Warden #42

[Rufus]

About the campaign upload, if you go for 100% rules, then it is not allowed to upload a map twice in any way, in the official map section.
Your idea of removing the current uploaded maps might sound like a good idea in the first moment, but if you delete them, they are not gone.
They are still there, just not available for the public and they still cause costs for Ralle.
I don't know a 100% what you are aiming for with the campaign, but you could bundle the maps in the Pack section. You might als want to consultate a map moderator about this issue, he can say things for sure.

I'll look into this in the future.

Attack: Yeah, my idea was that attack can only queue once. (1 stack)

I cannot confirm it a 100%, but I recall it sometimes did not trigger, when moving.

I'll research this further.

Thanks for the opinions!

If you have so much to do yet, then let's wait with a rating increase until you are done with it

Agreed. Here is a list of things I'll be fixing:
-Reduce Dash CD and distance, but keep two stacks.
-Make dash uncastable while standing still.
-Remove the Stun casting animation that plays even when you don't have enough energy.
-Attack queueing system. (I've tried before, and this is going to be tough!!!)
-Implementing the Gold lining UI. (This causes trouble with the dialogs though, but I think I might have a solution.)

Let me know if I missed something in the list above, or if you have more opinions!

 

[Rufus]

I've been working non-stop on updates today.
I have been crying blood, ripped my hair and uttered curses in 3 languages trying to fix those latest changes:

-Reduced Dash Cooldown to 1
-Reduced Dash Distance by 25%
-Dash can no longer be used while standing still
-Stun no longer plays an animation if the energy bar isn't full
-Energy bar is now full upon map launch
-Dialogs now also obscure the resources and the menu buttons when opened
-Updated Controls dialog to match changes
-Added an attack queue system. Recast attack while winding up to attack again after the first attack is done. I'll perhaps add an option to toggle this on/off in later versions
-Enabled Dash in the desert intro, since players will probably want to try it as soon as they are able to
-Changed Desert area slightly to adapt to the enabled Dash

After hours of searching and inventing I have not yet been able to fix the UI issue...
Ugh.

EDIT:
WOOOO! I AM SO HAPPY!
I made it! After like 10 hours of trying to figure it out, I managed to create a functional UI!
I had to create a whole new method for creating UIs in the process, but it was well worth it!
Also, now I have a great way of creating UIs in the future.

 

[JesusHipster]

I have enjoyed this map very much.

 

[Rufus]

I'm glad to hear that.
Just so you know, I'm currently working on putting this and a bunch of other maps like this one together into a campaign, two of which is available already.
Bonechiller Burrow
Forest Temple

I would be very happy if you took your time to put a rating on this map since you enjoyed it!

 

[Remixer]

Hmh where to start...

Quite a few flaws I'd say:

1. Check the messages for typos. =) "... men has gone".. noope they have gone =)

2. What's with the first puzzle? I can't hear any flute and man... eventually I just figured out that every time I spawn back to the same room I am supposedly going to the correct direction. Then again, it's exactly opposite to what the ancient said, as he hints that people have gone mad trying to get to the temple, so you could guess every time you leave that room you are going to the correct direction.

3. Some of the doors blocked by the magic wall are accessible before the magic thing is shut down. You ought to check for errors there.

4. I'd replace the helmet icon for food with a stun icon, it is a bit misleading, first I thought it was armor or something =D

5. You might want to leave a tiny bit of that switch under the Statue of the Keeper of the Grove visible, took me like 3 minutes to figure out one could move it. Phah.

6. The spinning blades are a bit... repetitive and hardcore. They are very easy to dodge but then again, if you even partly hit one it results in an instant death. Maybe you could make those parts harder to survive with 100% health but so that it does not mean instant death to hit one.

7. The spiky thorn room (is where I quited). I had no idea that they were deadly, maybe you could add some message like "Warden: Auch... I wonder how many souls have fallen into those deadly spikes." or something. Currently it is very cruel to die in an instant (I suppose I died).

