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MedievalStrategyOverhaul_v0.23a

-Medieval Strategy Overhaul-
This project is an overhaul of Warcraft III for the best experience in Medieval Real Time Strategy.

Inspired by WCIII, Stronghold and Age of Empires II

Medieval Strategy Overhaul is a grand and complex RTS. I've yet to play an RTS I've been truly satisfied with because each one has it's own unique systems and gameplay - so I decided I would combine the best aspects of them to provide a unique and thorough medieval RTS experience.

New combat mechanics, camera zoom system, upgrade system for all units and buildings, custom pathing for custom buildings, castle system with build-able walk-able walls & rotatable buildings, realistic environments that affect unit stats depending on the terrain + more rivers & bigger maps with miles between players and plenty of room for building cities and castles, updated hero system, custom resources, farming system, and a crafting system for food and gear. Not everything is implemented yet - still a work in progress...

4 Player Map - Custom Melee / Strategy - Terrain inspired by Germany's beautiful landscapes.
Terrain is in a rough state; laid out the basics but it needs smoothing, doodads, decor etc.

Information

Changelog

Screenshots

Credits

Authors Notes

Techtree coming soon...
0.2a - Implemented

Added Quests - Tutorial, Camera & Credits
Fixed missing icons
Building size reduced by 10-20%
Custom Pathing for Buildings
Additional tech requirements
Shortened file name (Now appears in game list)
Added descriptions to Attack and Armor types (% vs armor types, % vs attack types)\
Locked Player Settings (Always Human)
Added more stone throughout map
Walls slightly more expensive
Hawk & Falcon sight range increased
Updated Cavalry Icons
Implemented Markmanship Upgrade (train at Archery Target)
Implemented Canine Training and Animal Husbandry (Train at Barn)
Implemented unused abilities that had required upgrades (Smoke Bomb, Piercing Ballista, Burning Oil - Explosive Barrel)
Fixed Market and Cathedrals shop abilities - Items now buyable (Item Abilities still need work)
Paths can now be built upon
Updated Stone Gathering Trigger - Some loopholes fixed + Return Resources ability for stone.
Updated Item Abilities + Added New Items

0.21a - Implemented
Fixed missing icons in Quests
Wall (4) no longer upgrades into Path (2)
FIXED Stone Gathering glitches
Player Starting Positions no longer fixed
Assassin now upgrades at the Great Hall
Fixed Pickaxe (3) Icon
Gate no longer gives 10 population
Paths buildable once again however can no longer be built on

0.22a - Implemented
New JASS gathering system - Fixed memory leaks and all resource gathering bugs
Assassin now has requirements of Tier 2 Infantry
Heroes now have requirements similar to Infantry or relevant upgrades
All Tier 2 Buildings now require the upgrade: Building Framework (from Lumber Mill)
Well's Replenish ability heals x5 as much
Fixed Sword (2) upgrade's DISBTN icon
Ranged Foot Soldiers and Support Soldiers given Sprint ability
Pathfinder given Ensnare ability
Squire given Block ability
Units with Berserk no longer have Charge! & Berserk now increases movement speed
Scout, Fire Pit, Light Post (1) & (2) have extended LOS during night time

0.23a - Implemented

Gate (2) & (3) no longer have spirit tower attack
Stones now have 2500 hp, up from 1000 for additional stone
Creeps levels revised for proper experience gain
Hero XP rate doubled
Abilities that cost too much mana revised
Some new implemented abilities, more will come in later versions
Long Hall (4) no longer resurrects heroes
Workshop disabled icons fixed
Additional tech requirements for some buildings

Coming Soon...

Finish and detail terrain
New building construction system
New walls and towers for castle construction
Fix custom pathing maps and implement walkable walls + stairs
Fix and reworked abilities for all units, especially casters
3 new units - Spy, Physician, & Naturalist
New icons for all units (to match unique building icons)
Coming soon...
Created by UmbraUnda, check map Quests for complete Credits
NEED HELP WITH TRIGGERS AND JASS !!!

Check the forum @
Medieval Strategy Overhaul

Please give feedback and critique.
Contents

MedievalStrategyOverhaul (Map)

Reviews
deepstrasz
An overly complicated techtree with only two resource types. Still needs lots of work. The map file name's too long to be seen in the game. There are no credits in the Quest Log as the loading screen description mentions. Terrain is flat and has...
Xeryxoz
Another set of feedback 1. You made the roads require a goldmine to be placed - now you can't build them at all 2. I found that final upgrade of a wall (don't know if it's vertical or horizontal) can be upgraded into a road.... (All that money spent...
Level 4
Joined
Nov 23, 2014
Messages
133
I love the game! But are the trees really regrowable? Also, workers can't return stone resources manually.
 
Last edited:

deepstrasz

Map Reviewer
Level 68
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
18,680
An overly complicated techtree with only two resource types.
Still needs lots of work.


The map file name's too long to be seen in the game.
There are no credits in the Quest Log as the loading screen description mentions.
Terrain is flat and has little to not tile variation in many parts (especially the starting zones).
Why are all animals grouped and facing south?
Some buildings' description are not explicit.
Without the Stone Storage, the workers just keep harvesting on and on. With the storage, they just get to it and nothing happens. Stone is not given to the building, hence no stone resource added.
Pressing Builder (2) on Builder (1), nothing happens. He can't use the Thunder Clap because the has 11 mana and the spell costs 90.
Why not mention how much attack the drummer gives (ability) like for the banner?
Not sure why would upgrading the Lumber Mill be useful since all upgrades can be researched without upgrading the building. Upgrading it only takes resources and gives nothing except for increased HP.
Does Regrow Trees actually work?
Sweep on the Dummy mentions Gryphon Rider in the description.
Offensive Stance-> not yet working (description). Spear and Stone Wall as well.
Units get through buildings (after they are upgraded and become bigger).
In the House, Sleep and Rest are the same thing...
Why upgrade houses if they don't give extra food or anything else?
What are the unit on a unit (upgrades?) supposed to do? They cost resources but nothing happens when clicking them. OK, they work after upgrading some buildings but it's weird that the "ability" on them looks active before said research(es) is/are complete. What about using the ability/upgrade the Troll Headhunters have, Berserker? This way, all units will automatically be upgraded instead of having to spend resources and time on each.
What's the purpose of having a Falcon and a Hawk as two different units instead of one being the upgrade of the other or something? What's the difference between them?
Duke and Archduke as two different units one having an extra ability, gods...
King's Aura buff says: this unit has Bloodlust.
Because the units are so small it's hard to know which is a worker, which is which, most of the time unless they are set to a group.
Bishop and Counselor both have Cleanse.
Priest and Sage both have Healing.
How does the Boatman fish?

Worker (the second unit on the first row/the woman) has no DISBTN (icon looks like a green square on F10/pause). Use this program to create a disabled icon for it: Button Manager v1.8.2 Same goes for Long Hall and Sentry.
What's the difference between the workers, gender? Why not just make the gender spawn randomly like in AoE? So, then why not make a proper description for them instead of leaving the same description for both?
The woman worker has a green icon on her (Long Hall; I mean Worker (2)). The Repair ability switches places with the Long Hall as opposed to the other worker.
Scout's Light needs to look like a PASBTN (passive ability). Use that program to make it into one.
Stop, Hold Position and Attack have no DISBTNs. Sprint too.
Drummers and Bannermen have the same icon.
Blacksmith, Dummy, Pier, Path, Shrine, Fire Pit, Well, Tent don't have DISBTN.
All icons on the male Worker have no DISBTN.
Banner ability doesn't look like it's passive and it is placed differently than the drummer's.
All icons in the Training Ground except the one that has the Defend one have no DISBTN.
Most units in the Barracks have the same icon. It's frustrating.
Block icon doesn't look like a passive ability's. Same: Sentry, Evasion, Command Tactics.
Falcon's portrait is that of Medivh.
Inspire has no DISBTN. Neither do King, Nobility and Great Hall.
King's Aura's icon looks like a active ability's.
Inspire's buff is Inner Fire.
War Drummer's upgrade is placed instead of the Attack command while on units with Attack, the unit upgrade is placed near the Patrol command.
All icons under the units in the Archery Range have no DIBTN.
Archers look alike (icons).
Tooltip missing on the Ranger.
Multishot has no DISBTN. Same: Poison and Flame Arrows.
The icon upgrades for the archers don't look like their original icons like for the other units.
Tooltips missing on Fortified and Round towers. Also, no DISBTN.
Lots of green square icons in the Docks.


Overall a too complex techtree with things hard to remember; many similar units (look, icons, abilities, purpose). Hard to see units (small size). Everything is cluttered.
Huge buildings that take most part of the screen and units can get through them not being seen. Buildings can be constructed very near to each other.

