War in Georgia. Are Russians right or not?

[Deleted member 139377]

Russia, is in no way communist.

It has the some of the same leaders that were ounce prominent in the USSR, but is in no way communist.

"Well, I think they're far away from even being a super power with all of their problems... And I thought they were never a super power :-\???

Let Russia drop $10k bombs to Georgia's fields... "

Russia, in 1917, went through what we call, the Russian revolution, the birth of communism as a prominent world party. Russia, was renamed the United Soviet Socialist Republic.

It was considered socialism to the extreme, at first, the goal was to eliminate the class system. But as the system was very vulnerable to corruption, they quickly became a two class system, those who lived under the rule of the government, and those who were in the government/served it.

Russia, from 1945-1994 was a world power, always more populated then the united states, and it's leadership tried to overthrow governments by setting up communist parties(IE: Vietnam, China, North Korea.)

This led to wars in Vietnam and Korea.

So Russia was, and still is a super power, in it's own right, it has the weapon power of the US, a quickly rising economy, and is considered the number two world player, as a co-founder of the United Nations with the US after world war two, even after the breakup of the Soviet Union, Russia, retained it's permanent membership, meaning, that by all means, Russia was the soviet union, but now it is just under different rule, and under a different system...


Also, to make a nuclear bomb takes allot more then 10,000 dollars, it could cost well into the range of millions for just the materials, and this led to the USSR's economic downfall, only a successful capitalist system can go on that long doing that.

EDIT:

Also, it's not that Russia doesn't like America, it is just that the former Soviet leadership still sees them as a rival, and a threat to national interests. The public opinion of the US in Russia is much higher then the media leads us to believe, in fact, world wide, anti-americanism isn't that popular, only popular among areas like the Middle East, where there are, unfortunately, many extremist groups, and they are having an effect on the newer generations.

 

[Vicboy]

Okay, thanks for not calling me a dumbass...

 

[Celebrate]

And I thought they were never a super power

also Russians were the first who send man in space.

 

[Vicboy]

also Russians were the first who send man in space.

And they killed a dog, monkey, and etc.

Poor animals...

So what if they used a cheap ass rocket to blast people into space then used tank armor to crash down to earth?

 

[Masiah]

We passed from discussing who is right in the Georgian Crisis to posting simple propaganda against Russia and the USA.

I mean, I know they're a communist country

Welcome to 2008. Soviet Union was officialy disolved in 1991. Where have you been in the last 17 years?

And I thought they were never a super power :-\???

Why do you think USA has always criticised Russia? Because USA sees Russia as an equal, a rival that can compete with them. After the fall of the URSS, Russia's economy recieved a strong blow, but it is now rapidly regaining what it had.

And they killed a dog, monkey, and etc.
Poor animals...

I may be wrong, but aren't manifestations held in the USA regularly against experimentation with animals? None of the 2 countries are saints.

So what if they used a cheap ass rocket to blast people into space then used tank armor to crash down to earth?

So what? The political pressure that was applied to scientists at that time was incredible, as this was seen as a race: the first country to send a man to space would be the winner. Russia scored the point.
Ironically, none of the two countries invested money in this branch of investigation for the achievement of sending man to space (this was more of a secondary objective), but more to piss off the other. As sad and stupid as it sounds.

 

[Aeroblyctos]

An excellent comment, Masiah!

 

[brad.dude03]

Yes, the USA certainly isn't innocent here, but neither is Russia. That's just how it works.

 

[Elenai]

There isn't a single country on Earth that is innocent, as brad has said. The whole world is filled with stupid actions by said ruling governmental powers.

Heck, even Holland has some sorta hidden/dark/skeleton closet...thing.

However, upon reading this thread:

"The political idiocy of it is so thick, I can literally peel the fail off my screen and cut myself with it."

 

[brad.dude03]

I liked Switzerland better than Holland Elenai.

 

[teeaichsee]

LOL crazy swiss >.>
rly interesting topic i find here

 

[Deleted member 139377]

There isn't a single country on Earth that is innocent, as brad has said. The whole world is filled with stupid actions by said ruling governmental powers.

Heck, even Holland has some sorta hidden/dark/skeleton closet...thing.

However, upon reading this thread:

"The political idiocy of it is so thick, I can literally peel the fail off my screen and cut myself with it."

Thats agreeable.

Accept the thing is, the media only pays attention to what happens in a certain area.....

Also, I peeled a layer of fail of my screen, under it was a layer of win... the win turned to dust...

