Burning Legion Battleground 1.5

mafe · Jun 1, 2020

Well, there are definitely some unique ideas. I'm not sure how they will work out, but they are interesting nevertheless. The runes of rebirth on workers however are probably too gimmicky to ever be used in "serious" environment.

Other than that there are a few things which I think should be reconsidered:
1. Some creeps (at the shops in particular) should be moved out of the way, so that they dont accidentially attack player units.
2. Some itemdrops appear to be very strong, but probably just within acceptable limits. Still, I think at least the lvl 2 permanent/lvl 2 charged items at the expanssion should be downgraded to a powerup.
3. The transition from pathable areas to the areas blocked off by shadows dont look good imho.

Regarding looks, well it definitely makes sense and has some good mixes of tilesets, but there are some places where for me at least, it doesnt quite work out. But with such things, it's probably impossible to please everyone, so whatever. Are the "arrows" near some portals some sort of easteregg, referring to console fighting game input?

So, please reconsider 1 and 2, possibly also 3, and make some changes towards adressing these issues. Until then, map set to Awaiting update.

SlushyJones · Jul 16, 2020

mafe said:
Well, there are definitely some unique ideas. I'm not sure how they will work out, but they are interesting nevertheless. The runes of rebirth on workers however are probably too gimmicky to ever be used in "serious" environment.

Other than that there are a few things which I think should be reconsidered:
1. Some creeps (at the shops in particular) should be moved out of the way, so that they dont accidentially attack player units.
2. Some itemdrops appear to be very strong, but probably just within acceptable limits. Still, I think at least the lvl 2 permanent/lvl 2 charged items at the expanssion should be downgraded to a powerup.
3. The transition from pathable areas to the areas blocked off by shadows dont look good imho.

Regarding looks, well it definitely makes sense and has some good mixes of tilesets, but there are some places where for me at least, it doesnt quite work out. But with such things, it's probably impossible to please everyone, so whatever. Are the "arrows" near some portals some sort of easteregg, referring to console fighting game input?

So, please reconsider 1 and 2, possibly also 3, and make some changes towards adressing these issues. Until then, map set to Awaiting update.

Dear Mafe, thank you for the review.

I have made some changes based on your feedback.

1. The Goblin Merchant and its creeps have been moved back a couple of tiles. I have packed them a little tighter as well so that they do not engage with enemies on accident. In my current tests, the creeps will not engage with units unless units enter the zone near the Goblin Merchant. This might require additional testing, but for now I think it has been improved.
2. The Lvl 2 Permanent/Charged items at the expansion have been reorganized into Level 2 Permanent and Level 2 Power Up. The Level 2 Charged item has been moved to the Goblin Merchant. I think this change will fit the pace of the map better, due the the relatively high difficultly of the Goblin Merchant compared to the relatively easy Expansion.
3. I have updated some of the looks of the map in some ways, specifically near the portals. The terrain textures have been made larger and smoother so that they look less like arrows. The crossovers of textures is meant to be a hint for the players about what kind of creeps they will find in the portal they will visit. In regards to the shadow areas, I have placed decorative doodads at the border of all of them, except for deep water near some.

mafe · Jul 30, 2020

Hey, so:
1. To be honest, this issue still exists to some extend:

If units take the green camp and then walk straight north (ok, it can argued how realisitic this is, but still), then they will aggro the creeps at the shops unless specifically microed to avoid them. Similar stuff can still happen at the central gold mines.
2. I dont remember exactly, but it seems at the central expansions there still is the lvl 3 charged + lvl 2 permenant combination? That is very strong relative to the power of the creep camp. Any reason why you didnt change them?
3. While I think the map looks better, it was precisely the deep-water-into-shadow areas that stood out the most for me....

So maybe it was some kind of misunderstanding, but it seems to me, that my issues were addressed only partially. We can talk about these matters of course, but for now I'll set the map back to Awaiting Update.

SlushyJones · Jul 31, 2020

mafe said:
Hey, so:
1. To be honest, this issue still exists to some extend:
View attachment 360845
If units take the green camp and then walk straight north (ok, it can argued how realisitic this is, but still), then they will aggro the creeps at the shops unless specifically microed to avoid them. Similar stuff can still happen at the central gold mines.
2. I dont remember exactly, but it seems at the central expansions there still is the lvl 3 charged + lvl 2 permenant combination? That is very strong relative to the power of the creep camp. Any reason why you didnt change them?
3. While I think the map looks better, it was precisely the deep-water-into-shadow areas that stood out the most for me....

So maybe it was some kind of misunderstanding, but it seems to me, that my issues were addressed only partially. We can talk about these matters of course, but for now I'll set the map back to Awaiting Update.

Dear mafe,

Thank you for the additional input. I have made further updates to the map to try to address these problems, especially number 3.

1. Unfortunately I have nudged the Goblin Merchant and the creeps as far as I am comfortable with while still allowing players access to easy shopping. The creep camp will still be dangerous if crossed accidentally. I hope players will exercise caution and take the paths around it when necessary, or decide to creep the Merchant early. For a more competitive map I would consider more serious changes to address the paths as a whole, but for an informal team/FFA map I think this flaw is acceptable.
2. I have taken your advice for both the central gold mines and outer gold mines. The Center Gold Mine now drops a Level 2 Power Up and a Level 3 Charged. I believe that Power Up is less powerful than the Permanent that was previously at this creep camp. The Center Gold Mine Creep camp now feels like the drops are more appropriate to the strength of the camp. At the Goblin Observatory, the Sorcerer who used to drop a Level 2 Power Up now drops a Level 2 Permanent. This camp is more difficult than the Gold Mines and now the improved item will more accurately reflect the risk of the camp. Finally, the Outer Gold Mines drop a Level 3 Permanent and a Level 1 Power Up. This parallels the Central Gold Mines, but I have reduced the reward for the Outer Gold Mines from a level 2 Power Up to level 1. In the context of this map, I have assumed that the Central Gold Mines will be much more vulnerable to enemy attacks during creeping attempts, while the Outer Gold Mines are relatively safe to creep. Due to this lesser risk, I have reduced the reward of these Outer Gold Mines.
3. The idea of the map is a Colosseum built by the Burning Legion to watch their prisoners fight to the death. Near the boundaries at all sides, I have constructed stadium-like seating with benches and braziers. The braziers ominously glow in the dark territory. I am happy with the way it looks, but I will admit it does look a little cluttered and busy. I could change the braziers to a different decoration that is less distracting, if needed. The borders of the stadium have also been outfitted with hostile looking spikes which help break the straight uniformity of the cliffs.

I hope that these changes improve the quality of the map. I will be poised to make further improvements.

Burning Legion Battleground 1.5

Burning Legion Battleground 1.5 (Map)

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