New ORPG - Still under construction

Level 16
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Sep 26, 2005
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1,088
Greetings everyone, it's me again. You might remember me from "Tribe Wars" and "The Horde ORPG" projects which were given to others for use and further development. This time I bring you something a little more complex and, at least in my opinion, funnier. What you're going to see by downloading the map is first of several maps from the new ORPG map series. Project's current name is "The Growling Winds", but that's a subject to change. I would like to point out again that this is an alpha version of it and nothing you see here is final. There's still a lot of work ahead of me but I think I'll manage to launch the final version soon enough.

Currently map contains:
-5 fully playable hero classes, each with its own unique skills and type of gameplay.
-Completely remade combat system including variable critical chance, critical multiplier, weapon and spell damage scaling with strength, agility and intelligence, spell resistances, custom made health and mana steal and much much more.
-Many mobs around the map, more than enough for a decent test.
-Over 60 items which can be acquired by killing mobs on the map.

Things to come:
-Vendors, teleporters, waypoints, random map events, rare map spawns, save/load system, lots of new items, talent system, credits.

I would like to hear your opinion on what's made so far. Feel free to tell me what you like or don't; what should be fixed, added or removed. Also feel free to give some ideas. Balancing classes will be done as soon as it get's fully playable so that players can test it out from level 1 to around 50.

Screenshots:

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Multiboard showing hero's combat stats:

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Damage showing how much you deal to opponents and how much they deal to you. Damage done by normal attacks is displayed in white color, spells and abilities appear as yellow and damage done by pets is displayed as orange.
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Since there is custom physical and spell critical strike system implemented, numbers showing critical strikes are growing and then shrinking, just like in wow (I apologize for rip-off)
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Items dropped have they're own custom models, making it easier for player to see which class can use them (swords-death knights, double axes-barbarians, staves-elementalists, bows-night archer, normal axes-storm seeker)
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Level 8
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Feb 14, 2008
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364
W..t...f..? This is freaking awesome? I cant believe this, it's really nice. I was spitting blood when i saw it was protected :mad:

I was wondering, can you teach me to make the damage show system, when you hit a mob? or the random drop for the mobs.

Your my idol from now.. with a 3rd person cam, this could be like.. WoW!
Btw i can give you a very nice and unique 3rd person if you wish.

Thanks in advance.
________
California Medical Marijuana Dispensaries
 
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Level 1
Joined
Dec 22, 2008
Messages
3
Trying it with a friend atm, Really awsome Hope you can get this to a full version and please release some more alpha versions cause this was a real pleasure to play. Love the system and the leaderboard
 
Level 16
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Sep 26, 2005
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1,088
Still using standard wc3 6 slot inventory, but there are a lot of custom stats like: +% to strength, agility or intelligence, +% weapon damage, +chance to crit with attacks or spells, +chance to hit targets (reduces target's dodge chance), +spell power, +spell penetration (reduces target's resistance), +to physical and spell critical strike multiplier (increases critical damage), +to dodge, +to resistances (including critical strike resistance), +health and mana steal (both working with damage done by spells and effects), +to mana or health after each kill and many many more.
 
Level 16
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Sep 26, 2005
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1,088
Known and fixed bugs:
-barbarian used to have 100% critical strike chance until he learns critical swings talent
-talents background image used to disappear for all players when any player closes talents
-messages such as "You have no more talent points", "Talent already at maximum rank" and "You don't have required talent" used to show up for all players instead to specific player
-not showing talent info for certain talents after putting 5 points in base talent ("Unholy Strength", "Titan's Strength", "Arcane Intellect", "Astral Fire" and "Precision")
-not showing bonus fire damage to attacks as spell damage after scoring a critical hit with physical attack it has been added to
 
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Level 16
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Sep 26, 2005
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1,088
The Growling Winds alpha build 4335:
-fixed various talents system problems
-fixed some minor bugs with abilities, neutral mobs and bonuses such as +10-20 fire damage, +3-8 frost damage (to physical attacks)
-added 3 new talents to each class (15 new talents total), each requiring certain talent that was available in previous builds (for example: Archer's "Cataclysm" talent requires 5 points in "Astral fire" talent)
-fixed some balance issues to reduce difficulties during leveling with certain classes.