 

[Epimeliad]

It just a way to gain the world's pity for Georgia and perhaps the only way for a country to redraw it territorial boundaries in this day and age. I believe they knew Russia gonna att them but hoping that pressures from the UN along with the Olympics would lessen Russia strike back.

 

[Byaku]

I think Russian right

Russian war to save they people

 

[Slivar]

Russia started it, if Georgia started it then why are Russia's tanks in Georgia....common since...I believe Russia is trying to get power hungry again and is trying to take back it's satellite countries since we humiliated them all during the cold war. people that say Russia is not Communist the fact is they are vary much still a communist based society and will continue to be so forever. people over there don't have the mind set like there western counterparts. I do agree with some of what's Masiah is saying but even though Russia's economy is recovering it still has a long way to go. Also if you look at it they still silence the press and subdue there people not as bad as before but it is still a fledgling democracy and has a long long way yet to go. Also the US is jest throwing up flags because there is a oil pipeline that runs through there that gives us oil.

 

[Masiah]

How can you agree with me by stating that Russia started it? Power hungry? Communist? For ever? These are words of someone who blindly believes mass-information companies that gain profit from scandalising the masses by modifying information and didn't even bother to inform himself (or herself) correctly about the real situation, in Russia and in South Ossetia. Humiliated in the Cold War? I really doubt it. Humiliating was the fact that two countries where fighting like children over candy.
Russians don't have the mind set as western people? Wait a sec, why should they? Why should English people should think like a German? An Australian as a Brazilian? Or a any other comparison?
Subdue their people and silence the press? Think before you post and go to Russia and see the truth.
Russian tanks in Georgia? Are you still considering South Ossetia like Georgia? Read the news (real news) please.
I repeat, THINK AND INFORM YOURSELF BEFORE POSTING.

Moderators, please close this thread. I personally feel tired of this thread, and I'm quite sure many others feel the same. It's the same nonsense over and over again.

 

[Slivar]

dude we are jest discussing politics as i posted i believe in some of your posts not all and there is no way you can say that Russia's democracy is in anyway like any of there western counterparts. Russia is power hungry and massively humiliated. If you look at it Russia had a vary different mind set again your twisting my words im stating that they don't think the same. in America you ask someone what he/sh wants that depending on the person will be success in life or something relating to it you ask someone in Russia they want their "friends" cow to drop over dead so they can have more than the other guy and that somewhat still holds true today. Russia should have never gotten involved with this the point of it being that. Sections of Georgia started rebelling and they (Georgia) sent in troops to suppress them and Russia wants there satellite countries back yelled you cant do that and they sent troops in. how can you say this is Georgia's fault... a few things can happen from this. The current satellite countries could get together and out of the thought of being sucked back in and say we are not going to allow you food uranium or the ports in Lithuania, Russia is either going to fold like a deck of cards because this will set there country back about a decade and everyone will starve or start invading other satellite countries piss off everyone in the world and start a new WW3 making the map im working on a reality...

o sorry i didn't know you had a direct connection to Russia Masiah but dude i do admit they have came along way from what they where and the democracy is slowly growing

 

[Mechanical Man]

First of all, use commas and capitalize the first letters in sentence, because is very hard to read your text.

Also in Serbia sections (Kosovo) started rebelling, so they also sent in troops to supress them, but then NATO bombed them back and today they declared independence. Why in this case the intervention was ok and Kosovo deserve independence while Russia should not be helping and leave the Ossetian at the mercy of Georgian army. There were reason that those Georgians ethnicities began to rebel.

And why you think everyone must live in democracy? Like is a supreme achievement, the pinnacle of civilization, blah, blah. Some societies are living better in other government systems. Also USA is not really an example of democracy, even in my country we have higher degree of democracy, although if I tell you my country you'd probably think that is somewhere in ex. Soviet union.

 

[Gausslander]

I, for one, think this is an atrocity. The Russians just want to resume their state of world power, they should give back the land they took and resume to a state of peace.

 

[Dumblor]

Russia is intolerant. They only needed a pretext to attack georgia. Those deaths were the pretext. I mean, attacking because you lost 15 or whatever peacekeepers ? They went they're knowing the danger. Georgia attacked proly thinking theyre Osetian. Russia is using the roman Divide and Conquer tactic. It is most likely that Osetia and Abhazia are Russia's puppet states. They're allways like that. My satelite sometimes catches russian news tv and THERE IS SO MUCH PROPAGANDA IN THERE! Medvedev looks like hero and acts like one, but in reality he's just a puppet of Putin. I mean. You are Premier but you have more power than the president !? I live in a country that was occupied by russians and I know what kind of snakes they are. Acting like heroes ihn theyre tv. Medvedev looks like he's a good actor . Son of a bitch...

