Hey SpasMaster! First of all I have to say that it's so far the best map I've played in Wc3, but I'm not goin to give You more compliments cause there's probably no end to them.
Secondly just to Your information I've played this map many times since 0.9.x updates (can't remember exactly which one played first). I've done it as well in singleplayer (with different heroes; well I actually tried with every one of them but didn't finish all runs due to certain circumstances ex. too low dmg, can't outheal, can't tank or was just poke-runnin which is boring) as together with my best friend (we completed in total 3 runs: one as necro/rogue in version where rogue got 20% evade passive; one as necro/paladin after paladin got his "Flash of Light"; and yesterday last time as mage/tidewar we did 1.3.8 version).
We did also several other tries but we didn't finish them due to connection problems, Wc3 errors, or just the come of new update of the map.
Now forgive me the chaos in my post but theres quite a lot I'd like to write and dunno with what should I start (I actually decided today morning to make this account to share my thoughts on that map and there's a lot of them since that 0.9.x time).
So now these are the bugs, unbalances, ideas and suggestions i have so far:
1. It was in previous versions and it still exists: the bug with golems control (in Library theres one big with divine armor and two other that you can controll in order to kill the big one). The left plate is bugged - it doesn't give back control over hero when his golem is killed; the hero is forever neutral, uncontrollable and disappears from left top index (theres only backpack left). It happened to me and also my friend; theres no way to unlock that hero by load game save, complete quests, kill bosses etc. However when the bugged player leaves and the other kills the big golem, he gains control back over the bugged hero. But still the bugged player can't control his bugget char.
2. Another bug we've found was when my friend (tidewarrior; yesterday) tried to make "Gladius". Well we got all resources, recipe but it didn't mix. I also tried to mix them in my inventory and it also didn't work.
3. "Hell" level is hella... easy. Only the first run gave us some hard time early (well it was necro/rogue so we didn't have a good tank early) but later it's almost too easy. I'd suggest making another level "Impossible" which would be different than other levels in strength magnitude. I mean ex. like on hell last boss got 100k hp then on impossible give him 500k~xkk (well id like to make it even more World of Warcraft like with ex. 125kk hp Lich King) and dmg range instead of 300-600 on Hell to hmm... 3000-6000 or even 6000-12000 on Impossible? So that instead of a run which on hell took us 6-7hrs to make it like 15-20hrs. Also adding like 50+% critical instead of 15% and ex. x% evasion, x% on being hit to summon x, x% lifesteal or even x% dmg dealt to hp, etc. Please acknowledge that idea.
4. MOAR SPELLS AND ABILITIES FOR MONSTERS AND BOSSES! I know that triggers give quite the hard time to make the monster cast a spell properly but just pls... sth like a boss with 10-15 different and skumbag spells definitely would be great; also minor monsters would have 2-7 or sth like that spells also.
5. Scepter of Queen Tiara. The tank got usually Charged Shield, low spell costs and not much healing abilities. The dps uses autoattacks, even if combined with spells they still have low costs and usually dps at some point in game just can't run oom. So the only thing left is caster. Then my suggestion is:
- 10% of int into mana on spellcast that heals is awesome. I wouldn't change it. Moreover I'm not sure if this is planned or it's a bug but when you got Dawn (the fourth legendary item which heals you 40hp on every spellcast) you gain that 10% of int into mana every time you cast a spell cause Scepter of QT sees that spell as it is actually used to heal so it triggers (if this isn't planned then pls don't fix/change it. It gives a nice mana sustain to casters which spam spells ex. mage).
- 3% of agi into mana every attack. Hmm... Spellcasters don't have later too much autoattack action so I'd think about changing it ex. every time you take dmg (not you are hit but take dmg) you gain 1% of your agi into mana. Or sth like that.
- 2% of strength into hp everytime you are hit. Pretty good, not too op not too underpowered but according to previous change I like "everytime you TAKE DAMAGE" so I'd change to that and lower from 2% to 1% of strength.
6. Diabolic Scepter? You lowered from 2 to 1 hp but 1.5 sec cd is just too much. Ofc the same effect can be achieved by good timing in spellcasts covering that cd with your spells cd but still I assume that you did it due to ppl stacking 6 Diabolic Scepters and wandering around with 30k hp. I'd suggest making ALL of items do NOT stack. Well it would prevent another ex. dk walking with 6 thornmails and healing himself more than the surrounding can do to him (blood presence). On top of that it would make players think bout builds rather than buying several identical items that are simply good.
