SH v1.4 The Hunters

[UndeadImmortal]

Alright, played this with my friend.

• Creepers are too overpowered, you need a unit just to detect them.
• Templars does not have a collision and can destroy a building in a second due to their high attack damage.
• The superweapons looks really weird xD It can't even destroy low-tech buildings, it would be good if you could.
• Darkling's spark energy ball aoe is too small.
• Mephit's ability creates the egg before the projectile even landed.
• When you right click a templar while you're selecting a templar, they will combine even if i didn't ordered, pretty annoying :S
• Overlord of the Void's unit teleportation ability (I forgot the name) is too op, maybe add a casting range limit and reduce it's aoe size?

Overall, the new race needs rebalances.

 

[Strydhaizer]

I suggest you tint the icons to yellow , i know you know SCBW icons

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

Alright, played this with my friend.
Creepers are too overpowered, you need a unit just to detect them.
Templars does not have a collision and can destroy a building in a second due to their high attack damage.
The superweapons looks really weird xD It can't even destroy low-tech buildings, it would be good if you could.
Darkling's spark energy ball aoe is too small.
Mephit's ability creates the egg before the projectile even landed.
When you right click a templar while you're selecting a templar, they will combine even if i didn't ordered, pretty annoying :S
Overlord of the Void's unit teleportation ability (I forgot the name) is too op, maybe add a casting range limit and reduce it's aoe size?

Overall, the new race needs rebalances.

, thanks for testing. I don't know about the Creepers one. Do you know the Lurkers of Starcraft 1 Broodwar? They are very similar. When burrowed Creepers get detected, they often die very fast. And they have nothing against air. Dark Templars in Broodwar (they have some other abilities but basically comparable) were also permanent invisible and high damaging. Powerful when the enemy has no detection, but expensive and weak (low hp) to an enemy army with detectors. Maybe the problem is more that are too few ways to detection. Now every race has about 2 or 3 ways (where 1 is a tower and 1 or 2 is/are units). Maybe something like Radar and similar things should be added.

I found a bug I think with the superweapons by the way, some or all don't seem to effect air units (could be I did not saw it correctly though).
Thing is about increasing the damage of the superweapons, is that you would get a bit of that Command and conquer 3 gameplay where superweapons rule the game (next to the heaviest units that is). I think they would get overpowered. The rest is added on the to do list .

I suggest you tint the icons to yellow , i know you know SCBW icons

, I would like this but it is not worth the time (a lot of icons are used) and default warcraft 3 icons cannot be changed without reimporting them which adds to the valuable size (8mb map limit). The map is already optimized in countless ways, I am reaching a border where going beyond means ugly skins and icons etc. .

 

[Bloody Wolf]

,

, I would like this but it is not worth the time (a lot of icons are used) and default warcraft 3 icons cannot be changed without reimporting them which adds to the valuable size (8mb map limit). The map is already optimized in countless ways, I am reaching a border where going beyond means ugly skins and icons etc. .

so i guess theres no chance of having a 4th race?

 

[UndeadImmortal]

Btw, I just noticed, you forgot to changed the buff for the Cavern of Void's mana regeneration aura.

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

Update to V1.2b hotfix

With new easy adjustable camera function a moar!

Gameplay images

changelog v1.2b hotfix

* camera zoom function (done)
* Plague Nuke destroys minerals (done/fixed)
* Infested Nuke Silo requirements fix (done)
* Dark Force -> Void Predators (done)
* Void Predators AI ability to expand improved (done)
* Darkstream more damage (done, 25% faster and damage from 4 to 6)
* Energy mass bigger and bigger area (done, +0,3 scale and +30 aoe)
* Bionic Marines Mark Target too strong effect (done, from -5 to -4)
* Darklings keep "tilting" when they move for some reason (done I think, slowed walk/run animation)
* Nightskin Ultralisk's tooltip didn't changed. (done/fixed)
* Undead at the lobby when you create a game still didn't changed (done/fixed)
* 1 Nightskin Ultralisk can kill a horde of zombies in 1 charge, coz 100 hp vs 100 damage. (done, now 80 damage)
* Hellflury Mech has melee combat sounds (done, removed weapon bash sound)
* Swarm Nest from mephits were useless. give them higher hp or something (done, +40 hp)
* Mephit's Swarm Nest ability creates the egg before the projectile even landed. (done/fixed)
* Templar of the Void's invisibility upgrade requirement (done/)
* Call Forces aoe reduced (done, from 300 to 250)
* buff for the Cavern of Void's mana regeneration aura (done)

 

[Bloody Wolf]

Well time for more testing >

 

[UndeadImmortal]

I found a minor bug while playing, Swarm Nest's buff is still Pocket Factory, and the AoE indicator is gone? Swarm Nest's damage is also too low, can't even kill a worker.