 

[Mechanical Man]

Dude, Georgian army killed 1400 Ossetian civilians without any warning. They don't count for you?! Never heard of this? That many weren't killed even after Russian intervention.

Why don't you bitch over Israel who, when losing a single man, kills 50 people, which happens quite often and nobody gives a shit. Now that is about Russia, is ohohoh a genocide, ruthless killing, blah blah, bombing soverign states ... While who opposes US and Israel must be bombed, they are terrorists, ruthless dictators, muslim fundamentalists etc.

And there are plenty of puppet states in the world.

 

[Dumblor]

People die in war.
By the way, I don't know, but the news on my tv told that Russians robbed Georgian(ossetian maybe, forgot really) villages. And is independence of regions that belong to Georgia a real retalation against those few soldiers that died ? All they need is a pretext, and you can see tanks rolling in your backyard...

 

[Masiah]

Russia is intolerant. They only needed a pretext to attack georgia.

...Intolerant? Intolerant in which way?
About the pretext... this may sound cruel, but it's like saying that the 11-S was America's pretext to invade Irak. I personaly hope it's not, a country sacrificing it's own citizens to have a reason to invade an onother nation is a really sad irony...

Those deaths were the pretext. I mean, attacking because you lost 15 or whatever peacekeepers ?

Count the victims. Please.

It is most likely that Osetia and Abhazia are Russia's puppet states.

Never heard of the Banana Union?

THERE IS SO MUCH PROPAGANDA IN THERE!

While in the rest of the world is flooded with anti-Russia propaganda. And most of it based on completely faked information. For example, an interview made in the spanish television to a French representantive of the EU had an interesting translation: this man said "We shall not support Russia nor Georgia untill we have gathered enough information about what is really happening there" while the translator said "We shall not support Russia". Too obvious... TV companies like to create scandals, they gain money from them.

Medvedev looks like hero and acts like one, but in reality he's just a puppet of Putin. I mean. You are Premier but you have more power than the president !?

Indeed? And what proofs do you have to support this information?

I live in a country that was occupied by russians and I know what kind of snakes they are.

Which country exactly? (I'll just try to ignore that you are stating that Russia is the DEVIL in person)

Acting like heroes ihn theyre tv. Medvedev looks like he's a good actor .

Tell me just one leader of a nation that isn't an actor. Just one.

Son of a bitch...

Watch your mouth or I'll bite you with my venom-tipped fangs. I'm a snake, remember?

People die in war.

By the way, I don't know, but the news on my tv told that Russians robbed Georgian(ossetian maybe, forgot really) villages.

One incident of rogue soldiers who were punished afterwards, as far as I know.

 

[Slivar]

un gave scansion to invade Iraq. Most if not all of the stuff you get is true but most has been watered down. The wonder of the internet is that i can watch news from all parts of the globe... Medvedev is its common knowledge a freak en hamster can see it Russia isnt ready and will never be ready for a "full or a democracy" like the US the people couldn't handle it in a documentary its even noted by a Russian official that it would never work. I have family ties to a communist country and they are doing fine some stuff isnt cool what they do but for the most part its fine i try not to let my preconceptions cloud my judgment. Masiah im not trying to offend you but you are really Russian sided i think your letting your direct ties to Russia affect your judgment.

 

[Ash]

un gave scansion to invade Iraq.

Wrong.

Most if not all of the stuff you get is true but most has been watered down. The wonder of the internet is that i can watch news from all parts of the globe...

Wrong

Medvedev is its common knowledge a freak en hamster can see it Russia isnt ready and will never be ready for a "full or a democracy" like the US the people couldn't handle it in a documentary its even noted by a Russian official that it would never work.

I have family ties to a communist country and they are doing fine some stuff isnt cool what they do but for the most part its fine i try not to let my preconceptions cloud my judgment. Masiah im not trying to offend you but you are really Russian sided i think your letting your direct ties to Russia affect your judgment.

In mother russia... No. I can't even think of a decent mother Russia meme for the crap you just spurted.