8. The switch in that room. What the hell? Like seriously? It has like dozens of flaws and it makes no sense at all. Firstly, why on earth would a switch cause something like drunkness or dizzyness (to me it was like that since controls got messed up). Then again, after a couple of deaths I finally figured out it was camera angle that got changed. How did I figure it out? I left the room and my camera was inside a wall and I could not see a thing so I quit since I had no way to progress anymore. Then again, I stopped for a while and waited for the drunkness to end. Guess what! It did not end at all! Seriously that thing makes no sense and it is just purely retarded. If you really want to keep it change the concept - the walls cannot get in front of the player and it mustn't be a switch - maybe a toxic mushroom that blows up or something.

Well. After all those flaws a few positive things:
1. It was easier compared to the Solen's Temple I played last time. A lot easier, which is good, then again the bosses were really easy. Were the bosses?

2. Good variety of monsters (if I include the supposed bosses).

3. Nice secrets (I did find the extra soul behind one pillar, wonder if I missed many of them).

4. Good unique puzzles, you got to figure out the statue can be moved and that the thunder lizard and the furbolg has to be placed on top of the foot switches. I like that.

5. Better controls and not as op dash. Always a good thing.

Side notes:
I would strongly recommend to inform player a bit more. Often I was wondering if this room was the last boss or something until I killed the "boss" with a few hits. Also, the map is quite huge so the rooms require more variety - for the sake of functionality. I had no idea where I was or what I was doing, why did I even go where I was going? Was each room important, what is their meaning? You need to set goals for the player. Currently he has none and he just goes where he... can?

Set goals like: 1. Find a door and find out it does not open. -> Find a key.
2. Find the key from another room.
3. Open the door and proceed.
4. Find a magic wall that you cannot pass but clearly is important, like a key behind it.
5. Find the boss that needs to be killed in order to a magic wall to open.
6. Kill the boss and proceed.

This kind of build makes the map more clear. Currently it lacks it and player can first find the boss and figure out why did he kill it and have no idea that some door won't open without killing the boss. Then again he found a key by accident and has no idea which door it opened.

Keep up the good work. Also, the music is horrible, figure out something better, I liked the first map's theme music.

 

[Rufus]

I'd replace the helmet icon for food with a stun icon, it is a bit misleading, first I thought it was armor or something =D

Hmm.
I've been thinking about it and is in pursuit of a better one.

I would strongly recommend to inform player a bit more.

Agreed.

Also, the map is quite huge so the rooms require more variety - for the sake of functionality. I had no idea where I was or what I was doing, why did I even go where I was going? Was each room important, what is their meaning? You need to set goals for the player. Currently he has none and he just goes where he... can?

Not sure what you are suggesting.
If you mean the terrain... well. I found it really hard to terrain the inside. Perhaps I should give it a second go.

Set goals like: ...

This is ehat the "Objectives" dialog in the top of the screen was intended for. I didn't think it would be needed in this map, but perhaps it is.

Also, the music is horrible

WHAT!?
HOW DARE YOU???
That is music from the legend of zelda! I love it! :'(
(you really think so?)

I'm happy to see that all (but one) problems you mention is with the map specifics, which hopefully mean that the general controls and UI was fine.

For the others things you reported: I agree with most of the things you pointed out and will fix them.

Thanks!

EDIT: The flute in the forest: I think I added a tip that tells you how to turn on your sound and music. Are you sure these were not turned off?

 

[Remixer]

Hmm.
I've been thinking about it and is in pursuit of a better one.

Agreed.

Not sure what you are suggesting.
If you mean the terrain... well. I found it really hard to terrain the inside. Perhaps I should give it a second go.

This is ehat the "Objectives" dialog in the top of the screen was intended for. I didn't think it would be needed in this map, but perhaps it is.

WHAT!?
HOW DARE YOU???
That is music from the legend of zelda! I love it! :'(
(you really think so?)

I'm happy to see that all (but one) problems you mention is with the map specifics, which hopefully mean that the general controls and UI was fine.

For the others things you reported: I agree with most of the things you pointed out and will fix them.

Thanks!

