Replace W3 Classic Models with Reforged

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Hi, I was wondering if there is a way to replace W3 Classic models with reforged, so there would be no need to download tons of gigabytes of reforged only for HD UI
Since editing models in W3 is possible, then what keeps people from not replacing SD models with HD models and get Reforged experience in old patches like 1.26a ?
 

pyf

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Fyi, the HD models included in v1.32.x are paid assets. Therefore, are you wondering if one can have some kind of surrogate Reforged experience for free, on an outdated version of the game?

... and out of curiosity, why did you not mention instead, for example, the WC3 HD models that come with SC2? Or the already converted ones from WoW? Why specifically the ones that come with Reforged?
 
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Because I'm interested in playing with reforged models, since it is the same game, same model structure and etc
 

Dr Super Good

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Since editing models in W3 is possible, then what keeps people from not replacing SD models with HD models and get Reforged experience in old patches like 1.26a ?
Time causality.

The developers in the past could not make Warcraft III compatible with Reforged models because Reforged models, and the technology needed to render them in realtime, did not exist back in 2003 odd when they were making Warcraft III. The technology to support them was only added alongside Reforged so is only available in recent versions of Warcraft III released along side and after Reforged.

On top of that there is an issue with copyright and licencing since you are effectively trying to defeat the pay wall around the Reforged assets which is not something any company will stand around and let happen.

Technically it is possible to port the Reforged assets to a classic mdx format. However the result is unlikely to look good or perform well due to losing a lot of the advanced rendering features the models depend on such as complicated texture layers and shader effects.
 
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Technically it is possible to port the Reforged assets to a classic mdx format. However the result is unlikely to look good or perform well due to losing a lot of the advanced rendering features the models depend on such as complicated texture layers and shader effects.
Im looking for this, exporting an mdx model and using it in W3, even if it is just for fun and nothing really important
 
so there would be no need to download tons of gigabytes of reforged only for HD UI
But the assets themselves are the major contributors to those gigabytes, not the Reforged UI.

what keeps people from not replacing SD models with HD models and get Reforged experience in old patches like 1.26a ?
As Dr Super Good has touched on, Reforged models would look crude without the additional files that accompany them. Those same files are not usable in SD. The models would need a texture overhaul to look good in SD, and that comes with the cost of not having the responsiveness to lighting and the gloss that is possible in Reforged. That makes all the difference. Model conversion from HD to SD would not be the Reforged experience, nor anywhere near it.
 
Because I'm interested in playing with reforged models, since it is the same game, same model structure and etc
No. Noooooo. In the words of J Allen Brack, "Nooooo. You do not want that, to do that. You think you do, but you don't."

I am a person with the technical knowledge to more or less do what you are asking. During Reforged Beta I developed a computer program to sort of "unwind" the Reforged installation's assets and rewrite it as a 1.26 mod. I was simply curious, as a human, about the possibility and about the technology. I also wanted to prove to someone who was asking me... that it was a bad idea. The conversion process, since it needed to process 30 GB, was very slow until I parallelized it and got it running on all cores of my 12 core CPU simultaneously. As I recall, this caused my computer to make a loud noise as it ran near full capacity for about 30 minutes.

When this was complete I beheld the most stupid and terrible Patch 1.26 mod in existence. It had its own 3d HD Menu background back in the beta before they switched to the HTML Reforged UI. And so yes, these files were "compatible" with 1.26 after the conversion, except that they weren't. We hit the limit on the mesh data and 3D files would graphically explode. The menu was an epilepsy danger. I recorded about 30 seconds of gameplay on this mod in a video titled "This is why we can't have nice things" to prove to whoever it was that had asked me to do this that they do not actually want to do it.


After about 30 seconds something happened that surpasses my understanding. The game went into a "black state" due to memory corruption probably due to the exploded models and to be honest I forget if it crashed after this or if I closed the game for fear of damaging my computer.