 

[Dumblor]

...Intolerant? Intolerant in which way?
About the pretext... this may sound cruel, but it's like saying that the 11-S was America's pretext to invade Irak. I personaly hope it's not, a country sacrificing it's own citizens to have a reason to invade an onother nation is a really sad irony...

Count the victims. Please.

Never heard of the Banana Union?

While in the rest of the world is flooded with anti-Russia propaganda. And most of it based on completely faked information. For example, an interview made in the spanish television to a French representantive of the EU had an interesting translation: this man said "We shall not support Russia nor Georgia untill we have gathered enough information about what is really happening there" while the translator said "We shall not support Russia". Too obvious... TV companies like to create scandals, they gain money from them.
Indeed? And what proofs do you have to support this information?

Which country exactly? (I'll just try to ignore that you are stating that Russia is the DEVIL in person)
Tell me just one leader of a nation that isn't an actor. Just one.
Watch your mouth or I'll bite you with my venom-tipped fangs. I'm a snake, remember?

One incident of rogue soldiers who were punished afterwards, as far as I know.

Yeah ? Then why russia doesn't withdraw it's forces from Georgia, as promised? And do you know Putin's backround ? And really, are you a russian ?

And what proofs do you have to support this information?

Do you follow the news? The premier was given more power than president before Medvedev came to "power"(contolled by putin obviuosly). Putin would remain as a President, but his cadencies expired. And from where I hail, it is more likely to recive russian propaganda than western. Though we aren't showed any propaganda.

 

[Aeroblyctos]

Yeah ? Then why russia doesn't withdraw it's forces from Georgia, as promised? And do you know Putin's backround ? And really, are you a russian ?

Why doesn't USA withdraw from IRAQ?

 

[Arvedui]

Why doesn't USA withdraw from IRAQ?

1.) That has nothing to do with this thread.
2.) Why don't jackasses withdraw from this thread?
3.) Because the USA didn't sign a cease fire saying that we would withdraw.


Oh hai, look at that.

 

[Ash]

Russia signed a ceasefire deal, but that deal didn't include the withdrawl of troops. It's a common misconception that even certain media sources report incorrectly.

 

[Aeroblyctos]

That has nothing to do with this thread.

Actually it somehow does. It's the same thing, invading other country. But hey, USA has been in there many year. Why then Russian should leave Georgia? At least both are doing samething: protecting innocent civilans.

Why don't jackasses withdraw from this thread?

Please don't insult me. This is friendly discussion.

Because the USA didn't sign a cease fire saying that we would withdraw.

Oh yea, right.

 

[Dumblor]

Russia signed a ceasefire deal, but that deal didn't include the withdrawl of troops. It's a common misconception that even certain media sources report incorrectly.

Actually, russia did promise... Heres the deal Medvedev agreed to and signed to... :
1. No recourse to the use of force.

2. Definitive cessation of hostilities.

3. Free access to humanitarian aid (addition rejected: and to allow the return of refugees).

4. Georgian military forces must withdraw to their normal bases of encampment.

5. Russian military forces must withdraw to the lines prior to the start of hostilities. While awaiting an international mechanism, Russian peacekeeping forces will implement additional security measures (addition rejected: six months).

6. Opening of international discussions on the modalities of lasting security in Abkhazia and South Ossetia (addition rejected: based on the decisions of the U.N. and the O.S.C.E.).

 

[Arvedui]

Actually it somehow does. It's the same thing, invading other country. But hey, USA has been in there many year. Why then Russian should leave Georgia? At least both are doing samething: protecting innocent civilans.

No it doesn't. This thread is about the war between Russia and Georgia.

It has NOTHING to do with the USA and Iraq. So stop crying about it. I'm sick and tired of this shit.

If you hate America so much fucking make a thread and I'll show you how dumb you really are.

Please don't insult me. This is friendly discussion.

I'll insult you because you fail at logic.

Oh yea, right.

What in god's name does that mean?

Russia signed a cease-fire with Georgia saying it would withdraw troops. It has not (the last time I checked, I'm back at school so I haven't been keeping up) done so. Oh hai.

See Dumblor's post.

 

[Ash]

While awaiting an international mechanism, Russian peacekeeping forces will implement additional security measures

Thank you.

Thus, russia bypasses the crap in the peace treaty by saying that the remaining forces are peace keepers.

 

[Dumblor]

No it doesn't. This thread is about the war between Russia and Georgia.

It has NOTHING to do with the USA and Iraq. So stop crying about it. I'm sick and tired of this shit.