Set to Awaiting Update.

====================================================================

Always check/recheck the Map Submission Rules! (Map Submission Rules)

These will help make a better description:


Screenshots could attract more players to download your work. Make the best of them.

A credits list is required where the names of the resource (models, skins, icons, spells, sound etc.) authors are mentioned along with the specific resource. It would be a luxury to have links leading to the used resources. Credits in the Quest Log would be appreciated.

A changelog in the first post would be helpful to reviewers and notify fans about the newest implementations to your map.

If you want more reviews, come here:
The Grand Review Exchange!
 
Last edited:
Level 21
Joined
Dec 4, 2007
Messages
1,473
Basically what deepstrasz wrote.
And the mapsize is really extreme for 4 players.

I mean basic wc3 maxsize of epic (256*256) is already quite large and can easily comfort 12 players, whereas the new limit of 480*480 almost quadruples that, yet the maximum amount of players allowed stays the same.
So 12 players could work, still that's pretty large.

Waiting for update/response.
 
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
I love the game! But are the trees really regrowable? Also, workers can't return stone resources manually.

Glad you like it! Trees don't regrow - idk why, I followed some tutorial on how to get the ability to work but it won't work. If you know how to fix the trigger, let me know - btw the map isnt protected so feel free to open in the editor and edit the trigger yourself. Yeah I need to link the return resources ability to the stone gathering trigger but idk how. Like I said it's still a work in progress.

An overly complicated techtree with only two resource types.
Still needs lots of work.


The map file name's too long to be seen in the game.
There are no credits in the Quest Log as the loading screen description mentions.
Terrain is flat and has little to not tile variation in many parts (especially the starting zones).
Why are all animals grouped and facing south?
Some buildings' description are not explicit.
Without the Stone Storage, the workers just keep harvesting on and on. With the storage, they just get to it and nothing happens. Stone is not given to the building, hence no stone resource added.
Pressing Builder (2) on Builder (1), nothing happens. He can't use the Thunder Clap because the has 11 mana and the spell costs 90.
Why not mention how much attack the drummer gives (ability) like for the banner?
Not sure why would upgrading the Lumber Mill be useful since all upgrades can be researched without upgrading the building. Upgrading it only takes resources and gives nothing except for increased HP.
Does Regrow Trees actually work?
Sweep on the Dummy mentions Gryphon Rider in the description.
Offensive Stance-> not yet working (description). Spear and Stone Wall as well.
Units get through buildings (after they are upgraded and become bigger).
In the House, Sleep and Rest are the same thing...
Why upgrade houses if they don't give extra food or anything else?
What are the unit on a unit (upgrades?) supposed to do? They cost resources but nothing happens when clicking them. OK, they work after upgrading some buildings but it's weird that the "ability" on them looks active before said research(es) is/are complete. What about using the ability/upgrade the Troll Headhunters have, Berserker? This way, all units will automatically be upgraded instead of having to spend resources and time on each.
What's the purpose of having a Falcon and a Hawk as two different units instead of one being the upgrade of the other or something? What's the difference between them?
Duke and Archduke as two different units one having an extra ability, gods...
King's Aura buff says: this unit has Bloodlust.
Because the units are so small it's hard to know which is a worker, which is which, most of the time unless they are set to a group.
Bishop and Counselor both have Cleanse.
Priest and Sage both have Healing.
How does the Boatman fish?

Worker (the second unit on the first row/the woman) has no DISBTN (icon looks like a green square on F10/pause). Use this program to create a disabled icon for it: Button Manager v1.8.2 Same goes for Long Hall and Sentry.
What's the difference between the workers, gender? Why not just make the gender spawn randomly like in AoE? So, then why not make a proper description for them instead of leaving the same description for both?
The woman worker has a green icon on her (Long Hall; I mean Worker (2)). The Repair ability switches places with the Long Hall as opposed to the other worker.
Scout's Light needs to look like a PASBTN (passive ability). Use that program to make it into one.
Stop, Hold Position and Attack have no DISBTNs. Sprint too.
Drummers and Bannermen have the same icon.
Blacksmith, Dummy, Pier, Path, Shrine, Fire Pit, Well, Tent don't have DISBTN.
All icons on the male Worker have no DISBTN.
Banner ability doesn't look like it's passive and it is placed differently than the drummer's.
All icons in the Training Ground except the one that has the Defend one have no DISBTN.
Most units in the Barracks have the same icon. It's frustrating.
Block icon doesn't look like a passive ability's. Same: Sentry, Evasion, Command Tactics.
Falcon's portrait is that of Medivh.
Inspire has no DISBTN. Neither do King, Nobility and Great Hall.
King's Aura's icon looks like a active ability's.
Inspire's buff is Inner Fire.
War Drummer's upgrade is placed instead of the Attack command while on units with Attack, the unit upgrade is placed near the Patrol command.
All icons under the units in the Archery Range have no DIBTN.
Archers look alike (icons).
Tooltip missing on the Ranger.
Multishot has no DISBTN. Same: Poison and Flame Arrows.
The icon upgrades for the archers don't look like their original icons like for the other units.
Tooltips missing on Fortified and Round towers. Also, no DISBTN.
Lots of green square icons in the Docks.


Overall a too complex techtree with things hard to remember; many similar units (look, icons, abilities, purpose). Hard to see units (small size). Everything is cluttered.
Huge buildings that take most part of the screen and units can get through them not being seen. Buildings can be constructed very near to each other.

Set to Awaiting Update.

====================================================================

Always check/recheck the Map Submission Rules! (Map Submission Rules)

These will help make a better description:


Screenshots could attract more players to download your work. Make the best of them.

A credits list is required where the names of the resource (models, skins, icons, spells, sound etc.) authors are mentioned along with the specific resource. It would be a luxury to have links leading to the used resources. Credits in the Quest Log would be appreciated.

A changelog in the first post would be helpful to reviewers and notify fans about the newest implementations to your map.

If you want more reviews, come here:
The Grand Review Exchange!

Wow you went above and beyond - great review mate. Thanks a bunch for identifying all those fixes that need to be made.

Two resources for now - more will eventually be implemented, ex. food, gold, ore etc.
I was wondering why the green squares appeared - alright I'll get those DISBTN's uploaded asap.
I couldn't figure out where I could edit quests - gotta look up a tutorial, I'll get to it soon.
Animals are like that because that's how standard wc3 was. I would like to add spawn points and have them wander but it needs triggers that idk how to do.
Argh, oops. I forgot to mention that to upgrade unit tiers you have to be near a specific building. For the builder its the Long Hall (2) to upgrade to tier 2.
Yeah, some descriptions still need work.
True - I need to add additional tech requirements to make upgrading buildings more useful.
I still need to add custom pathing maps for 90% of the buildings.
Really? Upgrading houses don't give extra population? Weird I thought I did, but not by much. I'll double check that later.
Unit upgrades give better stats and new gear (attachments).
I know - the casters need more abilities... a lot more abilities.
You can zoom in and out with -zoom #
Yeah, just gender - for now its purpose it to build different buildings so that everything can be built. Until I redo the construction system.
I'll make more custom icons for each unit soon - for now it's just a portrait that upgrades per tier.
Awesome links, I'll use them to help advance the project.
Buildings are supposed to be big - size of a door is about the size of a unit. I'm considering a slight 10% reduction to building size though.
Right, I'll get those custom pathing maps implemented.

Thanks again, excellent feedback!

I agree, its extremely complex but I want it to be + I need to put a tutorial in quests. I will get most of your concerns worked out soon.

Basically what deepstrasz wrote.
And the mapsize is really extreme for 4 players.

I mean basic wc3 maxsize of epic (256*256) is already quite large and can easily comfort 12 players, whereas the new limit of 480*480 almost quadruples that, yet the maximum amount of players allowed stays the same.
So 12 players could work, still that's pretty large.

Waiting for update/response.

