Fallen Kingdoms

[Current Version - 3.1.5 - CLOSED PROJECT]
- For those users who have version 1.31.1, just download the file and place it in the following path: "C:\Users\USER_NAME\Documents\Warcraft III\Campaigns"
- For those users who have Reforged, they must first install the Quenching Mod.
- This campaign has been created for version 1.31.1, so we can't guarantee that it works correctly in another version.
nH1fD7u.png

What would have happened if Illidan Stormrage had managed to complete his spell in the ruins of Dalaran and had destroyed the Frozen Throne with the Eye of Sargeras?

>> Description
> Name - Fallen Kingdoms
> Difficulty - Normal
> Context - This campaign modifies what happened in Chapter Seven "The Ruins of Dalaran" of the Night Elves campaign (The Frozen Throne)

>>
Races
> Elves (blood and high)
> Humans
> Undead

>>
Main Heroes
> Kael'thas
> Magroth
> Sylvanas


Asssssvi
> Storm Sorcerer Kul-Tiras HD
> Mystical Knight on Pegasus Lordaeron
> Archer Lordaeron
> Rider Lordaeron
> Captain Lordaeron HQ (Unit\Hero)
> Footman Lordaeron HQ


FerSZ
> Felguard
> Infernal
> Fel/Shadow Shivarra
> Doomguard
> Fel Lord


Ujimasa Hojo
> Ghoul (Knights of the Ebon Blade)
> Fel Minion


HappyTauren
> ChaosCitadel
> Demon Tower


kangyun
> Battle For Azeroth - Sylvanas
> Vereesa Windrunner (v1)


Sin'dorei300
> Abominogre

Sellenisko
> PaleVal'kyrSvH

General Frank
> Bloodelf Archer

Edge45
> Forsaken Catapult

Thrikodius
> Elder Shadow Dragon

Wandering Soul
> Satyr Overlord

Mc !
> FireElementalByMc

Himperion
> Great Water Elemental

-Grendel
> Ogre Bonecrusher; Ogre Iron Fist

Jaccouille
> PenguinKing

>> Requires Patch 1.31.1 - Download Here <<
Contents

Fallen Kingdoms v3.1.5 (Campaign)

Reviews
deepstrasz
First of all, sorry for that game cache issue. I did not have any idea it was the profile I was playing as that caused the problems. Upon changing the profile to a new one, the game cache worked. It's heavily dependent on Warcraft III...
deepstrasz
This is not a role playing game. Use tags accordingly please. Compared to your previous one this one doesn't feel too far from from lack of creative gameplay. Most is circled around original Warcraft III material. You did not even try...
Level 9
Joined
Mar 4, 2014
Messages
152
Hi, i played this on War3 version 1.31
~ Positives:

- I love the way every missions looks, they were all unique and had their own interesting atmosphere, i can clearly see the effort put in the terrain and i gotta say, i love the vibes!
And not only the terrain but the entire structure of every chapter was very well done, i did not expect it to be this cool!

- Usually i would take every mission and say something about each of them, but for this one i can't really say much since in my opinion every mission was perfect, i had no negatives to say about them, so i am gonna talk about the overall campaign as a whole.

- Loved all the new units and skins! The new models for some of the skins of the units weren't really on my liking, like the water elementals and the infernals, i prefer the older og models for those, but there were a lot more newer models which looked pretty badass so i can't complain :D
But i understand why you implemented them, to make the campaign feel fresh and new, which is a positive in my eyes.
So yea, these ones were my favorite hehe
nice skins.png

- Now talking about the difficulty, funnily enough i almost died the first time i played in every mission cuz i underestimated them :D but the second time i managed to succeed by thinking of different strategies, normally i am not the biggest fan of missions that have time limits or things that need to be protected and such (example chapter 2), but this time i actually enjoyed those gimmicks, I love it when i play games that are actually challenging and not just easy shit, and let me tell you that this campaign was exactly that, a challenge, and i loved it!

- Now talking about the spells, at first i didn't even notice that heroes had totally different spells lol, the hero icons look similar to the old ones but to my surprise that was the only thing they had in common with the old ones, I loved all the new spells for every hero, at first i wasn't exactly sure i liked them that much, but the more i played with them the more i started liking them, so yea i was pretty impressed! good job with those ones!

- I liked how in most missions there was always the historian that was telling the backstory and the events of the past ,for the players that didn't really remember what happened.

- Loved all the side quests with the Goblin brothers :goblin_yeah:

- And of course how can i not say anything about the story, I love it when people create these kind of alternate universe stories from the original war3 campaign, and i can say with confidence you did a splendid job with this one, the characters did not seem that different from their older selves and the way they acted and interacted with the others and the overall events, was pretty good, it felt like i was actually playing a legit campaign made by the same people that made the original one :D

- And finally i liked the last chapters with the boss fights, now what would a custom campaign be without some epic boss fights :D
The fight didn't seem that hard to me, maybe cuz i stacked my heroes with lots of epic items, but yea the fight with Balnazzar was pretty epic, i did not expect it to be that grandiose, and i liked the fact that we had to fight only with the heroes, cuz my army was pretty op by the end :D


~ Suggestions:

- Players should be able to skip the cutscenes by pressing esc so that they don't need to wait for the cutscene every time they want to replay a mission for whatever reason.

- Spells should show their cooldown so the players know how much they need to wait after using them.


