Battle for Stratholme!

[Moderator]

03:24, 21st Jul 2009
ap0calypse: Rejected

The map does not meet the hive's standards by far.

 

[Svenska_0rmen]

Hmm pretty good

 

[krisserz]

First of all the description at Hive could be better. There are no info about the map.
The map is horribly imbalanced, you just placed normal units around the map in groups... The map isn`t playable, because it has no winning condition. The terrain in the most parts of the map is flat. It`s just simply unplayable. 1/5 and vote for rejection.

 

[adnan3]

did u play it through? u get regular spawns. and yea i just posted the map for fun, maybe soem1 will enjoy it, i know it sucks

Ps the name of the game describes the game

 

[krisserz]

and yea i just posted the map for fun

There are many maps posted for fun, but they are finished...

 

[adnan3]

there the map now HAS victory condition, so u cant blame that anymore

and btw it requires full house for game experience, playing it on single might seem bad but if u would play it with fh ud see its alot diffrent

 

[krisserz]

But it`s still imbalanced. Why Arthas is outside at the beginning? And there are some other things...

 

[adnan3]

arthas is suposed to die, i made it so when he dies the gates open

ps it is made so because the early version it was jsut blue vs red and i had no1 2 play vs

 

[vegetation]

The idea of this map is good, but the map is not good. Too inbalanced, too many memory leaks, too many units and bad terrain. Plus its just a normal map with triggers, you didn't even changed the units hps, skills or damages. I know im not really good at mapping, that's why i know when maps sucks. You could have done better.

 

[krisserz]

The idea is good, but not new. There are maps that are better like lotrs.

 

[adnan3]

the units stats are not changed cuz they are suposed to be real orcs of how wc3 made them. I just hosted this and no1 bitched like u 2. in fact they liked it. and im not experiacing memory leak, maybe ur not sending ur units to fight?

ps. the map is not imbalanced, its cause u play for 1 minute in single player and judge it, i just played it with full house and we won with 39 seconds left, thats pretty balanced so dont tell me its imbalanced before even trying it

 

[krisserz]

No, I test every map with friends. This map I tested 1v1 and WE agreed, that this map is weak.

 

[adnan3]

thats yout problem, you hosted 1v1, go full house or u cant do a right jugdement of this map

and btw what maps have youve done thats so great, id like 2 c, so far ive only seen ur shitty ass spell and ur so called project that never gets done, so untill u make one thats better than me stfu and go fuck yourself

 

[krisserz]

No, my project is in work, but it`s not good enough yet to be put at Hive. I respect this site, so I`m not gonna spam it with "maps" (if I can call it a map) like this.

BTW "map" like this I can do in 10 minutes...

 

[adnan3]

yea well i did it in 5 mins, whats ur point? Ive atleast done something and not jsut this crap a real map. Unlike you i do something other then going around pretending to be a expert on reviews when you havent doen shit yourself. Now stfu and go bother some1 else. And btw ur talking of originality? unusal TD, hero final fight and a rpg. Wow ur rly original.

 

[ap0calypse]

Please do not post maps for fun the next time.
This is a respected site, where people can browse good maps (and good maps only).

The hive is made because other sites' map standards are too low (e.g.: EpicWar).
When people play maps, they want to play higher quality maps, here they can find it very quickly thanks to the the good search-function and the fact that there are only higher quality maps.

and btw what maps have youve done thats so great, id like 2 c, so far ive only seen ur shitty ass spell and ur so called project that never gets done, so untill u make one thats better than me stfu and go fuck yourself

-rep for that... please respect other users, even if they aren't experienced (and I'm not saying he isn't), everyone deserves a chance.

yea well i did it in 5 mins

Good for you, work on it for another month and you the quality is high enough to upload at the hive
(My point: it takes a while to create a good map, try to put more effort in it, if you made this for fun, keep it for yourself, or share it with friends through other methods).

