crabs (lol), brought them back to mr shaman guy... Clicked the shaman, tried getting REALLY close in his personal space.. Quest didnt want to end.. But i kept hearing that "shop" sound, so by a fluke i thought of selling it into his shop, and that worked.. I checked and the quest said bring it back to his shop, but not the selling it into it part.. Either make that more clear, or just let it trigger when you get into the area.
5) OK, so i sold the crabs and.... nothing... Click the shaman guy, ran a distance away and came back (which is a mission because of the movement, kept having to go make massive circles) and finally it decided to give me another quest.. still not sure if it's from seriously invading his personal space, or clicking him repeatedly. I had this problem with a lot of quest givers, i think it triggers from coming in range but it's really close.. Could you increase the detect range on all quest receives please?
6) OK now I've got to collect lumber. I'm now getting annoyed because I don't know why I'm doing this stuff. No story, not even any game or quest text resembling a conversation, or him even simply telling me, i have to open my quest log and it just says "so and so wants this"... OK, so off i go hunting for lumber... Found the first one and it gave me 3, i was so happy, thinking "OK it gives multiple at a time, this'll be quick".. The second 1 i found but the floating text wasn't in my fiend of view so i didn't know how much i had, and then i found my 3rd 1 and i now had 12, or something.. Then began the long, incredibly arduous process of trying to find a 4th stack. After roaming around for about 20min, swearing at the movement system and the horrible camera and nearly quitting (btw, during this time i realized my lumber showed how much lumber i had, lol. Oh well, noob me). By some fluke, while the camera a wild swing as i tried to get somewhere else i saw the 4th stack... then had to make about seven very wide circles before i could get it back in my field of view.. OK, heading back to mr shaman.
7) "15 lumber collected, head back to bla bla".. the floating text didnt disappear and followed me around everywhere...
8) OK now I need to go find a friend? No quest info on where, or what to look for? No story info on why, except that he was looking for you? I see it now... Mr Shaman: Yes, you came to me for help regarding the BIG THREATENING STORM, but your friend is looking for you, so go play now " So i begin my quest to look for ANYTHING that might look different.. Thank heavens i've more or less accepted the movement and camera by now...
9) OK so he wants to go kill the native wildlife? No problem, i ran into them earlier when I was looking for lumber and they attacked me, so I've got a grudge.. But i have no idea why we should be doing this, got that storm to worry about, remember? I noticed i had a sudden "switch heroes" ability... BTW, the ability name says "S|witch".. Anyway, i tried walking but walked into some trees accidentally, silly murloc, and it did it in one of those periods when my camera was above tree level.. suddenly i couldn't move! Oh noes! "You have collected 15 wood, bla bla" floating across my vision as i turned wildly. Thankfully i noticed some random spikes at the bottom of the screen and realized my follower had trapped me in, so i use the nifty switch ability and go kill the turtles. (BTW, you don't have a DISBTN for the ability properly imported, when i pause i get a green block)
10) Nice models for the turtle shells! But they have no icon.. That's because you imported the turtle skin for the item, but you didnt add an icon to the item (i'm sure). Oh well, no big deal. I was a little worried becuas ei switched characters randomly and the turtle shells were divided between my heroes and i couldnt drop them, but it didnt seem to matter. OK, collected 5 and killed a few more turtles (grudge, remember) and off I go back to Mr shaman, because by now i am assuming he's the guy to return to for everything. Oh hey, he gave me 1 gold for the shells (this time without having to sell them to shop) and tells me to build my shelter. Yay. Ah, now i see why i needed turtle shells - shelter seems to be made from it.. OK, now i need to warn pplz.. Stupid friend kept following me around thou annoyingly.
11) OK the stupid murlocs on this island are stupid. "Please let save your own life and HIDE", "No! I'll only save my own life if you do something for me!" At this point in time I'd say screw you and go save myself, but lonely life is lonely... and i do their quests... and Well, the blue frog one was funny.. But now iv got to go plant magical seeds... I know the hill he's talking about, i went up it when i was looking for lumber, but where are these magical seeds? so i head to mr shaman because by now i just KNOW he's got the answers.. but he doesnt. He just sits there with a "?" above his head.. OK, let me head to the hill and, oh yay, the quest log says i must return to that murloc... Where the hell was he?!?! Not even a ping on the minimap to remind me... So i wander around for a few more minutes hoping to randomly find him, and i think i did, but there was no text... Randomly checking the quest log to see if maybe somewhere along the line helpful text arrived and, oh wait, it says quest completed.. Bugger.... Didnt even say thank you.
OK, now i see i must go warn this one guy's brother on the north part of island.. Would that be the main island, or the other island to the north? Well, i wander around and on the northern island i find a murloc with some punctuation over his head... I invade his personal space, i click on him multiple times... nothing. Is this the brother? Is it another quest giver that wont give me a quest because i'm busy with one? OK well screw you too, mr murloc, so i wander around for a bit more and i must have come back to the quest giver because randomly i notice my quest is complete.. so that was the brother, right? Oh well, after the seed quest i got some text about taking murloc home, i think it was the friend.. so i take him to my shelter... OK, apparently not that.. Where did i find him again? I think it was the south islands so i wander there... Oh yes, ok, quest completed... and murloc friend runs all the way to my shelter?! Uh, ok... No quest information, but i assume Iv got to go talk to Mr shaman, because apart from the one let-down, he's always been the guy to talk to. So i go to him and, we0, a storm. That looks pretty cool btw. OK, so he hides in MY shelter? OK then, guess I'll follow suite...
12) "Cannot load target"... Well SCREW YOU TOO! Apparently i went around saving EVERYONE ELSE but now there's no more space in MY shelter!! I couldn't figure out what to do here, so finaly i quit... and started typing this rant... /rant