Size is huge on purpose for more realistic sense of how big the world really is. Also plenty of room for city building.
 

deepstrasz

Map Reviewer
Level 68
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
18,680
I was wondering why the green squares appeared - alright I'll get those DISBTN's uploaded asap.
Also:
BLP Lab v0.5.0
Complete Icon Tutorial - All About Icons
How to Make an Icon
I couldn't figure out where I could edit quests - gotta look up a tutorial, I'll get to it soon.
Open up a normal WcIII campaign map and inspire yourself from there.
Basically you need to go to Triggers->Action->Quests->Create Quest->Set Variable: OptionalQuest1=Last Created Quest; then Action->Quests->Create Quest Requirement for OptionalQuest1 (and write there what needs to be written).
Animals are like that because that's how standard wc3 was. I would like to add spawn points and have them wander but it needs triggers that idk how to do.
You can use the numbers under Num Lock (activate it) to turn the units to a desired angle.
About wandering, there's an ability called Wander that WcIII neutral passive critters have but that makes them go absolutely random which means they can get to your base too. If you want them to wander in a specific zone, then you need to create regions and use triggers to make them move from one region to another by either using the Move or Patrol command (Action->Unit->Issue order to a point). You can either preset the regions or just make them wander to a random region from a region group. To do that you need to create variables for each region. It's a bit more complicated and takes more time. You'd have to make a chance based trigger like: Set RegionChance1=random number between 1 and max number of regions for said zone. Then have the unit move to the region corresponding to the RegionChance1 number.
Another thing you could do is just leave the Wander ability on and surround the animal zones with regions. If they enter one of those regions they will be ordered to go out of it.
Argh, oops. I forgot to mention that to upgrade unit tiers you have to be near a specific building. For the builder its the Long Hall (2) to upgrade to tier 2.
Oh man, that's kind of bizarre.
True - I need to add additional tech requirements to make upgrading buildings more useful.
Well, you could just have three levels per upgrade. I don't think it's necessary to upgrade stone harvesting 5 times. Every upgrade level requires the building being upgraded or something.
You can zoom in and out with -zoom #
Aw.
 
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
Also:
BLP Lab v0.5.0
Complete Icon Tutorial - All About Icons
How to Make an Icon

Open up a normal WcIII campaign map and inspire yourself from there.
Basically you need to go to Triggers->Action->Quests->Create Quest->Set Variable: OptionalQuest1=Last Created Quest; then Action->Quests->Create Quest Requirement for OptionalQuest1 (and write there what needs to be written).

You can use the numbers under Num Lock (activate it) to turn the units to a desired angle.
About wandering, there's an ability called Wander that WcIII neutral passive critters have but that makes them go absolutely random which means they can get to your base too. If you want them to wander in a specific zone, then you need to create regions and use triggers to make them move from one region to another by either using the Move or Patrol command (Action->Unit->Issue order to a point). You can either preset the regions or just make them wander to a random region from a region group. To do that you need to create variables for each region. It's a bit more complicated and takes more time. You'd have to make a chance based trigger like: Set RegionChance1=random number between 1 and max number of regions for said zone. Then have the unit move to the region corresponding to the RegionChance1 number.
Another thing you could do is just leave the Wander ability on and surround the animal zones with regions. If they enter one of those regions they will be ordered to go out of it.

Oh man, that's kind of bizarre.

Well, you could just have three levels per upgrade. I don't think it's necessary to upgrade stone harvesting 5 times. Every upgrade level requires the building being upgraded or something.

Aw.

Awesome, much appreciated.

Yeah, I saw a custom wander system in the resources but my lack of experience in Triggers keeps me from using it. Once I get somebody who knows triggers well to help me with this project I'll be implementing many more systems or until somebody sends me easy to use tutorials.

About the upgrading units near buildings - its done that way so that you don't rush with a small army, then upgrade outside of an enemy city - now that's bizarre. So it's more realistic if Spearman 1 upgrades to Spearman 2 at the barracks - where the new equipment would be located.
 

deepstrasz

Map Reviewer
Level 68
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
18,680
About the upgrading units near buildings - its done that way so that you don't rush with a small army, then upgrade outside of an enemy city - now that's bizarre. So it's more realistic if Spearman 1 upgrades to Spearman 2 at the barracks - where the new equipment would be located.
True. However, there's no notification of the range or something.
 
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
Without the Stone Storage, the workers just keep harvesting on and on. With the storage, they just get to it and nothing happens. Stone is not given to the building, hence no stone resource added.

Idk how I missed this - hmm it seems to be a rare range glitch. Try to move the worker closer or farther from the stone mill - that should fix it.
Sorry the stone gathering trigger isn't perfect and has a couple bugs.
 
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
Well, this trigger is very important. You should really find a way to fix/change it.
Aye, I know how - I'll try tweaking the range, otherwise I'll post for help in the forums then.

EDIT: After additional testing, I had no problems harvesting stone. Works fine harvesting close to stone mill and far away. If it isn't range, it must be another rare glitch.

I'll still post on the forums about linking gather & return resources abilities to stone harvesting.
 
Last edited:
Level 7
Joined
Jun 27, 2014
Messages
227
Just a few bugs and suggestions. . .

Bugs :
1. When upgrading a hero, It lowers it's damage value (as well as stat I think)
2. When peasants are mining stone, the problem of not building a building to set the stone in makes the peasants stuck and unable to mine any more, even if you build the storage for stone, they are stuck at a value too high from the limited, and their drop-off no longer works (needs fixing)
3. When the stone drop-off is not built, the peasants shall keep on hitting the stone quarry only lowering it's health needlessly along with the 2nd listed bug.

Tips/Suggestions :
1. You can build anything on roads!
2. Roads flatten the terrain and connect to the other road's height - that way dirty bulks are not visible sticking out from the ground!
3. Buildings you can rotate (Some people like to make beautiful cities)
4. Stairs, bridges, moats (choke points and defenses!)
6. More resources ( I know you will put them in)
7. Roads can be upgraded to crop fields - which would generate a food resource (for 6th suggestion)
8. I suggest that houses give less food capacity, 10 is too much, start it off at 2, then each upgrade gives 1-2 more
9. Battle experience for units - the more they fight and survive battles, the more battle ready they will be, sure a fancy set of strong armor can be good, but if you meet a master swordsman, even if all he has is a sword in his hands, he can beat a heavily armored man, even in his underwear - also, training grounds gives the units battle experience to a certain extent, and fighting among play units as well, but anything more would be from enemy units, that way even this has a purpose.


I like the overall system and idea - make several separate maps when you finish this, and you've got yourself an amazing strategy game to play...
Needs a lot more work, ambience and detail.... But the overall thought on this from me is that it has amazing potential, and that when it's finished, It will be worth more than the maximum rating value, but for now....

Edit : Please fix the gates which are stronger than the walls themselves + can shoot 45 damage arrows...

Well Done 4/5
 
Last edited:
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
Just a few bugs and suggestions. . .

Bugs :
1. When upgrading a hero, It lowers it's damage value (as well as stat I think)
2. When peasants are mining stone, the problem of not building a building to set the stone in makes the peasants stuck and unable to mine any more, even if you build the storage for stone, they are stuck at a value too high from the limited, and their drop-off no longer works (needs fixing)
3. When the stone drop-off is not built, the peasants shall keep on hitting the stone quarry only lowering it's health needlessly along with the 2nd listed bug.

Tips/Suggestions :
1. You can build anything on roads!
2. Roads flatten the terrain and connect to the other road's height - that way dirty bulks are not visible sticking out from the ground!
3. Buildings you can rotate (Some people like to make beautiful cities)
4. Stairs, bridges, moats (choke points and defenses!)
6. More resources ( I know you will put them in)
7. Roads can be upgraded to crop fields - which would generate a food resource (for 6th suggestion)
8. I suggest that houses give less food capacity, 10 is too much, start it off at 2, then each upgrade gives 1-2 more
9. Battle experience for units - the more they fight and survive battles, the more battle ready they will be, sure a fancy set of strong armor can be good, but if you meet a master swordsman, even if all he has is a sword in his hands, he can beat a heavily armored man, even in his underwear - also, training grounds gives the units battle experience to a certain extent, and fighting among play units as well, but anything more would be from enemy units, that way even this has a purpose.


I like the overall system and idea - make several separate maps when you finish this, and you've got yourself an amazing strategy game to play...
Needs a lot more work, ambience and detail.... But the overall thought on this from me is that it has amazing potential, and that when it's finished, It will be worth more than the maximum rating value, but for now....

Edit : Please fix the gates which are stronger than the walls themselves + can shoot 45 damage arrows...

Well Done 4/5

Thanks for the feedback!

Hmm - I'll double check hero stats.

Yeah, the stone mining trigger is far from perfect - I have a forum in triggers asking for help however not many people reply or can even help. If you know somebody good with triggers, send them my way.

Good tips! I agree with most of them - just implemented ability to build on paths.
I want to implement most of them however they require triggering (Some is found in other maps/projects however idk what to change to make it work after copying)

Not sure about paths upgrading into crop fields - maybe path (1) since its dirt. Still I'd prefer a separate build-able farm or farming system that works with terrain.

Yeah maybe 10 is a bit much. I'll consider lowering it.

Veterancy/Battle Experience system for normal foot soldiers would be awesome - I need to look for some tutorials on how to make one.

I'm about to release version 0.2a so I'm not going to do much more for now.
However in the next version I'll fix the heroes stats and more + start implementing more systems if I can find somebody to help with triggers.
 

deepstrasz

Map Reviewer
Level 68
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
18,680
Hey, I don't remember if I wrote this or not. What do you think about changing the hue of the unit icons for each upgrade? Say the last one would be golden or reddish or something and the first ones green, blue or whatever.
 
