Patch 1.27b changes to Commandfunc.txt

[wc3neverdies]

Hi, so after i downloaded the new patch i started the editor to finish an old map. In this map there were a custom CommandFunc.txt file in the Units folder. After i tested the map seems that it isn't working anymore, maybe they changed the path where you have to import it? Does anyone has the same problem?

Thank you


edit: IT seems that the 0,-11 X,Y coordinates doesn't hide the icon anymore

 

[mietek]

I found that out 10 hours ago. Looks like they patched this or maybe its in patch.dll right now but tryed in Local files(doesnt work). Path notes says nothing about it. I've tryed negative values, and also normal stacking(ofc. they didnt add it ).

 

[wc3neverdies]

ye i replied under your thread some time ago to confirm it. I also tried to take the new Commandfunc.txt from the new patched mpq and modify that, but don't work. I tried also to change the position to all buttons differently (es. like move 0,-11 ; partol 0,-2548583 adn so on) didn't work either.
Edit: Seems that even if you use world editor to hide an icon (shift+enter and digit a negative value in the X,Y fileds) it doesn't work.

Why Blizzard, WHY!!!!??????

 

[Dr Super Good]

Why Blizzard, WHY!!!!??????

It probably worked by doing something very unsafe. Such as try to place the command card out side the array allocated for it. It is possible that it could have been causing many of the unexplained crashes people randomly run into!

 

[DracoL1ch]

ye, lets fuck only possibility to safely hide icons in order to save those who're bad at it

 

[wc3neverdies]

It probably worked by doing something very unsafe. Such as try to place the command card out side the array allocated for it. It is possible that it could have been causing many of the unexplained crashes people randomly run into!

Oh well, I used custom command card in all my maps, now those are useless.... sigh...

 

[mietek]

Oh well, I used custom command card in all my maps, now those are useless.... sigh...

i know that feel bro, had two projects with this feature. One is repairable but second one is completly destroyed.

Let's wish someone will find new method either blizzard add hide UI function in future.

 

[wc3neverdies]

i know that feel bro, had two projects with this feature. One is repairable but second one is completly destroyed.

Let's wish someone will find new method either blizzard add hide UI function in future.

Hummm, ''in future'' means late next year, like next december... still sigh :'(
Maybe they release an hotfix, because there is some bugged stuff in the editor, but that feature(hiding icons) was super important for me, i hope they fix that aswell, in all the i played maps with button stacking never had a crash, never, on windows at least...

 

[DracoL1ch]

in all the i played maps with button stacking never had a crash, never, on windows at least...

its uncrashable and fully working, yet technically a bug. remember how guys here told "they will provide replacements for all hacky stuff"? Kappa

one more proof of what I said

 

[Dr Super Good]

I assume people were using it to hide standard command card buttons like move, attack etc? Because otherwise why not use a disabled spell book?

its uncrashable and fully working, yet technically a bug.

That is a bold statement to make without seeing the source code.

WC3 has dozens, if not hundreds of ways it can be crashed.

 

[DracoL1ch]

I assume people were using it to hide standard command card buttons like move, attack etc? Because otherwise why not use a disabled spell book?

because disabled spellbook is
1)another bug
2)reinventing the wheel
3)requires to make permanent not only abilities inside, yet spellbook as well
4)harder to maintain

but sure, for sake of fixes, it been used for different stuff, hiding default keys, placing them over UI etc

 

[Dr Super Good]

because disabled spellbook is
1)another bug
2)reinventing the wheel
3)requires to make permanent not only abilities inside, yet spellbook as well
4)harder to maintain

but sure, for sake of fixes, it been used for different stuff, hiding default keys, placing them over UI etc

Well this is what you get for using Warcraft III to do anything. Even the object editor is one great big hacky concept which makes little sense.

I would say that disabled spellbook is extremely unlikely to be fixed as it is used by so many custom games (even DotA would break?) and does not appear to be exploiting extremely broken mechanics such as out of range or invalid values.

 

[Wareditor]

Anyone has found another way to hide or move UI icons ? Without this all my maps are broken.

 

[DracoL1ch]

Anyone has found another way to hide or move UI icons ? Without this all my maps are broken.

theres none, except spellbooks. thats why its another big pile of patch

 

[Wareditor]

Well for the longest time, we thought it was impossible. The Commandfunc method was found only a few years ago. I hope someone can dig up a new way.
I still can't understand the reason to fix this ultra specific and safe exploit.

 

[Dr Super Good]

I still can't understand the reason to fix this ultra specific and safe exploit.

