HIVE

(climbing up the ladder)

FeelsGoodMan: as I am answering asynchronously, strange continuity issues may happen. But sometimes fruitful correlations of thoughts from several individuals may also unexpectedly happen.

Instead of a cluster of Profile posts, please try to envision it as a train of thoughts of sorts, where ideas and opinions are thrown in. From all that was, is, and will be written there, now try to envision what a bigger picture of a theoretical yet possible brighter future could be. Switch points of view, others have shown you how to do it. Do not hesitate to re-evaluate everything you think you know from the very beginning, if you realize something does not match.

(cont'd)

I would personally recommend you this imho great read:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method
After deepstrasz made me (made us all?) aware of the February thread on Battle.net, and after discovering by myself that the legacy SC and D2 were available on the same terms as well, I used this method to completely re-evaluate what had happened around the release of v1.32.0. ofc with this method, the more accurate and unbiased data, the better.

As an example: Blizzard is said by some haters to (supposedly) be a greedy company. Now, we know that some previous Classic games have made it to GOG in the past (D1, WC1&2) as paid digital download files. Question: why are SC 1.15.2 and WC3 v1.27b not on GOG as paid digital downloadable content only from them? (note: for D2, I am still waiting for Resurrected to rise).

I'd rather abstain from engaging further in this train wreck, honestly.

This ain't some huge deep rooted personal philosophical issue for me, it's a matter of supply and demand for me, nothing else. I need to make custom campaigns, and I will enable people to play what I make. Simple as that.

To unsubscribe, you have to delete your posts.

As for download counts. I am pretty sure Blizzard doesn't monitor something like that. They do not keep their web servers running on account of that and if they did, the multitude of people posting on the forums would be enough to keep their domain up and running.

The GoG versions are something like abandonware cared for by fans. There is not internet/Battle.net support as there is none now for Warcraft III 1.27 or any other version below 1.32+ and people resort to using external, unofficial means to play these games via multiplayer which one might call, illegal, especially with things like War3Champions(?) that offers ladder and paid contests, driving fans away from the official servers and possible contests.

What FeelsGoodMan and Shar Dundred wrote might sound like the black market to you, but in reality it's more like philanthropy. If people can't make or play custom campaigns anymore, imagine that without these older versions they'd probably be gone, some of them at least until past 1.32+ gets fixed but some will surely not come back and that means losing fans because with creators you lose consumers as well. So, Blizzard gets to keep players this way, actually.

(climbing up the ladder)

Shar Dundred, ever since v1.28.0 when Blizzard adopted the online digital installation and update method, people were aware there was no way back to the previously installed version of the game. This is not news, as there has *never* been any official way to remove *any* Blizzard upgrade patch.

People should try to interest themselves in the options of the software they install. It also applies to options of the OS they use, their browser extensions (if any) etc. And ofc it also applies to the Battle.net app

(cont'd)

Backups are indeed part of the good computer practices. Personally, I still have the original archives of almost all of the software I have been using since the early 90s on floppy disks (the 5 1/4 ones are gone, btw). Even today, I still backup anything I am downloading/installing (and sometimes buying). My archives are worth 100s of GBs, accumulated over 30 years of using PCs

(cont'd)

Regarding any forced update, I am lacking full information, so you surely can help me here. Now, I know one may have to connect once per month for some paid content to be 'rearmed', as a part of anti-piracy measures (maybe the version is also updated in the process?). I know Blizzard games can be played solo. I know that depending on the game version, LAN is available (be it internet LAN or authentic LAN). I know some game versions can be played using direct cable connection. I know that for free content, no internet connection is required to 'rearm' anything. I know that by using port filtering, the Battle.net client will not see any available updates and the game will not upgrade even if a new version is indeed available. I know that for some versions of the game, other third-party servers exist. Maybe I know that those who rely only on the Battle.net app to play vs games may not have friends they can shake hands with, to play LAN games and eat pizza together.

(cont'd)

Those illegal archives will have to go someday. It does not mean they will not be replaced by something better.

But 1.28 didn't kill features of the game. And who knew that 1.32/Reforged would and you know how B.net updates love to start by themselves.
I don't know about offline but every time I want to run 1.32+ I am forced to log in to the B.net app.
That's the point, they might not be replaced with official ones, ever. The obscure 1.27 links are a mystery, well, actually they are the last step before the transition to what ultimately became Reforged in 1.32.

