Reforged Recap: The Future of Warcraft: Part II

[StoPCampinGn00b]

01 July 2019

Here lies a previously unreleased article re-purposed for the WC3 Anniversary Week! We trace the community build-up leading all the way right up to the Reforged announcement at Blizzcon. We share about the experience, give a big recap on what we know about the game, and signal what to take away from it.

The Return

During last BlizzCon 2018, Warcraft III: Reforged was announced and the spotlight finally returned to one of the most genre defining PC games, ever. Reforged is a complete re-imagining of both Reign of Chaos and The Frozen Throne, and it is evident that this is much more than just a graphical remaster with widespread upgrades often only seen in expansions. Whether this stems from the ever so boundless modding and custom game scene, the exciting competitive thrills of esports and the ladder, or the unbreakable passion behind the campaign's lore and stories, this never could have happened without the community and its beloved creations.

Three years ago back in 2016, long time Hive members @Kam and @PurgeandFire visited the Blizzard headquarters in representation of the community's needs and wishes for Warcraft III amidst some rumors around the job openings and new patch. Prior to that, pro players from China did the same. Over time, the community built off of these new beginnings and other representatives increasingly came into contact with the classic team. Back2Warcraft and Blizzard even hosted its first pro-player invitational in years. This initiative left an erasable impact not only on Hive, but for both the game and communities abroad. Patch after patch, the game slowly showed new life but also hardships to get to where we are now.


The Unveil

This time, @TriggerHappy and @StoPCampinGn00b had the pleasure of being invited to BlizzCon 2018 and a Monday summit at Blizz HQ - but it wasn't just us! Faces like the legendary Grubby, our superstar partners from Back2Warcraft, and other players and representatives from around the world joined together to channel the community's early Reforged feedback to the classic team. Familiar faces including the likes of @MindWorX were also gleefully present, but this time on the developer side the table.

Those who were at BlizzCon had the chance to play RoC Human Mission #6: The Culling - as indicated by the artwork above. Just like the chapter, this announcement was a key turning point for Warcraft. The game felt and played 100% like Warcraft III as we purged baked innocent, infected, villagers as Arthas in glorious 4k resolution.

After Blizzcon, us invitees were escorted to the Monday summit in Irvine to attend a presentation, meet with the developers, and extensively play-test an early build of Reforged. Melee matches and a couple custom maps were played. TriggerHappy even got his hands on the editor. The classic team, partners, players, and community members alike were all excited beyond belief. The developers had an excellent understanding of the importance of feedback and yes, have been looking into many communities for a constant flow of feedback.

Everything, including the art, gameplay, modding, esports, readability, social features, suggested content, lore concerns, battle.net functions, server layout, custom game compatibility, and more was thoroughly discussed 'till the sun set. You bet tons of tabs of the Blizz forums, Hive forums, W3U/B2W/etc Discords, Warcraft subreddits, social media, and more where thousands of pieces of feedback accumulated over the weekend were always open during these discussions. There is an enormous amount of information that we would like to share, but there is also a tremendous amount of information that is still being looked at or is behind bars at the moment.

DISCLAIMER: Nothing here is of final end-all word of official word of Blizzard. This is our take on what we know from the experience, bar the NDA. Everything here has already has been publicly said in one way or another, but perhaps not compiled in this way.

General:
This is still on the same engine as the original Warcraft III! Reforged is physically built through the current game as a major upgrade, alongside the graphics. How the base game is played and feels remains the same. Reforged/Classic cross-play; Reforged players can play with classic players simultaneously. This also means both versions generally get the same patches for at least balance and overlying features since. You can switch between Reforged/Classic versions or graphics, though probably not through the ease of one button in-match like in Starcraft. You can swap between old voices or new voices. Expect a beta in ear-___.

Gameplay:
The core gameplay of what makes WC3 unique is not intended to be noticeably altered, especially for the base game and melee. The pathing and collision size should remain the same. However, outside of competitive play, they have the freedom to look decisions differently. Ideas regarding expanding unit selection limits over 12 and more item slots outside of ladder can be on the table.

Content:
Suggested new content such as the infamous 5th race, new campaign missions, and co-op modes have not had statements or announcements tied to them, but again, the team is looking at everything.

