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(8)Endless Cycle

Submitted by TheSilverhand
This bundle is marked as awaiting update. A staff member has requested changes to it before it can be approved.
First time uploading a Melee map to Hive workshop. I would love to get your opinion of the map and what I should do to make the map more interesting and how to even it out a bit more to make it a better map.

There have been rumors of Golems and Monsters who lurk in these woods. Keep and eye out and maybe you'll see some.

Updates

Change Log-1

Change Log (01-22-2019):
Removed Dragon Roost, Replaced with 2 Fountains.
Fixed Creep Levels
Added more creeps
Made more room for players
Added 4 new gold mines facing the Center
Added 2 gateways connecting to each other across from the 2 Fountains
Added small puddles
Added critters
Added gold mines behind bases
set gold mine creeps to Normal instead of Camp.
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Contents

(8)Endless Cycle (Map)

Reviews
twojstaryjakcie
I appreciate the effort, especially since this is your first time making a Melee map, but the fact of the matter is that it has numerous design flaws connected directly to you probably being new to Melee in general. The map is extremely squarish in...
mafe
Alright, were are we here? Since twojstaryjakcie is apparently no longer active, I guess it's my job to moderate this map now. You've already heard that regarding terrain, the map really is very basic. I can live with that if the map is of good...
  1. twojstaryjakcie

    twojstaryjakcie

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Messages:
    101
    Resources:
    2
    Maps:
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    Resources:
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    I appreciate the effort, especially since this is your first time making a Melee map, but the fact of the matter is that it has numerous design flaws connected directly to you probably being new to Melee in general.

    The map is extremely squarish in terms of design. Although aesthetics are not a key point when a Melee map is concerned, this particular tree alignment is - when trees are placed via square brush, they allow Wisps to slip into the corners of the treeline, rendering them immune to Melee attacks. This obviously gives Night Elves a serious edge over other races (especially Orcs since they usually start with a Blademaster and Grunts which are melee) as their scouting workers are much harder to kill. I would recommend changing the alignment of trees using the circle brush although it will obviously require a lot of work.
    upload_2019-1-21_12-25-14.png


    The item drops are all over the place - a level 24 expansion camp grants a level 3 Permanent item, while a level 18 Mana Fountain camp drops a level 6 item. You need to focus more on adjusting the item's level to the creep camp's level. There's a neat chart showing how to do that in this guide: Competitive Melee Map

    In most cases, the creeps at expansions should have their acquisition range set to 500. This is necessary mainly because of the fact that it prevents players from building towers near the camp and then clearing it without any effort while having their expansion defenses already set up at the same time. Change the acquisition range to 500 and move the treeline back a bit if it interferes with the map's pathing (if the creeps start attacking units passing by).

    There is no terrain variation save for the giant hill in the middle. This hurts the game both in terms of its aesthetics and gameplay value as not only does it make the map look boring, but it also doesn't let players make too many tactical decisions which therefore makes the skirmish boring as well. Try experimenting with adding high ground in some locations (some of the expansions, for example), maybe elevate the ground near Goblin Merchants, Marketplaces, and so on.

    There is very little terrain variation, only grass and some dirt here and there - try experimenting with the tileset, add some beaten paths, maybe make a few water puddles (it is raining in your map, is it not?)

    The expansions blocked behind trees are so small that it's not even possible to set up expansion there. Obviously, it'd be nice if you made the expansion a little bit bigger.
    upload_2019-1-21_11-23-51.png

    For now, the map requires quite a lot of improvement, but in time it might make for a decent Melee experience.

    As you are probably new to Melee mapping, I recommend taking a look at these guides as well:
    How to create Melee Maps
    Description Guide - Melee Maps
    Melee mapping - The reasons behind common aspects of competitive 1v1 maps
     
  2. TheSilverhand

    TheSilverhand

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2015
    Messages:
    63
    Resources:
    4
    Maps:
    4
    Resources:
    4
    I appreciate your feedback. I'm going to work on puddles, work on the sides a bit, and fix the items. Ima check out Blizzard maps while doing so and get some inspiration for (Maybe) adding in a Goldmine in the corners.
     
  3. TheSilverhand

    TheSilverhand

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2015
    Messages:
    63
    Resources:
    4
    Maps:
    4
    Resources:
    4
    Gotta say, love the feedback, but my map is a 4v4. I'm not much of a terrainer and it annoys me sometimes, I mainly make Custom maps aside melee. I just thought "I'd love to give a shot at making a melee map." Everything was balanced I thought. then I saw that there were a few uneven edges so I pretty much got upset at how it became uneven. It was started off with perfect even shapes on all their sides. Really upsets me on how it did that. But thanks anyways! :)
     
  4. mafe

    mafe

    Map Reviewer

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2013
    Messages:
    410
    Resources:
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    10
    Tutorials:
    1
    Resources:
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    Alright, were are we here? Since twojstaryjakcie is apparently no longer active, I guess it's my job to moderate this map now.

    You've already heard that regarding terrain, the map really is very basic. I can live with that if the map is of good quality with respect to gameplay. But still, I have a few question:
    -If a map is made to played for 4v4, why are most parts of the map so narrow that moving your armies around as a team will be impossible? Where are the big 4v4 team fights supposed to take place?
    -Why are some item classes not specified? Is this intentional or an oversight?
    -Creeps near waygates are very likely to interact weirdly with the gate.

    Some of the things mentioned in the reviews above also still exists. I respect anyone who tries to make a large map, as this take a lot of effort. But I don't think the map is quite good enough to be approved yet. So for now, it goes to Awaiting update, but if you have some good explanations as to why you think all of this is fine, we can talk about it.