(climbing up the ladder - whaaat, Shar Dundred again?? wow!)

imho the main issue with 1.32 which is preventing from its more widespread adoption is its overall higher system requirements. Personally, I will install it *only* when it gets stripped of its Reforged content, since I have no intention to pay for it. Restoring full DirectX9 compatibility and slimming down the online installed version can encourage some to move to v1.32. ofc it will not solve any of the EULA issues

(cont'd)

In order for Blizzard to provide content compatibility (like, with content from the 1.28-> 1.31.1 versions) and whenever compatibility can not be *reliably* achieved with a more recent version (like 1.32) then Blizzard should provide such compatible versions. period. So far, this has been silently achieved with 1.27b (and any other previous versions) so far. But a gap still remains, and it is up to Blizzard to fill it for his customers.

For the record, I myself have dropped for good my installed 1.31.1 version, because by doing so I also want to send Blizzard a message (don't forget, Blizzard games imho 'phone home' since several years). And that message is, I personally disagree with some of their decisions regarding the game. But it also does not mean I have given up on it, the fact that I have installed the v1.27a digital version instead, is proof of it.
This version fits my needs, I hope other such versions will fit other peoples' needs, be they gamers or modders.

(cont'd)

Regarding your "How do your links help the people who rely on those archives?", I still have something left to review carefully. Could be dodgy, could be great... Not enough time for everything. Maybe I will need some help and advice in private.

(climbing up the ladder)

"https://www.hiveworkshop.com/attachments/screenshot_1-png.364205/"
Thanks FeelsGoodMan. Not sure I have understood everything, but this sure looks funny
:)

I do not think Blizzard will someday fulfill all of our dreams (which would probably be impossible regardless, for practical reasons). But the fact is, Reforged is now here and the 'race' for its long awaited release is finally over. The dream has ended(?) and now comes the time of reflection for Blizzard.

(cont'd)

Regardless of its overall hardware requirements, v1.32 imho still has other deficiencies, according to what I have been reading on the Battle.net forums. I therefore think there is still a window of opportunity for Blizzard to provide solutions to alleviate these issues. These solutions can be deployed in a very short time, and with imho minimal effort. The most obvious one is ofc to provide a few selected previous versions of the game, to give both them and us a breath of fresh air and to alleviate any pressure. So far, this may have been partly achieved with v1.27a. But there is still a little bit of effort for them left to do. I personally encourage them to continue to take action in that direction.

(cont'd)

Regardless of any gaming/modding concerns, game version preservation for historical purposes also can be viewed as both a positive and important thing. I personally think that two versions ranging from 1.28.0 to 1.31.1 are eligible for such preservation. For the record, my own personal criteria do not take into account any gameplay nor modding feature.

The Hive's stance on this is clear, I have told it to you twice now. There is nothing to discuss about it. If you don't like it, leave the website.
I have no issues with your views or your person. This is just how it is, no walls of text will change it.

(climbing up the ladder)

"Any user is free to remove literally anything from their profile. That is why the feature exists. I also do not see how this is even relevant at all for this discussion. He obviously was not interested in what you had to say if he removed it which is his right to do."

It is relevant to this discussion, but because it has been deleted you will never know why, obviously.

I personally dislike it a lot when information disappears, and the state of the preservation of historical data on the internet or even IRL makes me sadder and sadder. It is really a problem when doing any historical research work. Sometimes archive.org, WebCite, Megalodon and archive.today all let me down. Like for example when I have been looking recently for some technical info pages from Blizzard's support site regarding 1.28

(cont'd)

Remember guys and gals: any relevant information that is deleted may be lost forever for everybody. Therefore, when one decides to delete something, he/she must also give himself enough time for reflection beforehand, as that information may be needed someday by someone else.

btw, deleting any imho well-informed information about legal matters is the kind of thing one may expect from a commendable individual imho

Censorship might be a nuisance, dishonourable and antiacademic but privacy gives people the right to use it on their property.

I usually take screenshots but that doesn't mean a person's, let's say belongings, in it will not trigger a privacy related drama.