What evidence do you have that it was safe? Not crashing immediately does not mean it was safe.

 

[Wareditor]

What evidence do you have to say that it was unsafe ?
They removed a feature that has never caused any trouble to anyone and has been used for at least two years. Many maps used it and now most of them need to be reworked, sometimes deeply.

Even if it was unsafe, there were lots of way to fix it and still allow us to hide ui icons.

 

[Dr Super Good]

What evidence do you have to say that it was unsafe ?

It was removed. The fact they removed it for what would seem to be "no reason" points towards someone working on the code spotting unsafe behaviour and fixing it. Otherwise there is no reason for them to have spent any time removing it if it was completly safe.

The fact WC3 does so many unsafe things, such as not bounds checking various stages of loading BLP files, means that it is highly likely this was highly unsafe and a frequent, or at least obvious, cause of problems.

They removed a feature that has never caused any trouble to anyone and has been used for at least two years.

It has cause no trouble as far as we know. We do not know how many fatal errors or other problems it has caused as we have no way of attributing random or unreported crashes to it.

Many maps used it and now most of them need to be reworked, sometimes deeply.

A lot more used the type casting exploit and that did not stop Blizzard from patching it.

Even if it was unsafe, there were lots of way to fix it and still allow us to hide ui icons.

I thought hidden spell book, which still works, did all this anyway...

 

[DracoL1ch]

It was removed. The fact they removed it for what would seem to be "no reason" points towards someone working on the code spotting unsafe behaviour and fixing it. Otherwise there is no reason for them to have spent any time removing it if it was completly safe.

nope, that only means somebody thought it's oversight and "fixed" it. blizz prooved they have no idea about community long ago.
whole your way of defending is pretending blizz know what they do. while in fact it is'nt the case.

oh yeah, lets replace pretty much safe (some negative offsets caused crash, but the one which been prooved safe totally stable) with harder-to-work-with spellbooks. cmon, mapmakers, you can surely twice your abilities count just 'cause blizzard had nothing more to do. goddamit.

 

[Dr Super Good]

nope, that only means somebody thought it's oversight and "fixed" it. blizz prooved they have no idea about community long ago.
whole your way of defending is pretending blizz know what they do. while in fact it is'nt the case.

If I spot something unsafe in code, I fix it. Looking how regularly WC3 crashes it is full of unsafe stuff. It does not even check buffer bounds when reading BLP files which can cause a crash.

oh yeah, lets replace pretty much safe (some negative offsets caused crash, but the one which been prooved safe totally stable) with harder-to-work-with spellbooks.

The fact some caused crashes shows it was unsafe. You have no proof the one chosen was safe, just that it did not immediately crash. The crashes it could cause might have been delayed or it could even break the behaviour of certain unrelated game features down the line. Stop trying to defend unsafe programming practices. Reality is no one knows for sure what memory was being modified for that feature to work and what implications that might have.

For example it might have been overwriting the memory management structures of some other objects so when those other objects, unrelated to the command card offset array, are deleted all kinds of unexpected or error prone behaviour might occur which may or may not end with a crash.

cmon, mapmakers, you can surely twice your abilities count just 'cause blizzard had nothing more to do. goddamit.

Now we do not have to worry about the command card offset being a potential crash cause. I would not be surprised if a few unexplained crashes no longer occur as a result.

That said I do agree that maybe their solution was not perfect. Perhaps they should have added a special "hide" case if the command card offset is any out of bounds or invalid number. Their solution to the problem was better than nothing but not perfect.

 

[DracoL1ch]

> break "safe if used correctly" bug
> better than nothing

well, since you aint doing anything in wc3 editor, it definitely is from your standpoint. but for mapmakers blizzards are just annoying kids who ruins stuff

 

[Emm-A-]

Oh shit, can we somehow communicate to them, that this really breaks a lot of the modern map projects?

Moreover: Are changes to the .txt file still valid, or did they only inhibit the stacking technique?

 

[Wareditor]

I thought hidden spell book, which still works, did all this anyway...

This shows how much you don't understand the issue and are out of touch with actual map makers. You can't hide Move, Attack and other basic UI icons within a spellbook.
In the latest patch, they simply removed a feature that nobody complained about, one that was actively used by the community. There is no valid reason for them to fix this without providing another "safe" way to do it. Not a single map will be better because of this "fix".

Also when they fixed typecasting back in 1.24 they added new functions to replaced typecasting.

Their solution to the problem was better than nothing but not perfect.