~ Negatives/bugs:

- It should he "her" instead of "him"
mistake.png

- In Chapter 6 after i failed the first time and got destroyed by the red undead forces, the second time i played the undead stopped sending attack waves like they usually did the first time i played, i must have glitched it somehow, the thing i did different this second time was the fact that i went with my heroes and poked them a little bit, killed some random units to raise some fire elementals and backed off, thats it, after that i just massed a huge army and crushed them, it was still a close fight, they really like to focus my heroes don't they :xxd:


Overall i very much enjoyed playing this custom campaign, it is surely worthy to be put into my collection! :grin:


P.S. i saw you were asking for some players to help you with testing your future campaigns, maybe i can help you with that, either way, i think is still the best to just upload the project on hive, even tho it might still have bugs or what not, people like me will always play it and give feedback and reviews with suggestions and what not, anyway, Good luck and thanks for keeping the War3 custom campaign scene alive!:infl_thumbs_up:
 
Last edited:
Level 20
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
369
Hi, i played this on War3 version 1.31
~ Positives:

- I love the way every missions looks, they were all unique and had their own interesting atmosphere, i can clearly see the effort put in the terrain and i gotta say, i love the vibes!
And not only the terrain but the entire structure of every chapter was very well done, i did not expect it to be this cool!

- Usually i would take every mission and say something about each of them, but for this one i can't really say much since in my opinion every mission was perfect, i had no negatives to say about them, so i am gonna talk about the overall campaign as a whole.

- Loved all the new units and skins! The new models for some of the skins of the units weren't really on my liking, like the water elementals and the infernals, i prefer the older og models for those, but there were a lot more newer models which looked pretty badass so i can't complain :D
But i understand why you implemented them, to make the campaign feel fresh and new, which is a positive in my eyes.
So yea, these ones were my favorite hehe
- Now talking about the difficulty, funnily enough i almost died the first time i played in every mission cuz i underestimated them :D but the second time i managed to succeed by thinking of different strategies, normally i am not the biggest fan of missions that have time limits or things that need to be protected and such (example chapter 2), but this time i actually enjoyed those gimmicks, I love it when i play games that are actually challenging and not just easy shit, and let me tell you that this campaign was exactly that, a challenge, and i loved it!

- Now talking about the spells, at first i didn't even notice that heroes had totally different spells lol, the hero icons look similar to the old ones but to my surprise that was the only thing they had in common with the old ones, I loved all the new spells for every hero, at first i wasn't exactly sure i liked them that much, but the more i played with them the more i started liking them, so yea i was pretty impressed! good job with those ones!

- I liked how in most missions there was always the historian that was telling the backstory and the events of the past ,for the players that didn't really remember what happened.

- Loved all the side quests with the Goblin brothers :goblin_yeah:

- And of course how can i not say anything about the story, I love it when people create these kind of alternate universe stories from the original war3 campaign, and i can say with confidence you did a splendid job with this one, the characters did not seem that different from their older selves and the way they acted and interacted with the others and the overall events, was pretty good, it felt like i was actually playing a legit campaign made by the same people that made the original one :D

- And finally i liked the last chapters with the boss fights, now what would a custom campaign be without some epic boss fights :D
The fight didn't seem that hard to me, maybe cuz i stacked my heroes with lots of epic items, but yea the fight with Balnazzar was pretty epic, i did not expect it to be that grandiose, and i liked the fact that we had to fight only with the heroes, cuz my army was pretty op by the end :D


~ Suggestions:

- Players should be able to skip the cutscenes by pressing esc so that they don't need to wait for the cutscene every time they want to replay a mission for whatever reason.

- Spells should show their cooldown so the players know how much they need to wait after using them.


~ Negatives/bugs:

- It should he "her" instead of "him"

- In Chapter 6 after i failed the first time and got destroyed by the red undead forces, the second time i played the undead stopped sending attack waves like they usually did the first time i played, i must have glitched it somehow, the thing i did different this second time was the fact that i went with my heroes and poked them a little bit, killed some random units to raise some fire elementals and backed off, thats it, after that i just massed a huge army and crushed them, it was still a close fight, they really like to focus my heroes don't they :xxd:


Overall i very much enjoyed playing this custom campaign, it is surely worthy to be put into my collection! :grin:


P.S. i saw you were asking for some players to help you with testing your future campaigns, maybe i can help you with that, either way, i think is still the best to just upload the project on hive, even tho it might still have bugs or what not, people like me will always play it and give feedback and reviews with suggestions and what not, anyway, Good luck and thanks for keeping the War3 custom campaign scene alive!:infl_thumbs_up:

Hello, thank you very much for playing and for your evaluation, I am very happy that you liked it.

It is very nice that there are people like you who appreciate the work and who also invest time in commenting on their impressions.

Regarding mission 6, the problem that sometimes stops attacking is something that I have not been able to solve, honestly, the AI programming is a headache for me and I still cannot make it work well at all, but I am working on it to improve and balance it as much as possible in the latest patch.

In that last patch I would also like to add new icons for the skills so that people don't get confused and think they are the same.

Lastly, skipping cutscenes is something I'm working on as well. I understand that failing a mission and having to rewatch the same cinematic is annoying.

Once again, thank you very much for your time, it helps me to continue and improve my content.

Regards.
 
Level 20
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
369
>> Update v3.1.5 February 1, 2021

> Skippable cinematic sequences.
> Hot keys added for units and buildings.
> Modified chapter six AI, attacks have been slowed down.
> Small grammatical and others errors have been corrected.

Thanks to all the players who have helped me with your advice and opinions.

PS: I've started work on the continuation of the "Fallen Kingdoms" campaign, "Bones Scourge" which will star Illidan and continue this Warcraft 3 alternate story.
 
Last edited:
Level 9
Joined
Oct 1, 2015
Messages
340
Is there a playable version of the campaign for patch 1.29.2?
It's the current patch I have and I really would like to check it out
 
Level 17
Joined
Nov 21, 2012
Messages
836
Chapter 6 Wild West was the hardest for me. Until I found a way to trick AI. Building a tower in the middle between Varimathras and my base, and placing a footmen near the tower cause enemy to retreat after destroing tower and unit. So the wave never attacks my base.

Moreover I made Fire Elemental (Kaelthas spell) on every cooldown even just killing my own peasants. Elementals do not cost food so at the end I had 100 food army+12 elementals.