I also attached a replay of we playing. Disregard the rude words, that's how we chat xD. Requires 1.26a patch, replay time is 1 hour. I'm the one who's playing the Void Predators (The_Optimizer).

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

I found a minor bug while playing, Swarm Nest's buff is still Pocket Factory, and the AoE indicator is gone? Swarm Nest's damage is also too low, can't even kill a worker.

I also attached a replay of we playing. Disregard the rude words, that's how we chat xD. Requires 1.26a patch, replay time is 1 hour. I'm the one who's playing the Void Predators (The_Optimizer).

, haha map folder: 'Special Maps'. Loved the replay, thanks for sharing that. From what I have seen:

- your 'bin laden topsecret bunker' (aka Void Predators superweapon) misses its birth attachment. Easy fix.

- mephit's egg ability is indeed too weak.

- into the void is too weak too probably.

- attacking with workers is the best offense

I also saw now that the Void Predators expand well now (too lazy to check it ). The idea is to make it that the Bionic and Infested AI do this too.

 

[Bloody Wolf]

are the super weapons supposed to damage your own units too?

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

are the super weapons supposed to damage your own units too?

, yeah, be carefull with that

 

[UndeadImmortal]

I found a small bug again, the Support Bot's heal's buff is still in default.

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

added to the list ,

Hey what do you guys think of the AI of the Void Predators? Do you think it is better in terms of economy, production speeds and/or expanding compared to the Bionic and Infested AI's'?

 

[UndeadImmortal]

Infested AI for me is too weak, they just mass out weak zombies and marines :/
I'll vote for production speed.

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

Infested AI for me is too weak, they just mass out weak zombies and marines :/
I'll vote for production speed.

, ok thanks, but I meant to ask if Void Predator AI is good now. Cause I want to go give the Bionic and Infested a similar AI cause they have a bad economy now (money/mineral problems ) and don't expand much.

 

[FLACC]

I very very like the VOID PREDATORS!!! my favorite is the creeper THE MODEL LOOKS SO AWESOME!!!

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

I very very like the VOID PREDATORS!!! my favorite is the creeper THE MODEL LOOKS SO AWESOME!!!

, glad you liked it! I like the model too (it is from Cavman -> http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/models-530/zerg-lurker-48280/?prev=search%3Dlurker%26d%3Dlist%26r%3D20, but I changed the skin a bit).

 

[Bloody Wolf]

you can easily mow down a horde of zombies with 4 reapers i think you should buff the zombies a bit more or nerf the reapers

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

you can easily mow down a horde of zombies with 4 reapers i think you should buff the zombies a bit more or nerf the reapers

, hmm, this is hard. I don't want to buff Zombies more, they feel balanced now. But weakening Reapers makes them maybe to weak against masses of Marines.

How about I increase the movement speed of Reapers a bit more and decrease their Sythe attack ability a bit?

 

[Bloody Wolf]

, hmm, this is hard. I don't want to buff Zombies more, they feel balanced now. But weakening Reapers makes them maybe to weak against masses of Marines.

How about I increase the movement speed of Reapers a bit more and decrease their Sythe attack ability a bit?

yea that should even the odds

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

yea that should even the odds

, it is deal than.

 

[Twilight]

Epic Alterd Melee map, Starcraft copy , Nice gameplay, Nice models.
________________________________________________________________
Rating:
-5/5
Stuff to fix
-Nothing to fix

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

Epic Alterd Melee map, Starcraft copy , Nice gameplay, Nice models.
________________________________________________________________
Rating:
-5/5
Stuff to fix
-Nothing to fix

, thanks, glad to hear it

 

[Twilight]

Your Welcome

 

[The_New_Divide]

Its a great starcraft copy. I have not played all till now, but i LOVE some of the units. I like innovated units like the Darkling.

I will you motivate to make a campaign, wich you can controll the races and learn their specialitys slowy.