EDIT: OK, since that post yesterday was a bit aggro, here's a nicer summery:
1) I did really want to like it, the movement and camera is just frustrating.
2) Give directions on how to play (movement, etc) and what the commands are for changing camera, etc, on the load screen (If you need load-screen space, you can move the credits to an optional quest - i noticed all the quests are Required)
3) Have the hero selected when the game starts
4) Give a bit more info on the quests. "His house can be found on the southern island", etc. Some more flavour added to the quests would also be nice, would make players WANT to do the quest more.
5) I suggest using quest messages instead of floating text. Play a few levels of any warcraft campaign, quest messages and quest updates are done nicely in there. Also, the "15 lumber collected" floating text not going away bug - although i assume if you switch away from floating text then that will no longer be an issue.
6) Increase "Unit comes within range" detection range when approaching quest givers

 

[waveseeker]

Okay, so first things first. Thank you for playing so much, and dealing with the flaws to help me! i really appreciate that. also, i think your player is bugged or something, there are LOADS of quest updates and transmissions... i have no clue why you don't see them... i have a photo album on here, you can see them on that. and i JUST played it, and it works for me... also, to change cameras, you type "camera 1" "camera 3" and "camera off".

Q&A

1) Noticed there's no map description... Also, the title has a full stop after it? Looked a bit weird
yeah, thanks for pointing that out... fixed now. and full stop removed.

2)I started off, and typed "help", nothing. "-help"... Nothing. I tried with info, tips, and any other information yielding request i could think of, with and without a line in front. Oh well, nothing... Guess I have to get used to this system of movement...
in the beginning, you see a Quest update telling you to type "Help1" "help2" and "help3" or "help" and it makes a new quest update. the reason you think it does nothing, is because you can't see the quest updates for some reason...

3) MOVEMENT: I had a long rant typed out here, but realized there's not much you're going to change about it anyway.. But could you reduce the angle turned with the side arrows to less than 90 degrees? And is there NO way you could just raise the camera viewpoint in 1st person? It really is a bit hard moving when your point of view is 3cm above the ground (usually), sometimes below the ground, and other times it seems to be flying at above tree level... Oh, and when the game starts, trigger so that the hero is selected at start.. Maybe inform players on load screen them that arrow keys and right click can be used for movement, instead of having them fumble around, getting annoyed at start. Moving on (no pun intended...)
the angle doesn't turn in quarters. it goes as long as you hold it, it's a pretty weak trigger system... the only reason it's in my map, is because it's a good way to get unstuck. with the viewpoint, i can't really change the angle of attack much, but i raised the camera, so your a bit taller, i can't do much of that either, because you will tower over everyone...now you will almost never see under the ground, i say almost never, because i have not seen below ground level yet.
The hero is now selected at the beginning. Thanks.
it's not at the load screen where they are informed. it's at the opening screen. another Quest update.