Very nice campaign I enjoyed it much. Thanks ;)
 
Level 20
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
369
Chapter 6 Wild West was the hardest for me. Until I found a way to trick AI. Building a tower in the middle between Varimathras and my base, and placing a footmen near the tower cause enemy to retreat after destroing tower and unit. So the wave never attacks my base.

Moreover I made Fire Elemental (Kaelthas spell) on every cooldown even just killing my own peasants. Elementals do not cost food so at the end I had 100 food army+12 elementals.

Very nice campaign I enjoyed it much. Thanks ;)
I was doing the same thing many years ago to fool the AI in the game's original campaign :ogre_hurrhurr:

Thank you very much for commenting and rating.

Regards.
 
Level 7
Joined
Aug 26, 2017
Messages
142
It's a very simple, basic, and straightforward campaign. It's an alternative story of what might have happened if Illidan managed to sink the Frozen Throne into the sea with the Eye of Sargeras.

From beginning to end, the story is filled with grammar errors and spelling mistakes. The story is fairly uninteresting with a plot that narrowly hooks you in it. The maps are very basic and barely populated with neutral threats or secondary objectives to further increase your heroes' fighting potential. Even the goblin merchant shop is almost flat broke and offers little items of use.
Despite its mistakes, the campaign offers interesting designs such as universal upgrades for all of your troops regarding damage and armor (making upgrading easier and cheaper). Lesser versions of items that are limited throughout the maps that offer some level of strength to your heroes.
The maps I enjoyed the most and are aesthetically pleasing are the Underground Libraries of Dalaran, the Capital of Lordaeron and the restored city of Stratholme; other maps are very basic and not very memorable or noteworthy.

Overall it is a very basic and simple campaign that serves as a stepping stone for people that aren't looking for a challenge to test their RTS skills, and want to have fun with the game plain and simple. This campaign gets a 3 star grade.
There is plenty of room for improvement and further fleshing of the story and the action that would earn it a higher grade, but for now this is the limit.
 
Level 20
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
369
It's a very simple, basic, and straightforward campaign. It's an alternative story of what might have happened if Illidan managed to sink the Frozen Throne into the sea with the Eye of Sargeras.

From beginning to end, the story is filled with grammar errors and spelling mistakes. The story is fairly uninteresting with a plot that narrowly hooks you in it. The maps are very basic and barely populated with neutral threats or secondary objectives to further increase your heroes' fighting potential. Even the goblin merchant shop is almost flat broke and offers little items of use.
Despite its mistakes, the campaign offers interesting designs such as universal upgrades for all of your troops regarding damage and armor (making upgrading easier and cheaper). Lesser versions of items that are limited throughout the maps that offer some level of strength to your heroes.
The maps I enjoyed the most and are aesthetically pleasing are the Underground Libraries of Dalaran, the Capital of Lordaeron and the restored city of Stratholme; other maps are very basic and not very memorable or noteworthy.

Overall it is a very basic and simple campaign that serves as a stepping stone for people that aren't looking for a challenge to test their RTS skills, and want to have fun with the game plain and simple. This campaign gets a 3 star grade.
There is plenty of room for improvement and further fleshing of the story and the action that would earn it a higher grade, but for now this is the limit.

Thanks for commenting and rating. I would just like to point out that the grammatical and spelling errors are there because my knowledge of English is very limited (I am Spanish), I know that the texts are wrong, but I do my best to understand it. I'm sorry about that.

Regarding the rest, I have nothing to add.

Regards.
 
Level 20
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
369
whats the code in chapter 8/9 where there are 8 pressure plates on the top right.

I gave up
The truth is that I do not remember, but if you notice, the buttons have a slight flash, you must follow the order in which they shine. When the sequence ends, it takes a few seconds for it to start again.

PS: Anyway, if you can't, I'll look for it when I can and tell you the exact sequence.
 
Level 7
Joined
Dec 29, 2017
Messages
119
A pretty straightforward campaign. I think some of the dialogue feels a bit odd. But overall you know it has the right tone.

This campaign is good but it feels like there is a lot more potential here. Some of the missions are very lackluster. The ones that you just go around the map and kill things are honestly quite weak.

The ones where you actually build up a base would be better if it was more like The 5th Mission in Arthas' human campagin. Where there are other bases multiple ways to attack us. While having a timer where we survive.

The kill Balnazzar mission is very underwhelming. I was hoping for something like Sylvanus and Kael teaming up and attacking his base filled with demons and undead. But they only really team up at the end. Killing Bal did not feel rewarding at all. Also I don't know if this is just me but i hate the flamestrike stuff man. It just me clicking and running around my heroes.

The attack Varimiathas was probably the best mission in the campaign there was the issue where you send like a unit forward and attack and they'd kill it and then they'd retreat. Probably should fix that. Otherwise it makes things too easy.

The missions where you control Sylvanus and have to kill Satyrs. Even though you can make an Altar of Darkness you still lose the mission if Sylvanus dies.

Some stuff happens in the last mission and now you have to attack trolls. This missions was super out of place. It just kinda happens.

One thing that did upset me though was that we never controlled an entire force. Like in Undead's campaign. Which again just feels like missed potential.

I do apologize for the more messier writing style. I lost all my data and my more detailed notes on your campaign.

In the end its a good fun campaign. Yeah it could be a lot better. But i think you've done a good job as it is. 3/5
 
Level 20
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
369
A pretty straightforward campaign. I think some of the dialogue feels a bit odd. But overall you know it has the right tone.

This campaign is good but it feels like there is a lot more potential here. Some of the missions are very lackluster. The ones that you just go around the map and kill things are honestly quite weak.

The ones where you actually build up a base would be better if it was more like The 5th Mission in Arthas' human campagin. Where there are other bases multiple ways to attack us. While having a timer where we survive.