I quoted you because this claim you make, "since it's the same game, same model structure" is, in my opinion, a technologically uninformed claim. If you think about how you can convert a PNG image to a GIF, but you cannot convert a GIF to a PNG because the PNG has no way to store animations, it is similar to this. A PNG can store an image, and a GIF can store an image that might be animated. In the same way, the Reforged MDX format can store the 1.26 MDX models as well as the Reforged HD models. But the 1.26 MDX format cannot store the Reforged HD models.
Even my backwards translation program that I created for the sake of example was throwing away substantial portions of the art that cannot be stored in the old format. Although it would be possible to create further iteration on the stupid project I created, it would from my standpoint be a waste of time.
You can see in the video the footmen do not animate, for example. I could fix that and then reconvert the whole game again. I did not back then know that Reforged MDX allows out of order sequences when Legacy MDX does not, and so my converter did not reorder sequences, which would have been necessary. In addition, I think that the model explosion may have been due to creating more than 256 vertex groups which would overflow the 8 bit unsigned ID system, although I forget. If that is true, then we could update the converter to split the model into more pieces that each individually do not overflow the 8 bit unsigned ID system.
I was also once criticized by someone who said that my direct use of diffuse textures instead of baking all Reforged textures together into a composite texture for the old diffuse-only system was also my own fault and not proof that the conversion is impossible. Sure, but, I do not care. Even if we assume a static daytime light and bake based on this, models who use the same texture in two places might now need two textures... we're talking about driving up the complexity of the backport script a lot. But I suppose if you did then you could also bring back teamcolor in most cases when it was not used side-by-side with alpha (which while legal on HD is literally impossible in SD without an artist splitting the model into bits and choosing different materials on different bits).

So you solve all that and then you realize that reading from pkb or fafx to produce something compatible with 1.26 is harder than reading from protected maps, and so you lose all particles and portrait mouth movements.

To be honest this is just a stupid project idea that is not worth it at all once you understand the technicalities. If you want to play Reforged, then just buy Reforged... seriously.

Edit: Although I have no intention of supporting this nonsense, while I was testing the above video I wanted a way to convert a single model file at a time rather that only being able to convert the whole game at a time. This was faster to test with to find bugs. I had been testing on the Paladin prior to converting the whole game, which is how his model in the video is the only one that doesnt look like completely broken garbage. During my test I added a button for "HD -> SD" conversion in Retera Model Studio. I meant to delete this button before publishing the next version of Retera Model Studio, but I forgot. Later I found ignorant people were actually trying to use it.
And one time I heard a rumor that some ignorant people might have spent a very long time clicking that button over and over on every model in Reforged to build a mod. Maybe it was Argentina, I forget. You should not click that button over and over. Side-by-side with it I developed a way to convert the entire game which I never published. If you were going to be stupid, at least do it in an automated way so you only spend 30 minutes of your life learning your lesson...
 
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Dr Super Good

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The mesh corruption is based on some total amount of complexity on display. In normal Warcraft III it used to be possible to make it occur simply by spamming 100s of Tauren Chieftains (or other complex models like town halls) on screen at the same time.

It could very well have been a limitation set by the Direct3D7 to 8 and OpenGL equivalent level technology that was originally used as Warcraft III used the fixed function render pipelines rather than programmable shader based ones.
 
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No. Noooooo. In the words of J Allen Brack, "Nooooo. You do not want that, to do that. You think you do, but you don't."

I am a person with the technical knowledge to more or less do what you are asking. During Reforged Beta I developed a computer program to sort of "unwind" the Reforged installation's assets and rewrite it as a 1.26 mod. I was simply curious, as a human, about the possibility and about the technology. I also wanted to prove to someone who was asking me... that it was a bad idea. The conversion process, since it needed to process 30 GB, was very slow until I parallelized it and got it running on all cores of my 12 core CPU simultaneously. As I recall, this caused my computer to make a loud noise as it ran near full capacity for about 30 minutes.

When this was complete I beheld the most stupid and terrible Patch 1.26 mod in existence. It had its own 3d HD Menu background back in the beta before they switched to the HTML Reforged UI. And so yes, these files were "compatible" with 1.26 after the conversion, except that they weren't. We hit the limit on the mesh data and 3D files would graphically explode. The menu was an epilepsy danger. I recorded about 30 seconds of gameplay on this mod in a video titled "This is why we can't have nice things" to prove to whoever it was that had asked me to do this that they do not actually want to do it.