EDIT: The flute in the forest: I think I added a tip that tells you how to turn on your sound and music. Are you sure these were not turned off?

Tried toggling them on and off but still nothing. The music yeah, it first played Blizzard music for me and then suddenly changed it as I proceeded. The controls and UI seems okay.

What I mean about the room variety is that currently you have a room Y that leads to rooms B, Y and Z and they are very similar to room Y, only difference is that they have less doors or something. The connection is always a door and it gets really messy as you have many dead ends.

ReplaceableTextures\CommandButtons\BTNStun.blp

 

[Rufus]

The music yeah, it first played Blizzard music for me and then suddenly changed it as I proceeded.

What?
That is super strange... :|
Just to be clear: Do you mean you didn't hear the custom music at all, that they were mixed, or you simply didn't like the soundtrack?

The controls and UI seems okay.

Good.
This is what I am trying to perfect before creating more maps as it is troublesome changing.

 

[Remixer]

What?
That is super strange... :|
Just to be clear: Do you mean you didn't hear the custom music at all, that they were mixed, or you simply didn't like the soundtrack?

Good.
This is what I am trying to perfect before creating more maps as it is troublesome changing.

I started hearing some custom music after I entered some door can't remember which one. But don't know if Blizzard music continued after that, I think so though.

 

[Rufus]

Probably know what door that might be, but it is strange none the less.

 

[Moderator]

Shadow Fury's review

[2016-05-18] Hidden Get ready to rack your brains on this one! This game requires lots of intelligence to get through the puzzles. However, what makes this campaign original and different from any other is that its commands are different. You control your hero using arrow keys and a series of commands Q, W, E and R. A tutorial to teach you everything and to get accustomed to such commands is not missing! The boss fights are awesome and you will surely need to use all your skills to defeat them, not to mention the cunning traps and tricky mechanisms! Be prepared to face all that! Campaign approved with a rating of 4/5.

 

[Rufus]

^.

 

[ILH]

This is one unique campaign that I have never seen. I like the concepts, I'll wait for them to be added
You might want to add different animations each attack, but that's optional.
Overall, I rate this 5/5

 

[Rufus]

Wow, thanks...
That is a great honour getting a 5 / 5!

I hope I will live up to this rating in future updates!

 

[Arad MNK]

Having a campaign is much better than having separate maps, I'm sure that the downloads will raise soon

I *might* review this, not sure.

 

[Rufus]

I understand what you mean, and I've been thinking that aswell. However, that is a matter of convenience.
Since the maps are not dependent of each other, they work fine as separate downloads aswell.
This was my thinking when I first started this project, that I might not finish it. And rather than having a campaing with only half a working map, I prefer having a few working, and perhaps not a campaign at all.
Also, the total file size of the finished project might get pretty large, so giving options of downloading and testing only one or of two of the maps is a good thing.

I *might* review this

Thank you!

 

[Rufus]

All the mentioned problems have been fixed.
I am a little unsure about the music though, as I discovered no bugs regarding it is i tried to fix it. I changed a few triggers though and I think that should do the job.

 

[Deleted member 247165]

ok! So I've just tried this awesome game! Your idea is really cool and i am sure the game will evolve into a wonderful standalone game, sometime. You just need to focus. I suggest you use some HD tile sets and better doodads, this way it will attract more people, since the gameplay system is already cool! I rated it 5/5! Good job!

 

[Rufus]

Thanks for your kind words and the awesome rating! It really means a lot! :3

About the hd tileset and doodads: I probably won't do that probably, mainly as I have been working with standard Wc3 doodads at all times when I have been modding, and have grown quite fond of it.

It is also a matter of filesize. As the campaign will contain multiple maps, I'd like to keep the filesize as low as possible by importing as little material as possible.

 

[JesusHipster]

Honestly, i think i would have enjoyed the current maps way more if it wasn't for arrows and qwe controlls. I just don't like them in WC3. Period. One just can't make them responcive enough. Maybe it's just me however. I think that a mix between slasher and click to move controlls would be neat. You know, so a player could do a vast majority of actions with his mouse but right-clicking an enemy will only make the Warden attack once.