The kill Balnazzar mission is very underwhelming. I was hoping for something like Sylvanus and Kael teaming up and attacking his base filled with demons and undead. But they only really team up at the end. Killing Bal did not feel rewarding at all. Also I don't know if this is just me but i hate the flamestrike stuff man. It just me clicking and running around my heroes.

The attack Varimiathas was probably the best mission in the campaign there was the issue where you send like a unit forward and attack and they'd kill it and then they'd retreat. Probably should fix that. Otherwise it makes things too easy.

The missions where you control Sylvanus and have to kill Satyrs. Even though you can make an Altar of Darkness you still lose the mission if Sylvanus dies.

Some stuff happens in the last mission and now you have to attack trolls. This missions was super out of place. It just kinda happens.

One thing that did upset me though was that we never controlled an entire force. Like in Undead's campaign. Which again just feels like missed potential.

I do apologize for the more messier writing style. I lost all my data and my more detailed notes on your campaign.

In the end its a good fun campaign. Yeah it could be a lot better. But i think you've done a good job as it is. 3/5
Well, it is what it is, if you see wasted potential remake it yourself. You have my permission to use the maps and whatever you want.

Regards.
 
Level 19
Joined
Jul 26, 2008
Messages
1,239
Just played on 1.32 with Xetanth87's campaign splitter tool.
Some notes I wrote down.

Interlude
Illidan using the word "idiot" kind of didn't sound right, I would probably use "fool" since most Wc3 dialogue avoids using too much modern day slang. It normally tries to keep it a bit old style speaking to match with the medieval setting.
Also, why did the spellcasters (4 naga casters) have to die to complete the spell.

Ch1
Did not explain why Illidan winning at Dalaran would cause Detheroc to assassinate Garithos. How did the change in the dalaran mission affect Kaelthalas?
The main quest on F9 did not mention anything at all about the Grimoir Kael was seeking for this mission, it was only mentioned right at the ending cinematics.
Kael mentions something about a source he wants to get through using the Grimoir, but nothing else is mentioned about that either.

Ch2
I like Magroths spells
Fighting the gargoyles actually made me lose on this map a couple of times, since they are so strong against air units.
I never found where the optional quest was.

Interlude
It doesn't show us what happens to Kael after the summoning, quite a cliff hanger.

Ch3
Plague tooltip (the catapult upgrade) on units that are effected has no icon, it just has that face of the Sam guy from Blizzard
This level was actually really hard at the start, especially since satyr hellcasters are sent against us who can animate dead, I could only win by rushing top right base and getting extra gold mine within the first 10 mins.
Not sure why the optional quest for this map is located right next to the end boss.
Also, why is Sylvanas dying a fail for main quest on a map with base building?

Ch (3.5)?
For some reason, the undead ignored the expansion I had even though it was closer to their base than the main base. Were the attacks trigger based and not AI based?
Not having a disspell on any of the units made this hard, since the necros came very close to swarming the human base completely at the end with their mass skeletons.
I liked the model for that ogre boss.

Ch4
I liked razing the entire wardens with the prisoners.
I think doing this mission in the 2nd style that was mentioned at start (stealth) would only be possible if we had put all our spell levels from the previous mission into the windwalk spell. Otherwise, i don't think it is possible to not use the prisoner method.
Arthas' dialogue with sylvanas sounds very strange, it's like arthas has already given up and wants to die.

Ch5
Ok, there was not much to do on this map, since the main enemy base (Varimathras) was located right next to us. Going south to do the optional quest didn't give us much beyond another access way to the 2nd gold mine, since the item reward was just 10% attack speed increase.

Ch6
Really liked how there was actually a reason for killing the keepers of the grove (trees keep growing back in the area protecting generator).
The arcane generator was quite out of place in a night elf setting, since they would mostly be using nature magic i'm guessing.
Liked how there were boats available to reach secret items.

I closed the notepad i was writing my comments on. I don't have the other mission notes here, sorry.

In general, I think you put a lot of effort into making the missions unique, and that was nice. Each had its own flavour which was really good. I think there can still be space for improvement for the not RTS missions to make them less like kill everything on the map, and for the RTS missions maybe more can be added to make it less like we do nothing until we reach max food for a final push, otherwise they feel a little 1 dimensional.
I really liked the story though, and it made me want to know what was going to happen next.
Also really enjoyed Kael's and Magroths spell set, they were great.

I look forward to playing Bones Scourge next. It is also nice to be able to play this campaign without worrying about wc3 version bugs, since all the pre 1.32 issues were fixed on the latest patch.

Thanks for making this campaign Resyak/Son of War.
 

deepstrasz

Map Reviewer
Level 62
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
17,426
Illidan using the word "idiot" kind of didn't sound right, I would probably use "fool" since most Wc3 dialogue avoids using too much modern day slang. It normally tries to keep it a bit old style speaking to match with the medieval setting.
Actually, both idiot and fool have Latin origins, with the former even deeper ones in Greek. Apparently, idiot has been used since the 13th century as fool.
 
Level 20
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
369
Just played on 1.32 with Xetanth87's campaign splitter tool.
Some notes I wrote down.

Interlude
Illidan using the word "idiot" kind of didn't sound right, I would probably use "fool" since most Wc3 dialogue avoids using too much modern day slang. It normally tries to keep it a bit old style speaking to match with the medieval setting.
Also, why did the spellcasters (4 naga casters) have to die to complete the spell.

Ch1
Did not explain why Illidan winning at Dalaran would cause Detheroc to assassinate Garithos. How did the change in the dalaran mission affect Kaelthalas?
The main quest on F9 did not mention anything at all about the Grimoir Kael was seeking for this mission, it was only mentioned right at the ending cinematics.
Kael mentions something about a source he wants to get through using the Grimoir, but nothing else is mentioned about that either.