No their solution isn't a solution at all - it's one of the most retarded fix I have ever seen. They actually took the time (months and months) to remove features in a almost twenty years old game. And to what result ? To avoid some craches if you input the wrong coordinates ?! But if you are thinking this way then you should remove half of the jass functions because you can make a map crash with them too... Really makes you think.

 

[Dr Super Good]

You can't hide Move, Attack and other basic UI icons within a spellbook.

Generally one does not want to...

In the latest patch, they simply removed a feature that nobody complained about, one that was actively used by the community.

One can hardly call such a dangerous error a feature...

There is no valid reason for them to fix this without providing another "safe" way to do it. Not a single map will be better because of this "fix".

Yeh minor oversight I guess. Report it as a bug?

No their solution isn't a solution at all - it's one of the most retarded fix I have ever seen.

There are plenty of more retarded fixes in the software engineering industry. We all know companies like EA are notorious for them.

They actually took the time (months and months) to remove features in a almost twenty years old game.

Among many things.

To avoid some craches if you input the wrong coordinates ?!

As far as you know. Who knows what that value was doing the fact others crashed.

 

[Flux]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, I thought hiding basic command cards via editing slot position to an unusual offset crashes Mac users?

 

[Dr Super Good]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, I thought hiding basic command cards via editing slot position to an unusual offset crashes Mac users?

If it crashed or not depended on what virtual memory was being manipulated outside of the allocated command card array space. Just because 1 index did not cause a crash on Windows does not mean it did not modify memory belonging to something else that could lead to a crash or unexpected behaviour. Even if one was found that did not immediatly crash either windows or Mac does not mean it will not eventually crash or cause unexpected behaviour. Out of bounds memory manipulation is inherently not safe and hence why it was patched.

Frankly they removed a feature of the game that never existed to start with. People think it worked (was safe) but there is no evidence it did (most likely was not safe).

 

[DracoL1ch]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, I thought hiding basic command cards via editing slot position to an unusual offset crashes Mac users?

doto had like 4 mac users per year. they're non-existant

People think it worked (was safe) but there is no evidence it did (most likely was not safe).

yeah, the fact the game always used 0/0 coords for button even if it's already taken, makes it unsafe. the fact that game itself uses negative offsets to provide some UI buttons makes it totally unsafe. what a bullshit.
real reason, as you said, it's just bound check for no reason. blizz had no idea if that ever been abused, they aren't in touch with mapmakers, so they just put it there 'cause why not. it wasnt required fix or w/e, just a note to get more of changelog (which is pathetic(

 

[Dr Super Good]

doto had like 4 mac users per year. they're non-existant

However the product is sold as supported for mac. Hence everything that works for windows should run on Mac as well.

yeah, the fact the game always used 0/0 coords for button even if it's already taken, makes it unsafe. the fact that game itself uses negative offsets to provide some UI buttons makes it totally unsafe. what a bullshit.
real reason, as you said, it's just bound check for no reason. blizz had no idea if that ever been abused, they aren't in touch with mapmakers, so they just put it there 'cause why not. it wasnt required fix or w/e, just a note to get more of changelog (which is pathetic(

People have reported that certain values caused it to crash. The reason some caused it to crash while others did not means that whatever it was doing was inherently unsafe. Instead of arguing why it was done, I recommend arguing that a feature to hide command card buttons be added. Such feature could come in the form of a separate flag or in the form of any invalid button offset meaning that the command card button should not be displayed.

 

[DracoL1ch]

added

blizz today + this word? impossible.
the best they could do is to fucking remove file size limit at 26, without breaking replays and stuff, and then get away completely.

 

[wc3neverdies]

It probably worked by doing something very unsafe. Such as try to place the command card out side the array allocated for it. It is possible that it could have been causing many of the unexplained crashes people randomly run into!

Well, im glad that they ''fixed'' this ''issue'' if it caused crashes, in fact some maps with this change couldn't be used by mac users, a real pity, but the cool thing wasn't just hiding icons, it was changing the command card completly, i hope developers understand the importance of this possibility for modders and maybe in the next patch(if there will be one) they make us able to do it again

finger crossed...

 

[EdgeOfChaos]

Perhaps it was safe, perhaps it wasn't. But either way, they removed functionality. I don't support Draco's blind hate against Blizzard, but he has a point here.

They should have patched the bug and then added an option for "Hide - Yes/No" in WE.

 

[Emm-A-]

who knows, how deep in to the system that goes, to add this option. Therefore they have been lazy and mainly focused on fixing that issue, that they putatively may have had there.