I'm glad everyone likes the map and enjoys playing it, but please tell me if you find any bugs, exploits or if you have any good idea. I'm totally open-minded for this map and any type of suggestion is welcome. Your responses is what's keeping me focused on this, so critics plz:
 
Level 13
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Jun 5, 2008
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504
Good job so far. I think the multiboard has some very useless stuff. Who cares about the events that happenned....Keeping it simple would be better.

Nothing else bothered me. Looking great so far. I really look forward to this.

I quess its pretty hard to comment more, since there wasnt that much stuff added yet. Just creep slashing and sweet terrain, that was already pretty enjoyable.
 
Level 16
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Sep 26, 2005
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1,088
Aww, i made a mistake i ment what happend to the horde orpg? =p

Horde ORPG ran out of ideas and I kinda started to experiment with stuff that you see in this map.

As for the previous 2 posts: I have already added a new boss (in the cave pass the Rampagors) and a large new area after that. Currently I'm woking on level 24-30 swamp, new set of items (dropped by mobs level 24 - 32), new talents and I might start to implement lore stuff into it.

I quess its pretty hard to comment more, since there wasnt that much stuff added yet. Just creep slashing and sweet terrain, that was already pretty enjoyable.

As for that... well everytime I make a new alpha version I try to implement some new element to the game that wasn't there in the last version (first version to second - talents, second to third - unique powerful talent in each specialization tree, third to forth - some lore finally coming up, beneath every talent icon there will be a number indicating how many points you have spent in that talent (1/5, 2/5, 5/5, 1/1 etc), a lot of minor bug fixed, vendors (meaning gold aswell) and respawn monuments most likely (allows you to revive your hero after he dies at a new place, just like the tent at the beginning of the map). I can't give you any details about when it's coming out just yet since I'm not sure how much time am I going to have this week.

Tnx for comments
 
Level 16
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The Growling Winds alpha build 5101:
-fixed various talents system problems
-fixed some minor bugs with abilities
-added 6 new talents to each class (30 new talents total), each requiring certain talent that was available in previous builds (for example: Archer's "Searing Arrows" talent requires 1 point in "Cataclysm" talent)
-added resurrection shrines that allow you to revive your hero at their spot, instead of walking from the beginning of the map
-added a large new area filled with level 22+ mobs, and an entrance to the Dark Swamp

I however apologize for not introducing the lore, at least it's still not visible for player but it is under construction.

Edit:
Known bugs and issues:
-leaving an open, closed or computer slot in multiplayer games will cause players beneath that slot to lose their combat efficiency (fixed)
-Storm Seeker's wolves never get tired of running around him and don't die when he dies (fixed)
 
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Level 3
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Aug 29, 2004
Messages
57
My Review of Your Test Map:

This is by far the best map I have played this year. Believe me, I exclusively play RPG maps out there with a friend, and I have to say I had more fun with your simple setup than I've had in a god damn long time.

I know that you must of chose the skills very wisely, because they are VERY fun to use! My favorite part is how many of your abilities combo into your other abilities and how every class is very powerful even when solo. Blowing away huge piles of difficult enemies with my friend was absolutely god damn awesome.

Also, the items were excellent and make a noticeable difference and your terraining (for what little work you put into it) has top notch potential. All your custom models are very good ones, and you have a very good sense of "themed" terrain areas.

And lets not even go into your talent tree, which I have never ever seen before in any RPG out there. Although its a little boring to see only passive skills in there, its extremely unique!

Class Opinions:

Barbarian's "Revenge" <--- Very awesome skill man, I actually had to pay attention for when revenge came up to unleash this thing. Barbarian in general is probably the most powerful dude in the game cause of his crapload of HP and ridiculous charge. Still needs support from the DPS guys though, which I like.

Deathknight skills <--- Its obvious that this guy is a closerange caster which is a very good concept. Thought you could of expanded more on his concept though, as his inferno like ability and raise dead seem a little too wc3 meleeish. Maybe he can raise permanent skeletons/demons instead.