After about 30 seconds something happened that surpasses my understanding. The game went into a "black state" due to memory corruption probably due to the exploded models and to be honest I forget if it crashed after this or if I closed the game for fear of damaging my computer.

I quoted you because this claim you make, "since it's the same game, same model structure" is, in my opinion, a technologically uninformed claim. If you think about how you can convert a PNG image to a GIF, but you cannot convert a GIF to a PNG because the PNG has no way to store animations, it is similar to this. A PNG can store an image, and a GIF can store an image that might be animated. In the same way, the Reforged MDX format can store the 1.26 MDX models as well as the Reforged HD models. But the 1.26 MDX format cannot store the Reforged HD models.
Even my backwards translation program that I created for the sake of example was throwing away substantial portions of the art that cannot be stored in the old format. Although it would be possible to create further iteration on the stupid project I created, it would from my standpoint be a waste of time.
You can see in the video the footmen do not animate, for example. I could fix that and then reconvert the whole game again. I did not back then know that Reforged MDX allows out of order sequences when Legacy MDX does not, and so my converter did not reorder sequences, which would have been necessary. In addition, I think that the model explosion may have been due to creating more than 256 vertex groups which would overflow the 8 bit unsigned ID system, although I forget. If that is true, then we could update the converter to split the model into more pieces that each individually do not overflow the 8 bit unsigned ID system.
I was also once criticized by someone who said that my direct use of diffuse textures instead of baking all Reforged textures together into a composite texture for the old diffuse-only system was also my own fault and not proof that the conversion is impossible. Sure, but, I do not care. Even if we assume a static daytime light and bake based on this, models who use the same texture in two places might now need two textures... we're talking about driving up the complexity of the backport script a lot. But I suppose if you did then you could also bring back teamcolor in most cases when it was not used side-by-side with alpha (which while legal on HD is literally impossible in SD without an artist splitting the model into bits and choosing different materials on different bits).

So you solve all that and then you realize that reading from pkb or fafx to produce something compatible with 1.26 is harder than reading from protected maps, and so you lose all particles and portrait mouth movements.

To be honest this is just a stupid project idea that is not worth it at all once you understand the technicalities. If you want to play Reforged, then just buy Reforged... seriously.

Edit: Although I have no intention of supporting this nonsense, while I was testing the above video I wanted a way to convert a single model file at a time rather that only being able to convert the whole game at a time. This was faster to test with to find bugs. I had been testing on the Paladin prior to converting the whole game, which is how his model in the video is the only one that doesnt look like completely broken garbage. During my test I added a button for "HD -> SD" conversion in Retera Model Studio. I meant to delete this button before publishing the next version of Retera Model Studio, but I forgot. Later I found ignorant people were actually trying to use it.
And one time I heard a rumor that some ignorant people might have spent a very long time clicking that button over and over on every model in Reforged to build a mod. Maybe it was Argentina, I forget. You should not click that button over and over. Side-by-side with it I developed a way to convert the entire game which I never published. If you were going to be stupid, at least do it in an automated way so you only spend 30 minutes of your life learning your lesson...
Thanks for brief explanation
So we ignore the 3D Models, What about Icons and UI ?
I do really like the Reforged Icons, Like the sword or move or etc, they are just the same bitmap images, is it possible for someone to extract all bitmap images from reforged and pack it as a usable resource in W3 1.26 ?
And Also is it possible to kind of implement the minimalistic UI of reforged in the W3 1.26 ? What Im asking is this topic
 

Dr Super Good

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I do really like the Reforged Icons, Like the sword or move or etc, they are just the same bitmap images, is it possible for someone to extract all bitmap images from reforged and pack it as a usable resource in W3 1.26 ?
You can do this yourself if you wish. Use CascView to extract them. Use GIMP to open the DDS files and export them as PNG or other lossless formats. Then use BLPLab to save them as BLP files which legacy versions of Warcraft III can load directly. TGA can also be used by legacy versions of Warcraft III directly to skip the use of BLPLab however the resulting files will be very big.

