Consumer Vs. Producer Differential

[StoPCampinGn00b]

As primarily modding site, the Hive naturally would have a large amount of producers, or resource creators. This wouldn't mean there wouldn't be a smaller percentage of consumers, but Hive sometimes seems that way.

Sadly, many resources, development threads, are left with little to no signs of consumer activity. While that isn't necessarily a terrible thing, I find that if there are more consumers, users tend to be more happy and active.

Why do we need activity? I don't know about anyone else, but I enjoy the site more when it's more active. Activity for entertainment. I hate to see newcomers present a resource and no one even posts on it. They then leave. Is it there fault that no one is buying into the map? Partially, yes. If they didn't make something appealing, then it's usually their fault. But, it doesn't have to be that way.

Here are my questions.
1. Should the site be more active?
2. Should there be more consumers?
3. How could the site be more active and have more consumers?

 

[sonofjay]

Its very hard to gather new players for a game that is more than a decade old. I doubt that we will see a map that can gather millions of players like Dota ever again.

1. Should the site be more active?

Of course, every forum needs activity to stay alive.

2. Should there be more consumers?

Although I am not one who cares if my maps are being played or not this isn't the case for many modders here so yes since I'd seen many good and promising maps/projects that was lost in the pile of threads in the map development section and the main reason that the project didn't last is most likely because of lack of feedback from the community.

3. How could the site be more active and have more consumers?

As I said earlier, I doubt that we can have that one map that can gather players on the same magnitude as Dota ever again, heck not even probably a small percentage of that. We had some truly unique and high quality maps yet they weren't able to boost the player base of the game. We can't really blame anyone why War3's player base is dwindling, first of all the game is simply outdated then the lack of support and advertisement from Blizzard itself is also a problem because they have their newer games to support and lastly garena's decision to stop supporting War3 on many countries was the nail in the coffin I have so many friends who stopped playing War3 after this and just jumped to Dota2.

The only way I'm seeing Hiveworkshop to gather new players is that we advertise the game to a higher extent like being actively advertising the game on sns but I still doubt we can regain enough by doing that. Option 2 is the old and classic topic of branching to other games like SC2.

 

[Shadow Fury]

1. Should the site be more active?

Yes, it should be. The hive is like a big office and the hivers like the employees. The more the employees are active, the more productivity we have.

2. Should there be more consumers?

Once again, yes! If there are too few consumers, producers are not that encouraged to display their work.

3. How could the site be more active and have more consumers?

Well, I don't know because it doesn't depend on we individuals. We can just hope to get more active users and consumers, nothing more. Since Blizzard abandoned this game to its fate, we cannot do anthing.

 

[Wasabee]

Should the site be more active?

YES especially when there are the times of no activity makes me feel empty. Being an active site means its really productive.

Should there be more consumers?

YES again makes you feel more productive or serves as an inspiration. Like you make something but no one bats an eye then you'll ask yourself why am I doing this? You want to share something but nobody responds. You lose the will? Don't know the right term.

How could the site be more active and have more consumers?

It's pretty hard since the game is not the priority of Blizzard or even update it.

 

[NagaRulez]

1. Should the site be more active?

Yes, of course. An active site encourages productivity and ensures a good flow between the consumers and producers, thus creating a well-rounded environment that fosters development and generates ideas. In short, an active site is pretty much wonderful.

2. Should there be more consumers?

Of course. It's like yin-yang. One cannot survive (or exists, if you stick to the yin-yang concept) without the other.

3. How could the site be more active and have more consumers?

Simple.

Reaching out. Reaching out brings more attention. This could be done by introducing Hiveworkshop itself into the Android community. Although the site can be accessed by mobile browsers, an app itself is pretty convenient. Quick searches and messages to reply would come in handy, eh?

Another one is through social media itself! If the Hiveworkshop is already a sprawling community of 50-50 alive users, then why not expand more? Facebook, Twitter, Youtube, or anything! We can host events and promote maps more effectively there. We need to be creative at this one!

Fostering starters. I've seen countless threads started by freshmen only to be closed after days of inactivity, or a different scenario would be a long thread only to contain one always repeating word: bump (sometimes they come with effects). Fostering starters encourages mass participation. How? Well, the experts should be more active in helping the needy. A little help wouldn't hurt, would it?

Also, I suggest being open to half-baked resources. Well, I'm not literally saying that we should accept such resources because if we do, it would undermine the whole purpose of the moderators, eh? Then, how about creating a forum where people can post half-baked resources, and when I mean half-baked resources, they are things that people can only do with their current level of proficiency (and WIPS are different to what I'm pointing out). And also, I think CnP's should also have their own place, too. Posting it in the proper section might undermine an artist's skills, but what if it's probably useable?

