MasterHaosis

Master Hoasis ! :as:

,,You look different now Illidan. Perhaps skull of Guldan agreed with you"... haha he also tricked him.

Hmm what? I didn't get that part, what do you mean by it? That skull of gul'dan tricked illidan? Well so far I haven't seen any negative effects from it. Perhaps in WoW lore they could have advanced his character and made SoG turn him kinda mad or something or health-costly. Or he starts feeling more pain/less pain, turns kinda demonic in some aspect I dunno. And he has to struggle more to overcome it or find a cure. It felt kinda costless to me, SoG. But what was even worse is that Furion saw it was costless (it turned illidan into an awesome looking demon with the best wings (one broken, I love that.), hooves and shit) but still banished him.

But anyways, I think we can wrap this up, unless you want us to continue?

Čukarički

Crvena zvezda nema da plati igrače, a Četnički ima za kupovati utakmice??:S

Do you want a story? The history of making my name.

See, that's another thing I like about Illidan - he is a complex character. People aren't sure what he is. At first he looks like a generic villain, but he could also be much more than that. He could be a good guy in the skin of a villain, seen as villain. I prefer to interpret him that way since he looks much more full and real, not just the evil, the mad, the power hungry or the good. He is a combination of all these stuff, with a main aspect of good, failing to actually be good because of his downsides like power hunger and a little bit of madness (not crazyness). Also, what I like about his power hunger is that it's not just a generic type of power hunger for no reason, he wants to prove himself with this power, to be a better leader and also to be able to lead his people with power. He sees power wrongly, he fails to understand that not power makes a good leader or a worthy person. Arthas had a similar lust for power. That's why these characters are so awesome and complex. Kil'Jaeden or Archimonde are just some generic villains with power hunger but for no reason. They both accepted Sargeras' power but for no reason, really. Draenei lived awesome back then, before the demons.

Ten. No no no, I never said anything like that. I didn't say he is crazy, just that he had reasons to be angry. Also, I didn't say that when he did something wrong it was because he is crazy. He isn't. He made mistakes there. Conscious mistakes, afterwards of course. After he fails at some place and does something evil, he regrets it. Ok lets recap his first failure. He is not Highborne but becomes a defender of the Highborne. The war begins. The highbornes are assholes and kinda working for the demons, in a weird way. Furion tells Illidan to leave the Highborne and come fight with him. He accepts. Furion tells Illidan to destroy the Well, thus NEs losing immortal life and great power. He sees this as wrong, thinking for himself and his people and disagrees. Splits. He tries to trick the Burning legion into giving him power with which he can destroy demons. Since he is in connections with Highborne, it seems like a good trap, it would be easy for them to be convinced that he is one of them. Or so it seems. Kil'Jaeden tricks Illidan into giving him the Demon Soul (was this the heart of Deathwing or something, I can't recall? Oo no wait, Deathwing wanted it too at some point in order to survive was it?) - also, he didn't know what the Demon Soul was, so it seemed like an artifact but he didn't realize how OP exactly. Few know what the Demon Soul is. Thus he is tricked and helps open the portal. The sundering takes place - Highborne turn into naga, Well of Eternity starts going GG. Illidan goes back to get the Demon Soul. To do so he needs more power, Sargeras burns out his eyes - now he sees all demons. He becomes a demon hunter. Illidan had filled seven vials from the Well of Eternity, goes to Mount Hyjal and pours them there, thus creating a new Well of Eternity.
Malfurion gets pissed because of his treachery (true it was treachery but unintentional, he tried helping) and also Furion gets even more pissed for him creating a new Well of Eternity because he is some kind of WellOfEternityHater and wants them all gone and imprisons him FOREVER (yea forever) (oh and btw, it seems both Tyrande and Malfurion use this well since they are like 10k years old. Or at least I think so. Assholes.)
Ok so here it is - he didn't actually join Kil'Jaeden, he tried to trick him but failed.
Later on he uses the Skull of Gul'Dan which just gives him power, taking nothing in return. Furion gets mad again cuz he now looks like a demon, so the racist is angry. Furion banishes Illidan from NE lands. So there we go, he didn't actually unite with KJ, he didn't buy the drugs in order to take them, he just wanted to expose the drug dealer but in return got involved with drug dealing.

Ten. He isn't really crazy.

Eleven. Yea, he is not a hero. I never said that. He is an antihero probably. Or antivillain? What is it called. He tried to be a hero but instead turns out a villain. So his actions are wrong, but he is a better person than Furion, he's a good guy :p