Visuals and Art:
Art style - The original intended art style was to go for a more cartoony look, but the team has instead settled on a grittier look closer the spirit of Warcraft III's lore and story themes as opposed to WoW. There's a lot of work to be done still, so making the style more consistent should help solidify the direction to stand on its own over time.
Models - An abundance of feedback for many reforged models has been communicated constructively. It is clearly understood that while many of the models host extravagant detail, more clarity is needed for gameplay purposes. They are also looking at feedback in terms of model resemblance to the original looks. To share a specific example, the new Grunt is agreed to be a great standard while the Footmen should be evaluated under scrutiny quite a bit more. Things like ground textures for buildings and particle effects will be seen in time.
Terrain - The terrain shown at Blizzcon is in a very early state. It's been communicated that it looks flat and lacks volume, and some tiles may lack saturation. They are planning an overhaul of the old terrain tile system to a new one.
UI - The UI shown at Blizzcon was also in a very early state. You will be able to swap between the original UI and new minimalist version, but there could be more changes to that. Modders will be able to fully customize it more than for their custom maps.

Battle.net:
It's been confirmed that Warcraft III will be on the modern Blizzard Battle.net launcher, which would give it much better server infrastructure and also new life from other Blizzard game players. Features like clans, improved hosting and filtering, lobby control, friends, bans/avoid, are all being looked at and the hope is that these are all retained if possible, while also being improved.

Lore:
The story will not be changed, but Blizzard is looking at ways to make the entirety Warcraft lore as a whole more consistent in WC3. The Culling mission already had WoW easter eggs that did not affect much other than there being cool mini-bosses other than Mal'Ganis. And maybe this doesn't only pertain to WoW, as some WC1 and WC2 pieces don't perfectly line up with WC3's. The intention seems to be for WC3's story to remain what it is at heart, while also adding things for consistency and fun that other players in the Warcraft universe can also enjoy. Specifics on the extent of this are still up in the air, but remember that you can always choose to play the classic campaign generally untouched.

Custom Game Compatibility:
Most custom maps should be compatible with reforged. While the aim is for the vast majority of maps to work on reforged Day 1, Blizzard is also looking at ways to maximize the amount of complex or import heavy maps to be transferred over. They are looking at many maps individually and are doing internal testing. Since this is such a momentous task, it would be a collaborative for modders and map makers to continue to find workaround methods with modders and map makers with the developers. Point out the maps that don't work with patches, especially if they haven't seen it yet. Worst comes to worst, few maps will have to be significantly updated or would stay with the classic version, but a revitalized player base and modding tools added for both games still improves the net experience of said custom map.

World Editor and Modding:
It is not a separate new editor and it is not the SC2 editor in WC3! It is strictly the current World Editor upgraded, with the base features of editor going to function as it always has. Blizzard's goal is to keep the editor as accessible as possible while providing the needed efficiency while ridiculously insane features are added. Yes, new natives are on the way, but also expect some other crazy shit. The specifics of this are not confirmed, but the the editor will be updated as one alongside both classic and reforge.

For the artistic side, new modding tools can be used to make Reforged quality models and will be provided by Blizzard for community use.



Other:
Other things like animations, certain voice lines, Chinese censorship/age rating, bots, monetization, and more were discussed, but were were not yet ready to become public information for one reason or another, or were minor points. There's so much more that we can't fit into this article, but if you search around you'll likely see some more.

For more recaps from November, see: Hive's What We Know So Far Thread, and Grubby's Reforged Videos, Back2Warcraft's Reforged Videos

The Takeaway

This all leads back to the community. Blizzard, even more so than before, is looking at community feedback across all the major outlets. Hive will of course be working closely representatives from both Blizzard and other parts of the community, but that alone is never enough. Tell them what you like so far and tell the what you don't like. Express specifically and constructively of how you think things can be improved. Even suggest things that you feel the greater community would go nuts over.

We hope that everyone found some super exciting things in here! The main takeaway is that there will be updates all across the board with Reforged's Release, but the the original game should also keep die-hard classics at bay especially with the ability to swap and cross-play between games. But the underlying message we got is cheesy enough for all of you to know already. We are extremely thankful to the community for sticking by us throughout all these years. What we have now is a result of every building block each one of you provided, and that is something to be proud of.