4) So i collected my crabs (lol), brought them back to mr shaman guy... Clicked the shaman, tried getting REALLY close in his personal space.. Quest didnt want to end.. But i kept hearing that "shop" sound, so by a fluke i thought of selling it into his shop, and that worked.. I checked and the quest said bring it back to his shop, but not the selling it into it part.. Either make that more clear, or just let it trigger when you get into the area.
It is more clear in the transmission from him...
5) OK, so i sold the crabs and.... nothing... Click the shaman guy, ran a distance away and came back (which is a mission because of the movement, kept having to go make massive circles) and finally it decided to give me another quest.. still not sure if it's from seriously invading his personal space, or clicking him repeatedly. I had this problem with a lot of quest givers, i think it triggers from coming in range but it's really close.. Could you increase the detect range on all quest receives please?
I made them separate triggers, i don't remember why, anyway, i fixed it now. it's in the same trigger now. also, the reason it took you so long to get the next quest, is because he was talking... with transmissions... i also change the detection range from 200.00 to 250.00 and in the end, where you tell people to hide, it's now 300.00 instead of 200.00

6) OK now I've got to collect lumber. I'm now getting annoyed because I don't know why I'm doing this stuff. No story, not even any game or quest text resembling a conversation, or him even simply telling me, i have to open my quest log and it just says "so and so wants this"... OK, so off i go hunting for lumber... Found the first one and it gave me 3, i was so happy, thinking "OK it gives multiple at a time, this'll be quick".. The second 1 i found but the floating text wasn't in my fiend of view so i didn't know how much i had, and then i found my 3rd 1 and i now had 12, or something.. Then began the long, incredibly arduous process of trying to find a 4th stack. After roaming around for about 20min, swearing at the movement system and the horrible camera and nearly quitting (btw, during this time i realized my lumber showed how much lumber i had, lol. Oh well, noob me). By some fluke, while the camera a wild swing as i tried to get somewhere else i saw the 4th stack... then had to make about seven very wide circles before i could get it back in my field of view.. OK, heading back to mr shaman.
there is story line there, there is reason. it's in transmissions and quest updates... there is lumber on the south and west islands. it says that in the quest updates... each piece gives you 3 lumber. so you will need five bundles. there are 8 in game. i will move them out a little more, to make sure you can find them. the spinning and stuff is what the arrow keys are for... to un-stuck you. it's why i have two ways to move, and three camera systems.

7) "15 lumber collected, head back to bla bla".. the floating text didnt disappear and followed me around everywhere...
it didn't? thats really odd... always does for me...
8) OK now I need to go find a friend? No quest info on where, or what to look for? No story info on why, except that he was looking for you? I see it now... Mr Shaman: Yes, you came to me for help regarding the BIG THREATENING STORM, but your friend is looking for you, so go play now " So i begin my quest to look for ANYTHING that might look different.. Thank heavens i've more or less accepted the movement and camera by now...
Again, blame the fact that you don't see the quest updates or transmissions... it's there. and so is "help"

9) OK so he wants to go kill the native wildlife? No problem, i ran into them earlier when I was looking for lumber and they attacked me, so I've got a grudge.. But i have no idea why we should be doing this, got that storm to worry about, remember? I noticed i had a sudden "switch heroes" ability... BTW, the ability name says "S|witch".. Anyway, i tried walking but walked into some trees accidentally, silly murloc, and it did it in one of those periods when my camera was above tree level.. suddenly i couldn't move! Oh noes! "You have collected 15 wood, bla bla" floating across my vision as i turned wildly. Thankfully i noticed some random spikes at the bottom of the screen and realized my follower had trapped me in, so i use the nifty switch ability and go kill the turtles. (BTW, you don't have a DISBTN for the ability properly imported, when i pause i get a green block)
Mar'karn gives you two large transmissions on why you are doing it... And thanks for the tip on S|witch. i keep forgetting to add the r...and as for the icons, i had no idea on how to fix it, but i did some google work, and figured it all out. it's in the PATHING! not the obj editor! anyways, it's fixed now.