Also, i suggest you to think of the idea of enchantments being active not only untill the end of a map. I think since it's a campaign it would be nice to have some powers\items to gather to carry on with you across and between the maps of the campaign. Especialy if Zelda games were an insparation for you. Zelda insparation is also important in terms of gameplay. Those series featured a constantly evolving gameplay, right. However i don't think that you could possible base the variety of gameplay entirely on the implementation of new puzzles and enemies.

Those were my suggestions and the things i wanted to highlight. However i still enjoyed those maps very very much and i'm looking forward to the release of this campaign, even with arrow+qwe controll scheme and without boosting your char throughout the whole campaign.

Also i'm a very big fan of your level-design. Maps were very visualy appealing (maybe besides those stone walls in the forest temple map) and the gamplay part of the map design was deep. As it is i think those stand-alone maps a worthy of 4\5 stars. A campaign might be worthy of a Derector's Cut rating.

Great job!

UPT: Since the last update it's definitely a 5/5. Aim for DC, mate!

 

[Rufus]

Thanks a lot for your thoughts!

Maps were very visualy appealing (maybe besides those stone walls in the forest temple map)

Thanks! I am pretty proud of what I have created with only blizzard (and a few internal edits) doodads. But yeah, totally agree with the forest temple one...
I just found it really hard to make the inside fitting. I am returnign to the map now and then, trying to come up with something for the inside. No luck so far, but i'll keep trying

A campaign might be worthy of a Derector's Cut rating.

Wow... :3
I hope so. Someday.

Also, i suggest you to think of the idea of enchantments being active not only untill the end of a map. I think since it's a campaign it would be nice to have some powers\items to gather to carry on with you across and between the maps of the campaign.

Well, I have a few concept here that I will start working with as soon as I start working on the campaign maps. The problem having it now is that those maps should not be played in any specific order. A specific order would cause the player to have a single line campaign, which is not what I wanted to achieve. However, I'm considering doing like this: The campaign levels (about 10 when finished) has a set, raising difficulty level. The side maps has a variable level that varies depending on how poerful you are, resulting in side maps almost always being of eual difficulty. But, when there are about 20 side maps, that won't be needed, if i reach that number that is. I realize that this piece may be confusing...

Honestly, i think i would have enjoyed the current maps way more if it wasn't for arrows and qwe controlls. I just don't like them in WC3. Period.

I'm glad you enjoyed them as much as to give them 4/5 rating anyway then!
I may experimetn in the future to convert them to standard warcraft movement system, and offer it as an alternate download. Perhaps.

 

[Supernickman 32]

Good campaign i like because music was good gameplay too my rate 5/5!

 

[Rufus]

Thanks a lot! Really appreciate it!
And the music... Yes! It is loevely isn't it?
The Zelda atmosphere it contributes gives me nostalgia chills down to the center of my bones...

 

[Supernickman 32]

Thanks a lot! Really appreciate it!
And the music... Yes! It is loevely isn't it? The Zelda atmosphere it contributes with gives me nostalgia chills down to the center of my bones...

Zug zug! (Translate- yes!)

I hope updates soon...

I'm currently working on one.
You'll have to be a little more patient as each of those map takes plenty of polishing before I can release them.

Okay.

 

[Rufus]

I'm currently working on one.
You'll have to be a little more patient as each of those map takes plenty of polishing before I can release them.

 

[Rufus]

Glad to hear it!
Did you try the campaign aswell?
It is a map-pack containing this and three (and a wip) maps of similiar concept.

You can check it out here:
http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/maps-564/warden-277161/

 

[FireTiger]

Awesome!!! 5/5. Nice Idea! {Nothing More To Say..}

 

[Rufus]

Thanks!
I'm really glad you enjoyed as much!

 

[Rufus]

I just finished the map and I must that it is very well done. The systems, the narration, the puzzles the mood, and the gameplay are on point. I don't think there is much you can improve on this particular map, maybe after I test the two other maps I would have a better say about that.