7. I heard that you might put mana shield into that map. Good idea but... instead of making it absorb 100% dmg and drain like 10 mana for 1 point of dmg make it absorb 33% of dmg (range between 25%~50% would do great) and make just absorb 1 point of dmg for 1 point of mana. Don't also forget to give such mana shields to some bosses and monsters... ;p Moreover I've got an idea for item with such mana shield - mix it with spell absorb shield (Crystal Belt was it?). An item with ex. 20%~40% spell dmg reduct, equip: 30s cd spell shield and use toggle mana shield. Good def item for squishy heroes who dies whenever they take a stun.
8. Warlord - his aoe skill is... target spell? why not make it aoe like paladin's Divine Storm (not needed enemy unit to target and cast on).
9. Druid - previous versions druid was better idea than the latest one...
10. Spellbreaker - kinda useless passive that adds int and agi for each nearby spellcast (doesn't stack); could be exchanged for some active like mana drain or could be given only 3s~6s duration but stackable.
11. Spells that do only base flat dmg (don't consider ones that do dmg based on enemy's max/current hp). Pls, man, even if you would have to give sth like only 10~20% of ex. strength to those spells... Pls just do it. It feels kinda pathetic and limiting having only base dmg...
12. At some point while wandering in Master's Chamber location dunno how I got vision on the inside of left door. To not spoiler I won't write here what's inside. ;p Same goes for vision on Dawn's recipe when you are on stairs near to it.
13. Priest - noone plays him cause other int heroes' heals are enough. Just make him heal like other casters can now and lower their heals.
14. Rekst's mission is bugged. After it's completed (Rekst's skull given to that druid and reward recived) in journal its still uncompleted.
15. This is more like a question: Whats with the last undiscovered mission? The one on top of journal. Is it related to that strange 20lvl naga with undestroyable divine armor and 12hp near waterfalls, bridge and secret arena?
16. Case with secret arena as in 15 point - the one near that naga. I was in singleplayer and just fell down into water while walking the way to that secret arena. So I fell into water and swam (I was tidewarrior at that time) down and I've found... Well You should know what I've found and if I'm not wrong it's not invented to be accessable for any player. Also when I use those "ancient elevators"
a lil to much I can walk down and climb up like nothin without using them.
17. Well it's more like repeating myself but you actually can fight the god of that city and... Is it a joke? I know that hes not the last boss but still hes a god so he should be on pair with the last boss (or actually make HIM the last boss). Well not much will change since the last boss also was damn too easy even on hell.
P
18. Since I've nearly fallen in love in mage due to her spell setup and gameplay... I'm goin to stick here some of my thoughts on her and ideas I'd like to see in future:
- Arcane Mastery? You got 10%+1% per 10 int chance to reset cd of spell; cd of passive is 1s. Hmm Best suited skill for mage. early you don't have too much mana so you don't need it that much and later it allows you to sorry... SHIT OUT nice burst dmg. The % is actually balanced but I'd make it no cd OR even more without cd but spells cd will be reduced to 1s~3s (can be depending on spell initial cd) when it triggers. Why? I'll answer that question using next spells.
- Living Bomb? That one that deals 10+250% int dmg in aoe. And for 50 mana? Hmm... Too good for poke'n run and harass. And also I'd change that for some passive so mage wouldn't be able to sprint compared to other heroes in early through monster camps. The idea for passive? Well since I really like the idea of 10%+1% per 10 int it would be that. And what would it do? Sth that makes mage with wonderful 290hp at lvl1 don't go down in 2 shots early and allow to survive a stun later - absorption shield (or just absorption). I mean: You got 10%+1% per int chance each time you TAKE DAMAGE to absorb for the next 3s~12s an amount of damage equal to 50%~200% of your int. This effect can't trigger more often than 3s~12s (equal to duration time).
- Pyroblast - pretty good but for an explayer of World of Warcraft it's lame. I mean combine it with Living Bomb and some damage over time. A good singletarget fireball that deals dmg to ex. 250 circle range from target and set everythin on fire for x sec.