There! Now that that's over, here's to another journey through Warcraft history. Happy 17th, everyone! We hope to see you all on the other side.


More:
The Future of Warcraft (Part 1, 2016)
Warcraft III Anniversary Week (main post)

 

[tulee]

Thanks for all the great information you posted.

age rating

By age rating, are you referring to there being such thing as age censorship (based on the example it was combined with using the "/" with, I assume you mean it is tied together to that first idea). Otherwise not sure what that means, since an age requirement means nothing to the warcraft 3 community.

 

[Death Adder]

It is not a separate new editor and it is not the SC2 editor in WC3! It is strictly the current World Editor upgraded, with the base features of editor going to function as it always has. Blizzard's goal is to keep the editor as accessible as possible while providing the needed efficiency while ridiculously insane features are added.

That's reassuring

 

[_lycan]

Oh damn, I wonder what we'll have in the "TBA"

 

[Deleted member 219079]

Oh damn, I wonder what we'll have in the "TBA"

shirtless pic from staff member of choice

 

[StoPCampinGn00b]

Thanks for all the great information you posted.



By age rating, are you referring to there being such thing as age censorship (based on the example it was combined with using the "/" with, I assume you mean it is tied together to that first idea). Otherwise not sure what that means, since an age requirement means nothing to the warcraft 3 community.

Chinese decency laws often attributing to the subjects of the dead/skeletons and gore. Discussion on how to go about this, e.g. differing regional version.

@BlueSaint
Spin the gachi wheel!

 

[Spankfurt]

Having a good time imagining "All of the tabs opened" during that weekend with Blizzard

"Hey guys, what's this one? Panther-Anth-" As the laptop is slammed shut

Also having a giggle at one of the Blizz execs taking you aside into a dimly lit room

"..... What's this we hear about a schism at diplo?"

 

[FlameofChange]

Don't add new race ! It would ruin the game !
If you add a new piece of chess, it's no longer chess anymore !

Don't make +12 selection unique for Reforged !

There's tons of people who can't afford Reforged or a new computer, the advantage of Warcraft 3 is it can runs on almost everything. Paying to keep yourself in the community is shit.
Reforged is just a 30$ Texture pack !

Am i the only one not hyped by Reforged ? If there's exclusive content they will kill classic players !

EDIT : Also for the sake of CROSSPLAY don't make unique content for Reforged !

 

[_lycan]

Don't add new race ! It would ruin the game !
If you add a new piece of chess, it's no longer chess anymore !

Don't make +12 selection unique for Reforged !

There's tons of people who can't afford Reforged or a new computer, the advantage of Warcraft 3 is it can runs on almost everything. Paying to keep yourself in the community is shit.
Reforged is just a 30$ Texture pack !

Am i the only one not hyped by Reforged ? If there's exclusive content they will kill classic players !

EDIT : Also for the sake of CROSSPLAY don't make unique content for Reforged !

If you can't afford reforged you can keep playing TFT, nobody is forcing you to play reforged lol, the vast majority of us though are excited for reforged cause it's something new after 15 years of warcraft 3.

 

[deepstrasz]

something new

Hmm...

 

[FlameofChange]

If you can't afford reforged you can keep playing TFT, nobody is forcing you to play reforged lol, the vast majority of us though are excited for reforged cause it's something new after 15 years of warcraft 3.

I agree, but the thing i want to say to the community is
1) No exclusive content for Reforged
2) No new melee race
3) No new non-Tavern hero
4) I'm not against a new campaign DLC, but any new model/skin/icon would be available in classic version for everyone. This would have a new race for some chapters, but don't make it a melee race (for example as the Nagas).
5) I'm not against some item tweaks or unit tweaks (like they did for Knights, Tauren totem and Necros)

 

[_lycan]

I agree, but the thing i want to say to the community is
1) No exclusive content for Reforged
2) No new melee race
3) No new non-Tavern hero
4) I'm not against a new campaign DLC, but any new model/skin/icon would be available in classic version for everyone. This would have a new race for some chapters, but don't make it a melee race (for example as the Nagas).
5) I'm not against some item tweaks or unit tweaks (like they did for Knights, Tauren totem and Necros)

No? You already got what you paid for, 15 years (and more) of support for classic, if in the future they decide to add a new race or units in an "expansion" for reforged, I would 100% be for it.

