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[Role Playing Game] Memento Mori

Discussion in 'Map Development' started by Talavaj, Mar 16, 2013.

  1. BandolXD

    BandolXD

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    Yea,I agree tortured shark xD
     
  2. tobyfat50

    tobyfat50

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    OMG! What extreme changes caused that shark to look like that, your world is insane!
    Have to admire your modeling skills.
    You will probably optimize this shark a lot...
     
  3. Talavaj

    Talavaj

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    Yep, the design is not final though so it may end up looking completely different.
    It will be a recurring enemy, and a highly annoying one at that.
    It is intended as the ultimate dread as it is unbeatable so it will have to be avoided, it represents the very basic form of fear, the fear of the unknown and the protagonist's fear of water which is tightly tied to the fear of the unknown as water represents depth through which you cannot see with your senses alone.

    He may cause disturbing insta-kills when you piss around in water too much (and let your horror reach too high) and will have a whole level dedicated for him which will be a flooded subway and a part of the Perching square station.
     
  4. tobyfat50

    tobyfat50

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    Did you use a brush on that shark?
    Hope you eventually integrate the 2 levels in the end. It seems you put a lot of work in them, it would be a shame not to be used anywhere.
     
  5. tobyfat50

    tobyfat50

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    [bUMP]
    -----------
    Just bake the Displacement map and use a scribble cell technique it should look just as bumpy. I don`t know how you do it but you'll have to see my bumping technique. You could be using a similar technique but I'm not sure. From the results I got the bump looks just like the original one and it is less visible in the light (got the opposite effect as well in v2) and more deep in the dark, it also interacts with the light but maybe it`is just a optical illusion. It`is not actually much to be proud of but let's just say I improved the bump a little, better than the first results you have seen, those were nahh...bump!
     
  6. Talavaj

    Talavaj

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    Hello there ladies and gentlemen. I would like to present you with the newest graphical invention to be added to the mod.
    It is a trick that uses layers of two-dimensional images to reconstruct 3D space that gives illusion of fully three dimensional volume where there is none.
    Results of the technique are similar in look to what parallax mapping produces and because the technique is indeed a parallax illusion I dared to call it "Faux Parallax"
    as seen below.

    [​IMG]

    And a following example using a bit more detailed texture suggesting the target application of faux parallax.

    [​IMG]

    The shark is made in mudbox, and yep I'll just bake an ambient occlusion with the diffuse map blended together.
    From what I tested the surface looks just fine like that. The problem is the texture size limit..which may force me to somehow cut it in parts.

    I'm looking forward to see how you expanded the bumps.
     
  7. BallisticTerrain

    BallisticTerrain

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    Fake parallax. Impressive. How did you manage that?
     
  8. Talavaj

    Talavaj

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    :p it is explained up there. I got the idea after seeing this piece of art.
    The artist paints layers and layers and layers of glass with a piece of painting. When overlaid on each other they make a 3d illusion.
    This works the same way, applied differently. The height and quality of the displacement depends on how many layers you use. Because of its nature the technique is best used on low poly, inanimate models.
    To lower the performance burden, the displaced layers should use a considerably shittier texture resolution than the topmost layer.
     
  9. BallisticTerrain

    BallisticTerrain

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    I saw that to.. I think I get it now. Is it just a bunch of planes on top of each other?
    Or maybe I don't get it. I stupid, you know.
     
  10. Talavaj

    Talavaj

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    Exactly, similar trick was used in Shadow of the Colossus for fur shader. ~ off I'm for today.
     
  11. tobyfat50

    tobyfat50

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    A Stunning discovery. I am still puzzled on how you got the layers to blend together or you are using multiple planes?
     
  12. Talavaj

    Talavaj

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    It is 10 planes, the bottom one is the base and all the top ones are the height they are all transparent.
    9 offset layers give enough density to create a solid 3D illusion. Ofc the illusion is lost when you view the model from side where you can see the layers.