Yes, nagas are evil, I never tried to justify them. All I'm saying is that Illidan tries not to use them for evil. He commands and army of evil but not to do evil. Nagas were bitch ass high elves that drained some mana source or whatever it was (I can't remember) and they sank afterwards but remained douches. While nagas actions are wrong, I see nothing bad done by the blood elves. They were wronged by the humans so they just left. And as I said earlier, I am not trying to justify nagas, or any of the races, but Illidan. So, he awoke a group of "terrorists" but who knows exactly what he wants to do with them. He saw them as wronged Night elves, so he probably wants to lead them to redemption, as he leads himself to redemption (because that is one of his "missions", he always tried to prove himself - to his Bro, to Tyrande, to the world, that he isn't a worthless piece of shit (thus, the power hunger) although he always failed).
On your third point - Yes Illidan does both good and bad actions, here we agree. But what I'm trying to say is that he always did them with good or neutral intentions (good being helping other races, etc. ; neutral being helping himself (power hunger)). He isn't neutral by any means, you could say both Evil and Good, but neutral? Ones such as the Archmage could be described as neutral. Illidan does have evil in him, but for a reason - Brother betrayed him, 10k years in prison, hated by all of his race when he only wanted to help, failing every time when he tries to do something good, etc. I can say that he manages to keep his evil closed very well, considering all of the above. Unlike piece of shit Arthas who broke so easily due to power hunger and so on.
Now, Tyrande helped them yes, but I am unsure whether Furion would have helped them. Perhaps he would have, but he is quite an ass, always following the law, old rules, and probably the old hate for High Elves still remains.. who knows.
Oh I didn't count in his acts to do something good for Tyrande since I think that even a villain would help her if he loves her. I was trying to point out him helping people he doesn't know, cuz that is true good, the other could be turned into doing something for your own good. But also, yea, I forgot that one.
No, because I can point out Humans doing just fine, being good guys - the ones lead by Jaina. Lord Garithos has no excuse to be an ass.
Actually he tried to walk away, as we can see, in Outland. And btw he didn't really make a pact, he was forced. If KJ appears before you, you either make a pact or die. Cuz if he had not made that pact he would have been dead. At least now he's alive, able to do something about it. And he tried. It's not like to say he totally gave up like Arthas and succumbed to evil. He was just pushed to evil. If Furion had not been an ass and accepted him, he would have been fine.

Nine. I doubt tyrande and furion gave a shit about Maiev, nobody cares about her xD. I think he could have killed her if he had stopped to fight her, but I guess you are right here, he was on the run, had no time for fights.

I have not seen that movie but I have always loved the Terminator series, from the commercials it looks like the story has become very complex and they showed a bit too much. I feel like I've seen a good deal of the movie already! lol.

Master
Haosis
:D

Yes?

TOO MANY CHARACTERS, READ FIRST POST FIRST

also, I didn't reread my posts. Might have some mistakes or repeats. Sorry about that. It's too late here, really sleepy.

Kael also said yes, he said they would follow him anywhere. I think it was after KJ appeared before all of them. So they trusted him even after they saw his demon master. Respect is earned and he managed to earn it. Illidan didn't promise Kael power, he promised him a source for his magic and he had the chance to give it later on but in WoW lore they chose that he does not give it instead for NO FUCKING REASON (cuz they wanted to split the bosses in 2 raids). He would have lost nothing by giving them that magic power or whatever it was but he chose not to and he lost them as allies. Like, even the dumbest person wouldn't do that - if you give something you bond with your allies more, if you don't give it you lose them and they become enemies. And lets point out that you lose nothing by giving it because you do not need it. So if we were being realistic here, he would have given it, thus, fulfilling his end of the bargain. Hunt down were Blood elves and draenei, I wasn't referring to the Nagas. Blood elves by the rest of the races, banished from everywhere and every land that they step on (undead, humans, orcs, elves - nobody wants them) and draenei - demons.
While I realize I am biased, there is enough free space for interpretation. You could say he was ultra evil or ultra good, but what he did was far from evil. He did good stuff, he failed some times and made some bads, but what I managed to extract from all of it is that he always wanted to do the good stuff but just often failed. You can see it in his talks with Kael and Vashj (where they choose to fight alongside him, and he asks them if they wish to do so, not command them), with the talks with his brother when he just wants to peacefully return home but he is banished, when he doesn't slay Maiev and so on, when he wants to destroy Ner'Zhul, when he tries to escape from KJ's slavery, when he tries to find a free land for himself/his people (nobody knows which one exactly, but hey, after seeing all of his Wannabegooddeeds up above, I think it's because of both, both himself and his allies), when he frees dranei, when he, the only one who helps Blood elves and doesn't reject them cuz of Racism (elves hate BE cuz of ancient wars, stupid NE are so LawStrict, Humans are bastards and orcs.. well.. They are just orcs. Probably Thrall and Jaina would have accepted them but they were too far. Besides, few characters can make decisions worthy of those like Thrall's and Jaina's. Like save the BE's.) and Nagas well uh.. Hmm. He just asked them for help, to join him and they said yes.. so I see nothing wrong with that. While he did not help them, he did not force them either so... I don't know. Nagas are just weird. They are NE outcasts, probably that's why they joined him - he's a NE outcast too, but also strong.