Unlike you i do something other then going around pretending to be a expert on reviews when you havent doen shit yourself

Suprprise, surprise.... he is an official map reviewer (social group: map reviewers) and believe me: he is absolutely right about everything he has said.
I do not try to break you down, it's just that I would like other people to respect the rules and standards of this site.

Well, I rejected the map - obviously.

If you have anything to say, you are free to do so.

 

[adnan3]

Cant belive 1v1 maps where all the mapmaker did was to make terrain and goldmines and doods and then upload but this one gets rejected? -.-

 

[ap0calypse]

This is the same what I have said on your page:

So you do not see the difference between melee-maps and custom maps?
Well, I'll explain it a bit:

Melee-maps are standard warcraft-maps, the triggers/objects have not been changed, only the terrain has.
The point of the game is to create an army, starting off with a mai building and 5 builders.

You can team up with others, play FFA, play 1v1, or play versus an NPC.
You are victorious when all enemy buildings have been destroyed.

Now, does your map resemble this?

Here is another difference:

This is the sign that the map is a melee-map, with the standard trigger and standard objects

This is the sign that the map is a custom map, with edited triggers and/or objects.


-> Melee-maps are an exception and it isn't really easy to make melee-maps: you need to make sure the terrain is exceptionally good (your terrain, for example, woudln't be good enough), the game needs to be perfectly balanced (for symmetrical maps it's easy, otherwise it isn't) and the drop-rates and creeps need to be balanced as well.
Make sure every player has the same drop-chances from his creeps (and his/her creeps must be the same as the other players).

 

[adnan3]

If its a fun map it should be allowed. This is prob why epicwar is more popular than hive -.-

 

[ap0calypse]

If its a fun map it should be allowed. This is prob why epicwar is more popular than hive -.-

The quality of maps on EpicWar is extremely low.
If you wish to upload your maps at EpicWar, I will not stop you.

If you think this map is fun and meets the hive's minimem requirements, I can proove you wrong with that.
Just tell me if I need to post a complete review, so you can see your mistakes.

 

[adnan3]

Please do because i have no idea why it got deleted. And do not say its umbalanced, it isnt

 

[Septimus]

If its a fun map it should be allowed. This is prob why epicwar is more popular than hive -.-

lol... epicwar.com might have zillions of map. Then again, how many have quality on it compare to hiveworkshop.com and wc3c.net?

i know it sucks

If you know it was terrible, then why do you still bother to upload it?

and btw it requires full house for game experience, playing it on single might seem bad but if u would play it with fh ud see its alot diffrent

A decent map would be good no matter how much player on it.

the units stats are not changed cuz they are suposed to be real orcs of how wc3 made them. I just hosted this and no1 bitched like u 2. in fact they liked it. and im not experiacing memory leak, maybe ur not sending ur units to fight?

Do they know anything about map making? Getting 5,000 useless review that saying "It awesome", "Great" "Sucks" are definitely not worth a cent.

 

[ap0calypse]

You wanted a review?
I'll give you a review that is most fair.

If you can still deny that this map deserves a 1/5 rejected, then I should advise you take a look at higher-quality maps (higher-quality in my eyes).

Full review:

We will start out with the description on the hive.
The entire first paragraph is about you finding this map in your folder, so you can remove that.

In the second paragraph, you describe the tactics that you need to use to play this map, instead of the gameplay.
You also describe the victory/defeat condition (when a player wins/loses), but that is where it ends, there is no further description.

The lay-out of the description is also very bad, I do not want to play a game that is described like this, it looks very unprofessional.
(And I have heard from a lot of other - experienced - users the same comment: maps with a poor description aren't appealing enough to be played, this is not a subjective note).

There is no in-game description, so that part deserves a 0/10.
Without description in-game, a map will not be allowed on the hive (first reason to reject the map).

This is the longest part of the review, since I've added some screeny's...

Units/spells

Almost all units are standard, there is hardly any customization.