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
Hey, I don't remember if I wrote this or not. What do you think about changing the hue of the unit icons for each upgrade? Say the last one would be golden or reddish or something and the first ones green, blue or whatever.

Hmm, idk about that... feels repetitive and corny. However for the version after 0.2a (going to release in a few hours) I'm going to screen shot every single unit and make custom icons for them so that each unit has unique and depicting icons. I'm also going to attempt to fix building animations which are currently broken or non existent for ~50% of buildings.

Also I posted for help on the forums about the stone trigger however I've gotten 0 help... just one reply that didn't follow through.
However its an old thread so maybe if I start a new thread more people would reply.
Hopefully people read the tutorial - I mentioned the bugs and how to harvest correctly so that should at least avoid the bugs for now.
 

deepstrasz

Map Reviewer
Level 68
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
18,680
Player starting units are created for each even if player slots are not filled.
Why not use some plants/crops something on the wide plain grass parts (or some other grass tiles)? Would make it look like fields and not desolate land.
Unless the Stone Mill is built, the workers just consume the stone pile health without taking the gathered resources to the main building. It's a neat patch since those resources aren't lost, they're being add up.

Long Hall 3's icon switches places with Set Rally Point's. It's all because of the Builder that pushes the Rally Point icon there.
I suggest placing each building upgrade icon (eg: from Long Hall 1 to Long Hall 2) on the same spot so that it won't look confusing like in the Great Hall, the icon being somewhere between the unit icons and whatnot.
Fine Meal text is yellow; a |cffff0000|r text error. What's the difference between this spell and Sleep again? They both have the same description. Plus only one of them is activated when one is used on a unit.
Some buildings like the Water Mill and Stone Mill have no displayed (yellowed) hotkey in their names/titles. Neither do: Long Hall, Great Hall, House, Manor, Forge, Tavern, Market and Warehouse. Now you can either make one different letter for each like the original game does or use: W, E, R, T etc. depending on the position of the icons in the build menu.
In the Tavern, Water Purification's icon looks like that of a passive ability.
Tavern Brew and Brewing icons look the same. Differentiate them somehow. Changing the hue is one idea.
Why would you have all 3 Tavern Brews at the same time in the Tavern to choose from? Plus, they all have the same description but require different mana values.
Same with the food in the Marketplace. The icons don't have DISBTNs there.
Assassin's Poisoned Strike's hotkey is green not yellow (ability text/title).
Many unit icons are the same even though they're supposed to represent different unit types (eg: Assassin and Ranger).

And so on and so forth, however, the map is playable with the critical issue being fixed.

Set to Approved.
 
Level 7
Joined
Jun 27, 2014
Messages
227
Another set of feedback

1. You made the roads require a goldmine to be placed - now you can't build them at all
2. I found that final upgrade of a wall (don't know if it's vertical or horizontal) can be upgraded into a road.... (All that money spent on a wall, and someone upgrades it to a road ^^)
3. Assassins from tavern can't be upgraded (I ain't sure if it's fixed in 0.2) - Edit : It ain't....
4. Another idea - unit damages that are not siege deal 1% of damage on structures - I've noticed how fast units kill structures, and it just isn't all that realistic, what's the point of siege if a metal sword can cut down a stone wall

-A compliment - Finally someone who made a system where archers as a large scale army isn't able to kill 2 armies at once - It's actually a large scale problem by many people, however, I also feel that archers might be a little bit too weak in the battles, I suggest a system of RNG battle for them, bonus damage based on hitting a critical point (like a lung or a head shot) but it may be over powered in the long run - as it is now, it's some-what on the balanced zone, well done!

5. It would be fun to add in a bandit element after a 10 minute grace period that happens every so often, just to keep people concerned about safety and to make defenses early on along with some soldiers, as well as wildlife re-population (and the regrow doesn't quite work.....)
6. Shrine's "Ceremony" does not work, at all.... does it need a priest next to it? - Edit : It doesn't....
7. For those siege units that offer cover from archers, I have an idea for a system if there isn't one... - AoE damage transfer/ Linked damage - if an unit within the AoE gets hit / The linked units are hit, the damage is transfered to the defending unit, that's the basic idea I have for that - I think such a thing is possible because it has been done years back in metastasis, where there was a shield generator protecting you from getting hurt for as long as the generator has mana, and each shot would remove a portion of it's mana in terms of how much damage was done, so it' might be the only way, however I do also suggest giving a fail % chance, so that an arrow may stray past in the right point and hurt the units behind - nothing is perfect after all
8. Packing and unpacking trebuchets is way too fast - The process should be at least twice as long as it is now....
9. Automatic use of healing from houses on those which are hurt - it would help a lot more than having to nitpick healing everyone which would last a heavy amount of time more?
10. Inn serves the highest mana costing beverage (wine) all the time, even if you try taking the lower costing ones (Also.... make the HP regeneration different for each, even if for just 10 points) - and rework cooking and resting a bit, rest should be a AoE 0.2 hp per sec add-on regeneration while cooking should give 20 HP on 10 seconds - or else the tavern brews would be obsolete and irrelevant (plus, suggest you add mana to those buildings that give home made cooking and rest)
11. Houses that can transport, so that you can hide those pesky peasants in time of war.... and hide an army that can suddenly attack as a strategy
12. Walls should, like the siege units that defend you from arrows, defend from attacks, that way there ain't killing behind walls that cover half the city until they are down...
13. Since the system of resources is a little buggy, and hard to understand for new people, perhaps sending off the rocks to the longhuse is also a good thing?
14. Description for what does damage more to what and takes damage more from what in colors, dark green - great against, red - bad against, yellow - in between, orange - not good against, light shade of green - good against etc - easier for people to see how to counter and to learn

That's all for now - I will keep on nitpicking to help out with the development - just hope you don't find me bothersome after several long messages like this

Also - I do know an expert in Jass coding - try WselfWulf on battle.net - he goes on U.S. East and Europe, I ain't sure what times but he knows his stuff...
 
Last edited:
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
Player starting units are created for each even if player slots are not filled.
Why not use some plants/crops something on the wide plain grass parts (or some other grass tiles)? Would make it look like fields and not desolate land.
Unless the Stone Mill is built, the workers just consume the stone pile health without taking the gathered resources to the main building. It's a neat patch since those resources aren't lost, they're being add up.

Long Hall 3's icon switches places with Set Rally Point's. It's all because of the Builder that pushes the Rally Point icon there.
I suggest placing each building upgrade icon (eg: from Long Hall 1 to Long Hall 2) on the same spot so that it won't look confusing like in the Great Hall, the icon being somewhere between the unit icons and whatnot.
Fine Meal text is yellow; a |cffff0000|r text error. What's the difference between this spell and Sleep again? They both have the same description. Plus only one of them is activated when one is used on a unit.
Some buildings like the Water Mill and Stone Mill have no displayed (yellowed) hotkey in their names/titles. Neither do: Long Hall, Great Hall, House, Manor, Forge, Tavern, Market and Warehouse. Now you can either make one different letter for each like the original game does or use: W, E, R, T etc. depending on the position of the icons in the build menu.
In the Tavern, Water Purification's icon looks like that of a passive ability.
Tavern Brew and Brewing icons look the same. Differentiate them somehow. Changing the hue is one idea.
Why would you have all 3 Tavern Brews at the same time in the Tavern to choose from? Plus, they all have the same description but require different mana values.
Same with the food in the Marketplace. The icons don't have DISBTNs there.
Assassin's Poisoned Strike's hotkey is green not yellow (ability text/title).
Many unit icons are the same even though they're supposed to represent different unit types (eg: Assassin and Ranger).

And so on and so forth, however, the map is playable with the critical issue being fixed.

Set to Approved.

YESSSS APPROVED tyvm sir. Would be nice to get 1 more star after all the work done though :D

As per your feedback- Terrain is far from done. Doodads have yet to be added + some mountains need smoothing and variation.
That glitch for stone gathering is mentions in the tutorial so hopefully people avoid it. For the next version, Jampion came up with a way to fix that.
Hmm, could be the button #s which are mostly 0. I agree, I'll revisit that to make sure everything has its own slot.
O0o0o ok I'll double check the text for fine meal. Well, fine meal is supposed to be rejuvination, while sleep puts unit to sleep + regeneration.
Yeah, hotkeys are not 100% implemented, nor text (text hotkey color) and some descriptions.
Hmm you're right - water purification lost its border somehow, I'll rework that.
Brew and Brewing? That could be my mistake of having both - it should just be Brewing + Tavern Drink Abilities.
Err, oops forgot tech requirements for the Drink abilities. Maybe I should change up the Tavern's inventory as it upgrades, like I did for the Market.
Really? I thought I did DISBTN's for those - I'll double check filepaths and names.
Yup, I thought green was a more suitable color for a poison ability. Some fire abilities are orange-y-red. Would just having all gold be better?
Yup, icons for footsoldiers still need work for unique depictions just how Eagle XI and I did for buildings and horses.