Stormseeker skills <--- All of them are awesome and are combocentric, I like the single boss killing type concept this guy has (till lvl 12 anyways). I didn't really understand his first multihit move. Whenever I used it I found it hard to see how many hits I pulled with all the numbers flying around.

Nightarcher skills <--- Elunes arrow is VERY cool as well as piercing arrow and starfall. He's extremely weak compared to the barbarian early game though. This guy needed the blazefire bow (intel items in general) to be good. Before I got those, he totally sucked. Also his last move (the one that turns him red) doesn't really work with the others that well because all it is, is an increase in attack speed. With this guy, I am constantly rotating my 1st three moves, I don't have much time to physically attack. Does agility even make heroes shoot faster? This guy could use slightly more work in the skill combo/synergy department.

Elementalist skills <---- Similar to night archer but with less range. Very weak before the intel items. Barbarian in my opinion is a lot better because of his massive amount of HP. Nightarcher seems a little better too cause of the massive range. I could be wrong at very high levels.





Suggestions?
Well I would say the same thing as the guy above, you may need more spells (spellbooks are slightly annoying but work fine, I have played several RPGs with spellbooks and it was alright, perhaps you could just have an option to "swap" abilities in and out of the spellbook and onto your regular hero interface). I only say this because I wonder if making every ability have like 20+ levels is a wise choice compared to adding in more variety for some tactical options. The RPG will obviously be very long, you may need some learnable skills, or just more skills in general. Perhaps as the players get further they develop more abilities? In a long game I'm going to need to feel that I am making noticeable progress such as acquiring and using new skills.

I know that you are true to the diablo style in many ways in that there is no class with a healing move. I really think all your moves are very good though, I wouldn't replace one for any type of healing unless you added a new class. Perhaps a summoner type (pets and healing makes sense in this case).

I like how you had larger and larger piles of guys as the game progressed. This was really awesome because we got to use our AOE to some dish out some VERY impressive damage. Keep up the scripted boss areas, as the one with the dwarf was really fun to tear up. Hopefully there'll be plenty of minibosses to go around.

Obviously you are not done, but I'm a fan of RPGs that have towns in them. I know this is an alpha build, but it seems that you are just creating areas to fight in rather than areas based around a centralized town or "safe" area. In my opinion safe areas provide solidarity to an RPG, however, your style of progressively changing the setting has its advantages. Perhaps you could make a series of different zones/islands you can travel to or something though. The advantage to your system was that it really kept backtracking to a minimum, but you can do this with a town as well if you are clever enough.

Have you thought about professions such as enchanting, armor making, herbalism, etc. I recently played an RPG with a levelable profession system that was not too complex (as in none of this get to an anvil to make armor etc., it was more like, when you kill things you automatically get parts that you can use on the spot) and the result was very satisfying. To see what I'm talking about look up "Iles at War RPG". They use spellbooks and professions, so you will know exactly how it feels like. It's important to work a profession into natural combat as well (such as killing enemies gets you components). Something you shouldn't do is have something like the "cooking" or "fishing" system in Dark Invasion where you just sit down and cook/fish for hours outside of actual combat and miss out on experience/gold. The whole idea of a profession gives more ways of character progression than just leveling up in physical power.

Faster run boots. More RPGs than I can count need these. I also need a way to see how many talent points I have and perhaps a backpack system. If you want to try something fancy, checkout TKOK or even better: Dark Invasion for their inventory styles.

And if it's not too much... multiple weapon classes for each hero class rather than just one and equipment that actually shows up on your char. This one is obviously forgivable if left out.

Lastly, I think you should make criticals to be large red numbers instead of large white/yellow numbers. With all the numbers flying around I have no idea what is a critical half the time and what is not. Also, perhaps certain skills such as stormseekers multi-hit melee move could have different coloured numbers as well so you can see which damage numbers pertain to the spell.



Lets face it. Why was this small map more fun than every huge complex finished map out there? Because your heroes were totally themed, very unique and very VERY well thought out in my opinion. Also, the pace of the game was excellent and adequately difficult especially once the large amounts of enemies started showing up.

Your map really has style, keep it up man, I'm looking forward to your amazing potential.
 