However as Ralle and myself pointed out, this might run into copyright issues as you are effectively trying to undermine the paywall of Reforged to some extent.

And Also is it possible to kind of implement the minimalistic UI of reforged in the W3 1.26 ? What Im asking is this topic
It is not really possible to lower the UI below where it is in classic as Warcraft III does not draw below the UI so there is effectively a huge black bar across the screen.
 

pyf

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Im looking for this, exporting an mdx model and using it in W3, even if it is just for fun and nothing really important
Thanks for brief explanation
So we ignore the 3D Models [...]

Why are you not interested anymore in experimenting, all of a sudden?

[...] What about Icons and UI ?
I do really like the Reforged Icons, Like the sword or move or etc, they are just the same bitmap images, is it possible for someone to extract all bitmap images from reforged and pack it as a usable resource in W3 1.26 ?
And Also is it possible to kind of implement the minimalistic UI of reforged in the W3 1.26 ? What Im asking is this topic

Are you wondering if one can have some kind of surrogate Reforged experience for free, on an outdated version of the game?

Also, based on the title of your own thread, you are off-topic.
:bored:

Because I'm interested in playing with reforged models, since it is the same game, same model structure and etc

Are you simply looking for ways to modify / improve your version of the game?
 

pyf

pyf

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@erfanmola: to pimp Legacy versions of the game, please refer to this post for example

In case you are looking for more detailed assets, you may visit the pages of the projects hosted on ModDB:
Do note that I do not use any of them myself, and I do not know which ones may work out of the box with v1.26a.
Maybe one day I will extract from them everything I need to create my own personal and private version of the game (note: I would probably restrict the use of higher poly 3D models to the Interludes only)

Please also do note that being a modding community, The Hive Workshop also has lots of great assets and is the home of many projects from many talented people, for you to try out and/or experiment with.


Regarding WFE, if the latest version does not give you satisfaction, then give v2.19 a try. I myself have to use this one to remove the parts of the console/interface I want gone.

About the stretching when using widescreen resolutions, for the record, tweaking some mdx files alone can already fix (or significantly improve) the cursors, the logos, the loading screens, the endscreen, the loadbar, the multiplayer screens, the scorescreens. Extra fixes / improvements can very certainly be achieved by editing the fdf files, but in that case one must run the game with an executable that allows to load more modified files than allowlocalfiles does. This is (for example) how the subtitles of the FMVs can be fixed.

Sorry, but hopes look extremely brim.
@Regno: believe.
:wink:
 

pyf

pyf

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@erfanmola:
So, have you followed my advice so far? Have you extracted and converted all the images from Reforged that you are interested in, from your copy of v1.32.10? And why are you not interested anymore in experimenting with 3D models, all of a sudden?

Speaking of any enhanced assets, please read this post, as a complement of sorts to what I have written previously and linked you to:

[...] I'm using 1.26a patch, Im looking for improvments, like removing 60fps limit and etc, I have tried so many ways, but still no luck [...]
Which ways have you tried so far, please?

I would like to point out what Mythic said already, the gigabytes that were specified as the issue will not go away if you just try to get the models into an older version, but all of their PBR-ness (all the properties of their materials) will.
One can merge any luma/glow, gloss, bump, normals etc. effects into a single diffuse texture. The result will not be dynamic ingame ofc, but it will improve the overall appearance of the 3D model regardless, especially when the diffuse textures are poor, because they were designed to rely on these extra effects to look good ingame.

What one has to remember with any enhanced assets, is that WC3 1.26a is not Large Address aware. This memory allocation restriction was alleviated/removed with v1.30.1. Some 32-bit games can be patched/hacked with a small tool so they may use RAM up to (/above?) 4GB (like for example Unreal Tournament v4.36). Other games can be patched/hacked to use more recent instruction sets (like Morrowind). These file manipulations are (very?) experimental and error prone, and do not work always for all games, obviously.
 