Awesome, I agree the core mechanics are in place - definitely should be playable.

Another set of feedback

1. You made the roads require a goldmine to be placed - now you can't build them at all
2. I found that final upgrade of a wall (don't know if it's vertical or horizontal) can be upgraded into a road.... (All that money spent on a wall, and someone upgrades it to a road ^^)
3. Assassins from tavern can't be upgraded (I ain't sure if it's fixed in 0.2) - Edit : It ain't....
4. Another idea - unit damages that are not siege deal 1% of damage on structures - I've noticed how fast units kill structures, and it just isn't all that realistic, what's the point of siege if a metal sword can cut down a stone wall

-A compliment - Finally someone who made a system where archers as a large scale army isn't able to kill 2 armies at once - It's actually a large scale problem by many people, however, I also feel that archers might be a little bit too weak in the battles, I suggest a system of RNG battle for them, bonus damage based on hitting a critical point (like a lung or a head shot) but it may be over powered in the long run - as it is now, it's some-what on the balanced zone, well done!

5. It would be fun to add in a bandit element after a 10 minute grace period that happens every so often, just to keep people concerned about safety and to make defenses early on along with some soldiers, as well as wildlife re-population (and the regrow doesn't quite work.....)
6. Shrine's "Ceremony" does not work, at all.... does it need a priest next to it? - Edit : It doesn't....
7. For those siege units that offer cover from archers, I have an idea for a system if there isn't one... - AoE damage transfer/ Linked damage - if an unit within the AoE gets hit / The linked units are hit, the damage is transfered to the defending unit, that's the basic idea I have for that - I think such a thing is possible because it has been done years back in metastasis, where there was a shield generator protecting you from getting hurt for as long as the generator has mana, and each shot would remove a portion of it's mana in terms of how much damage was done, so it' might be the only way, however I do also suggest giving a fail % chance, so that an arrow may stray past in the right point and hurt the units behind - nothing is perfect after all
8. Packing and unpacking trebuchets is way too fast - The process should be at least twice as long as it is now....
9. Automatic use of healing from houses on those which are hurt - it would help a lot more than having to nitpick healing everyone which would last a heavy amount of time more?
10. Inn serves the highest mana costing beverage (wine) all the time, even if you try taking the lower costing ones (Also.... make the HP regeneration different for each, even if for just 10 points) - and rework cooking and resting a bit, rest should be a AoE 0.2 hp per sec add-on regeneration while cooking should give 20 HP on 10 seconds - or else the tavern brews would be obsolete and irrelevant (plus, suggest you add mana to those buildings that give home made cooking and rest)
11. Houses that can transport, so that you can hide those pesky peasants in time of war.... and hide an army that can suddenly attack as a strategy
12. Walls should, like the siege units that defend you from arrows, defend from attacks, that way there ain't killing behind walls that cover half the city until they are down...
13. Since the system of resources is a little buggy, and hard to understand for new people, perhaps sending off the rocks to the longhuse is also a good thing?
14. Description for what does damage more to what and takes damage more from what in colors, dark green - great against, red - bad against, yellow - in between, orange - not good against, light shade of green - good against etc - easier for people to see how to counter and to learn

That's all for now - I will keep on nitpicking to help out with the development - just hope you don't find me bothersome after several long messages like this

Also - I do know an expert in Jass coding - try WselfWulf on battle.net - he goes on U.S. East and Europe, I ain't sure what times but he knows his stuff...


1. What? Goldmine? I only required Path(2) & (3) to require stone building and stone masonry upgrades. Stone mill researches those btw.
2. Oops, that's my bad - Wall (4) should not upgrade into anything except a gate. I'll upload a new map tonight with some hotfixes.
3. Sorry mate, I had Assassin's upgrade at the Long Hall - I'm gonna change that to the Great Hall since thats its tech requirement.
4. Hmm, maybe buildings just need more hit points. I disagree about only dealing 1% of damage though. The mechanics system I put in place does well for realistic damage types vs buildings. Smash damage does double damage - so macemen take out buildings faster than swordsmen (seems plausible to me).
- Haha, Thanks. Didn't want ranged too op. Archers are fine as they are in terms of damage amount. Haha, idk how I'd implement critical hits based on areas of the body hit by the arrow. However, notice the damage dice are more on Ranged units than Melee ( I did that based on the chance it hits a vital point ). GOOD! tyvm
5. I want to add that soon! Bandit and Beast spawn points and custom wander ability... needs a lot of triggering though.
Yeah, about regrow - idk why it won't work, I followed two different tutorials exactly and still didn't work. Hopefully somebody can check out the trigger and fix it.
6. Hmm could be a range issue - I'll double check that.
7. Oo0o idk if that's even working yet - might need a custom missile system for that.
Hmm, maybe however shouldn't the siege unit take most of the damage? I foresee a Manlet absorbing almost 100% while Ram (1) would be 80%, Ram (2) 90%
Great suggestions - I'll try to get a siege cover ability going for the next version.
8. Yeah it is. Maybe four times as long...
9. Autocast healing would be nice, good idea. Also was thinking about adding 2 new caster units that act as Physicians/Doctors that know bandaging and herbalism.
10. Hmm, could be the buff or I forgot to give each Drink its own healing ability (they all have the same healing ability right now probably)
Yeah, food and rest #s could be tweaked.
11. Yeah, I actually want to have all buildings have a garrison ability for all types of units.
12. Another great suggestion! Hmm, idk how to implement it though.
13. Only stone has a few glitches - mainly if you harvest without a stonemill which I mentioned in the Quests - Tutorial.
Nope, makes 0 sense to bring it to the Long Hall. Mined stone needs additional processing at the stone mill before it can used just like lumber and the lumber mill.
The Long Hall is simply a Town Center for civilians.
14. Colors could help make it easier to read through all the numbers.

o0o0o0o REALLY!? Hope he's helpful! I'll look for him later.

GREAT FEEDBACK MATE! THANKS!
 

deepstrasz

Map Reviewer
Level 68
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
18,680
Would be nice to get 1 more star after all the work done though
I need to see it refined first. I've cautiously approved it.
Yup, I thought green was a more suitable color for a poison ability. Some fire abilities are orange-y-red. Would just having all gold be better?
Well, hotkeys would be nice to be the same colour. Colour variation is good when it is supposed to differentiate things. Say, you'd use green for a rank name or something.

Also, please try to make the description here more likable.
 
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
I need to see it refined first. I've cautiously approved it.

Well, hotkeys would be nice to be the same colour. Colour variation is good when it is supposed to differentiate things. Say, you'd use green for a rank name or something.

Also, please try to make the description here more likable.

Alright, fair enough.

Ok, I'll update the description so its more organized and appealing later tonight.
 

deepstrasz

Map Reviewer
Level 68
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
18,680
Wanted to edit but you've just replied.

Tutorial and Credits icons are green squares.
I don't remember if I mentioned this or not but the players seem to always start on the position their start location is. Try not to have them fixed as two players playing will always know where they are. Plus, is there a way for teams (eg: 2v2)? If it cannot be done the normal way try the triggers of this map: Skeletal Coast v1.3
 
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
Wanted to edit but you've just replied.

Tutorial and Credits icons are green squares.
I don't remember if I mentioned this or not but the players seem to always start on the position their start location is. Try not to have them fixed as two players playing will always know where they are. Plus, is there a way for teams (eg: 2v2)? If it cannot be done the normal way try the triggers of this map: Skeletal Coast v1.3

Thanks, oops... Forgot to update the icon file paths.

Good suggestion. I'll untick fixed start.

I still need to implement an alliance system where you can -ally (color) or maybe have different game modes, FFA 2v2 etc.
Thanks, I'll check it out.
 
Level 7
Joined
Jun 27, 2014
Messages
227
The goldmine isn't a requirement for you to have built, but rather, imagine how an undead or night elf requires a goldmine to entangle/to haunt in order to start collecting resources - that's what the road requires; a goldmine underneath the place you want to build a road on...

Also, I'm glad you like my feedback, I'll keep you posted on any bugs I find or things I come up with and at least the ideas on how things could be made - I'm just not even moderately good in GUI but I do have some knowledge as to see if something is possible

Also, a quick feedback, again...