It is not like the biggest maps in wc3 history needed that feature - so I think we should not be angry too much - but now that we have this, I think they really should deliver some hot fix to bring this back!!

@DracoL1ch calm down Maybe you should not modd wc3, if you really hate all this so much. Not trying to offend you but maybe it would be healthier for yourself Edit: also not at ALL saying you should quit . please dont!
Try to see it like that: the game has an easily accessible world editor with hash tables included, it is not like this is a standard in games industry peace !

 

[DracoL1ch]

I like the game, I hate managers who let it sink.
just as "I like the country, but hate the goverment"

 

[Emm-A-]

I like the game, I hate managers who let it sink.
just as "I like the country, but hate the goverment"

and it is good to have people that articulate their dislikes with things, that seem to be a clear mistake!

I just think it does not help to go further once you already clearly stated, that blizz fucked this up

 

[DracoL1ch]

and it is good to have people that articulate their dislikes with things, that seem to be a clear mistake!

I just think it does not help to go further once you already clearly stated, that blizz fucked this up

dont worry, heres dozen guys who gonna ride blizzard's dick for every patchnote, so my actually relevant ideas will easily go unnoticed.

 

[Emm-A-]

I hope they do not vanish unnoticed, but dont you think,
the probability for them to become real is much higher by wirting "hey blizz you did a mistake, this does not make any sense. please do x" instead of " you are a bunch of stupid children" ?

If I was that person responsible I would rather like to read and think about the first option ..

 

[DracoL1ch]

none of them reading this
none of them even reading their own forum
so whats the matter? im trying to enlight ppl that not everything falling down from the sky is rain, it may as well be bird's shit. yet they're standing around with open mouthes.
I already gave my fuck with that "hive's advices of what we need from the patch". blizz used that list as toilet paper.

 

[Wareditor]

Can someone actually try to find a new exploit to hide those icons ? If you need help I am here.
Though to be honest, I have very little knowledge of the internal workings of Warcraft 3 - so I don't really know how I can help.

 

[EdgeOfChaos]

I don't know either. But, maybe there's some way to accomplish your goal by different means (to avoid button hiding?)

Anyways if there's something to be learned from this, it's that bugs aren't reliable. I suppose it's the same lesson from the return bug that broke half of WC3's maps :\

 

[DracoL1ch]

I suppose it's the same lesson from the return bug that broke half of WC3's maps :\

you know, return bug has been patched with somethig in return. it didn't become totally broken at all, it been replaced, and pretty much equally.

 

[Dr Super Good]

you know, return bug has been patched with somethig in return. it didn't become totally broken at all, it been replaced, and pretty much equally.

Except it did break almost all good maps available at the time. Some were eventually patched by their authors but most were not.

The reality is a few people are making a huge fuss over nothing. A tiny exploit was patched away and by the sounds of some of the people here it was a big deal. Most WC3 maps have and never would have used the patched exploit. I recommend requesting the feature instead of pointlessly sprouting hate.

 

[DracoL1ch]

The reality is a few people are making a huge fuss over nothing. A tiny exploit was patched away and by the sounds of some of the people here it was a big deal. Most WC3 maps have and never would have used the patched exploit. I recommend requesting the feature instead of pointlessly sprouting hate.

now repeat all the same about return bug. or preload exploit. everything can be labeled "fuss", which is totally subjective opinion with no solid ground. and nope, bliz didnt received any suggestions so far. literally nothing.

 

[Wareditor]

@DrSuperGood I don't think you are in position to tell that it was a small thing because you are not a map maker. You are out of touch with the community. You should not speak about things that you don't understand.

 

[Marcos_M]

Yeah.. This feature was really core in my project, my units use 9 spells, with only maintaining attack, move and stop commands.

Modifying the command card is a really BIG deal for all the non-melee maps
Who use Patrol in DotA or a Hero Arena anyway?

 

[Tal'Rarity]

Well you can still disable attack UI button and turn patrol into that though if you are okay with unit dummies, you can visually copy the "exploit" mostly with rally ability and triggering your own versions of commands/orders. Definitely does suck that as usual they do mostly nothing besides give us stuff that hinders or blocks our fun.

 

[DracoL1ch]

Who use Patrol in DotA or a Hero Arena anyway?

you will wonder, but it has its own purposes.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Until we get an alterntivr, you can repurpose the buttons by catching the orders and triggering your spells.

for example, patrol can easily be repurposed as a ground target ability and hold position for an instant self-cast ability. Its the easiest and cleanest solution so far.