 

[YourArthas]

I agree, but the thing i want to say to the community is
1) No exclusive content for Reforged
2) No new melee race
3) No new non-Tavern hero
4) I'm not against a new campaign DLC, but any new model/skin/icon would be available in classic version for everyone. This would have a new race for some chapters, but don't make it a melee race (for example as the Nagas).
5) I'm not against some item tweaks or unit tweaks (like they did for Knights, Tauren totem and Necros)

Exactly thinking the same, also a loyal remaster instead of reimagining is always more than welcome.

 

[FlameofChange]

No? You already got what you paid for, 15 years (and more) of support for classic, if in the future they decide to add a new race or units in an "expansion" for reforged, I would 100% be for it.

Do you really want to split the community ???! IT WOULD KILL ALL OUR 17 YEAR EFFORTS ! Poor people left alone on a side, and rich people on the other. Same problem with Age of Empires II & HD. Don't split a community.
I had a dream where all Warcraft 3 player could play together without being separated by game version or DLC.
Warcraft 3 just needs engin improvements (24 player maps, Direct X, map archive limits, natives), and we are only at halfway (Pathfinding improvement, max selection, natives, desync, memory leaks). You don't need custom races and campaigns when tons of excellent mappers already do this. Do you just want a Blizzard stamp to approve any new content ?

I totally disagree with you, as well as i'm angry against everyone who share that same opinion, but i'll defend your and their right to say it.

 

[Aldeia]

Poor people left alone on a side, and rich people on the other.
Well the rich people will support the game right?
And i don't belive u can't find money for a game (not so hard, the game is not so expensive , and if you are a true fan and love this game, you must support the people that are making the game)

 

[Deleted member 219079]

I had a dream where all Warcraft 3 player could play together without being separated by game version or DLC.

word. stop gamer oppression

 

[FlameofChange]

Poor people left alone on a side, and rich people on the other.
Well the rich people will support the game right?
And i don't belive u can't find money for a game (not so hard, the game is not so expensive , and if you are a true fan and love this game, you must support the people that are making the game)

Not expensive is more expensive than free.
Plus many people can't buy any games (middle-high school kids) with the right computer. I lived a decade without being able to buy any games. One purchase -> one game -> one community. I was frustrated by Age of Empires II HD because it stole almost half of online players. "Can i play with you guys ? - No you don't have the HD version". This is horrific, having to pay to follow the community.

 

[Verb8im]

Not expensive is more expensive than free.
Plus many people can't buy any games (middle-high school kids) with the right computer. I lived a decade without being able to buy any games. One purchase -> one game -> one community. I was frustrated by Age of Empires II HD because it stole almost half of online players. "Can i play with you guys ? - No you don't have the HD version". This is horrific, having to pay to follow the community.

Except they specifically said Reforged can cross play with classic

 

[FlameofChange]

Except they specifically said Reforged can cross play with classic

What i wanted to say is if they make Wc4 or new esclusive DLC/Expansion packs it would divide servers population. Right now i've still some concerns for reforged exclusive content but far less than when it was announced.
I'm not against a new RTS from blizzard but let Warcraft alone.

 

[deepstrasz]

you must support the people that are making the game

By your logic, all games should be like WoW, with a monthly fee, just for support.
Reforged is not a new game. It's an edit, big graphical one.

 

[Yahya]

Oh wow you guys got early access to melee and custom games in Reforged?

How was that experience? Tell us all about that.

Are you allowed to?

 

[stormy]

> Expect a beta in ear-___.

Is it a typo? What does it mean? Thx.

 

[deepstrasz]

> Expect a beta in ear-___.

A year?

Kidding. I think the word was cut. It was possibly supposed to mean early+date.

 

[The Stormbringer]

Don't add new race ! It would ruin the game !
If you add a new piece of chess, it's no longer chess anymore !

