Gaias 1.2B(8) released: Introducing the Soul Vault!

[Zwiebelchen]

Download from the maps section,
here.

Updated Extension folder containing the legendary Soul skins will follow as soon as I finished uploading it.

As always, please report any bugs you find.

BUGFIXES/GENERAL:
- New Feature: Souls
- Souls and Soul Vaults are imported on a seperate (account-bound) load code and can be shared between multiple characters
- Only one Vault load per game
- Vault, once loaded, can not be "repicked"
- Vault autosaves whenever a hero is saved
- Saving will now process a HTML file instead of a raw .txt, to improve readability
--> if asked for a confirmation about activating script plugins upon opening these HTML files, confirm it and add this folder to any whitelists regarding scripts
--> this script is not dangerous and will only pre-select the savecode so that you can copy it to your clipboard faster

- Improved performance for Shattering Glacier
- Fixed a bug with AoE of Battering Ram not getting calculated correctly
- Increased damage of Battering Ram, but changed targeting to first-in-aggro
- Added a better visible effect to Frostbite
- Increased base damage of BETA Boss

 

[SHBlade]

Damn I have to wait till friday to test it

 

[WhiteFang]

Just download it

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

Once again, loading into the new version will magically change your accessory. This can easily be avoided by the player in the same way as before: save in earlier version with your accessory in backpack or stash.

The HTML is awesome. Now we just need to the copy button added there and we're good to go for basic functionality.

 

[Jumbo]

As Demon said, this accessory item problem is slightly annoying.

Where is this vault thing btw, cannot seem to find it anywhere.

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

Is it intended that the souls only get exp from mobs within range? Just like heroes? So we have to start new heroes to level our souls?

Also, can you tell us if there are "better" souls to find or are they all just different but equal?

 

[Jumbo]

And now we really need some real content so lvl 50 chars can lvl their souls without resorting to bosses. =)

EDIT: or maybe we misunderstand the system. Well, some information on how to level the souls up would be appreciated.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Once again, loading into the new version will magically change your accessory.

I didn't even change the savecodes. You should be able to -load chars from 1.2B(7) without using -comp at all.

As Demon said, this accessory item problem is slightly annoying.

I can't fix this retroactively. Changing it would mean that all your *current* codes would malfunction in the same way. I rather break perfect compatibility with -comp than with -load.

Where is this vault thing btw, cannot seem to find it anywhere.

The vault unlocks as soon as you find (and absorb) your first soul.

Souls drop randomly from outdoor creeps, bosses, dungeon mobs throughout the entire level range. It is very possible to find great souls even in your first levels.
Of course, Bosses have higher drop chance and a higher chance to find higher quality levels (blue or legendary), than normal mobs; however, that does not mean that the souls obtained from bosses are superior to normal ones (if they have the same quality level).

Is it intended that the souls only get exp from mobs within range? Just like heroes? So we have to start new heroes to level our souls?

Yes. They get the same amount of XP from kills as your hero. The level of the soul does not matter for this, so it's perfectly possible to level a soul to level 50 by just playing lowlevel chars. So basicly, the rule of thumb is: if your hero gains XP, so do your (activated) souls. Inactive souls don't get any XP though.
This was designed as an additional incentive to help lowlevel players or to do something other than just grinding endgame bosses ("So... I already have a maxlevel Crusader, but at least I gain soul XP by rolling a new squire to help these guys").

I also highly encourage players to build up a certain etiquette for dealing with souls, i.e. leaving them for players that already have all gear from one boss or are required to play a char they don't want to play due to group performance reasons.

Souls will not get XP from completing quests. This is intentional to prevent players from leveling their souls unusually fast by remaking lowlevel chars constantly.

Also, can you tell us if there are "better" souls to find or are they all just different but equal?

There are 3 quality levels of souls:
Green (2 stats), blue (3 stats) and legendary (3 stats + aura effect).
Note that souls *can* have one stat with doubled weight, so don't go crazy if you happen to find a blue soul with just two stats... one of them has a higher quantity in this case.

The stats of these souls are randomly selected after a certain ruleset. It adds a kind of gambling aspect to the game and the possibility to always have room to improve by just finding new souls and hoping for better stat combinations.

Remember that soul vaults can be shared across all your characters... if you so happen to find a soul that grants SP as an assassin, maybe your twink will love it.

Also, Soul Vault slots are limited to 5 currently, with the possibility to upgrade to 7 in the future. If 5 slots turn out to be too restrictive in it's current design, I can give out that vault upgrade for free when a player reaches level 50 with one character.
But so far, it was planned to have these vault upgrades as raredrops or quest rewards of future content.



I hope you guys like this new system. It is basicly the Gaias flavour of random-loot with some customizability added on top.