Some suggestions and remarks :
-Find an idea for an addition spell for using actions points (right now 3 actions is fine but it might get old fast);
-In the intro, the presence of tree or doodads reveal the "trick" that you are using to make it feel like an infinite desert;
-The button Z is to close to all the other actions buttons, I happened to hit it multiple times in the middle of an action (maybe because I have an AZERTY?);
-In the first puzzle room, the necro could drain my life trough the door if I got too close
-The Rune of the wind didn't seem to protect me from the towers;
-The final boss used to teleport quite often to the center of the map, strange and sometimes lethal.


Keep the good work and good luck for the rest of your projects

Sorry. I didn't see this until you notified me.

Addition Spell: Well, that particular map was built on nt having an extra spell. The two WIPs I have right now both have that though. I might try to implement somthing though, if more people think it is an issue.
Intro: I will apply an idea I have been trying in a WIP map. It will get better!
Keyboard issue: Yeah, sorry. It is supposed to be for a qwer board. I might add an option to change hotkeys, but first I gotta ask:

Does your keyboard look like this?

Necro Drain-through-door: Easy fix. Will be done soon.
Rune of Wind: Hmm... Strange. I'll see what I can do.
Boss teleport: This is intended. I should perhaps add a special effect in order to make it more clear.

The systems, the narration, the puzzles the mood, and the gameplay are on point.

Hehe, thanks!

Thanks a lot for the review and the rating! I'll fix those issues soon.

 

[Mgeterno11]

Excellent idea, storyline and music choice. I really like this campaign, the spells and the terrain are well-done, too. 5/5

 

[Ardenian]

Great, as the other ones.

My suggestions:
- Add a small cinematic or explanation in-game, some kind of short introduction,
telling why we are there and what we are up to
-

Spoiler

Make the bridge look more broken ( first area, bottom right), from the player perspective the bridge looks walkable

-

Spoiler

What does one have to do in the first room ? I defeated all enemies except the shade,
but I could not find any clue how to continue.

My suggestion would be to add a -help comment that slightly helps you ( maybe on lower difficulties only) what to do next.

 

[Rufus]

Thanks a lot!
Really glad so many appreciate it!

 

[Legal_Ease]

This is a very refined mod. It has all the aspects working together like a symphony of precision and simplicity. - sophisticated in every way - The triggers are clean - very effective and the action is smooth. Sounds are nice and all fitting. Terrain is excellent and all things seem to work properly. The theme and overall feel of the game are what make it so amazing. It all feels like it belongs exactly how it is. I got stuck at the statute and have to cook dinner for the gf, but I loved it and will play it again. I noticed one little bug. An Hp bar for a dummy. Also, I got attacked by something through the right wall that I couldn't see. But Rufus, you are very talented and I would love to see more. The UI looks fantastic.
​

Very Well done! 5/5 +rep

 

[Rufus]

That is the goddamn finest review I've ever read... :3
Thanks a lot for those words! I really appreciate it.
I hope the rest of the level and the other maps will be equally fun to you!

I'll try to fix that dummy right away, even though I'm not sure what that is... It might actaully be one of the furbolgs, in the edge of the room, health bar bugging to the middle of the screen.

And yes, don't let the girl starve. Things might get violent...

Also, If you wished to try out the other maps, I recommend downloading the campaign, as it contains all uploaded independent maps plus introduction and a small WIP.

 

[Victarion]

I enjoyed it very much. Controls are easy. Terrain, musics and the atmosphere is really appealing. Overall 5/5

 

[Rufus]

Thanks a lot!
I'm really glad you enjoyed it!

I'm soon fixing the things you mentioned in the development thread aswell.

 

[Rufus]

Strange... I din't get a notification for this...

However, i agree with most of the things you say, and will try to fix it today.
I won't add a help command though. In this specific case I think I need to add a general hint when she approach one of the doors: "Shalis Darkhunter: Those runes on the floor... They are similiar to the ones outside the gate. I should try chanting them again."

Do you think you understand what to do in that case?

Spoiler

You are supposed to go to the south-eastern door, and say "kozu" again, as it is the same runes as the ones outside.