Don't make +12 selection unique for Reforged !

There's tons of people who can't afford Reforged or a new computer, the advantage of Warcraft 3 is it can runs on almost everything. Paying to keep yourself in the community is shit.
Reforged is just a 30$ Texture pack !

Am i the only one not hyped by Reforged ? If there's exclusive content they will kill classic players !

EDIT : Also for the sake of CROSSPLAY don't make unique content for Reforged !

There should absolutely be 12+ selection of units in Reforged, just only for custom maps. Having it in custom maps will in no way damage the normal melee or tournament brackets, and will instead add loads of options for the mapmaker community.

What i wanted to say is if they make Wc4 or new esclusive DLC/Expansion packs it would divide servers population. Right now i've still some concerns for reforged exclusive content but far less than when it was announced.
I'm not against a new RTS from blizzard but let Warcraft alone.

How would single-player content divide the community...? DLC and new campaigns would be very likely limited to that sort of thing, outside of skins like Jaina on a horse for Multiplayer that they discussed, which is just a cosmetic issue and also doesn't divide the community.

Now, DLC heroes, races, or units I could see as being a problem, but I don't think they'll be doing that.

 

[kantarion]

Whaaaats up

 

[Deleted member 219079]

Whaaaats up

hey fellow hiver, i'm eager to engage in some on-topic conversation with you

which comes first, tuesday or reforged? all my capital's on latter

 

[YourArthas]

When tuesday comes, the Reforged beta will be up too, but I doubt the actual game will come before tuesday

 

[FlameofChange]

There should absolutely be 12+ selection of units in Reforged, just only for custom maps. Having it in custom maps will in no way damage the normal melee or tournament brackets, and will instead add loads of options for the mapmaker community.

I think a constant in the map file (from 1 to 48 for example) would benefit a lot of custom games, but without the removal of the pathfinding limit army movement are still glued.

How would single-player content divide the community...? DLC and new campaigns would be very likely limited to that sort of thing, outside of skins like Jaina on a horse for Multiplayer that they discussed, which is just a cosmetic issue and also doesn't divide the community.

Because of classic, they have to make every single ressources HD and classic if they add some. Also these model/skins ressources have to be available for custom games.

 

[Rui]

Damn you guys. When you revived this thread, I was excited the next batch of anniversary week had come out, and then...

 

[noob]

Many custom maps are based on selecting individual groups of 12 units and sending them to the fray as fast as possible with a + click.
If you can just select all the units and send them all at once it makes those maps way too trivial.

 

[deepstrasz]

Many custom maps are based on selecting individual groups of 12 units and sending them to the fray as fast as possible with a + click.
If you can just select all the units and send them all at once it makes those maps way too trivial.

Who said it has to be a general thing? It's supposed to be an option for custom games to use when needed.

 

[Innerdesert4346]

Everyone who thinks that adding extra content + increasing unit select limit etc. is bad, you're an idiot because as others have said it could be an option for the map(unit select limit) or (extra content) would be added for both reforged and classic and if it isn't would be only cosmetic or just a campaign thing.

 

[Kostyarik]

There should absolutely be 12+ selection of units in Reforged, just only for custom maps. Having it in custom maps will in no way damage the normal melee or tournament brackets, and will instead add loads of options for the mapmaker community.

And campaign (single-player) too! God I hated that limit in RoC human campaing in mission where you had to blow some ships in Northrend

 

[Chaosy]

Boohoo, changes.

It's not like just about every game updates and changes.

 

[Rui]

Selection limit is a tad annoying. I remember loathing it when playing maps like BFME or Azeroth Wars . I wish it would go.

 

[neven1]

Except they specifically said Reforged can cross play with classic

Did they? Good luck finding official post that explicitly says that.

 

[FlameofChange]

Did they? Good luck finding official post that explicitly says that.

Here we go.
Warcraft III: Reforged will support original’s custom games, allow crossplay between both versions | Massively Overpowered

 

[deepstrasz]

Did they? Good luck finding official post that explicitly says that.

The only difference is this:

Spoiler

 

[Sapprine]

 

[BobLowbraight]

both Blizzard and other parts of the community... what?