 

[Jumbo]

Well that makes sense. Now we just need proper high lvl area to be released fast. The soul system is very cool and a good addition for enjoying other aspects than boss farming. However, the game is still very short and lacks a real challenge - something that will be addressed with the new bosses (judging from the already quite powerful Yeti).

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Well that makes sense. Now we just need proper high lvl area to be released fast. The soul system is very cool and a good addition for enjoying other aspects than boss farming. However, the game is still very short and lacks a real challenge - something that will be addressed with the new bosses (judging from the already quite powerful Yeti).

Btw, I did some big adjustments to the BETA boss.
Make sure to give it a re-assessment.

 

[Jumbo]

Yeah, I noticed from the changelog. Sounds great ! I am always for making things harder =). And the fix to glacier is much appreciated (though haven't tested the boss yet in this ver).

 

[BoxOfFaith]

Yeah even -load causes the accessories to bug out, kinda weird.

Anyway this soul system seems great

 

[edo494]

I see you got very good color on the html, a lot better than the green one

 

[BoxOfFaith]

Do higher level bosses have increased chance of dropping souls over lower leveled bosses?

 

[Jumbo]

Yes apparently.
What I know (as in 100% fact) is that the highest quality souls (legendary) cannot drop from D1 and below. I dunno about lvls - i.e. when it actually starts dropping - after that but at least that info keeps you from farming starting area for legendary souls

 

[BoxOfFaith]

Assigning bosses in D3 the highest chance at legendary souls would be a good incentive to run that dungeon :^).

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Yeah even -load causes the accessories to bug out, kinda weird.

Keep me posted about this.
If it happens with a 1.2B(8) code loaded into (8) and not just a 1.2B(7) code into (8), then message me.

 

[Jumbo]

Since it seems likely that you'll release a new version soon how about adding the change to recruiter quest that we talked about in the process ? ;-)

EDIT: Also I suggest adding the mentioned 7 slot limit increase for lvl 50 since 5 is a small amount for 2 different things and so many classes. I'm not saying that one should be able to have a soul for every build and situation, but 7 is probably the sweet spot (at lvl 50).

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

Really? I think 4 souls is sufficient. 1 Set each for casters and attackers, with 1 slot open to check new souls. I prefer having the extra slots being accessible by doing higher quests, or bought with tokens, as originally planned.

 

[Jumbo]

I suppose you mean 5 and not 4.

Either way, there are lots of different souls and 7 limit will just allow you 3 sets + 1. For players who have +4 chars maxed this is much needed. Take different builds on the same chars and you have probably 30 souls that could be great to have. Hence the 7 slot on lvl 50 makes sense.

Finally, wh the immense amount of souls in the game, 7 slot limit will not be too much in that regard either

 

[BoxOfFaith]

Eh, 5 is kinda too few.

Defensively we would ideally have one with threat reduction (Physical DPS), one with spell haste (casters), and one for actual tanky characters.

Offensively.. We could probably use a different one for every character, but even just breaking it down to Healing caster, Offensive caster, Crit build, Normal physical DPS increases etc.

While on this topic, would it be possible to save just our vaults without our characters? Or perhaps a -savevault2 option? Currently if we just do our normal save, it'd overwrite our current vault code, so even if we wanted to create a second vault for excess space it'll be a bit tedious.

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

I just don't like the idea of all players having everything, doesn't that seem bland to you people? Having fewer slots for this would allow more individuality in the game. You don't need to have a soul for every situation, you just need souls that cater to your taste.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

The thing with having too few vault slots by default would be that players basicly circumvent the limit by maintaining 2 vault code bases...

... so I might aswell increase the limit to 7 to encourage players to handle just one.
I really don't want players to shuffle different vault versions, really, because it will be just annoying for other players ("can we remake plx? I loaded the wrong vault for this char!")...
Maybe I'll assign an ID to each created vault and also save that ID in the char saves to make sure that players can only use one vault for their characters.

The problem is: what would happen if you try to load a character that has a different vault ID? Would the vault be destroyed? Would the game prevent you from loading that character or the vault, whatever is loaded first?
Also, players could still effectively have 1 vault for each character by just shuffling the files for each character. It's just way more tedious as the game does not allow you to reroll.

So in the end, it probably boils down to giving the player a positive encouragement to loading the same vault every game - which is basicly enough slots to not make it worth the effort to shuffle.
And I guess the magic number here is 7, not 5, considering that 5 restricts you to more or less just two souls per type and a swap slot.

... with 33600*2 possible stat combinations for legendary souls alone, that still seems limited enough to me.

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

Well OK then. Are legendary souls obtainable yet? And are they dropped by only bosses or can we just get them naturally as we're levelling from normal mobs but just an insanely low rate?