Ch2
I like Magroths spells
Fighting the gargoyles actually made me lose on this map a couple of times, since they are so strong against air units.
I never found where the optional quest was.

Interlude
It doesn't show us what happens to Kael after the summoning, quite a cliff hanger.

Ch3
Plague tooltip (the catapult upgrade) on units that are effected has no icon, it just has that face of the Sam guy from Blizzard
This level was actually really hard at the start, especially since satyr hellcasters are sent against us who can animate dead, I could only win by rushing top right base and getting extra gold mine within the first 10 mins.
Not sure why the optional quest for this map is located right next to the end boss.
Also, why is Sylvanas dying a fail for main quest on a map with base building?

Ch (3.5)?
For some reason, the undead ignored the expansion I had even though it was closer to their base than the main base. Were the attacks trigger based and not AI based?
Not having a disspell on any of the units made this hard, since the necros came very close to swarming the human base completely at the end with their mass skeletons.
I liked the model for that ogre boss.

Ch4
I liked razing the entire wardens with the prisoners.
I think doing this mission in the 2nd style that was mentioned at start (stealth) would only be possible if we had put all our spell levels from the previous mission into the windwalk spell. Otherwise, i don't think it is possible to not use the prisoner method.
Arthas' dialogue with sylvanas sounds very strange, it's like arthas has already given up and wants to die.

Ch5
Ok, there was not much to do on this map, since the main enemy base (Varimathras) was located right next to us. Going south to do the optional quest didn't give us much beyond another access way to the 2nd gold mine, since the item reward was just 10% attack speed increase.

Ch6
Really liked how there was actually a reason for killing the keepers of the grove (trees keep growing back in the area protecting generator).
The arcane generator was quite out of place in a night elf setting, since they would mostly be using nature magic i'm guessing.
Liked how there were boats available to reach secret items.

I closed the notepad i was writing my comments on. I don't have the other mission notes here, sorry.

In general, I think you put a lot of effort into making the missions unique, and that was nice. Each had its own flavour which was really good. I think there can still be space for improvement for the not RTS missions to make them less like kill everything on the map, and for the RTS missions maybe more can be added to make it less like we do nothing until we reach max food for a final push, otherwise they feel a little 1 dimensional.
I really liked the story though, and it made me want to know what was going to happen next.
Also really enjoyed Kael's and Magroths spell set, they were great.

I look forward to playing Bones Scourge next. It is also nice to be able to play this campaign without worrying about wc3 version bugs, since all the pre 1.32 issues were fixed on the latest patch.

Thanks for making this campaign Resyak/Son of War.
Thank you very much for the review. I'm surprised that it can be played in 1.32+ without any problem, it's very good news since many have asked me if they can play my campaigns in 1.32+ and I don't know what to answer because I have never tried it.

Regarding the things you say about the campaign, this was the first project and its shortcomings are very obvious. I remember that when we were designing the missions the main idea was that each chapter would be of a different type, one a time trial, another a puzzle, etc. And so we did, although that also made the chapters quite simple, since they focus on one thing. The RTS mission was never well balanced and the AIs are lacking quite a bit. In the continuation, Bones Scourge, things work a little better, I think it was a palpable improvement from one to the other, although the project was closed there since we later moved on to other projects.

Be that as it may, I'm glad you played it and at least it entertained you, but above all I appreciate the feedback, thank you very much.

Regards.
 

nv4

nv4

Level 7
Joined
Jul 17, 2022
Messages
32
This campaign has some interesting ideas, like 4 4 1 1 skill levels, or growing trees in chapter 7, or chapter 5 where you raze the prison from inside using prisoners and possesed watchers. But there are numerous things making negative impact on the overall experience.
Some missions are overall fine, but they feel like they're missing something. For example, chapter 1 - overall solid design, but there are only 2 types of enemies (water elemental and archmage) throughout the whole chapter, and that gets dull even in such short chapter. Or is it especially in such short chapter, where you focus your attention on small details?
Or chapter 2 - you just go throughout the whole city killing ambushed undeads, and even though the actual time to complete the chapter isn't that much, it feels way longer. Because there are mages with cripple, banshees with curse, and no dispell for that crap. And killing almost every group of enemies feels so slow. The granaries added some action, but I still didn't feel like it was enough.
Or chapter 4 - you have to defend against 9 waves of enemies, and each wave is basically the same - 4 zombies, 4 dalaran mutants, 4 necromancers, 2 meat wagons and a dreadlord. The only difference between waves is that dreadlord gets extra level each time. That's just dull. And looks silly when the end cutscene shows actual variety of units, but you don't even get to fight them, they're just killed by the towers.
There is also design problem with Chapter 6 - there is basicaly no reason to explore the map and do the secondary quest. The enemy base (main quest) is right across the road, and the objective is clear from the start of the chapter. And since enemy AI doesn't just sit idle at its base, you can't freely walk around exploring the map, so you're very inclined to just go and complete the main quest. Which I did. And only after that I explored the rest of the map and did the secondary quest. Not because there was a gameplay reason to do that, but simply out of curiosity. So the design problem is that there's no proper motivation to explore the map and do that secondary quest. It's just not worth it. Even more, on the first playthrough the player is more likely to complete the main quest before even discovering the secondary quest.
Chapter 3 is the least pleasant of all chapters. Numerous enemies with curse, cripple, bloodlust, summons, and the only way to counter that is Sylvanas' Denial Arrow. But it's a cheap ability so there's no problem, right? Wrong, there are hordes of fucking satyr soulstealers eager to mana burn the fuck out of your every unit with mana. And even then denial arrow doesn't help to deal with summoned units, and oh boy do satyr hellcallers love raising undeads. They love it so much that the first time I tried this chapter I got overrun as soon as I built my first buildings. Satyr hellcaller just walked up to my graveyard and summoned 5 grotesque ghouls, which are stronger than the normal ghoul. But okay, a rough early game with killing all those strong units will result in fast experience gain for Sylvanas, right? Wrong, the experience gain here is extremely low.
And there's also a bug with green AI, it produces units and attacks by timer, without checking the state of the previous attack wave, and the AI doesn't even have a food limit. So if you let it do its work long enough without killing the attack waves, it can become (took ~25 minutes) that there are so many enemies that the interval between the attacks is shorter than the time interval required for the attack wave to get to the point and back.

