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Are we something more than organic robots?

Discussion in 'Recycle Bin' started by Shiroaisu, Dec 26, 2009.

?

Are we more than organic robots???

  1. yes

    32 vote(s)
    55.2%
  2. no

    26 vote(s)
    44.8%
  1. NearbyHermit

    NearbyHermit

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    A question comes to mind !

    Puppets are created by a puppeteer ,that may probably be the only free will in the universe,right?
     
  2. N-a-z-g-u-l

    N-a-z-g-u-l

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    its enough that ONE human would create some thing like that... and there are some... for example me :) i mean its a great challange to make a robot think on its own, designing and building new robots, evolving. challenges are meant to be met.
    of course you wont try to create a robot which has its free will and equipped with big weapons, that could be a bit dangerous ^^
    by the way, there are already computers which are meant to "scare" us... what about AI in computer games? thats the same question.
    I think a "human" robot can also exist virtually. Because the most important thing about a human is his brain, his ability to learn and so on... such robots could also exist in virtual environments.

    besides that, remote-controlled mini-machine-gun-carts and stuff like that is being developed... it "help" for the others, but a nightmare for the others...

    ehm well... i would like to see you sitting in the arctic.... i doubt you would survive it without being prepared already... knowledge and the ability to plan are more important for humans to survive... true "adaption" is quite slow... (actually knowledge grows too fast for adaption, the human seen as an animal does no longer need to change, its only the "controller")

    and by the way, that long time does not mean that robots cannot be created... maybe it means that it will take some time, BUT i doubt it will be millions of years, because humans evolved randomly, bad versions died, good versions survived. But humans are able to create robots in a different way...
    that would be the same as if you want to code a program just by editing random parts and then try what happens...




    Anyways, for all those who voted "no":

    so you say you are a robot? that would be plausible from the outside, it would also be okay that "robots" say "I" and have feelings like "i feel my battery is low", "need oil" or "wanna build more robots" (robot-sex)
    but from the inside: YOU see a picture with your eyes and brain, it feels like the human body is a helper and YOU can think and decide... it would be possible to create robots acting the same as humans, but i dont know where you can find that "robot pilot"... and you wont be able to prove it from the outside... i mean you cannot even prove that other humans have that "human pilot".... and it would be hard to believe that anyone else has, if we werent all of the same race... same for animals...

    so well, my conclusion: organic robots hmm... i think robots and animals work differently... there are computers working with some bio-processes i think, so you could also build a human from scratch and title it a "robot"... on the other hand, the mechanical robots are a bit different, i think they will be able to "feel" and so on, but they would be something different, but neither better nor worse, and neither more living or less living.

    its very likely humans will be downgraded to some kind of robots some day, because you will also be able to modificate them (add arms and so on, which is already partly possible)... with a "chip and harddisk" in the brain

    -> thoughts vs executed code

    the visible result of both would be the same, and a robot would also say that it "knows" things and sees pictures, as it is able to work with them, identify objects on them and so on...

    differing between subconscious and conscious would also be possible: subconscious is everything a predefined operating system does (i think humans have something like that, too), the rest is "dynamic code" of which the robot knows and it can edit on its own.



    anyways.... hard to say and my final answer is there is no answer, a matter of belief

    do our computers already go to robot-heaven? :D
    (if you believe in a life after death or a soul then this topic is nothing for you anyways)




    EDIT: some posts while i was writing, most important:

    well its a bit different, that could be something like rust ^^ However, theres a mushroom which affects animals' brains. they try to climb as high as possible, die there, and the mushroom has a better chance to spread... that would be a true computer virus ;)
    another example: theres bacteria or something like that killing birds, but it can also be transmitted to humans and other animals. Those humans / animals then do risky things more often, the readiness to assume a risk grows, so they die earlier... birds tend to eat dead animals -> bacteria win! ^^

    technically robots and humans are similiar, but seeing yourself from the inside... hm ^^ dont know whether robots can do that, because its not really necessary ^^ maybe its just some kind of interface simulated by the brain to transmit data to a given "chip" in the brain, which is what "you" are... :D I wonder whether all of that chips in a brain are self-conscious, THAT would be weird ^^ ( I am only one of the chips, so i cant tell ^^ )


    AH, and another question which came to my mind: identity.
    you can say "thats me", "that was me", and you can plan your future a bit, but what if you were teleported. Not at once, but a copy of yourself is created, the old version of your body is simply removed...
    the new human will say "that was me", and "thats me", but what about yourself and your thoughts? i mean would you stop existing? theres no real connection to the future, but i personally would not like to teleport myself... though i knew that the final product will act perfectly like me and say "hey, really, thats no problem", and other persons would tell me that teleporting is no problem, because they think nothing happened... but is that another person then?
     
  3. NearbyHermit

    NearbyHermit

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    And even so,humans are equipped with one feature - knowledge !


    But that knowledge is just spontaneous ,the reaction of triggered events.
     
  4. Alagremm

    Alagremm

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    I believe we are not organic robots or something more. We are something different. Lulz, I just imagined that aliens are reading threads like this to better understand us.