 

[Manipulation]

I just don't like the idea of all players having everything, doesn't that seem bland to you people? Having fewer slots for this would allow more individuality in the game. You don't need to have a soul for every situation, you just need souls that cater to your taste.

exactly.

 

[galactcus]

the souls are very cool
but there are how many souls??
man the vampiric curse from necromancer is not healling the 15% :X

 

[Jumbo]

Exactly my point Zwiebelchen. There are so many stat combinations that 7 limit is hardly "having every combination" .

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

I said every situation not every combination, there's a huge difference. Most combinations aren't great, pretty much all mp souls will be tossed (unless it's a legendary). However, I see zwieb's point about trying to avoid players remake scumming.

Vampiric curse worked just fine the last time I used it (necro is my least favorite class), you may not notice the effect because it doesn't show green numbers and the effect is small. If you watch your minions hp you should see it taking effect when your curse ticks.

 

[Jumbo]

I see. Sorry Demon. Still though I don't agree that 5 limit is enough for every situation =).

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

What? That's.. exactly what I said >_<. I didn't want a player to have a highly flexible vault set, which is what a 5 limit would achieve - I would like it if each player chose between having souls for certain types of heroes but not all. However, as zwieb said, that would simply cause some players to make multiple vaults and I agree that having one vault set per player is just better for the game.

I'm not sure why you're still pursuing this when zwieb already said he's going to increase base slots to 7.

 

[Jumbo]

Hahaha I can't read apparently. Only half right. But yeah I just wanted to discuss with you . /Case closed

 

[Zwiebelchen]

New version is up!

CHANGELOG (v1.2B (9)):
- New feature: disenchanting!
--> Mytargas, Lumberjack and Riversdale now have a Nether Circle that allows to disenchant (unsaved) items for materials
--> 1 item = 1 mat
--> 3 items = 1 raremat
- Increased number of vault slots to 7
- Fixed a bug that caused unused linear stat components of souls to suddenly appear after level 10
- Added a music theme for the soul vault

 

[Jumbo]

Great!
2 questions:
-The mats from disenchant are those already existing in the game? (meaning lvl 50 ppl wont find any use in it).

-Did you add any of the new tracks I Pm'ed? Sorry playing with some ppl atm so no time to see for myself.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

-The mats from disenchant are those already existing in the game?

Yes. It's just to make life a bit easier for those that like to solo...

 

[Jumbo]

Alright. So all items can be disenchanted or only green ones and above?

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Alright. So all items can be disenchanted or only green ones and above?

Only green+

 

[Jumbo]

I see. Well thanks for another cool release. Kamina has some good suggestions coming up for Yeti (which we downed 4 man in version 8 by the way).

 

[BoxOfFaith]

Would it be OP to be able to use the Nether Circle to combine 3 green souls into 1 blue one?

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

Would it be OP to be able to use the Nether Circle to combine 3 green souls into 1 blue one?

+1 for this if it's technically possible. Not easily abusable since unidentified souls don't save. So far I've found roughly 50 greens, 20 blues and 3 reds so the ratio is about right.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Being able to combine souls would kind of defeat the purpose of souls, no?

 

[BoxOfFaith]

We'd still be gambling, cause its not like we'd be forcing the stats we want on the souls. It'd just make it SLIGHTLY less grindy since we could turn the already almost not worth picking up green souls into something that could be useful.

Most blues are junk anyway, so I dont think it'd be defeating the purpose, just make it more enjoyable imo! As long as we can't force reds, I think it'd be fine .

 

[Zwiebelchen]

We'd still be gambling, cause its not like we'd be forcing the stats we want on the souls. It'd just make it SLIGHTLY less grindy since we could turn the already almost not worth picking up green souls into something that could be useful.

Most blues are junk anyway, so I dont think it'd be defeating the purpose, just make it more enjoyable imo! As long as we can't force reds, I think it'd be fine .

Meh, I'm kinda okay with this, but it will definitely cost gold and not be able to create reds.

Edit: damn no, it can't, because people could just reload to get the gold back anyway. I need to find another kind of "payment". God I hate this... I basicly have the same problem with vault upgrades. Any resource that can be saved is not a resource I can base this on. For vault upgrades, at least I can resolve to raredrop items, but for the soul splicing thing?
That could have been the one major gold sink I have been lusting for since forever.

A possible solution could be that it requires disenchanting an item in the process aswell. That's kind of the same effect as an actual gold cost, as you lose the chance to sell that item and disenchanting only works on unsaved items anyway.
Basicly:
- 1 green/blue item (of level 35 or higher) + 3 green souls = 1 blue soul

That's basicly the equivalent of 200-400g, depending on what it is.

 

[BoxOfFaith]

Well, souls can't be saved so the player at the very least would waste whatever time they invested in obtaining the souls to begin with. You could put a cost on it, and if it combined into something actually good they'd be forced to take the loss of gold along with the soul they received.