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Level 16
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Sep 26, 2005
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1,088
Ty Nogusta a lot! Things I might consider are:
1. spellbook system (not warcraft spellbook ability, but a system similar to that you saw with talents: for example each class has 20 skills, each selectable from spellbook which contains them.
2. professions that will most likely also be done on my own way... using system similar to that talent one.
3. towns are planned and as you might have noticed there are places that really look like that they should be populated - but they aren't. They will contain profession trainers, vendors, quest givers, and maybe class trainers (but I'll give that a second thought tho)

As for the night archer... Hi's ultimate skill increases your weapon damage aswell, thus increasing your elune's arrow and piercing shot's damage (100% bonus damage at lvl 20), and if you're specced as marksmanship (the disengage/lethal shots build) it gets really awesome.
And I wasn't really sure about the elementalist since... well in my opinion at least... she's the best dps class currently in game :S (rolling 8k+ criticals at lvl 29 while clearing zombies which by the way have 35% frost resistance)...

Anyway, I might be wrong and I will reconsider things. Ty for your great review, +rep!
 
Level 3
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Aug 29, 2004
Messages
57
Thanks man, the pleasure was all mine, literally. My friend and I are professional wc3 rpg players of sorts lol. Happy to hear your working your talent tree into the game more, because we had no idea that the tree was even upgradeable before lvl 15 although it becomes available at lvl 10. From the things you said, I'm sure you already outclass the competition by a long shot given what we have seen out there. 20+ skills? Professions done using a talent tree? That's impressive man. The possible character progression methods will be enormous.

The only thing they might have on you is ridiculously handcrafted terrain (that stuff in Diablo 3 Rpg is mind blowingly accurate), but looking at your previous work, I don't think that'll be a problem!

I played your horde campaign briefly as well. Needless to say, the first 5 minutes of this map was already superior. Keep it up!
 
Level 26
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Jun 16, 2008
Messages
1,940
i've played this and now i found the thread and i have to say that it is damn lovely...

it has diablo feeling, i like the ability tree and enjoyed to play it though it gets boring at some point, try making more variation with creeps, events and bosses

it is the same scheme everywhere on the map

new creeps area and at the end of it a boss, then again

make events (quests) some towns for areas, more bossmonsters, questbossmonsters etc. (i think i gave u +rep at the map?)
 
Level 16
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1,088
Ok, I need a suggestion:
Should I make 20 abilities per class (while you'll be able to have only 4 at the same time and swap them when needed), each scaling up with hero level and having only 1 level (for example: Stormstrike: Deals (100+2xhero_level)% weapon damage...));

or

Should I make 20 abilities per class and give players skill points equal to their hero level to put them where they want them, thus increasing level of abilities (for example: Stormstrike: deals (100+10xskill_points_put_in_it)% weapon damage...))?

In first case you would only need to select abilities while they would scale up with your hero's level. Ofc, some of them would require higher hero level than the others etc.

In second case you would need to focus on only one ability to max it out til level 20 (1 skill point per level), but you would be able to max out all 4 abilities at lvl 80, but that would require a lot of clicking to swap an ability for another one.
 
Level 3
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Aug 29, 2004
Messages
57
Ok, I need a suggestion:
Should I make 20 abilities per class (while you'll be able to have only 4 at the same time and swap them when needed), each scaling up with hero level and having only 1 level (for example: Stormstrike: Deals (100+2xhero_level)% weapon damage...));

or

Should I make 20 abilities per class and give players skill points equal to their hero level to put them where they want them, thus increasing level of abilities (for example: Stormstrike: deals (100+10xskill_points_put_in_it)% weapon damage...))?

In first case you would only need to select abilities while they would scale up with your hero's level. Ofc, some of them would require higher hero level than the others etc.

In second case you would need to focus on only one ability to max it out til level 20 (1 skill point per level), but you would be able to max out all 4 abilities at lvl 80, but that would require a lot of clicking to swap an ability for another one.


Both have their merits Serbian, but note that the Diablo 3 team also had this dilemma. They changed their system back to putting skill points into the actual skill itself (does not scale with hero level) because people liked and understood the idea of putting points into a skill. They felt that putting more points into a skill gave a solid sense of power gain.