    We proved many times that human isnt just a body - even scientist have to accept the fact that soul may exist. However we are here to serve some purpose, so basically we are robots.

    Somehow I still belive that its either both or neither.
     
  5. NearbyHermit

    NearbyHermit

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    I can think of a certain spiral theory right now.

    Just like a spiral,we flow in a circle that never ends.
     
  6. Crazed_seal2

    Crazed_seal2

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    We are puppets actually, we try to control everything when infact your getting controlled! We are puppets and we made ourselves puppets, i could be using another person while some one is using me.
    We are puppets!
     
  7. NearbyHermit

    NearbyHermit

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    Made ourselves?

    The fact that 2 people poped out of nowhere is just unacceptable :thumbs_down:

    There has to be a greater ''power'' !
     
  8. Dreadnought[dA]

    Dreadnought[dA]

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    Humans can assimilate their surroundings better. We are great as using our senses and adapting to what we *sense*. Machines cannot do that yet. However they can perform whatever functions programmed into them a million times better than a human. I don't know if we will ever be able to program artificial intelligence where machines can incorporate information on their own. We can always have fun trying though :p

    To answer your question, we are something more than organic robots because of our imaginations. I don't know if you could give a robot an imagination. It might be able to write a symphony, but only by taking samples of other songs and using strict songwriting rules. It could paint a picture, but again only by using something it has seen and also following strict rules.

    You could say the same of humans, that we only have an imagination because we are inspired by what we see, but it's something so complex that we don't understand and can't understand it will never be programmed into machines.
     
  9. N-a-z-g-u-l

    N-a-z-g-u-l

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    could you give some examples?

    (this near-death-experience proves nothing in my opinion: that replay may be meant to give you a concentrated will to come back to life because it was so nice. out-of-body experience: dreaming can be very realistic, but is there any proof that someone "left his body", walked round a corner with his soul and read some information or something like that? would be useful for a spy, wouldnt it? ^^)

    in fact, i do not know of a single solid proof. but i would really be glad to have one, it really feels better when you know you are something more than materia^^
     
  10. LordDz

    LordDz

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    Yes. We are more than robots.
     
  11. NearbyHermit

    NearbyHermit

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    Arguments ? :confused:
     
  12. N-a-z-g-u-l

    N-a-z-g-u-l

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    true, i am already thinking of structures how to save lots of information in a style an ai could use it... and THEN, once the "operating system" is finished, you can teach it things like a baby :p would be hard though ^^

    EDIT: incredible posting frequency in this thread^^
     
  13. Alagremm

    Alagremm

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    I always thought of humanity like this:
    After many failures like the meteorites, destroying life on Earth, it has started a very risky project with low possibility of success. A lifeform that can control the planet and protect itself and the planet with it. All was going well, however there were some problems. Humanity had its "programm" and destination, however it was forgotten. All the shamanistic and other ancient cults are the last breath of that programming. Lately humanity began destroying the planet and it has no other choise but to start slow extermination, hoping that humanity will understand and stop destroiyng the planet. That explains all the viruses and other cataclysms. Most likely Earth wants to shorten human population to a few hundred thousand humans.

    My theory explains all the mysteries of ancient humans, origin and purpose of human kind and the explanation of the cataclysms and very strong viruses on earth.
     
  14. Dreadnought[dA]

    Dreadnought[dA]

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    I'm trying to understand this post, but it's difficult.

    You can't prove or disprove the existence of a *soul* as it is something we can't detect with our *senses*. It might feel good, sound good, and be an easy way of explaining something, but that doesn't make it true.
     
  15. N-a-z-g-u-l

    N-a-z-g-u-l

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    dont know about that cults, but the rest is true....

    its not that "earth" is a person or something with an own will, but what you can call "earth's will" are the rules of evolution and everything around it (still random in some way)
     
  16. Crazed_seal2

    Crazed_seal2

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    Ok, i can tell you what we are; we are humans, unless your a cylon or a cake, but we are humans and we random, we cannot be controlled like robots, we are a thinking, evolving race, we have dreams. Its emotions what make us humans not pre-programmed data, we learn from our mistakes, we are more then capable of thinking, we are capable of doing! Remember, if you throw away your feelings you no more then a robot, that is my final oppinion!
     
  17. N-a-z-g-u-l

    N-a-z-g-u-l

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    i doubt we can prove a soul, too.

    i was just replying to "We proved many times that human isnt just a body", which i cant believe...


    well yes, theoretically i could have no soul, and i cant find a proof, but in fact practically i act like i knew that i have one
     
  18. Alagremm

    Alagremm

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    Thats the point of my theory. Earth doesnt create robots - it creates life that can think greater then animals, that has its own feelings, our minds are the tool earth uses to save itself! We arent programmed or anyhting, we can undertand what is good, so we will protect Earth.

    The starting programm was made to guide humanity in the beginning, but feelings and mind are what we are made for.
     
  19. Crazed_seal2

    Crazed_seal2

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    OMG, can't you guys see! We are being humans now, we are putting in what we BELIEVE and what we FEEL like what is right!
     
  20. Alagremm

    Alagremm

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    We dont deny that.