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

Its a great starcraft copy. I have not played all till now, but i LOVE some of the units. I like innovated units like the Darkling.

I will you motivate to make a campaign, wich you can controll the races and learn their specialitys slowy.

, thanks! I indeed want to do a campaign at some point and giving it something extra. Something like heroes but a bit different than in Warcraft 3 (more Starcraft 1 campaign style heroes). Or maybe 'commander' like units that are a tad stronger than normal units but have abilities that strengthen groups. Still pure pondering though. I first want to finish/improve AI a bit further and than add some extra maps/terrains.

 

[Bloody Wolf]

yep never rush you have plenty of time

 

[The_New_Divide]

Maybe non experiencegetting big fleetships and skilled infanteryunits with 1 or 2 special abilitys and good in combination with other units of the game. I can suggest the dark one(bigger version of darkling), which summon stormmasses for example and other spells.

 

[Bloody Wolf]

Maybe non experiencegetting big fleetships and skilled infanteryunits with 1 or 2 special abilitys and good in combination with other units of the game. I can suggest the dark one(bigger version of darkling), which summon stormmasses for example and other spells.

I think a superior archon would fit more

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

Maybe non experiencegetting big fleetships and skilled infanteryunits with 1 or 2 special abilitys and good in combination with other units of the game. I can suggest the dark one(bigger version of darkling), which summon stormmasses for example and other spells.

I think a superior archon would fit more

Those are good ideas. This is like the Starcraft 1 heroes but than they would be unique units too (instead of just 'elite' versions), which I think would be fun.

 

[GhostThruster]

i reckon u shud remove the superweapons if ur gonna put in unique units. i dont like superweapon mechanic that much coz it doesnt feel like it requires 'effort' if u noe wat i mean? like all u need is patience and a wall-in for the mana to reach 300, it wud be better to either set it to like 50 mana but nerf them alot OR scrap them and make unique units with powerful abilities (though not as powerful obv)

 

[UndeadImmortal]

Or maybe add a casting time that alerts nearby players.

 

[The_New_Divide]

Btw, where the siegeunits? :O

Add high range Siegeunits and i think you shouldnt remove the superweapons. Isn´t it so?

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

i reckon u shud remove the superweapons if ur gonna put in unique units. i dont like superweapon mechanic that much coz it doesnt feel like it requires 'effort' if u noe wat i mean? like all u need is patience and a wall-in for the mana to reach 300, it wud be better to either set it to like 50 mana but nerf them alot OR scrap them and make unique units with powerful abilities (though not as powerful obv)

Or maybe add a casting time that alerts nearby players.

Well first to get this right, in the normal/skirmish maps unique/hero units will not be added. This will only be for the campaign where they can be integrated with the (campaign) story.

As for the superweapons, something like casting time sounds good. Next to that, I must say I personally like them since they make the game more dynamic and less predictive. Smaller bombs would only involve more micros.

Btw, where the siegeunits? :O

, Hellflury Mech (Bionic), Spitter (Infested) and Voidpredators have a way to teleport groups with their Overlords (behind enemy lines). Next to that there are units that are effective against clustered buildings or towers: Radiator with its Meltdown (Bionic), Mutated Beast (Infested) and Darklings merged as those energy balls (Voidpredators, you do it right this; take 2 darklings and merge them next to buildings or some towers, and when the energy ball is about to die bring in another darkling to create a stronger energy ball, do this one more time and optionally you can end the energy ball with the spark ability). Superweapons are also an option against big groups of towers (instant kill with some superweapons!).

ps: if some people dislike superweapons, I can add an option that allows player 1 to choose whether superweapons are enabled or disabled ingame.

 

[The_New_Divide]

Why no high range units?

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

Why no high range units?

, what you mean? There are high range units: Hellflury Mech and Spitter . Similar range to the 'siege units' in Starcraft 1 (e.g. Guardian).

 

[The_New_Divide]

Damn, im so stupid. Have misunderstood this:

Hellflury Mech (Bionic), Spitter (Infested) and Voidpredators have a way to teleport groups with their Overlords (behind enemy lines)

I think all named units have the ability to teleport behind enemy lines(which is the same like drop). I tested just all voidunits till now. But when this is true, i find, the void need a high range siegeunit too for the balance. Teleport is something difference then this: By teleports, you units can be attack and damage from enemy canons. Units with high range can kill canons without take damage.