- Ring of Frost - another overpowered early-mid-late poke'n run and harass spell. The 3s stun makes monsters act neutral even if you give them your whole combo in their face and go out of their vision range. Also again as WoW explayer I'd recommend it instant stun to units around mage. Not target spell but just like Frozen Nova in WoW - when you get surrounded you can freeze them and try to run.
- heal - the best heal in the game. Rly. Priest kneels down and necro kisses your feet. I'd lower the initial heal (50% more when under 25% of hp actually can be left), make some portion to heal over time and lower the range of arena.
- ulti - well I considered ult into Ring of Frost in this suggestion. So... considering her passive I'd recommend... Another passive.
Rly while on last boss and with enough % mana per cast I got to 11k dps with only 250~300 int. She just got too many spells but still the passive is great to leave alone so lets limit the active spells! And for ult: level1 gives pyroblast aoe effect, ring of frost stun, and heal gives heal over time. Level2 gives pyroblast damage over time, ring of frost hmm... attack speed and ms reduction after the stun? and heal area of effect heal. And maybe some enchanted effect for absorb shield passive?
Well that's my ideal mage I can't force it upon You. What a pity...
19?. Bordo? - the zombie boss. Actually... SUMMON MOAR STRONK ZOMBIES, MOAR ZOMBIES.
20. Chaoseater - well you buy one, you go on the mentioned zombie boss and even without boost to zombie-making you kill only zombies and after like 30 min you end up with additional... 1000 dmg;p Pretty gamebreaking; I'd recommend leaving attack damage alone to only primar stats.
21. Primar stats that gives attack damage - pretty wierd when mage actually can deal from auto the same damage as agi heroe like rogue later on. Why not make Primar stats give somethin different? And make Strength give x (0.75?) damage per point and agi give x MAXIMUM damage per point. I mean to increase range between minimal and maximal damage (or vice versa str to max and agi to actual).
22. Think about starting class items. Ex. dk's starting item is actually now one of best items for dk the whole game.
23. Gold per sec items op. I've bought the one that gives 1g per 3s as first and as sec item that charm that gives 1g per 4s. It seemes like they stack and after 6hrs of play my friend without any of them got like 8k gold gathered (he was selling ALL the stuff we found, ALL and he was given ALL gold we found, ALL) and I got... 17k gold.
24. Beastmaster - dunno how others think but I've played him only once and it was the most unpleasant try comparing to other heroes. He's lame, squishy and doesn't deal that much damage. Think about rework.
25. Add arena or PvP system. I mean ex. when you are waiting for like 50g or are just fed and want to spare a lil time instead of waiting you could fight your teammates. Sth like that gives 1 more life for both pvping players; pvp can be quit after death of one of them; the winner gets -1 lives (if using life system). You know that feeling when You and Your friend is pretty fed and You just want to give it a try to duel.
26. Well... After the kill of last boss its like... end? Why not give it (maybe only on hell and eventually impossible level) mission to escort those low hp goblins all the way back to Your camp but... The demon lord (or Atalai if the god would be last boss considering my previous idea) put a curse again just before his death so now everywhere there will be spawning armies of dead? Or sth like that. Just when You killed the last boss and got all possible items You have to face the last crazy wave.
27. Another question: any hints on the active skill on Scepter of Queen Tiara?
28. Sapper - when dying he deals 1000% damage to everyone around and his ult, nuclear bomb deals just 300%? a bit wierd I'd change those two. Also his passive "Napalm" doesn't work when used on a creature that you don't see (damage from skill shows and is dealt but the passive doesn't trigger. Same goes for actual mage's Ring of Frost but it just do nothin - no dmg, no stun).
29. More unique items found on map for different classes!
30. More traps; More kinds of traps ex. pitfall trap that You fall down and only Your teammate can dig yYou out or like in previous versions You fall down into Hydra Matriarch lair and have to kill her in order to be able to escape or You are tped to a room with a brain breaking game which you have to win in order to leave; Moving walls (idea from Alien vs Predator movie - a labirynth that exchanges its shape every single lever); More energy walls;
31. Areas that need to split up in order to complete them/be able to go into boss room/be able to complete quest etc. Ex. two ways that need to be done at the same time in order to use levers which opens the further path of the other way.