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Dr Super Good

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Some 32-bit games can be patched/hacked with a small tool so they may use RAM above 4GB (like for example Unreal Tournament v4.36).
This is unlikely to be the case for most game engines. Every single data structure with a pointer would need to be modified due to the pointer size increasing from 4 bytes to 8 bytes, something not easy to do without the source code. Without doing this, the application will likely bug out or crash once it reaches the 4 GB threshold.

That said it should be possible to get 32bit applications to become 4 GB aware on 64 bit OSes instead of the default 2 GB through changing some simple executable flags. As long as the application does not use the most significant bit of pointers for its own purposes it should just work.

Other games can be patched/hacked to use more recent instruction sets (like Morrowind).
Not sure what you mean by this. Do you mean modifying performance critical parts of the game engine to use more efficient recent vector instruction sets (AVX)? Or transpiling the code from an older instruction set, such as 16 bit x86 to a newer one such as x86-64 or some ARM based code?
 

pyf

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This is unlikely to be the case for most game engines. Every single data structure with a pointer would need to be modified due to the pointer size increasing from 4 bytes to 8 bytes, something not easy to do without the source code. Without doing this, the application will likely bug out or crash once it reaches the 4 GB threshold.

That said it should be possible to get 32bit applications to become 4 GB aware on 64 bit OSes instead of the default 2 GB through changing some simple executable flags. As long as the application does not use the most significant bit of pointers for its own purposes it should just work.
rotfl, I had just amended my post to read "they may use RAM up to (/above?) 4GB (like for example Unreal Tournament v4.36)", before reading your post.

The 4GB Patch is here, for those who are curious. The reason I amended my post is, it is recommended to use it with UT4.36 when using this DX11 renderer (v1.61) along with the HD4K Extreme Resolution Edition v3 Texture pack for Unreal and UT99, and with the High Resolution Unreal skins v3.1. Therefore the texture memory requirements blur the line here.

Because all these HD assets are really pushing the limits of poor legacy v4.36 UT99, one also has to limit the use of memory for the game engine to 8GB in the Advanced preferences settings of the game, else it would then become unstable.

These memory limitations/hazards do not exist anymore in the community developed 4.69 version.

Not sure what you mean by this. Do you mean modifying performance critical parts of the game engine to use more efficient recent vector instruction sets (AVX)? Or transpiling the code from an older instruction set, such as 16 bit x86 to a newer one such as x86-64 or some ARM based code?
I was referring to Morrowind EXE Optimizer:



Of course, I had already written about all this stuff in 2018:
nobody reads my posts, as always...
:slp:
 
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@erfanmola:
So, have you followed my advice so far? Have you extracted and converted all the images from Reforged that you are interested in, from your copy of v1.32.10? And why are you not interested anymore in experimenting with 3D models, all of a sudden?

Speaking of any enhanced assets, please read this post, as a complement of sorts to what I have written previously and linked you to:


Which ways have you tried so far, please?


One can merge any luma/glow, gloss, bump, normals etc. effects into a single diffuse texture. The result will not be dynamic ingame ofc, but it will improve the overall appearance of the 3D model regardless, especially when the diffuse textures are poor, because they were designed to rely on these extra effects to look good ingame.

What one has to remember with any enhanced assets, is that WC3 1.26a is not Large Address aware. This memory allocation restriction was alleviated/removed with v1.30.1. Some 32-bit games can be patched/hacked with a small tool so they may use RAM up to (/above?) 4GB (like for example Unreal Tournament v4.36). Other games can be patched/hacked to use more recent instruction sets (like Morrowind). These file manipulations are (very?) experimental and error prone, and do not work always for all games, obviously.
I tried to follow your instructions, but unfortunatly Im not a 3d Modeling expert and not familiar with gaming stuffs
 

Dr Super Good

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I was referring to Morrowind EXE Optimizer:
This falls under "modifying performance critical parts of the game engine to use more efficient recent vector instruction sets". They are moving it from the old FPU to SSE. That said in this day and age I doubt it will noticeably increase performance given how undemanding Morrowind is (should be...) to run. The crash stability might be due to improvements in how NAN and other edge case values are handled, or maybe that they bothered to write stable code to begin with (Elder Scroll games are traditionally crash prone messes).
 