Greetz, The_New_Divide

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

I forgot to mention the Keeper for the Infested too. But yeah good point, the Void Predators does lack indeed 1 siege unit but their Nightskin Ultralisks are good against towers. I maybe have a solution for it. At the moment the Spectral Archon (created when 2 Templars merge) seems to be useless at some moments so I can give him an channeling bombard spell. The same mechanics the blizzard or death & decay spells have in Warcraft 2 (not like the ones in Warcraft 3! but like this -> the unit casts an another wave of the spell if it has enough mana) with a small area of effect.

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

I managed to let the new Bionic AI Air variation do droppings (harassment style). Was somewhat funny with 7 cpu players. This AI variation will mainly be activated when playing island maps and 34% when playing non-island maps (where 66% is the normal AI). SH mappers (like me ) only need to change 1 simple variable to let the AI properly work.

Now only to let it properly expand like the ground AI and than the AI air variation is ready to rock.

 

[Twilight]

dont dubble post [K40$]-Spectre, it is against the rules.

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

dont dubble post [K40$]-Spectre, it is against the rules.

, you may bump your thread after 48 hours. The post I made before the post I made yesterday was 3 days ago ( > 48 hours)....

Bumping and multiple posting: A post (or the act of posting) with the purpose of making the thread rise to the top of the listing is called bump(ing). You may only bump your thread if no posts have been submitted to it in the last 48 hours. You may not submit one or more posts after you've posted (double-post, triple-post, quadruple-post...).

 

[Twilight]

Oh sorry I dident saw that.

 

[UndeadImmortal]

Hmm, I was thinking of creating different landscapes on 1 map like in EotA or Troll vs Elves (ever played that?), where you choose a terrain to play with, using a dialog. But yeah, I'm aware of the file size too :/

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

Hmm, I was thinking of creating different landscapes on 1 map like in EotA or Troll vs Elves (ever played that?), where you choose a terrain to play with, using a dialog. But yeah, I'm aware of the file size too :/

, it is a fun idea. I tried random terrain templates through trigger with an other map, it was too hard though to get it right. I never played Troll vs Elves, do they it through triggers or terrain templates already in the map? In anycase, won't take long anymore before terrain variations can be made . I have made the map so I can easily keep updating several map terrain variations of it.

What do you guys think of differences for easy and insane for the AI? I can't do really different AI scripts (cause of the map filesize) but I can add things like a handicap (for easy) or a boost (for insane) in resources gathering etc.

 

[UndeadImmortal]

TvE already have templates on the map, you could use the modify camera bounds trigger. The AI bonus sounds good

 

[The_New_Divide]

I dont like Bonis for AI-players, becouz they are lesser humanlike and you cant train agains this version for get better against real opponents.

How big are the AI-Files? My simply AI´s have often just 20 kb.

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

To bonus (or handicap) is optionally though (just choose normal difficulty than).

The AI files are about ~80-100 kb and squished alot (reducing filesize by manually removing not needed object data for that specific race, e.g. Bionic AI don't need the object data of Infected units/upgrades). Each race already has 2 AI variations (in the upcoming V1.3 that is) that differ alot (1 with ground focus & 1 with air focus).

you cant train agains this version for get better against real opponents.

, sry I don't understand what you say here

 

[The_New_Divide]

you cant train agains this version for get better against real opponents.

, sry I don't understand what you say here

When the AI opponent become more ressources, you can´t be better against human-opponents, becouz timing etc. is difference.

 

[[K40$]-Spectre]

That depends on the skill of the human-opponent. It makes the AI atleast a bit better or worse though, especially in the beginning. Also vespene gas (the second resource) is more scarce. If you play with an AI as ally, you can see that he often has enough minerals (but not so much that it is useless) and almost no vespene gas.

But you have a good point that timing still matters, and gave me an idea +rep. I can increase the timing of the AI too, by speeding up the production/research processes of the AI. That should make it definitely more of a challenge.

ps: can't +rep you now will do it later

 

[The_New_Divide]

Hey, someone here, who want play this game on B.net?(best 1vs1 or 2vs2)

I know this sounds stupid. But i dont know how to use bots for hosting maps in wc3.
(Only heared from MakeMeHost.com, but dont find this map on this site)

BTW, anyone know, where get replaybase of custom games? Specially Games like Starcraft Hybrids is nice to see.