This way, the people in this community can have real interaction, not just continued rants about sarcasm and unfinished promises.

 

[Ezekiel12]

1.
Yes.
2.
Yes.
3.
Do some of those and then create an outstanding outstanding project. From time to time old games come up in the news because some crazy modder has outdone himself and created something amazing.
I have to admit though that for wc3 this is not easy.

 

[OutsiderXE]

3. post news on the front page whenever a decent map is released. point to videos, threads, reviews etc.

 

[SA Dashie]

I'm usually afraid to post stuff due to having little to no feedback.
I have at least a couple of maps that have some really well rounded and polished terrain with started to almost release ready vJass constructed code and other worked on elements and I don't want to bother showing the public because of the lack of activity.

If only there where a way to highly boost activity. :s

I wonder how the Wc3 commuity would react to Hive 2.0 though.

 

[Ralle]

I'm usually afraid to post stuff due to having little to no feedback.
I have at least a couple of maps that have some really well rounded and polished terrain with started to almost release ready vJass constructed code and other worked on elements and I don't want to bother showing the public because of the lack of activity.

If only there where a way to highly boost activity. :s

I wonder how the Wc3 commuity would react to Hive 2.0 though.

The only way to win the lottery is to buy a ticket.

Nobody is going to look at your stuff if you won't post it. Just saying.

 

[SA Dashie]

^Yeh I've heard/read stuff about that.
Show your values in the right crowds and recognized there.
If you don't show value in your resource although post it everywhere no one will care.

If I feel like I have time and enough motivation I'll post my progress in the map dev forum.

Posting progress to the public is more of a thing I feel like doing when I want to try and push myself
to make things really push through.
If I post stuff aimlessly and without clear reason things could go wrong.

 

[Jaina Proudless]

There are many consumers who use the hive just to download maps - without registering or anything.

I think the hive could be made better by creating new sub-sections for skins, models, and icons that greatly value the usefulness of the creation as opposed to its originality and overall artistic perfection.

 

[Wasabee]

There are many consumers who use the hive just to download maps - without registering or anything.

I think the hive could be made better by creating new sub-sections for skins, models, and icons that greatly value the usefulness of the creation as opposed to its originality and overall artistic perfection.

You mean redefining the rules in the resources section.

 

[Jaina Proudless]

You mean redefining the rules in the resources section.

It doesn't have to redefine existing resource sections, it could add new ones such is recolours and geomerges with their own standards.

 

[Wasabee]

Recolors and geomerges are good but wouldn't that create a huge amount of data?

 

[sonofjay]

Recolours can be posted on the forum if I remember correctly.

 

[NagaRulez]

Recolors and geomerges are good but wouldn't that create a huge amount of data?

I think their usefulness would compensate for such matter.

Recolours can be posted on the forum if I remember correctly.

The site needs more disclosure. Usually, users don't know what and where exactly they could advertise their works for feedback.

 

[Mr. Gameplay Knowledge]

Sadly i can't engoy the side how you becasue i am mobile here and thats the only way how can i be with you here becasue my computer has no internet, so i wil soon when i earn enough money to have my own internet,my own laptop and my own life.
1. Should the site be more active?
For me is the site enough active but the site can do it better you know how more people are here that more people happy and more people have fun and becomes more information
2. Should there be more consumers?
I am seriously happy if more players plays my multieplayer maps then i have more fun becasue my maps are not just made it for other people it is for myself too,so i give shit for my single player maps but sadly how i said my computer have not internet and now is coming my best minigame what i have ever maid in my hole life so when i upload it i will gave everybody the premission to upload an a good AI version,so yes the site shut have more consumers becasue it helps all uploadet multiplayer maps on this site and it makes the creators happy and if the creators are not happy they don't make stuff on the site so no stuff brings zero people on the site and no fun
3. How could the site be more active and have more consumers?[/QUOTE]
it exist many methods so you can pay ads or sell fan articles then people see the fan stuff then they think about what is it,wher can i find it and the result is "fan:i'm gona check it out"then when site gots popular maybe it will be put on a catalog or something like that,and it exist more ways but i don't want spam this threader....haha xd

 

[Mr. Gameplay Knowledge]

I change my mind this site needs more activity the chat is full with not talking lame people ...sorry people l i'm a moron but my words are the pure truth accept that.

 

[Ralle]

The pure truth of divine intelligence.

 

[Heinvers]

I change my mind this site needs more activity the chat is full with not talking lame people ...sorry people l i'm a moron but my words are the pure truth accept that.