Screeny's of your map

These are the unit stats of your map, you can check it in the object editor: it's exactly the same.
Not only these units are standard, about 90% of your units/buildings are.

With customization, I mean:

• Edited damage
• Edited HP
• Edited Name
• (not required edited model/icon
• Edited armor
• (not required for units without abilities edited spells

None of these conditions are met for most of your units.
Here are the spells for your heroes, for example:

Screeny Spells

Yet again, these aren't all heroes, but it's basically always the same: no spell has been changed.
You can also check this in the World Editor to check if I'm right or not.

Also the description/spell abilities haven't been changed, making it perfectly standard.
This goes for all other spells as well.

Items

There were no items.

Overall

Obviously this isn't good...
There are no items, most units are standard, all spells are standard.

The terrain is extremely bad.

It is way too plain, you've used almost no doodads or tileset change.
When you did change the tileset, it was too sudden, there is no transition between 2 tilesets.
A perfect example of that is in this screeny:

Screeny - bad terrain transition

The city is very unrealistic.
Though the horde hasn't invaded the city yet, there are already some houses on fire, the structure of the city is randomed (this is not how a city looks like), there are no paths, no doodads (like lights or walls), you have used blizzard cliffs to seperate the city from the horde's terrain.

An example of the bad city is in this screeny:

Screeny - bad city terraining

The houses on the left are clearly randomly positioned: they do not follow any logical city structure.
The burning house is over the top (as said before): the horde did not invade the city yet and the houde is burning.


The rest of the terrain is basically a copy of these screeny's: bad transitions, almost no doodads and unlogical structures.

The gameplay is very bad: you have massed some units and made them fight eachother... that's it.
Here is a screeny of the massed units:

Screeny - Massed units

So now it's up to the players to fend off those massed units, or be overrun by them.
This isn't really called a "gameplay", actually - this is called "randomly hitting/massing buttons".

And now try to say I had no reason to reject this map!

 

[Svenska_0rmen]

The game play is good. so why redject it? if people likes it, it shouldnt be redjected

 

[adnan3]

There is a strategy, u gotta try hold them at the walls using heroes are very important. Some of the houses are on fire cause the catapults have fired earlier into the city. Its the world of wc3 so the terrain changes all the sudden (magic). The houses can also be explained by the humans way of building. The more random the more awesome. The units spells are same because i mean cmon ive based them on the real heroes so they should have the standard spells and stats.

 

[ap0calypse]

The game play is good. so why redject it? if people likes it, it shouldnt be redjected

I have explained why it isn't good.

There is a strategy, u gotta try hold them at the walls using heroes are very important. Some of the houses are on fire cause the catapults have fired earlier into the city. Its the world of wc3 so the terrain changes all the sudden (magic). The houses can also be explained by the humans way of building. The more random the more awesome. The units spells are same because i mean cmon ive based them on the real heroes so they should have the standard spells and stats.

I'm not saying there isn't a strategy, it's just very hard to apply it because of the massive amount of massed units.

A catapult's range is 1150 (I think, didn't check it), the buildings on fire are way beyond that reach.
If the catapult's range suddenly got higher for that moment, then it would be higher for the entire battle.

The terrain can change, that isn't the problem, but it changes in a crappy way, so now the terrain is just really bad.
If you use magic to change the terrain, at least change it into something nice.

The more random the more awesome?
I don't think so... humans are the only race on earth that tries to break the law of physics: eventually, everything will return to chaos.
Though nature wants to return everything to chaos (disorder), humans try to limit that in every possible way: we have our own rituals (organized), we are bound by the law (to restrict chaos from expanding in civilization) and we build cities in a structurized way!

So you've based them on the standard heroes, I can see that.
That still doesn't explain why you've 'based them on' the standard heroes.
Look: in a custom map, you use custom heroes - it's as simple as that.

 

[Hunting_Panda]

nothing special, same opinion as apo