    It is kinda like when you duplicate a text in photoshop and put a layer under each other with 1 pixel offset down and to side.
    When you have about 6 ~ 10 duplicates it makes the text look 3D and because of the pixel density it looks solid and not just a bunch of layered text.

    Like in this image, you can see the layers a bit when viewed from an angle.

    [​IMG]

    And the another gorgeous part I did not mention yesterday. When you put a dark shadow under the transparent texture (using the drop shadow or glow in photoshop or whatever) and use blend material mode, it makes the layers look like they have proper occlusion in the crevices, rendering the final illusion pretty much complete ! (although it may be a bit spazy because of how blend works)
    Also remember, this is using a single layered texture so if you would use a different map for every other layer you could make a completely smooth height transition for pretty much anything.
    Alternatively, ENB seems to be able to tell the alpha and the SSAO reconstructs it even more accurately !
    Obviously, you have to keep in mind the model has to be fairly simple and even so the shell can scale around it properly.

    [​IMG]

    Without native blend, using SSAO only. Another alternative is to simply ensure the height layers have dark outline which will have similar result but it won't be smooth.
    One advantage over real parallax and normal mapping is that this technique creates illusion of 3D volume even on corners whereas parallax and normal mapping don't as it is still just a 2D shader.
    As seen in the examples here, the bricks quite obviously extrude out of the column. Which could not be done using parallax (without silhouette rendering) or normal mapping, only with displacement mapping and tessellation.

    EDIT:
    Well balls, I just found out somebody else thought of the same thing before for similarly ugly game. (even called it fake parallax like I did what the eff) And now I thought I'm just a unique snowflake xD.
    Well, at least mine doesn't look like shit.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2013
  13. tobyfat50

    tobyfat50

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    Don't worry, Yours looks damn like the real deal even better since it uses actual geometry so stop crying! Can't wait to test this out, think I am going to combine this with bump out of curiosity, It seems to open up more possibilities.
    I just had this Dumb idea of trying to do this with only one plane but I doubt it will work since wc3 blends all the layers like a dumbass. This probably will mean less geometry more textures.
    Forgot to mention:
    My bump doesn't work with ambient for some reason.
    Was trying to make it react like real bump, when moving the light the shadow also changes position but it didn't work. I Tried multiple layer combinations and mask directions, should of worked but the layers cancel eachother out or blended together. Testing the Team color layer I thought that maybe it would work if I added Actual R G B layers, Still nothing. The whole process is still in development but maybe I can do it...

    Also working on a police skin pack!
    OVH POLICE CAR
    [​IMG]
    Skin still under development
    Dedicated to the OVH POLICE Police Department!
     
  14. Talavaj

    Talavaj

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    Yeah, you can make some heavy geometry and I think it will still be very efficient performance wise.
    I'm not an expert on the technical side but the polys are low, the texture is same for every layer (so it should not really take up video ram) and it is only two materials so it shouldn't be too taxing.

    And it really does look kick ass. The best part is that ENB seems to shade it just as if it was actual geometry somehow which is perfect.
    And at the density I used, there is no way you'd be able to tell in-game.

    Also, lovely car is that. What is the pack for ?

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  15. tobyfat50

    tobyfat50

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    Remember the flying police cars from the physics example? They were so horribly low poly and res that I had to change them. Wasn't satisfied and obviously was too lazy to make a car model from scratch so I painted one on the model, Will also remake the physic more accurate. Obviously it's for my cinematic. I`am making a scene where the villain fight the police and police cars will be sent flying in the air in a rain of explosions. So I decided to make a skin pack available for download. Obviously it won't be much but just enough to please some pls hunger.
    ------------------------
    Well I already tested it and It does look kick ass. This is probably the first real displace and it is visually impressive to see when you move in 3d space.
    Too bad that my bump doesn't work with this technique, I tried but there are too many layers and they cancel the mod and adds, tried to place it underneath but that cancels the Displace. Not even a simple additive can't go over it so I`am going to ask you how you make specular on this.
    I also noticed that it looks better with the ENB.
    Forget about what I said about achieving something like this with one plane, I was probably daydreaming.