pyf

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This falls under "modifying performance critical parts of the game engine to use more efficient recent vector instruction sets". They are moving it from the old FPU to SSE. That said in this day and age I doubt it will noticeably increase performance given how undemanding Morrowind is (should be...) to run. The crash stability might be due to improvements in how NAN and other edge case values are handled, or maybe that they bothered to write stable code to begin with (Elder Scroll games are traditionally crash prone messes).
This falls under 'patching/hacking video games to use more recent instruction sets', as I have written above. And as I have also written above, these file manipulations are (very?) experimental and error prone, and do not work always for all games, obviously.

As for Morrowind, there are many fan-made modifications (including game engine ones) that make the game more resources demanding. Like Morrowind Graphics Extender.

I tried to follow your instructions, but unfortunatly Im not a 3d Modeling expert and not familiar with gaming stuffs
You must read, learn and try again.


** Update **

That said it should be possible to get 32bit applications to become 4 GB aware on 64 bit OSes instead of the default 2 GB through changing some simple executable flags. As long as the application does not use the most significant bit of pointers for its own purposes it should just work.
For documentation purposes (which I am sure nobody here on THW will care to read and/or to remember), I am pointing out that 32-bit OSes like Windows XP can use more or less 3GB of RAM (less than more tbh) to run a single program, by modifying the boot.ini, and if all the prerequisites are met for this memory hungry application to run (most notably, any third-party drivers have to load from the top of this now available memory). Explanations and a working example, are provided below:


I have no doubt I will have to remind everybody of this, in less than three years.
:slp:
 
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Dr Super Good

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For documentation purposes (which I am sure nobody here on THW will care to read and/or to remember), I am pointing out that 32-bit OSes like Windows XP can use more or less 3GB of RAM (less than more tbh) to run a single program, by modifying the boot.ini, and if all the prerequisites are met for this memory hungry application to run (most notably, any third-party drivers have to load from the top of this now available memory). Explanations and a working example, are provided below:
Windows XP was available as a 64-bit edition. Just due to a lack of driver support and limited need it never saw wide spread use outside of industry. Who had more than 4 GB of total system memory anyway?
 

pyf

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Based on the hypothesis this is not a rhetorical question nor a red herring to derail the thread, I would say those using Windows Server 2003 (which also came as a 64-bit edition as well) on Intel Xeon hardware

XP64 was to the NT world what Windows Millenium was to the W9x one. Nobody really cared for any of these OSes, and Microsoft did not try hard to market them properly either afaik and iirc. For the average Joe, there already were XP and W98SE and these users did not care for 64-bit applications (which btw did not really take off nor became really mainstream until 2013 imho). As for the professionals, they already had Windows 2000 [Advanced] Server, or Windows Server 2003, or even NT4. Not surprisingly, the support for Server 2003 lasted longer than the one for XP64, yet not as long as the unofficial one for XP (until 2019 at least for its POSReady 2009 variant)

Back when Vista and 7 had been released, it was not uncommon to have 32-bit versions of these OSes shipping with pre-built computers with 3GB RAM. Because some wanted to make the most out of that much RAM (which would have been expensive and error prone to buy in 2002) they would install XP instead, and maybe buy 1GB extra RAM. That was all in the late 2000 - early 2010s, when XP was still officially supported by Microsoft. ofc those who had opted for pre-built computers shipping with 64-bit versions of Vista or 7 may have opted for computers with 4GB RAM, but not more as it would have been more expensive, and the average Joes of the early 2010s did not need more RAM at that time anyway.


For those who would want to know more about Project Cars (which is a 2015 game) and its official system requirements:

The example I have provided above demonstrates how, on 32-bit editions of Windows such as Windows XP, the virtual address space that is available to an application can be increased up to 3 GB, at the expense of the amount available to the system, based on a total virtual address space of 4GB, provided all the other conditions and prerequisites are met for this to work.
 