Bugs/Flaws
1. Wells only regenerate at night (like moon-wells) I am not sure if it's a bug or if it needs be like that, but for how much mana it costs to heal someone with it, it ain't really worth it unless for actual decoration...
2. Alchemist Molotov Cocktail.... It's a passive and cannot be used for throwing, currently, it has no use
3. Ability bug - when trying to use charge with units that have berserk, they will first activate berserk, then you are able to use charge (needs fix) - Sentry (hero) is an exception, he charges then he can activate berserk
4. Some heroes lack the mana to do spells, and I am not sure if you made it intentionally for them to be able to achieve the spells after leveling up and attaining enough experience or not
5. Not all buildings are affected by the stone upgrades in both terms of armor and health - both buildings that are affected and which are not say that the upgrade is "Building Framework" but one states it's at tier 1, and the other states it's at tier 5 - Needs fixing - The amount of added health through upgrades for buildings is really not significant as much as the armor added to it, bonus health should be bigger I think? Edit : My mistake - This one is alright, just has a separate upgrade with a really similar name that I failed to realize - colored black means it's irrelevant
6. Pack Storage at market, I am not sure if it's implemented properly, the inventory is already there, thus the upgrades are irrelevant (Also, it would be nice to have a group healing item - also it gives peasants and several other units inventory so it ain't really too big a loss) - Oh and, how do you upgrade a horse to a cart, I tried next to stable and market
7. Pickaxe 3 has no upgrade Icon - Stone Mill
8. Might want to change the A hotkeys for upgrades into U, and make abilities on a QWERTY/QWERTZ Symbol use, it's killing the hotkey for attack move.
9. Paladin (Hero) sword when mounted is in the wrong hand, so he's hitting with his bare hand on his last tier...
10. Do remove the "deflect arrows back" from the defend ability that gets upgraded in training grounds (not sure if it's within there or not as I have not tested it with people) - if it is, it would not be realistic to deflect an arrow back with a shield, and make the archers suffer such an unrealistic hit
11. Siege units "Explosive Barrel" is, like molotov cocktail, a passive that cannot be used as intended...
12. Why does gate give 10 population - and warehouse 40?


Ideas...
1. Wouldn't it be also a good idea to swap assassin into warehouse and in tavern to add a new unit like "spy", I remember in Rome : Total War they were used to open the gates into an enemy town so I was wondering if these ideas could be used? - I just kind of feel like the warehouse is a common get together place for assassins due to the size and relative emptiness in terms of workers when it's nightfall, where as a tavern is a place of exchange in information? - Still, the current setup is perfect as it is (just my opinion) Edit : Assassins are good rush units, real high damage, ability to move faster, not too costly - perfect harassment and quick games
2. Might want to add engineer specific buildings like traps and road pikes for blocking for engineer
3. Cavalry charge gives the cavalry immolation for the time it's active, that way it simulates the actual cavalry charge breach towards the units, giving them a "ram" effect when confronting enemies
4. Might want to add a lot more HP to the buildings - As it is now, siege units can destroy walls in 3 shots minimum when the walls are maxed out in upgrades, and 4-6 as a regular, and that's a bit too fast, not to mention that the units can quite easily kill buildings within seconds - Needs a bit of balancing in that aspect

That's all for now, I do hope this feedback also helps (I might be piling up things for you to do when you have time though - I'm sorry in advance for that)
 
Last edited:
Level 11
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Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
The goldmine isn't a requirement for you to have built, but rather, imagine how an undead or night elf requires a goldmine to entangle/to haunt in order to start collecting resources - that's what the road requires; a goldmine underneath the place you want to build a road on...

Also, I'm glad you like my feedback, I'll keep you posted on any bugs I find or things I come up with and at least the ideas on how things could be made - I'm just not even moderately good in GUI but I do have some knowledge as to see if something is possible

Also, a quick feedback, again...

Bugs/Flaws
1. Wells only regenerate at night (like moon-wells) I am not sure if it's a bug or if it needs be like that, but for how much mana it costs to heal someone with it, it ain't really worth it unless for actual decoration...
2. Alchemist Molotov Cocktail.... It's a passive and cannot be used for throwing, currently, it has no use
3. Ability bug - when trying to use charge with units that have berserk, they will first activate berserk, then you are able to use charge (needs fix) - Sentry (hero) is an exception, he charges then he can activate berserk
4. Some heroes lack the mana to do spells, and I am not sure if you made it intentionally for them to be able to achieve the spells after leveling up and attaining enough experience or not
5. Not all buildings are affected by the stone upgrades in both terms of armor and health - both buildings that are affected and which are not say that the upgrade is "Building Framework" but one states it's at tier 1, and the other states it's at tier 5 - Needs fixing - The amount of added health through upgrades for buildings is really not significant as much as the armor added to it, bonus health should be bigger I think? Edit : My mistake - This one is alright, just has a separate upgrade with a really similar name that I failed to realize - colored black means it's irrelevant
6. Pack Storage at market, I am not sure if it's implemented properly, the inventory is already there, thus the upgrades are irrelevant (Also, it would be nice to have a group healing item - also it gives peasants and several other units inventory so it ain't really too big a loss) - Oh and, how do you upgrade a horse to a cart, I tried next to stable and market
7. Pickaxe 3 has no upgrade Icon - Stone Mill
8. Might want to change the A hotkeys for upgrades into U, and make abilities on a QWERTY/QWERTZ Symbol use, it's killing the hotkey for attack move.
9. Paladin (Hero) sword when mounted is in the wrong hand, so he's hitting with his bare hand on his last tier...
10. Do remove the "deflect arrows back" from the defend ability that gets upgraded in training grounds (not sure if it's within there or not as I have not tested it with people) - if it is, it would not be realistic to deflect an arrow back with a shield, and make the archers suffer such an unrealistic hit
11. Siege units "Explosive Barrel" is, like molotov cocktail, a passive that cannot be used as intended...
12. Why does gate give 10 population - and warehouse 40?


Ideas...
1. Wouldn't it be also a good idea to swap assassin into warehouse and in tavern to add a new unit like "spy", I remember in Rome : Total War they were used to open the gates into an enemy town so I was wondering if these ideas could be used? - I just kind of feel like the warehouse is a common get together place for assassins due to the size and relative emptiness in terms of workers when it's nightfall, where as a tavern is a place of exchange in information? - Still, the current setup is perfect as it is (just my opinion) Edit : Assassins are good rush units, real high damage, ability to move faster, not too costly - perfect harassment and quick games
2. Might want to add engineer specific buildings like traps and road pikes for blocking for engineer
3. Cavalry charge gives the cavalry immolation for the time it's active, that way it simulates the actual cavalry charge breach towards the units, giving them a "ram" effect when confronting enemies
4. Might want to add a lot more HP to the buildings - As it is now, siege units can destroy walls in 3 shots minimum when the walls are maxed out in upgrades, and 4-6 as a regular, and that's a bit too fast, not to mention that the units can quite easily kill buildings within seconds - Needs a bit of balancing in that aspect

That's all for now, I do hope this feedback also helps (I might be piling up things for you to do when you have time though - I'm sorry in advance for that)

Great feedback once again mate.

Dammmit idk why but I ticked can be built on - now requires that... wtf. Well I unticked that stat and Paths are buildable again. I'll release hotfixed v0.21 soon.
Thanks for catching that - Paths are important!

1. Hmm, weird - Hit points are adjustable to choose when it regenerates however mana isn't. Wells are based off of moonwells so I guess that's maybe why?
Really? Well (1) def won't heal much however what about when fully upgraded to fountain? Mana may need tweaking if you're right...
2. Really? It's a passive? darn it... need to do more testing. I may have based it off the wrong ability.
3. That's odd... I think it's because they have the same string command.
4. Mana and Abilities have been the bastard childiren of this project. That's my bad - I'll get it worked out soon
5. Y'Know all upgrades have a tier # problem, idk why... Maybe cause of multiple upgrades? The upgrades do work though.
6. Pack Storage and Bag don't work past the first tier upgrade idk why... same with ability levels - idk how to upgrade the ability of the unit via upgrades.
7. Idk how I missed that - then again I did all the icons during an all nighter. xD
8. Yeah, hotkeys need to be reworked.
9. Oops - good attention to detail mate.
10. Good point
11. So weird, I'll get that fixed.
12. Really gate has pop? oops .
Warehouse is pretty big storage structure - also it doesnt have much implemented uses yet so I gave it pop... maybe 40 is a bit much tho

1. Maybe - I was thinking about adding a few more utility units. A spy would be good - also thinking about a physician (bandage + medical healing), and a naturalist (herbalism healing) Good idea, Assassins are known for training in warehouses
2. Yeah, traps and such have yet to be implemented - i just need more room in the build abilitiy
3. I like the ram ability - maybe a pushback and stagger chance but idk about immolation
4. Ouch - alright I'll do some testing soon and test the building hp balance