You don't even know those people, how can you make a judgement so rapidly?
You basically registered on this site YESTERDAY, so kindly refrain from saying that until you get to actually know them(at least some of them).
So until then you have no right to say that they're lame, they could say the same thing about you if that's the case.

 

[Mr. Gameplay Knowledge]

How can i know them when they can not talk to me,ther is no resone to not talk,no indetity=no shame,so anybody can talk about dumb stuff,about his life,only not about his full name,so why people don't talk,i have only ask them what they doing right now then if they replay it ,i am sure that i would say what i'm doing right now so ther is two reasons why they didn't talk to me:
1.they think that they are something better than me but we are all just humans not more then humans
2.becasue they are llamas:

P.s. sorry but i have to fusion lame dudes with llamas ,I'm Soooo sorry you didn't bealive how many i feel sorry for you,my bad...

 

[Kazeon]

None will talk to you when nobody knows you. Perhaps greet some people first, do some introductions or something, like when you need a new friend in a new neighborhood? I'm one of those people which you call "llamas" >.> In my point of view, actually, you are that llama. You just came, silent, then gone. We actually have some good chat times without you in the chat room.

Learn how common society works.

Ah, I have gone off-topic.

On topic now,
1. yes
2. yes
3. yes

Wait, what's the topic?

 

[NagaRulez]

Go home kid. Learn how common society works first.

*horrified gasp*

You can't just call somebody a kid.

 

[Mr. Gameplay Knowledge]

None will talk to you when nobody knows you. Perhaps greet some people first, do some introductions or something, like when you need a new friend in a new neighborhood? I'm one of those people which you call "llamas" >.> In my point of view, actually, you are that llama. You just came, silent, then gone. We actually have some good chat times without you in the chat room.

Go home kid. Learn how common society works first.

Ah, I have gone off-topic.

On topic now,
1. yes
2. yes
3. yes

Wait, what's the topic?

Okey...okey don't call me "kid" little boy i have just replayed his comment and in the replay you can see how i say sorry in many ways becasue i call them llama, so little boy if you have here a problem then follow this what say now:take 10 steps back from your comp.,tablet,laptop and phone,then take a chair and sit on it,then think about that what you have say here over 10 minutes,then go to your comp.,laptop,tablet or mobile phone, then go to my profile,then add me to your ignore list and then you can chill if you don't follow this words then set your negativ energy free again on the post and don't worry you are not a llama and its better that the named thing that you are is not spoken here,Peace!
P.S. with a negativ person like you i don't want have to do and it makes no sense to talk with you.

 

[Shadow Fury]

None will talk to you when nobody knows you. Perhaps greet some people first, do some introductions or something, like when you need a new friend in a new neighborhood? I'm one of those people which you call "llamas" >.> In my point of view, actually, you are that llama. You just came, silent, then gone. We actually have some good chat times without you in the chat room.

Go home kid. Learn how common society works first.

Okey...okey don't call me "kid" little boy i have just replayed his comment and in the replay you can see how i say sorry in many ways becasue i call them llama, so little boy if you have here a problem then follow this what say now:take 10 steps back from your comp.,tablet,laptop and phone,then take a chair and sit on it,then think about that what you have say here over 10 minutes,then go to your comp.,laptop,tablet or mobile phone, then go to my profile,then add me to your ignore list and then you can chill if you don't follow this words then set your negativ energy free again on the post and don't worry you are not a llama and its better that the named thing that you are is not spoken here,Peace!
P.S. with a negativ person like you i don't want have to do and it makes no sense to talk with you.

Stop it now, both of you. This is not the manner you should have when talking. Keep a civil tone (Site Rules, number 12), especially you Quilnez. You are in front of a new user, don't be so frigid with him even if you feel he's doing wrong. You, just like me and other old users, shall give the good example to the new users, not reprimanding them or, even worse, offending them as you would get paid back in the same way and eventually create a disaster.
THE Bora_Balboa, you've acted in the wrong way as well. As a new user, you shall respect others to be respected (same applies to old users clearly). Why do you think people just consider you a null quantity? Because as long as you think they will treat you badly and ignore you, they'll not consider you. Start being nice, enter the chat room, try to strike up, be an active user and you'll see that people will start to appreciate you.

 

[Kazeon]

Stop it now, both of you. This is not the manner you should have when talking. Keep a civil tone (Site Rules, number 12), especially you Quilnez. You are in front of a new user, don't be so frigid with him even if you feel he's doing wrong. You, just like me and other old users, shall give the good example to the new users, not reprimanding them or, even worse, offending them as you would get paid back in the same way and eventually create a disaster.