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Don't want to read all. I exactly do what you want and is pretty good. Just watch this video:
But first go to the group named Warcraft 3 resources on facebook, all share their models and almost all of them have been converted to classic.
 
I exactly do what you want and is pretty good.
Edit: Although I have no intention of supporting this nonsense, while I was testing the above video I wanted a way to convert a single model file at a time rather that only being able to convert the whole game at a time. This was faster to test with to find bugs. I had been testing on the Paladin prior to converting the whole game, which is how his model in the video is the only one that doesnt look like completely broken garbage. During my test I added a button for "HD -> SD" conversion in Retera Model Studio. I meant to delete this button before publishing the next version of Retera Model Studio, but I forgot. Later I found ignorant people were actually trying to use it.
And one time I heard a rumor that some ignorant people might have spent a very long time clicking that button over and over on every model in Reforged to build a mod. Maybe it was Argentina, I forget. You should not click that button over and over. Side-by-side with it I developed a way to convert the entire game which I never published. If you were going to be stupid, at least do it in an automated way so you only spend 30 minutes of your life learning your lesson...
Watching your video kind of made me sad from deep inside... I guess it was slightly reassuring when I realized the video was created before I posted the above message, but still...

Maybe we should delete this thread?
 
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Watching your video kind of made me sad from deep inside... I guess it was slightly reassuring when I realized the video was created before I posted the above message, but still...

Maybe we should delete this thread?
I don't know exactly what you're saying here, you mean its like a misfortune that this can be done? Cus I think that way to covnert models for classic its pretty simple and useful.
 
its like a misfortune that this can be done
Yeah, maybe it is.

Users should either play the classic game in the classic style, or else buy the Reforged game for the option to play in the Reforged style.

Doing the rips of the Reforged style that don't even have the shaders and don't look good, to then put them in classic, will:
  • Reduce the consistency of classic assets for people who want the classic only feel and do not want Reforged
  • Encourage classic players to think this is how Reforged assets look (when it actually looks much better on Reforged) further dividing the players
  • Steal from potential Reforged revenue making updates less likely for users who really enjoy Reforged style

So, it's kind of like a way of hurting everyone else. I know maybe life can feel bad sometimes but I think it's wrong to hurt everyone else.
 
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Blizzard is a criminal organization. I do not care what they should think. They should be punished, and some of their staff should go to prison. But I also would not mess with this matter much because I do not want Hive to have problems with those ,,Reforged to Wc3" conversions. I see this thread as ,,gray line", it is not a stealing or copyright issue yet, there is no proof that guys actually did it. But you all should be cautious. Because that gray line could be easily crossed.
 
Blizzard is a criminal organization. I do not care what they should think. They should be punished, and some of their staff should go to prison.
M'kay. Then please don't support the "criminals" by trying to port their new artwork into my favorite childhood video game.

Conversely, for the people who do not see them as criminals, we should not steal their work. So, as a result, from either viewpoint: don't convert Reforged models to Wc3.

Thanks.
 
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M'kay. Then please don't support the "criminals" by trying to port their new artwork into my favorite childhood video game.
Agreed completely. I never intended to do this. But I see that some people are up to.
Conversely, for the people who do not see them as criminals, we should not steal their work.
That is irrelevant how someone ,,sees" them. That company has been falsely advertising product, which is a crime. And after that, company refused to give money back, until mass rebellion happen for days, which is a crime as well. And punishable in many countries. That company is in courts now for many offenses. You have tons of articles about them. Their manager, that woman quit and told to gave to inspections tons of papers against Blizzard what they did. Just lately, they reported that their CEO back then told to his employee that he will kill her one day. The lastest article about them which I saw recently is that some women accursed them that they stole several times their breast milk. Some women have babies, and put their breast milk in the fridge. And idiots stole that many times. I never heard about anything similiar to that. So, how someone ,,sees" them does not matter at all. That matters of subjective perspective. I am speaking objectively. You have many biased people towards criminals and that is oK. That old Blizzard that gave us Wc3 is a completely different company from shithole now.

So, as a result, from either viewpoint: don't convert Reforged models to Wc3.
Yes yes I completely agree on that with you.
 
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