    Here is that rock I used for bump with your Parallax.
    My Bump
    [​IMG]

    It's kinda crude..
    Used blend and about 20 planes or so What density did you use in the last pics? It seems dens.

    EDIT:
    It eats performance some bit, i don't believe it but if you had modulate or x2 it slows down depending on how many planes it's got plus graphic card got a little hotter. I shouldn't of doubted a master in multiple geometry!
    -------------------------
    EDIT:
    Added some specular and it helps make it bumpy in the dark but doesn't look to good in global light, it's... white like some birds had a party on it! The specular must be in the area outside the mask exclusion otherwise you get a undesirable glass like effect.
    Using modulate is out of the question.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2013
  16. tobyfat50

    tobyfat50

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    [BUMP]
    PS: Kinda fell in love with this technique and I'm testing it on every texture I have. There goes my productive time for OHV!
     
  17. Talavaj

    Talavaj

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    Lovely ! I used only 10 layers. Transparent mode with the top one being blend because all layers with blend spazzed out on me.
    I think 10 is enough for fairly high stuff, you won't generally see it from too close so yeah.
    The advantage of ENB is that the SSAO can tell the pixel depth of my parallax and shades the cracks as if it was a proper mesh.
    Wc3 does not as it still treats it as a flat surface. You can fake that with some extra dark black blend like I did in the examples and it looks ok though.
    The wall looks neat, did you use a single texture for the bricks or you used levels of different height ?

    xD honestly I didn't get as far as to start applying speculars on it so you will have to wok on that one :p
    Good luck with your experiments !
     
  18. tobyfat50

    tobyfat50

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    Grass & Fuzz
    Too tired to comment on it ~~~
    1
    [​IMG]

    2
    [​IMG]
     
  19. Talavaj

    Talavaj

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    Heh yeah I know of this it is very neat.
    It is another fun thing to use this for. It has actually been used extensively in shadow of the colossus for fur and grass patches.
    The more deformed the base mesh is the more offset you get as well, not sure if they used different textures per layer because their fur was pretty detailed (but didn't actually use many layers only like 5 or so)
    The game is l33t for its time especially after people started poking in it and figuring out its insane tricks (such as that it is one of the first games to ever use self shadowing on its models using stencil shadows) these fur tricks, and its massive use of vertex color to easily paint occlusion.
    The green parallax looks perfect for moss patches too. By the way tried what happens when you skew it ? Or flip around a few planes you get a bit more noisy look. It is particularly good for grass because it doesn't have to be too dense and the texture doesn't have to be too big.
    But it still will end up nice and fluffy. Another thing you can do is animate the top layers for waving in the wind for ever neater visual.
    The advantage of the technique is it can be used for quite a wide range of things. Even volumetric clouds/light for example.

    By the way regarding another things, I made displacement for water (which displaces texture using vertex paint).
    It is made using vertex paint on the diffuse. Incidentally, I made it when I was testing whether I can use vertex paint to paint occlusion and store it in the mesh.
    It works with scribble cel (already applied), the problem is it needs large amount of vertices for finer displacement and cannot be tiled very well. So for a big flat surface you'd need tremendous amount of vertices.
    Ironically, it is what I needed because scribble adds highlights and I wanted to displace the surface somehow and efficiently. The technique is so efficient as the textures can be of laughably small size, because most detail is added by the vertex paint and scribble cel and it only really requires a single texture or two if you want cel.
    It is the most "liquid" effect and it is closest to any actual water shader that I got so far. It still does not reflect or refract anything but you can fake this by making the diffuse texture from the surroundings sphere map (the container+sky+environment) and blend it somehow.
    Here is the result:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ht3g1vNVQnw
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2013
  20. BlueSaint

    BlueSaint

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    I see you have no resources uploaded here on hive. Is this your first warcraft 3 project on internet?