Also I don't like the sorcerer's skillset. I mean I understand the decision to make something new other than simply using priest and sorceress, but "new" doesn't automatically equal "good". Throughout the whole campaign, I almost never had the need to use slow or polymorph, but way more than once I wished I had dispell. So if sorcerer ends being an inferior version of the priest, making the intent of originality go in vain, then was it worth it?

But the biggest downside of this campaign is story. It has more plot holes than a piece a of swiss cheese.

The story goes straight to Kael in Dalaran's dungeon, completely omitting how he managed to come to this point in the first place. I mean, in the original story Kael was ordered virtually impossible mission, and only managed to succeed due to nagas' help. But nagas were there on behalf of Illidan. So here in this alternative timeline Illidan was never captured by Maiev and therefore Vashj had no need so seek for allies to help her rescue Illidan. So if there were no nagas to help Kael then how did he manage to do his missions and survive long enough under Garithos' command?
After I watched that interlude with Kael doing something to Aegwynn's grimoire, I expected it to play some part in the story. So I finished the campaign, and the first thing that came to my mind was Chekhov's rifle. What was the point of that interlude, if it didn't impact the story in any way or even simply mentioned ever after? This interlude could be cut out and literally nothing would change.

Why was Arthas in Kalimdor? Illidan's spell took place at the time of the first chapter of undead campaign in TFT, when Arthas was slaughtering villagers in Lordaeron. Kel'Thuzad even explicitly mentions Arthas' return in cutscene. And after being ambushed by the dreadlords, Arthas headed to Northrend. And in this timeline Arthas went to Kalimdor apparently? But there's literally nothing there for him, especially when he's so weakened - it simply doesn't make any sense. The logical course of action would be to stay in Lordaeron, with Kel'Thuzad and majority of their forces, and to fight the dreadlords to take over their forces.
Besides, why did he end up in Maiev's prison? Like, for what crimes exactly? His only business in Kalimdor and with night elves was that he indirectly helped them by revealing the secret about Skull of Gul'dan to Illidan. Actually, how did night elves even know who he is, so that the first sentinels that spotted him didn't just kill him, like they would any other undead? I'm not that familiar with whatever lore "Blizzard" pushed over the years in WoW, but in WC3 even Malfurion apparently was unaware about the Lich King, as he still tried to stop Illidan's spell even after consulting with the wisps at Lordaeron and knowing that the spell is targeted at the Icecrown at Northrend. So how come sentinels, who care not for anything outside Kalimdor (or even Ashenvale alone) and who probably never even ventured outside Ashenvale for thounds of years, not only recognise Arthas, but also know about his recent doings much enough to sentence him to eternity in prison?
So ok, Arthas went to Kalimdor, but why was he alone and not with Kel'Thuzad? In the original campaign Kel'Thuzad stayed back in Lordaeron as a ruler of this land, since Arthas headed to Northrend. But in this alternative timeline that's obviously not an option. So they were together when Illidan finished his spell, and then somehow got separated in such way that Kel'Thuzad knew where Arthas went, but it took him so long to catch up that Sylvanas even finished all her doings in Kalimdor by that time? Again, I fail to see how that makes any sense. Also, Kel'Thuzad's death doesn't fit his character at all.

Apparently Sylvanas had enough forces to deal with satyrs and then with night elves. But wait a minute, in the original campaign her forces were pretty small initially, and even Varimathras alone was too much for her own forces, so she had to have her banshees posses local races' leaders and use their forces. And only after defeating all 3 dreadlords, taking control of the lands and remains of their armies, she finally had a real army at her command, that is the Forsaken faction. All those things that she hadn't done here, yet somehow still got enough forces for little campaign in Kalimdor. And yet again all I see is plot holes.

Also, Detheroc wasn't even here. It's only been mentioned briefly that he killed Garithos and that's it. In the original campaign Detheroc had control over Garithos and his forces. So why would he just kill Garithos instead of using him and his forces to battle with Kael and Magroth? Again, doesn't make any sense.
It would make way more sense to alter the story in the manner of the original campaign, so that now Kael and Magroth would fight Detheroc to free Garithos from his control, and then join forces with Garithos to defeat Balnazzar.
But since this campaign has a continuation, I hoped Detheroc would play some part there. Unfortunately, even in Bones Scourge Detheroc's involvement in the story felt off, but at least there he wasn't just forgotten.

And what the hell is with Maiev's part of the story? In the original campaign she acted like nothing matters to her besides her objective, and nothing can scare her. She didn't care about blood elves, didn't really care about Tirande's fate, didn't hesitate to lie to Malfurion about such important matter as his beloved's fate, and didn't have any second thoughts jumping into the portal after Illidan, without even any knowledge of what lies beyond. She knew how much more powerful Illidan became with the power of Skull of Gul'dan, even personaly wintessed it at the Tomb of Sargeras and at Lordaeron, and stil didn't bat an eye. Malfurion explicitly stated how obsessed she became with her hunt.
But here, in this campaign? Illidan finishes his spell, and Maiev... Does absolutely nothing! She just fled to Kalimdor and that's it. It's even more off-character than Kel'Thuzad's death. Okay, maybe such turn of events affected her so much that she even got some common sense? Nope, she gets all personal again with Arthas. She simply let Illidan go, the obsession of her life, yet she goes back to Lordaeron after Arthas, the prisoner that is as irrelevant to her as any other no-name prisoner. And then she even gets captured by Sylvanas. So how did Sylvanas manage to capture a character whose most prominent feature is short-ranged teleportation? She uhhh... She surrounded Maiev with possesed huntresses. Yeah, that definitely would prevent Maiev from simply blinking away.
Maiev's involvement in the story feels off. All of it. Like she's there not because it makes sense, but due to lack of any better idea of what to do with the story.