Thanks, Appreciate it. Don't worry, there's already a bunch of stuff piled up that needs to get done xD
 
Last edited:
Level 7
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Jun 27, 2014
Messages
227
Paths are buildable again - great! (Still needs to be buildable under structures and that structures can be built upon it though)

For now I don't have any feedback of bugs and ideas, I'll need to wait for the new version and more implementations you will put in, I really don't see any game breaking things to point out at this time, but I'll be nitpicking some things - meanwhile, I really like how you put the stats for the damage and attack values like I suggested, though I do recommend to separate them in terms of them going one under the other rather than the simple texting out approach, for now, it's a good basis

I really want to see your project come to life, could be said that for now it's in a pre-beta stage that is playable with other people
It's also fun to notice that in the start, resources are just so vast for you and you start thinking "I have so much resources I can build anything" only for building upgrades to have you think carefully as well as abilities
A bit over 100k gold and wood is needed to upgrade every structure and upgrade, put in the fact that you'd like to make a city and you can surely add 30k to that - all in all, it proves to be a "pick a tech tree you want to base your army on" for a conservative approach to your resources, rather than "I have a surplus of everything from the vast riches and auto gain, and now I can max out everything!" - Really like this fact

All in all, it should be a 2 hour long game before big battles occur, anything before that would be like small scale skirmishes and harassment - which in turn, is like the real thing

One thing I'd like to point out as a bad feature - The community on wc3 nowadays favors quicker maps - I might be wrong about how long it takes to fight, but I do know that people will favor playing up to a hour, so I guess tier 2-3 armies will mostly take the fields along with many tier 1's and up to tier 2 upgrades and abilities, so seeing elites and tier 4's and 5's will be some-what rare if not heroes like king who can cast tranquility and queen who is an excellent group healer (my thoughts)
 
Level 4
Joined
Nov 23, 2014
Messages
133
Are trees regrowable now?
How do you "trade"?
Can you change the wall's structure? That wall type isn't suitable to be walkable and not thick enough for it either.
 
Last edited:
Level 11
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Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
Paths are buildable again - great! (Still needs to be buildable under structures and that structures can be built upon it though)

For now I don't have any feedback of bugs and ideas, I'll need to wait for the new version and more implementations you will put in, I really don't see any game breaking things to point out at this time, but I'll be nitpicking some things - meanwhile, I really like how you put the stats for the damage and attack values like I suggested, though I do recommend to separate them in terms of them going one under the other rather than the simple texting out approach, for now, it's a good basis

I really want to see your project come to life, could be said that for now it's in a pre-beta stage that is playable with other people
It's also fun to notice that in the start, resources are just so vast for you and you start thinking "I have so much resources I can build anything" only for building upgrades to have you think carefully as well as abilities
A bit over 100k gold and wood is needed to upgrade every structure and upgrade, put in the fact that you'd like to make a city and you can surely add 30k to that - all in all, it proves to be a "pick a tech tree you want to base your army on" for a conservative approach to your resources, rather than "I have a surplus of everything from the vast riches and auto gain, and now I can max out everything!" - Really like this fact

All in all, it should be a 2 hour long game before big battles occur, anything before that would be like small scale skirmishes and harassment - which in turn, is like the real thing

One thing I'd like to point out as a bad feature - The community on wc3 nowadays favors quicker maps - I might be wrong about how long it takes to fight, but I do know that people will favor playing up to a hour, so I guess tier 2-3 armies will mostly take the fields along with many tier 1's and up to tier 2 upgrades and abilities, so seeing elites and tier 4's and 5's will be some-what rare if not heroes like king who can cast tranquility and queen who is an excellent group healer (my thoughts)

Yay paths! I know however when I ticked can build on/ can be built on - I get the requires gold mine notification... Not sure what the deal is.
Or maybe I can just make a custom pathing map that allows it to be built and walked on.

Awesome - I agree. I did some testing last night and the core mechanics are working fine. Yeah, attack vs armor descriptions could be nicer.


So do I - maybe eventually remake it even better on Unity or another RTS game system. Yes, currently its barely an Alpha. Once walkable walls, rotatable buildings, farming system and custom resources are implemented, I'll release a legit Beta or maybe v1.0 if its worthy. Thanks, resources amounts could still use a bit of tweaking however it's fine for now. Glad you enjoy. It's pretty realistic for upgrades to be more expensive too - especially for foot soldiers. Supposively in medieval times, you could arm 100 spearmen with the necessities at the same cost of arming 1 knight in full equipment & plate armor. I think my amounts come close to that.

Yeah - this game is quite long, which I enjoy. Although I'm sure after a few playthroughs and you figure out what you're doing, it'll be a bit quicker.
Age of Empires is about the same time frame depending on the map. Then again - if you rush early at Tier 1-2 and your opponent didn't build an army because they focused on city building it could be GG at ~30 minutes.

True- however it depends on the person... RTS players already know what they're getting into however RPG and TD players may run out of patience.
One idea I have is to implement Game Modes which have options for Alliances, Starting Resources, Amount of Creeps, etc.
Possibly other maps (different sizes) as well. Options for altering those factors will help speed up or slow down the game.

Great feedback as usual mate. Hope to hear from you after the next version - or maybe on BNet after MMH approves the map.

Are trees regrowable now?
How do you "trade"?
Can you change the wall's structure? That wall type isn't suitable to be walkable and not thick enough for it either.

Sorry - regrow trees is broken. Trade isn't implemented yet - it will be once alliances (-ally color) are set up.

That wall is not going to be used as the walkable wall - I have bigger better models for those.

Once I get help from somebody who can Trigger and write JASS, more features will start being implemented.
 
Level 26
Joined
Oct 2, 2011
Messages
2,482
Review Notes
-Custom Loading screen would be nice.
-No portrait for scout. Neither for the female workers.
-The workers didn't return with stone when they finished mining it. Neither did the lumberjacks. I later realized this was because the main building does not have the "return resources" ability. Shouldn't it have?
-When I trained workers, and put the rally point on a tree, they just walked up to it, without starting harvesting.
-Nice clear icons.
-The attack type and armor icons aren't that nice, but not a big problem either.
-The builders tooltip in the long hall should tell that the male and femlae builders can construct different things.
-Lovely buildings! Provides a real nice medieval feel.
-Fckn giant map! Enormous, big boundless, eternal, insane! Nah, but really, the map did not have to be this big, i think. :)
-Good pathing maps for buildings! I was especially hinking of the market here, which I expeceted to be quite clumsy.
-Scout is the only unit that does not have a soundset.
-The horizontal and vertical wall models are rotated correctly, but their pathing is just 4x4; not the same pathing as the model shows. This seems to adjust when finishing the building though, but it still comes across confusing.
-The walls also have a quite a high lumber cost, for little protection, and they take loads of time to build, if you wanna fence in a big area.
-Additionally, I happened to build a wall close to some wild elks. they had to run to the middle of the wall in order to attack it, which is kinda weird.
-The elks fire electric bolts when attacking? :D
-I could build barracks, but not train a single unit with it until more requirements had been met. Same thing with archery range.
-The guard towers doesn't actually fire arrows as it says in the tooltip.
-The tooltip for the scout and its upgrade are the same, and nothing happens when I try to upgrade the unit.
-You can build the market early, but you have no unit with inventory to put the items in.
-The regrow trees ability did not work, or perhaps it took really long?
-The arch-duke doesn't have a lot better stats than a scout, except for the abilities. Felt pretty underwhelming.
-Elks and pigs are very aggressive to be critters. It doesn't quite fit I think.
-There are upgrades for all houses, but the tooltips doesn't say what they can offer, which is quite irritating. Then you have to figure that out after already investing time and resources. Sometimes it is just a bit more armor and health which is really useless on some buildings (such as the market).
-The female villlager trained from houses has the sorcoress tooltip.
-I don't get the point of vilagers. Are they just superweak army units?
-The pathes, like the walls are also painfully slow to build, considering you'll need loads of them to make them useful. THe speed boost it provides is barely worth it either. I didn't actually notice a difference. I like the idea of this though!
-When you train something in the docks, the building changes visually to (maybe) an upgraded version.
-Almost all the things that were available for research in the dummy target, lacks a proper description. One says "not working yet". I found more of those in the training ground.
-All buildings have pretty weird building times. A large warehouse atkes as long to build as a patch of road.
-There was a small area on the south-western island that was lit up for no reason.
wc3scrnshot_042217_202815_01-kopiera-png.265828
-When you train a horse from a calf (that's a cow baby btw. A horse baby is called foal) the calf remains.
-The elks screams in a very manly manner when slain. :D
-The ballista projectiles are really tine compared to the bolt it has readied. Also a really powerful unit for a low cost! Especially compared to the battleship which was underwhelming for its cost.
-I could never find the cloth armor requirement that is needed to train soldiers.
-The "fortified armor type still have the wc3 icon, but attack types are mostly changed. I think you should change all or none of those icons.
-I wanted to train a fencer which required Sword (1) and Mail Armor (1) which I had upgraded, but I could still not train the unit?