Whoa. Hold it a second... please. You were talking like I was yelling at him, no, I wasn't. Secondly, I don't know since when "kid" has an offensive manner. In the urban dictionary "kid" has much better meaning than that "llama". In fact "llama" has disrespectful meaning, but I just took it easy. So I don't get how that single line spoils the whole point in my post. And I'm trying to side on my friends in the chat room, so I don't see the reason why you attack me like that?

And you are not "old" enough to call yourself old.

@Balboa:
Let me lay this on you, when you are totally new here and don't know anybody and just blindly call everyone "lame", then yes, you are a kid. I'm sorry, just saying.

EDIT:
On topic,
To be honest, I think answering the first and second questions doesn't solve anything.

3. We can't do anything about it, can we? It completely depends on the users themselves. They may have excuses that they are busy with real life, but actually giving comments to other's resources doesn't take so much times. I conclude that users nowadays just aren't really interested to give comments.

While from the producer's point of view, this site is productive enough. But just, the criticizing process doesn't seem to work very well lately. I saw some resources are left un-commented, or at least they could worth more comments.

 

[Cherrymage]

Stop the arguments. This thread is about the consumers and producers of the Hive, not an argument thread. If you people wish to argue, please do not bring them here, kay?

 

[Shadow Fury]

Whoa. Hold it a second... please. You were talking like I was yelling at him, no, I wasn't. Secondly, I don't know since when "kid" has an offensive manner. In the urban dictionary "kid" has much better meaning than that "llama". In fact "llama" has disrespectful meaning, but I just took it easy. So I don't get how that single line spoils the whole point in my post. And I'm trying to side on my friends in the chat room, so I don't see the reason why you attack me like that?

And you are not "old" enough to call yourself old.

Uhm, I did not mention that I am an old user (I said "including me and old users")
Next, as you can see Bora didn't reply to you in a good way since you've been frigid with him. He took the word "kid" as an offense as you can notice from his response.
Finally, you personally took it as an attack but I was just trying to calm down both of you, nothing more (uh as usual threads tend to go off-topic)

 

[Daffa]

Let's say Hive is a market (this an example), where each resources is a product, each author is a seller and each downloader is a buyer.
A seller would keep selling his products as long there are buyers buying them. If no one buys his products, he will left and change to other market.
Also, with buyers, come consumers feedback. With these feedbacks, a seller can improve his products to keep up with the market challenge, especially if new sellers come everyday.

 

[NagaRulez]

Let's say Hive is a market (this an example), where each resources is a product, each author is a seller and each downloader is a buyer.
A seller would keep selling his products as long there are buyers buying them. If no one buys his products, he will left and change to other market.
Also, with buyers, come consumers feedback. With these feedbacks, a seller can improve his products to keep up with the market challenge, especially if new sellers come everyday.

Then there's the thief.

 

[Daffa]

And the police come in. That's how things work I assume around here, the analogy shouldn't be too difficult to understand.

Basically, it's necessary for customers (resources Downloaders) to be a big amount for producers (resources makers) to make their efforts worth it. But since Warcraft 3 is a very old game, and unless Blizzard give their supports, we're pretty much struggle to reach the goal alone.

 

[Jaina Proudless]

I think though it isn't as simple as having only two categories.

The primary consumers are players. They produce nothing other than perhaps forum posts and fun times in-game. They download the maps and are the entire reason behind the community, behind all the maps, behind all the resources.

Then you have the map makers. They produce maps and use other resource which are the building blocks of the maps such as models, skins, and icons. They consume those building blocks and produce glorious maps.

And lastly you have the producers of those building blocks. Creators who do not make an entire map but only small parts of the map which can be anything from a model to a triggered spell. Their work is consumed by the map makers and not by the players.

The original post highlighted the issue of there being an excess amount of producers (I assume both map makers and resources makers) when comparing to the amount of consumers (consumers of both the maps and the resources meant for maps I assume). I think that this is most probably due to the producers not partaking as much in playing and instead getting stuck in the creation process. I myself have been spending far more time working on my map than playing other maps for the past several months.

Thus, In order to address the issue we have to go back to the roots, to just playing the game instead of being busy-bodies over model wraps or the blizzard-cliffs. Sometimes I get the feeling that many hive users care less about the fun aspect of the game and look at it like a piece of art, forgetting the purpose behind the entire endeavor.

 

[Xonok]

Sometimes I get the feeling that many hive users care less about the fun aspect of the game and look at it like a piece of art, forgetting the purpose behind the entire endeavor.

Yep, that's me. I don't usually publish my resources, but I do work on them a lot.

 

[Dr Super Good]

Wikipedia explains the Consumer V Producer problem very well. It is important in this day and age that it is solved properly otherwise resources will not work.

 

[SA Dashie]

Yeh I don't think I've been overly active in the Wc3 online play since I first started modding somewhat seriously.