10) Nice models for the turtle shells! But they have no icon.. That's because you imported the turtle skin for the item, but you didnt add an icon to the item (i'm sure). Oh well, no big deal. I was a little worried becuas ei switched characters randomly and the turtle shells were divided between my heroes and i couldnt drop them, but it didnt seem to matter. OK, collected 5 and killed a few more turtles (grudge, remember) and off I go back to Mr shaman, because by now i am assuming he's the guy to return to for everything. Oh hey, he gave me 1 gold for the shells (this time without having to sell them to shop) and tells me to build my shelter. Yay. Ah, now i see why i needed turtle shells - shelter seems to be made from it.. OK, now i need to warn pplz.. Stupid friend kept following me around thou annoyingly.
Thanks! i made the shells myself with a simple edit of the bundle of lumber and a turtle...
i have the icon on the item, yet it still gives me trouble, no clue why...sorry that he annoys you...

11) OK the stupid murlocs on this island are stupid. "Please let save your own life and HIDE", "No! I'll only save my own life if you do something for me!" At this point in time I'd say screw you and go save myself, but lonely life is lonely... and i do their quests... and Well, the blue frog one was funny.. But now iv got to go plant magical seeds... I know the hill he's talking about, i went up it when i was looking for lumber, but where are these magical seeds? so i head to mr shaman because by now i just KNOW he's got the answers.. but he doesnt. He just sits there with a "?" above his head.. OK, let me head to the hill and, oh yay, the quest log says i must return to that murloc... Where the hell was he?!?! Not even a ping on the minimap to remind me... So i wander around for a few more minutes hoping to randomly find him, and i think i did, but there was no text... Randomly checking the quest log to see if maybe somewhere along the line helpful text arrived and, oh wait, it says quest completed.. Bugger.... Didnt even say thank you.
OK, now i see i must go warn this one guy's brother on the north part of island.. Would that be the main island, or the other island to the north? Well, i wander around and on the northern island i find a murloc with some punctuation over his head... I invade his personal space, i click on him multiple times... nothing. Is this the brother? Is it another quest giver that wont give me a quest because i'm busy with one? OK well screw you too, mr murloc, so i wander around for a bit more and i must have come back to the quest giver because randomly i notice my quest is complete.. so that was the brother, right? Oh well, after the seed quest i got some text about taking murloc home, i think it was the friend.. so i take him to my shelter... OK, apparently not that.. Where did i find him again? I think it was the south islands so i wander there... Oh yes, ok, quest completed... and murloc friend runs all the way to my shelter?! Uh, ok... No quest information, but i assume Iv got to go talk to Mr shaman, because apart from the one let-down, he's always been the guy to talk to. So i go to him and, we0, a storm. That looks pretty cool btw. OK, so he hides in MY shelter? OK then, guess I'll follow suite...
yeah, they are pretty dumb, it was half intentional. and when you type help, it gives you help with each of the four quests in that stage, and it pings the mini map... and the whole game, there is text, there is storyline, you just are not seeing it, and i have no clue why...
he says thank you, and the brother talks to you, i promise!
as soon as you finish the 4th quest, be it the blue frog, the brother, the seeds, or the escort, you get this transmission: "i think that our time is up! lets go tell everyone to take shelter!"
For that quest, before you can enter, you must get all 8 of the murlocs from the islands into the bunker, basically, you need to walk up to everyone you have spoken to. (okay, ONE guy you never talk to, but he's right next to the brother quest giver.)




12) "Cannot load target"... Well SCREW YOU TOO! Apparently i went around saving EVERYONE ELSE but now there's no more space in MY shelter!! I couldn't figure out what to do here, so finaly i quit... and started typing this rant... /rant
The bunker is no longer yours, it is player 10's. so that all the light blue units can run into it. once you get all 8 of them you can enter it. you didn't get all 8, but you also didn't know, so i REALLY don't blame you for the rant. and i thank you for it. knowing but bugs people, or makes them laugh helps a LOT in the long run.