I have also been thinking of adding a walkthrough to all maps, so if a player get stuck, they can try to find the solution themselves, and don't have to be frustrated as they wait for my answer.

What is your opinion of the shade? It is supposed to be invulnerable. Is this a bad thing? I thought it was different, and they are useful in some places, but someone else said that it was a little strange...

 

[Ardenian]

Yes, that would be completely fine, I myself would understand then what to do.

About the shade, hm, I thought there might be a way to kill it with those flames/braziers on the pillars.
It is not a problem if there is an invincible creep, in my opinion. Adds some tension and
requires the player to pay a bit more attention to its surronding.

 

[Rufus]

Good, then we are thinking the same.

 

[furyuS]

Map is very good, but in my opinion it is too hard. Anyway i enjoyed it, 5/5

 

[Rufus]

Thank you for the awesome rating!
I really appreciate it!

What did you think was too hard? Handicap does not change difficulty a lot, but it helps if that was the problem.
The puzzles are supposed to be a little hard. However, I consider adding a tutorial though, so if a player get stuck, they can check that out in stead of just having to give up.

You could try the campaign, as you might find the other maps slightly easier (Bonechiller burrow is the hardest so far though). If you want to check it out, there is a link in my signature below.

 

[Ardenian]

Since my wc3 sounds are always muted, I just randomly tried trees ( for an actual review I would turn sounds on, ofc).
I was teleported back a few times, but suddenly not. The camera panned to the starting area,
but my hero was not there. As short moment I saw a small health bar to the right,
somewhere in the forest, but after pressing moving keys that disappeared. It moved faster than the hero.
Energy would still reset when using R.

 

[Rufus]

Strange...
I don't have an instant fix to this, but I will see if I can reproduce the bug.
About the small health bar:
I think that this an unsolvable but fortunately a pretty rare bug with having "-1.00" scaled selection size.

Energy would still reset when using R.

Don't quite understand what you mean here. There is no R ability in this game.
Gonna check this myself soon.

Just a side note:
I think you are actually not allowed to review my resource, as we are both reviewers. I think it was stated in the reviewers rules, to avoid drama.
Now, I'm pretty sure this won't happen, as you have fair reviews, and I'm know the difference between a review and declarations of war.
But, perhaps we should check with the moderators first anyway.

 

[Rufus]

Agreed with and fixed the terrain changes as suggest by Ardenian.
Also finished the walkthrough I have been working on for this map, as this one seems to be the hardest to complete without help.
I'll probably add walkthroughs for the other maps too, eventually.

 

[Deleted member 247165]

Finally approved!

 

[Remixer]

Everything seems to be bugged right now. No glaves or guardian birds move at all.

 

[Rufus]

Oh...
I must have been too sloppy creating it...
I was a little stressed out at the time and I tried only to do a simple fix for desync, but must have forgot to test it at all locations as it worked in one.

Will fix it as soon as possible, thanks for discovering it!

EDIT:
Simple mistake...
I paused the blade and owl units before giving them an order to patrol, causing them to never take the order.
Fixed now.

 

[ededededed]

loved your maps. played the sun tomb. didnt finish the puzzle except 2 tiles.

now here in the frozen map I got a problem. First time I went thourgh a route with a lift, I bugged and couldn't move so I restarted. Went through diffrent way and got to the zombie boss, but after I killed it I only see one obelisk and read about 3 in your walkthrough. if that up there is supposed to be a cave, I can't get through.
on my way to restart.

ok, I found one through the ice path, but I was trapped in the game before, is that how's it supposed to be?

 

[Rufus]

Thanks for playing!
No, you are never supposed to be trapped. However, I fixed an elevator bug in version 1.10.
1.09 still had the elevator bug.
Which version were you playing?
And was the problem that you went up with the elevator, and then couldn't move off it?

 

[ededededed]

I downloaded and played both the map (1.11 latest) and the campaign as for the elevator bug (went up and couldn't move off). Also, second time I'm stuck (in the room) after I kill the zombie boss.

The last map in ashenvale worked 100%.