On the other hand, keep in mind that their situation was a little different, in that their 1 point ability did not scale up with character level, but with a separate upgradeable skill to increase its damage, AOE, etc.

If you have the skill scale up with level you really free a crapload of skill points to put in other areas. But with 20 skills to spend on, maybe this is preferable. Then again, I don't know what the max number of points you can put in each skill is. To be honest, I'm old school and I prefer the former suggestion (skill does not scale with level).

Btw, I played your new build. Really fun stuff, the sorc is really as good as you said, however I noticed in the hero summoning tooltip for the stormseeker that it says he can "dual wield". In reality, this is not really true because his dual wield is actually one weapon.

And about what Palaslayer said above. I think he is saying in part that at the moment your map plays very linearly. Each of your areas connects with only one path to the next. This is contrary to 99% of the rpgs out there that use a town as a quest hub and are non-linear (as in you can go in pretty much any direction). But of course, you're not even done yet, so it doesn't matter.
 
Level 16
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Well I planned to put up to 80 skill points at your disposal (which you gain from level 1 to 80) and put them where you want them, thus increasing level of certain abilities, but, since you'll have only 4 abilities bound to QWER hotkeys, you wouldn't really need that many points, so I think I'll go with scales up with level since it's as good as the other one and makes it way faster to swap between, for example, single target and AOE build. However talent system will remain passive, increasing potential of certain skills, hero or a certain hero build.
And as for the linear playstyle... well I thought that I mentioned it before, but in case I did not... I'll finish the regions, terrain and systems first. Then I'll implement storyline (which I already have in mind) and things such as vendors, towns, profession trainers etc etc. The game will be less predictable and I will give you choice further in to the game.
 
Level 27
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Sep 24, 2006
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lol, i just took a look at the map and im so jaleous of your terraning skills! You seriously know how to make playable terrain look great.

Btw, is your unit spawn system going mad? There's alot of creep spam, i can't imagne it has to be that way.

Where did you get that system to set damage to the attack of the item o_O? (Or something) Did you make it yourself?
 
Level 3
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Aug 29, 2004
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57
Well I planned to put up to 80 skill points at your disposal (which you gain from level 1 to 80) and put them where you want them, thus increasing level of certain abilities, but, since you'll have only 4 abilities bound to QWER hotkeys, you wouldn't really need that many points, so I think I'll go with scales up with level since it's as good as the other one and makes it way faster to swap between, for example, single target and AOE build. However talent system will remain passive, increasing potential of certain skills, hero or a certain hero build.
And as for the linear playstyle... well I thought that I mentioned it before, but in case I did not... I'll finish the regions, terrain and systems first. Then I'll implement storyline (which I already have in mind) and things such as vendors, towns, profession trainers etc etc. The game will be less predictable and I will give you choice further in to the game.



Looks like I misinterpreted what you said. Yes I totally agree with your choice. 1 lvl is the recommended way to go! Your decisions are sensible enough.

I wonder, are you going to keep everything as one large landmass? Or are you going to split anything up with oceans and rivers?
 
Level 16
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I wonder, are you going to keep everything as one large landmass? Or are you going to split anything up with oceans and rivers?

I guess that I'll keep it this way... for this chapter at least.

Btw the filesize is almost 4 mb right now, you sure you won't pass it? =/

That's the thing that bothers me the most :S I'm trying to reduce filesize of barbarian's model (it's bloody 700KB+ at the moment while textures are only like 100KB) or to find appropriate substitution for it. I'm really out of solution for this problem but I'll take care of it when I get dangerously near 4MB.

By the way, could any of the admins change thread's name to The Growling Winds?
 
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Level 27
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Sep 24, 2006
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That's the thing that bothers me the most :S I'm trying to reduce filesize of barbarian's model (it's bloody 700KB+ at the moment while textures are only like 100KB) or to find appropriate substitution for it. I'm really out of solution for this problem but I'll take care of it when I get dangerously near 4MB.

God, i would never import something huge like that o_O

Couldn't you get an alternative model?
 
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