And the last chapter feels like it doesn't even belong here. It doesn't really offer anything to the story (the characters' dialogs could be simply made into interlude, omitting the playable part of the chapter), has no explanation why the trolls would even get so daring here all of a sudden, and is also rather boring in terms of gameplay.
I mean, chapter 3 (with satyrs) doesn't offer anything to the story either and could be as well just cut out, but at least it doesn't feel like a foreign element to the story, unlike the last chapter.

Oh, and while Tyrande's death doesn't contradict the original plot or anything, it just feels... Cheap. Like, the undead were so eager to kill her because there was a singular will commanding them to do so. But after the Lich King's demise the undead must have been in disarray, ferral and uncoordinated (at least until someone takes control over them). Doesn't mean that it would 100% be enough for Tyrande to safely escape, but making an extra chapter about her would be certainly better than that pointless chapter with the trolls in Quel'Thalas.

I mean, sure it's an alternative WC3 story and if that's how you want it to be then so be it. But for it to be plausible it needs some legit explanation, and without it the story feels like a swiss cheese - too many plot holes and "loose ends" without explanation.
 
Level 20
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
369
This campaign has some interesting ideas, like 4 4 1 1 skill levels, or growing trees in chapter 7, or chapter 5 where you raze the prison from inside using prisoners and possesed watchers. But there are numerous things making negative impact on the overall experience.
Some missions are overall fine, but they feel like they're missing something. For example, chapter 1 - overall solid design, but there are only 2 types of enemies (water elemental and archmage) throughout the whole chapter, and that gets dull even in such short chapter. Or is it especially in such short chapter, where you focus your attention on small details?
Or chapter 2 - you just go throughout the whole city killing ambushed undeads, and even though the actual time to complete the chapter isn't that much, it feels way longer. Because there are mages with cripple, banshees with curse, and no dispell for that crap. And killing almost every group of enemies feels so slow. The granaries added some action, but I still didn't feel like it was enough.
Or chapter 4 - you have to defend against 9 waves of enemies, and each wave is basically the same - 4 zombies, 4 dalaran mutants, 4 necromancers, 2 meat wagons and a dreadlord. The only difference between waves is that dreadlord gets extra level each time. That's just dull. And looks silly when the end cutscene shows actual variety of units, but you don't even get to fight them, they're just killed by the towers.
There is also design problem with Chapter 6 - there is basicaly no reason to explore the map and do the secondary quest. The enemy base (main quest) is right across the road, and the objective is clear from the start of the chapter. And since enemy AI doesn't just sit idle at its base, you can't freely walk around exploring the map, so you're very inclined to just go and complete the main quest. Which I did. And only after that I explored the rest of the map and did the secondary quest. Not because there was a gameplay reason to do that, but simply out of curiosity. So the design problem is that there's no proper motivation to explore the map and do that secondary quest. It's just not worth it. Even more, on the first playthrough the player is more likely to complete the main quest before even discovering the secondary quest.
Chapter 3 is the least pleasant of all chapters. Numerous enemies with curse, cripple, bloodlust, summons, and the only way to counter that is Sylvanas' Denial Arrow. But it's a cheap ability so there's no problem, right? Wrong, there are hordes of fucking satyr soulstealers eager to mana burn the fuck out of your every unit with mana. And even then denial arrow doesn't help to deal with summoned units, and oh boy do satyr hellcallers love raising undeads. They love it so much that the first time I tried this chapter I got overrun as soon as I built my first buildings. Satyr hellcaller just walked up to my graveyard and summoned 5 grotesque ghouls, which are stronger than the normal ghoul. But okay, a rough early game with killing all those strong units will result in fast experience gain for Sylvanas, right? Wrong, the experience gain here is extremely low.
And there's also a bug with green AI, it produces units and attacks by timer, without checking the state of the previous attack wave, and the AI doesn't even have a food limit. So if you let it do its work long enough without killing the attack waves, it can become (took ~25 minutes) that there are so many enemies that the interval between the attacks is shorter than the time interval required for the attack wave to get to the point and back.

Also I don't like the sorcerer's skillset. I mean I understand the decision to make something new other than simply using priest and sorceress, but "new" doesn't automatically equal "good". Throughout the whole campaign, I almost never had the need to use slow or polymorph, but way more than once I wished I had dispell. So if sorcerer ends being an inferior version of the priest, making the intent of originality go in vain, then was it worth it?

But the biggest downside of this campaign is story. It has more plot holes than a piece a of swiss cheese.

The story goes straight to Kael in Dalaran's dungeon, completely omitting how he managed to come to this point in the first place. I mean, in the original story Kael was ordered virtually impossible mission, and only managed to succeed due to nagas' help. But nagas were there on behalf of Illidan. So here in this alternative timeline Illidan was never captured by Maiev and therefore Vashj had no need so seek for allies to help her rescue Illidan. So if there were no nagas to help Kael then how did he manage to do his missions and survive long enough under Garithos' command?
After I watched that interlude with Kael doing something to Aegwynn's grimoire, I expected it to play some part in the story. So I finished the campaign, and the first thing that came to my mind was Chekhov's rifle. What was the point of that interlude, if it didn't impact the story in any way or even simply mentioned ever after? This interlude could be cut out and literally nothing would change.