EDIT: OK, since that post yesterday was a bit aggro, here's a nicer summery:
1) I did really want to like it, the movement and camera is just frustrating.
"camera 1" puts you in First person. "camera 3" puts you in third person. "camera off" turns off the camera, sort of. it makes it so the camera is locked to your unit, but it's normal WC3 camera mode.
2) Give directions on how to play (movement, etc) and what the commands are for changing camera, etc, on the load screen (If you need load-screen space, you can move the credits to an optional quest - i noticed all the quests are Required)
it doesn't need to be on the load screen, i swear, as soon as the 3 second opening cinematic is over, it pops up. i have posted a few pictures in the description here to show you. it has help on movement. camera, and tells you you can ALWAYS hit "help" for additional help.
3) Have the hero selected when the game starts
Done.
4) Give a bit more info on the quests. "His house can be found on the southern island", etc. Some more flavour added to the quests would also be nice, would make players WANT to do the quest more.
here is a quote, from when you type "help" when you need to do that quest... : Bring the Murloc that is following you down the mountain and to his Hut at the south side of the southmost village." kind of creepy how close you were. i am not sure what else i can do to add the "flavor"
5) I suggest using quest messages instead of floating text. Play a few levels of any warcraft campaign, quest messages and quest updates are done nicely in there. Also, the "15 lumber collected" floating text not going away bug - although i assume if you switch away from floating text then that will no longer be an issue.
once again, there are TONS of Quest updates in there. and the floating text bug, i am not seeing...
6) Increase "Unit comes within range" detection range when approaching quest givers[/QUOTE]
Fixed. Thanks.


All in all, Thank you for the time, and rage. it helps me make the game better. i know, that the first person camera sucks balls. and so does the arrow key system. but i ONLY have that in there, for people who want it. do you have an instant messenger, or better yet, a skype account? we can work together to figure out why you can't see the transmissions or the quest updates?
oh, and Map updated.

 

[InfernalTater]

I just played your map, and it looked like it did have potential, and would be very fun to play when finished, however many aspects of your map simply made it boring to play.
Camera issues. When standing on a hill, you cannot see the ground below you. You could either 1: Allow up/down arrow keys to tilt your screen, or 2: Download a better system (camkeyboardmovementsys) which automatically tilts the screen up and down hills. This system also provides for smoother movement. This would also solve another issue: Camera goes beneath ground at some height levels.
Rather boring gameplay. You need to add in a bit more action. For example, the first quest of gathering crabs is rather boring, as is the second quest of gathering lumber. You could make the crab quest more interesting by having the crabs be hostile units with the wander ability. You could make them reasonably weak, taking only a couple of hits to knock them out, then netting them, turning them into an item which picks them up. They would deal low damage, say, 5-6. This would still be an easy quest, but at least it would be less boring.
Also, running through a forest, carrying a sword, searching for bundles of lumber seems somewhat silly. Why not attack a tree, cut it down, and gain lumber?
Another thing I noticed was that your trees hovered above the ground. Make sure to page-down your trees; sink them into the ground.
It also annoyed me that you made the camp AI unrealistically powerful. I often see games such as yours which gives camp AI 150,000 health, as yours did... I suggest lowering their health to no higher than 2,000. If you don't want them to die, just give them high health regeneration.
The turtles seemed somewhat weak. I suggest that you either power them up or power the hero down. It would probably be better to power the hero down. Lowering the damage would make the fights long and tedious, rather than more challenging, so I suggest either lowering the heroes maximum health or lowering the amount of health gained from strength. Lowering the health gained from strength would most likely be the best solution; lower it from 25 to 15, causing the hero's health to lower from 475 to 325. The game would still be very easy; you should still increase the turtle damage from 6-10 to 8-12. Even then, the game would be extremely easy, but hey, it's the first level, that's ok. Just, keep things interesting.
I also believe it would improve your map if, at the start, it would tell you how to obtain and turn in quests. This is important, and a player shouldn't need to enter a command to learn it. Entering chat commands in a RPG-ish map pulls the player out, ruining the feel of the game.
Also, I gathered 15 lumber pieces, returned to the quest giver, and nothing happened. I tried right clicking him repeatedly, left clicking him, right clicking and left clicking the shop, and such. You need to make it more obvious how to turn a quest in.
As for the lack of a build animation, you should either use the in-game murgul worker model and 1: import a custom texture to make it look like your main character, 2: open the model and swap it's textures and re-import it, or 3: deal with the way the murgul worker looks.
As for the turtle icon: Change the paths, it isn't hard to make DISBTN icons work. I'll even do it for you if you won't do it yourself.
As for the human sound set: Change it in the game interface...
On the side note, your forum description, in the Extra Pictures hidden, you have an extra