32. Combine 30 and 31 in order to get mini games that needs to split up with teammate (well I've read that you prefer multiplayer rather than singleplayer so thats why im giving such anti-singleplayer ideas; but don't make eventual splitups for more than 2 players)
33. Well items like Mote of Fire and Temple Tablet need 100% drop chance from certain creature; also for that relic alongsite Temple Tablet "Orb of Light"? or sth like that. There are skumbag games in which You get no ex. Mote of Fire and You say bye bye to Your Sulfuras of Ragnaros. ;p
34. When You got full build, max level and You simply shine with awesomeness theres only last boss/two last bosses left. You don't have time to enjoy Your godlike character - here comes the previous idea of the last stand army of death mission to protect goblins or sth like that.
35. Resurrection stone's teleportation op. At least too low cd. At least too instant teleport. Imagine the You are stupid and You go into stronger boss room. Imagine that You are gettin Your ass kicked. No worries! Resurrection Stone saves the day!
36. I'm not sure about Wc3 map editor limits but instead of sticking new areas in tight places why not extend the map size and use some teleportation between them?
EDIT:
37. I've just remembered: the armor->agi ratio. You can easily get 200 agi in that game - its 20 armor. lets say You've put 18 points in armor from level gains and You are a lame spellcaster that starts with 2 armor. On top of that you have at least +10 armor from items and lets say that now You buy Titanum Shield which reduces incoming damage by 13. Now to sum it up we got something like 80%~90% damage reduction on a lame mage which isnt made to tank; so if someone hits us for ~100 he'll deal hmm... 0~1dmg^^ lets say last boss on hell hits us from critical for 1000 and you got like 3k hp (even with Diabolic Scepter later You won't go much higher than 3k) so U'll get lets say 150 dmg from armor reduct - 13 = 137. Well comparing to Your 3k hp and Your regen like 50hp/sec it's lame. Even no need for heal. Even no need for a tank. Even no need for a teammate.
Well not to mention that summons that last boss makes each of them hits you for 0~10dmg (20 at best possible circumstances). So maybe instead of 0.1 sth like 0.05? or even 0.025.
38. Hmm maybe some enchanting/jeweling system? I mean You got Your nice rare item then why not give it some boost through enchant; some more stats through upgrade and some more stats/abilities through jewels?
39. Maybe critical strikes on spellcasts? Different critical than for auto attack like lifesteal and hp steal from dmg dealt. But it would mean lowering spell dmg/increasing monsters spell resistance. :/ And also on pair with that maybe spell pene? (we got armor pene so why not; yes I am well aware of the fact that it's not that easy to make
)
40. Again my World of Warcraft experience - just as with Firelord, last boss try giving more "stages" to boss battles. Well really helpfull here would be a custom Wc3 map "Impossible Bosses".
41. Ad. 18 about Arcane Mastery. I've written that I got like 11k dps on last boss - the passive seems to work no with 1s cd for all spells but 1s cd for each spell that means actually each spell gains 1s cd with good timing rather than theres 1s global cd.
Ad. 3 about Hell level beeing too easy. I should also mention that as well in singleplayer as well in multi with friend we've ALWAYS played on hell difficulty with only one starting life. So don't think that I tell You it's easy after 24 deaths in row with 6 lives left.
Also we do not save/load when we die - it's lost run if we have no more lives left. (around 2~3 so far)
42. Tidewarriors Razorspine Scales always heal for 50, doesn't increase up to 200.
43. Maybe "select target" skill for shops so that there wouldn't be the problem with selling to backpack?
EDIT END
Well thats all so far that I remember. I'll talk with friend if we happen to remember something more I'll eventually write it. I'd normally send You all the replays of our games (and maybe my singleplayers also) but 1. I have no idea how to make replay from lan game (well at least I've got save) and I don't have the previous ones cause a few days ago I've reinstalled Wc3 and everyhin is lost.
I know I might be boring now but I'd really like to see the idea of Impossible level, changed mage, described terrain changes and pvp/arena system. Well to be not modest together with friend we loose lives on hell only when using Wc3s smart auto pathway finding while theres a trap on the way Wc3 selects and in the meantime... we are checking somethin on the net.
Hope I helped. Again sorry it's so chaotic and long.
Approved