If you hate America so much fucking make a thread and I'll show you how dumb you really are.



I'll insult you because you fail at logic.




What in god's name does that mean?

Russia signed a cease-fire with Georgia saying it would withdraw troops. It has not (the last time I checked, I'm back at school so I haven't been keeping up) done so. Oh hai.

See Dumblor's post.

Calm down

Thank you.

Thus, russia bypasses the crap in the peace treaty by saying that the remaining forces are peace keepers.

Peacekeeping forces not Heavily Armed. Do you know how peacekeeping looks ? Like why don't we drop a nuke or few to maintain peace, right? They could leave armed peacekeeping forces (for whatever reason), but not a whole army marching over Georgia.

 

[Aeroblyctos]

No it doesn't. This thread is about the war between Russia and Georgia.

It has NOTHING to do with the USA and Iraq. So stop crying about it. I'm sick and tired of this shit.

If you hate America so much fucking make a thread and I'll show you how dumb you really are.

Can I ask, you have to be from USA? Please try to respect the members of hive I have not insulted you in anyway and you are almost trying to kill me. You have to calm down now. ~post reported

I'll insult you because you fail at logic.

Logic, huh? I just tried to show you that Russian is not the only country in the world that is attacking to other countries.

What in god's name does that mean?

Actually nothing.

Russia signed a cease-fire with Georgia saying it would withdraw troops. It has not (the last time I checked, I'm back at school so I haven't been keeping up) done so. Oh hai.

If I remember right, there no exactly time when Russian have to withdraw.

 

[Ash]

Firstly, thanks for editing your post without telling me. I totally knew you'd done something so that I could reply with a good argument, oh well!

Peacekeeping forces not Heavily Armed. Do you know how peacekeeping looks ? Like why don't we drop a nuke or few to maintain peace, right? They could leave armed peacekeeping forces (for whatever reason), but not a whole army marching over Georgia.

Yes it is, and if you seriously don't believe that then you have problems.

Call me MGS4, but the world, very basically, works around a war economy. Without war, things would cease to function.

 

[Arvedui]

Can I ask, you have to be from USA? Please try to respect the members of hive I have not insulted you in anyway and you are almost trying to kill me. You have to calm down now. ~post reported

Oh no! Maybe you should try thinking before posting huh? Maybe you offend people without thinking?

You're post was wrong, off-topic, and offending. It has been reported.

Logic, huh? I just tried to show you that Russian is not the only country in the world that is attacking to other countries.

No. You said "Why doesn't USA withdraw from IRAQ?" to this post:

"Yeah ? Then why russia doesn't withdraw it's forces from Georgia, as promised? And do you know Putin's backround ? And really, are you a russian ?"

So as such, the discussion was about how the Russians did not remove their troops when they promised they would.

Then you come along and post something completely asinine that has nothing to do with the discussion.

The US did not sign a cease-fire, thus the hostilities have not ended. Russia and Georgia DID sign a cease-fire/withdrawal thus the hostilities should have ended, but haven't.

Understand now?

Actually nothing.

Fair enough.

If I remember right, there no exactly time when Russian have to withdraw.

There was no time limit, but if I remember correctly, Medvedev, said they would be out of Georgian territory within a couple days, or something. Which did not happen.

 

[Aeroblyctos]

Well, you are the one who made a few bad word to me. I just asked friendly a "counter attack" question.

 

[Arvedui]

Well, you are the one who made a few bad word to me. I just asked friendly a "counter attack" question.

This is ridiculously off-topic:

Actually, I was the first to "counter attack" to your bad post. If you notice I only replied after you.

ON-TOPIC: Russia hasn't coincided with the cease-fire agreements, but neither has Georgia, which is understandable with Russian forces still in their territory.

Someone please close this topic, it's been a diatribe of witlessness.

 

[Aeroblyctos]

This is ridiculously off-topic:

Yes it is, my mistake once again and I'm sorry about that.

Someone please close this topic, it's been a diatribe of witlessness.

I agree.

 

[brad.dude03]

~Thread Closed.

 

[Byaku]

This thread closed or error?

 

[The Last Istari]

I... have no clue.

Maybe Brad opened it back up and forgot to tell us? Because it was closed several hours ago.

 

[Byaku]

That's weird

 

[brad.dude03]

*If anyone reopened this thread (I'm in a hurry so I can't check) please feel free to leave a message next time*

~Thread Reclosed.