Why was Arthas in Kalimdor? Illidan's spell took place at the time of the first chapter of undead campaign in TFT, when Arthas was slaughtering villagers in Lordaeron. Kel'Thuzad even explicitly mentions Arthas' return in cutscene. And after being ambushed by the dreadlords, Arthas headed to Northrend. And in this timeline Arthas went to Kalimdor apparently? But there's literally nothing there for him, especially when he's so weakened - it simply doesn't make any sense. The logical course of action would be to stay in Lordaeron, with Kel'Thuzad and majority of their forces, and to fight the dreadlords to take over their forces.
Besides, why did he end up in Maiev's prison? Like, for what crimes exactly? His only business in Kalimdor and with night elves was that he indirectly helped them by revealing the secret about Skull of Gul'dan to Illidan. Actually, how did night elves even know who he is, so that the first sentinels that spotted him didn't just kill him, like they would any other undead? I'm not that familiar with whatever lore "Blizzard" pushed over the years in WoW, but in WC3 even Malfurion apparently was unaware about the Lich King, as he still tried to stop Illidan's spell even after consulting with the wisps at Lordaeron and knowing that the spell is targeted at the Icecrown at Northrend. So how come sentinels, who care not for anything outside Kalimdor (or even Ashenvale alone) and who probably never even ventured outside Ashenvale for thounds of years, not only recognise Arthas, but also know about his recent doings much enough to sentence him to eternity in prison?
So ok, Arthas went to Kalimdor, but why was he alone and not with Kel'Thuzad? In the original campaign Kel'Thuzad stayed back in Lordaeron as a ruler of this land, since Arthas headed to Northrend. But in this alternative timeline that's obviously not an option. So they were together when Illidan finished his spell, and then somehow got separated in such way that Kel'Thuzad knew where Arthas went, but it took him so long to catch up that Sylvanas even finished all her doings in Kalimdor by that time? Again, I fail to see how that makes any sense. Also, Kel'Thuzad's death doesn't fit his character at all.

Apparently Sylvanas had enough forces to deal with satyrs and then with night elves. But wait a minute, in the original campaign her forces were pretty small initially, and even Varimathras alone was too much for her own forces, so she had to have her banshees posses local races' leaders and use their forces. And only after defeating all 3 dreadlords, taking control of the lands and remains of their armies, she finally had a real army at her command, that is the Forsaken faction. All those things that she hadn't done here, yet somehow still got enough forces for little campaign in Kalimdor. And yet again all I see is plot holes.

Also, Detheroc wasn't even here. It's only been mentioned briefly that he killed Garithos and that's it. In the original campaign Detheroc had control over Garithos and his forces. So why would he just kill Garithos instead of using him and his forces to battle with Kael and Magroth? Again, doesn't make any sense.
It would make way more sense to alter the story in the manner of the original campaign, so that now Kael and Magroth would fight Detheroc to free Garithos from his control, and then join forces with Garithos to defeat Balnazzar.
But since this campaign has a continuation, I hoped Detheroc would play some part there. Unfortunately, even in Bones Scourge Detheroc's involvement in the story felt off, but at least there he wasn't just forgotten.

And what the hell is with Maiev's part of the story? In the original campaign she acted like nothing matters to her besides her objective, and nothing can scare her. She didn't care about blood elves, didn't really care about Tirande's fate, didn't hesitate to lie to Malfurion about such important matter as his beloved's fate, and didn't have any second thoughts jumping into the portal after Illidan, without even any knowledge of what lies beyond. She knew how much more powerful Illidan became with the power of Skull of Gul'dan, even personaly wintessed it at the Tomb of Sargeras and at Lordaeron, and stil didn't bat an eye. Malfurion explicitly stated how obsessed she became with her hunt.
But here, in this campaign? Illidan finishes his spell, and Maiev... Does absolutely nothing! She just fled to Kalimdor and that's it. It's even more off-character than Kel'Thuzad's death. Okay, maybe such turn of events affected her so much that she even got some common sense? Nope, she gets all personal again with Arthas. She simply let Illidan go, the obsession of her life, yet she goes back to Lordaeron after Arthas, the prisoner that is as irrelevant to her as any other no-name prisoner. And then she even gets captured by Sylvanas. So how did Sylvanas manage to capture a character whose most prominent feature is short-ranged teleportation? She uhhh... She surrounded Maiev with possesed huntresses. Yeah, that definitely would prevent Maiev from simply blinking away.
Maiev's involvement in the story feels off. All of it. Like she's there not because it makes sense, but due to lack of any better idea of what to do with the story.

And the last chapter feels like it doesn't even belong here. It doesn't really offer anything to the story (the characters' dialogs could be simply made into interlude, omitting the playable part of the chapter), has no explanation why the trolls would even get so daring here all of a sudden, and is also rather boring in terms of gameplay.
I mean, chapter 3 (with satyrs) doesn't offer anything to the story either and could be as well just cut out, but at least it doesn't feel like a foreign element to the story, unlike the last chapter.

Oh, and while Tyrande's death doesn't contradict the original plot or anything, it just feels... Cheap. Like, the undead were so eager to kill her because there was a singular will commanding them to do so. But after the Lich King's demise the undead must have been in disarray, ferral and uncoordinated (at least until someone takes control over them). Doesn't mean that it would 100% be enough for Tyrande to safely escape, but making an extra chapter about her would be certainly better than that pointless chapter with the trolls in Quel'Thalas.

I mean, sure it's an alternative WC3 story and if that's how you want it to be then so be it. But for it to be plausible it needs some legit explanation, and without it the story feels like a swiss cheese - too many plot holes and "loose ends" without explanation.
Thank you very much for the comments, we really appreciate them very much, regarding this campaign and its continuation (Bones Scourge) I must say that they were the first ones we uploaded and it is obvious that they have many deficiencies at all levels, but it helped us learn a lot and thanks to people like you who take the time and effort to comment and leave their impressions, we have been able to improve. Once again, thanks for playing and I hope you enjoy the new content that we are uploading.

Regards.
 
Top