All in all I must say that this felt pretty unpolished. Unfinished to some degree. It should be playable for sure with more than one player, but there are a lot of stuff that is not finished or balanced yet.
Generally it was confusing knowing what to research to build for the optimal outcome. Perhaps you need to play it a few times first though.
You can really decorate and create a beautiful base with all the different buildings available! I had more fun designing than actually winning. :D
Not because you need even more stuff in the map really, since it is really content-rich already, but maybe a few more resources to use would be nice? It would be more like Age of Empires then too.

I think it has some distance to go still, but when it gets there, it can become epic. :)
 
Level 11
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
Messages
657
Review Notes
-Custom Loading screen would be nice.
-No portrait for scout. Neither for the female workers.
-The workers didn't return with stone when they finished mining it. Neither did the lumberjacks. I later realized this was because the main building does not have the "return resources" ability. Shouldn't it have?
-When I trained workers, and put the rally point on a tree, they just walked up to it, without starting harvesting.
-Nice clear icons.
-The attack type and armor icons aren't that nice, but not a big problem either.
-The builders tooltip in the long hall should tell that the male and femlae builders can construct different things.
-Lovely buildings! Provides a real nice medieval feel.
-Fckn giant map! Enormous, big boundless, eternal, insane! Nah, but really, the map did not have to be this big, i think. :)
-Good pathing maps for buildings! I was especially hinking of the market here, which I expeceted to be quite clumsy.
-Scout is the only unit that does not have a soundset.
-The horizontal and vertical wall models are rotated correctly, but their pathing is just 4x4; not the same pathing as the model shows. This seems to adjust when finishing the building though, but it still comes across confusing.
-The walls also have a quite a high lumber cost, for little protection, and they take loads of time to build, if you wanna fence in a big area.
-Additionally, I happened to build a wall close to some wild elks. they had to run to the middle of the wall in order to attack it, which is kinda weird.
-The elks fire electric bolts when attacking? :D
-I could build barracks, but not train a single unit with it until more requirements had been met. Same thing with archery range.
-The guard towers doesn't actually fire arrows as it says in the tooltip.
-The tooltip for the scout and its upgrade are the same, and nothing happens when I try to upgrade the unit.
-You can build the market early, but you have no unit with inventory to put the items in.
-The regrow trees ability did not work, or perhaps it took really long?
-The arch-duke doesn't have a lot better stats than a scout, except for the abilities. Felt pretty underwhelming.
-Elks and pigs are very aggressive to be critters. It doesn't quite fit I think.
-There are upgrades for all houses, but the tooltips doesn't say what they can offer, which is quite irritating. Then you have to figure that out after already investing time and resources. Sometimes it is just a bit more armor and health which is really useless on some buildings (such as the market).
-The female villlager trained from houses has the sorcoress tooltip.
-I don't get the point of vilagers. Are they just superweak army units?
-The pathes, like the walls are also painfully slow to build, considering you'll need loads of them to make them useful. THe speed boost it provides is barely worth it either. I didn't actually notice a difference. I like the idea of this though!
-When you train something in the docks, the building changes visually to (maybe) an upgraded version.
-Almost all the things that were available for research in the dummy target, lacks a proper description. One says "not working yet". I found more of those in the training ground.
-All buildings have pretty weird building times. A large warehouse atkes as long to build as a patch of road.
-There was a small area on the south-western island that was lit up for no reason.
wc3scrnshot_042217_202815_01-kopiera-png.265828
-When you train a horse from a calf (that's a cow baby btw. A horse baby is called foal) the calf remains.
-The elks screams in a very manly manner when slain. :D
-The ballista projectiles are really tine compared to the bolt it has readied. Also a really powerful unit for a low cost! Especially compared to the battleship which was underwhelming for its cost.
-I could never find the cloth armor requirement that is needed to train soldiers.
-The "fortified armor type still have the wc3 icon, but attack types are mostly changed. I think you should change all or none of those icons.
-I wanted to train a fencer which required Sword (1) and Mail Armor (1) which I had upgraded, but I could still not train the unit?

All in all I must say that this felt pretty unpolished. Unfinished to some degree. It should be playable for sure with more than one player, but there are a lot of stuff that is not finished or balanced yet.
Generally it was confusing knowing what to research to build for the optimal outcome. Perhaps you need to play it a few times first though.
You can really decorate and create a beautiful base with all the different buildings available! I had more fun designing than actually winning. :D
Not because you need even more stuff in the map really, since it is really content-rich already, but maybe a few more resources to use would be nice? It would be more like Age of Empires then too.

I think it has some distance to go still, but when it gets there, it can become epic. :)

Wow you went the distance with this review. Thanks for the awesome feedback. I already gave you rep yesterday but once the cooldown passes I'll give more.

Custom Loading screen would be nice - I'll get on that soon.
Yeah, the custom villager models I use doesn't have a portrait - my bad.
Nope, the main structure should not store resources because that's unrealistic - thus - wood -> lumbermill, rocks -> stonemill
I think it's the trigger that won't allow rally point harvesting... I didn't make it so idk exactly how to fix that but I'll talk to my trigger people.
The attack and armor icons need to be reformatted to properly fit the UI - also the upgrade #'s don't work idk why...
Good suggestion - descriptions need reworking.
Thank Mike for the buildings, he did a great job on his series - although I did edit them and make some of my own for the map.
I thought it's so unrealistic to build a city just 1/2 mile or so away from your opponent so I made it feel like miles long - as big as the real world.
Some of the pathing maps are a little off because the models aren't properly centered, most are working fine tho.
The 4x4 pathing for walls changes to 8x2 after being built, however the 4x4 is to allow construction of walls against other structures.
Hmm, that is odd with the elk. I know - I looked through their abilities and combat variables and idk why they have that orb effect.
Yup, gotta research armor and weapons for the troops.
I think that's just the first tier, after you upgrade, it should attack and fire more arrows.
Did you read the tutorial in quests? You have to upgrade within range of the structure originally trained at. This is for anti-rush and realism purposes
All units have the potential for inventory once you research Bag (1) at the Water Mill.
Regrow does not work - even after following two different tutorials idk what the issue is - feel free to look at it and give me advice :D
Well, the Arch-Duke is a fragile old man so... Also women workers have less hp than males because -> realism.
I agree, the creeps are too aggressive (I should lower acquisition range) and don't wander. I need advanced triggers with regions for that tho.
Building upgrades are for more stats and upgrading units to the next tier. Again though, I should rework the descriptions to specify. House upgrades give population
Villagers are useless right now - I want to use them as farmers and early healers once I get the abilities and triggers working.
True - building times need serious reworking as well as upgrade times. Once paths are fully upgraded they are worth it, especially once I implement trade carts.
Yeah, the dock's animations are broken. Gotta redo that on Mdlvis.
The melee dummy's researches are all broken actually - they are required for melee abilities which haven't been implemented yet.
I noticed that random spot of visible land as well - no idea why that is...
Did you try upgrading near the stables? Oo0o0o my bad. I thought calf just means baby animal in general for some species.
Sounds need reworking as well... Lancer (5) sounds like a dragon xD
Yeah, I should trim it on Mdlvis and make a custom projectile
Hmm, perhaps siege and naval unit costs should be reworked...
Really? xD Water Mill .... maybe I should put that in requirements too.
Hmm, that's very odd... Maybe I left an additional requirement or something by accident - I'll double check that.

Indeed, it's very unfinished and very much still in the works. Thus it's currently an alpha, not even beta yet.
Yeah, the game is very complex with all of it's nuances - I should write an in-depth tutorial on everything for newbies perhaps.
Hahaha - awesome. I feel the same way, city building is quite fun. Once I implement rotatable structures and more decor it'll be great.
YES, I just need someone to help me with the triggers. If you know anybody will to help, send them to me.
I want to add gold, ore, clay, and food - maybe water also.

Thanks again mate - best feedback so far.
Also, I'm considering remaking this on Unity or another game engine for RTS games because wc3 can only go so far.
 
Level 26
Joined
Oct 2, 2011
Messages
2,482
I already gave you rep yesterday but once the cooldown passes I'll give more.
Thanks, but no need really. :)
Also, I'm considering remaking this on Unity or another game engine for RTS games because wc3 can only go so far.
I'm considering that too. That's a lot more to learn first though... :D
Thanks again mate - best feedback so far.
Glad I could help!
 
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