What he did in the past was a mistake, but with a just cause acutally. He wanted to end the war by making a pact with Gaygeras but gaygeras burned out his eyes and said "fuck you" and fucked up the well and shit. He was tricked by the demons, cuz he isn't very bright. I did say he is power hungry but with that power he hasn't really done anything bad (if we don't count in mistakes which weren't because of his power but because he's naive at times and easy to fool). While selfish is not a good characteristic, it doesn't mean it's always bad. It can be kind of neutral if you are both selfish and selfless. Like, you care about yourself, so that you can help the others. He wants power, true, but he also wants to use it for good. I have such a friend who, you could say, is power hungry, but by no way evil. Power hunger isn't always a bad thing. He sacrificed himself in order to get more power in order to be more powerful (his bad side) and help the rest (his good side). It's not only black or only white here. He works for Kil'Jaeden not because he wants to but because he had no other choice and was kind of, enslaved. He tried to escape in fact (to Outland, saving the outcasts there), but made another mistake and got it wrong. Kil'Jaeden rules this land. He actually wants to kill Kil'Jaeden but as he realises he is still powerless for that, he hungers for more power in order to be able to free himself. Kind of like what Grom did. Doing something wrong for a just cause (with Grom it was finding a land for his people where they can live freely, without demons n shit). Yes he fails. A lot. Illidan is the character with most failures ever.
He didn't really lie. He just didn't say it. Now, while this is wrong, I don't see how that affects blood elves or nagas much. You will say "well KJ could have punished them too for his actions" but I strongly doubt that. He didn't even punish Illidan after he failed. He worked for KJ because the cause was right - destroy the Frozen Throne. I am pretty sure he intended to break his pact afterwards and run/kill KJ? (unlikely, due to lack of power) but working for KJ was a win-win then (or at least it seemed so) - more power gain in order to do something good.
While I realize that he realizes that attacking Furion is GG he also did have a lot of reasons to do so, 10k years, one would go insane for revenge, but he did not. Resisted, still wanted peace with his bro, tried to come back but Furion the ass told him "well no fuck you, now you got horns and hooves and we're racists. No demons allowed. Good or evil, doesn't matter". Also, he could have slayed Maiev with his guys if he wanted to. Aaaand he would never attack Tyrande (never said he would) cuz he loves her n shit. Hang on a second, Nagas were sleeping, at least they are awake now. Better yes? Also, they chose to serve him for whatever fucking reasons. They could have just killed him and said fuck you. But they chose him as their leader. Democracy, free choice. He didn't force them, he actually asked (in once cinematic, can't remember) if they wish to continue on his path with him and they said yes. He ASKED them.

Lol those terminator robots are freaking ''Nherfed''

Nothing much. What's up with you?

Nema se, vala. Nas odrase za fakultet 10.000 RSD :O.
Pa trudim se. Sad sam malo pauzirao, ucio sam ovih dana, inace svaki dan radim razlicite modele.

Pff, Broken lost ones of course. WoW draenei suck ass. They should have made WoW draenei look like Archimonde. He ran in Outland, didn't want to conquer it at first. Besides, wanting to conquer it is cool cuz that means slaying the bad guy demons, I see nothing bad in that. He could have made it a better place. Also, he wanted to kill Ner'Zhul but was stopped. And he could have killed him. Stop the Scourge forever. Imagine that. He didn't enslave the Naga they chose to serve him for they saw his cause a just one and wanted to fight beside him. Besides, Naga were bloodthirsty fuckers, now at least they are controlled by someone who does not want wars (with other intelligent races that is, he wants to kill the demons but he doesn't fight stupid wars - like with NE, Humans, Orcs, etc. Also, they wouldn't have disappeared even if they failed in Outland for he did not take all the Nagas, only Vaj's ones (can't write her name) and the Blood elves which he saved, so I see nothing wrong with them wanting to help him. If we ignore WoW lore, he was a good guy, done some bads, but for a good cause. WoW lore turned everyone into idiots and bosses, lets pretend WoW never happened.
I'll say it again, he didn't come to conquer Outland as in kill everyone else there, he came to find a free land in which he could live peacefully at last, away from Kil'Jaeden, hoping he could give his guys (Blood elves, Nagas and eventually Draenei) a place where they are no longer hunted, because, they were too, like him. Outcasts. So I see nothing wrong with him leading them there. 1. They chose to join him, all of them, he enslaved no one. 2. They wanted a free land just like him, willing to pay high costs, just like him. 3. He wasn't the sharpest of minds, he made many mistakes and might not have thought that Kil'Jaeden could be there and doom him along with his BE,N,D.
As proof of his good character I would like to point out the first wars, the sacrifice he made (skull of gul'dan) in order to obtain power to slay Ner'Zhul, etc. etc. And yes, he was power hungry but only because he wanted to have power in order to slay demons and the like. Kil'Jaeden, First Demon War, Ner'Zhul, Arthas corrupted son of a bitch, etc. He never hurt anyone "Good" or "neutral". And didn't fight Night Elves and kill them when he had the chance, but instead ran (Maiev, Furion), meaning that he didn't want to kill them, he just wanted to escape. Save all the outcasts and himself. Selfish? Not really. Thinking of everyone else by getting more for himself, I would kind of put it like that. Probably both Selfish and Selfless, but Selfish in a good way.

Yea I love their designs. They are ultra awesome. Illidan might lead them to victory though, I mean, might have if WoW Lore wasn't crap. He was a good guy - saved 3 races O.o My fav char.