I was mostly just looking to give a further use to the green souls. They're kind of too common to honestly bother with after playing for a couple hours. Its not too difficult to find a blue one thats equal to the best green ones you find, even if the third stat in the blue one isn't too useful. They're designed in such a way that the best possible green is equal to a mediocre blue, so in turn greens kind of just go to waste.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Well, souls can't be saved so the player at the very least would waste whatever time they invested in obtaining the souls to begin with. You could put a cost on it, and if it combined into something actually good they'd be forced to take the loss of gold along with the soul they received.

I was mostly just looking to give a further use to the green souls. They're kind of too common to honestly bother with after playing for a couple hours. Its not too difficult to find a blue one thats equal to the best green ones you find, even if the third stat in the blue one isn't too useful. They're designed in such a way that the best possible green is equal to a mediocre blue, so in turn greens kind of just go to waste.

I understand the problem. It's kind of the problem Diablo 2 was having aswell, in that blue items pretty much became vendor junk after act 2.

I can't force players to take the gold loss when they splice souls. That's kind of the problem. Since vaults load seperately from characters, whatever resource they used can be reverted by just reloading. So gold or MC is off the table. All I can use as a "payment" is stuff that is obtained in-session.

 

[BoxOfFaith]

Could you maybe internally track something like.. total levels of enemies killed per character? So if you killed 5 level 20s, you'd have a total of 100 levels killed.

Assuming soul combining is balanced around being level 50, which I don't see why it would be necessary before level 50, lowbies can look forward to finding newer and better souls while simply training and gearing. This would also incentivize level 50s to go back and train as noobs again, as if they combine a really nice soul, it'd be level 1 so they wouldn't be able to level it up while they're still searching for souls.

Anyhow, back to the total levels thing. Require something like 5000 total levels to be able to combine the souls. Everytime you repick or reload the map the count is set back to zero. This way you're essentially forced to do excess grinding to come up with a "resource" that can't be saved or transferred over in anyway.

You could also put in a shop of some sort that the only resource it takes are level kills. This way theres an opportunity cost to combining. On top of this, you could perhaps make it only available for use when theres one player in the game. I don't think we need to worry about people combining greens while playing in groups, they'll likely be able to farm their own blues just fine lol.

Edit: Call it the Soulo shop :^)

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Sounds a bit too convoluted to me. Disenchanting an unsaved item basicly serves the same purpose, but feels and flows more logical than this arbitrary killcount system, imho.

Also, I could easily justify it by lore by just saying that the additional item required is basicly the energy source for that process.

Umm, also, the soul vault kind of is connected to the game story, and it wouldn't make sense lore-wise for NPCs to have any connection whatsoever to it. But I don't want to spoil the story, so I won't write more about this.

 

[BoxOfFaith]

Could you do unsaved items based on their sell price? Seems trivial if all it will require is an unsaved D1 item, but if it costs ~1k total sell cost of items then that becomes somewhat of an actual sacrifice.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Could you do unsaved items based on their sell price? Seems trivial if all it will require is an unsaved D1 item, but if it costs ~1k total sell cost of items then that becomes somewhat of an actual sacrifice.

That's kind of included in the level 35+ items requirement. I wouldn't want to put a "minimum value" requirement there, simply because that would be hard to communicate to the player (how does the player know how much money worth of items he dropped?) and difficult to code (there is no way to get the selling value of an item directly).

Level 35+ items are basicly all foothills content, so the minimum gold loss would be around 100-200g for a green item of that level. 400g if I restrict it to blues.

 

[SHBlade]

Hey Zwieb could u increase red droprate from regular mobs? I killed a whole lot of kobolds and razormanes and didn't see a single red (hardly even blue or green ) while got bunch of blue items from those mobs.

 

[Jumbo]

To be honest the Reds wouldn't be red if they weren't very rare. Also, having 1 giving 5%+ attack speed aura I know that the red's surely aren't that much of an improvement over good blue ones.

In any case, souls play not even a secondary but a tertiary role in the game really. Your hero with lvl 50 souls will be something like 15% stronger, which is only slightly noticeable.

Some people will probably say that this is wrong and that they are alpha omega part of the game, but I doubt that to be true. For comparison, Enchanting in Wow (pre-TBC) was not required for doing a more uptier raid like BWL (Blackwing Lair), but the elite guilds wanted you to have the best enchantments for maximum efficiency. I think souls in Gaias Retaliation are kinda the same. They can add an extra edge, but are hardly a have or fail addition to the game. In conclusion, if you want to just play the game, items and playing well can get you to the end, while if you want perfectionism you can get the best souls for complete power.

-Sorry SH, I know you are a perfectionist Gaias fanatic