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So, you wake up this morning and after doing your usual morning routine, you look out the window and see the sky in its red glory.
But wait; wasn't the sky supposed to be blue?
You hear the faint noises of guns fired and people screaming. You pick up the newspaper and read the lines "THE END."
Four apocalyptic riders are dancing across the perimeter as a missile just turns your newly constructed doghouse into vapor.
What would you do?
PS: This thread is not to mock those that live in a country that is actually at war. If you come from or live in a crisis country, feel invited to share your story with us. While this is a hypothetical question for everyone, having actual real stories in here might provide some interesting insight for the majority of users who mostly have never seen a real war within their home country in their lives.
Probably shat myself first. Then I would be looking through the windows for like 5 minutes, wondering what the fuck is this. I would perform a reality check in case I am Lucid Dreaming.
When I would realize it's all fucking real, as I probably can't do absolutely anything, I'd just hide somewhere and hope for the best.
Google fast as hell what's going on, pick up phone, call people and try to get to safety.
If the machine guns are just around the corner, I doubt running outside is a good idea, so I would probably try to stay inside and hide.
Can't do so much without a gun, probably wouldn't be able to do so much with a gun anyhow, sure if I had a gun, I can kill 1 guy, then they'd blast the building away with explosives.
"Better 100 days as a chicken rather than a day as a lion"
So yeah, I'd just go and search for a secure shelter. If I manage to pick up a weapon from a dead person, even better! I could fend off the guys who want to blast my shelter. Otherwise if the situation is too treacherous to try to pick up a weapon, I'd simply hide somewhere where nobody would headshot me (dunno where tbh).
I'd suddenly become extremely circumspect, rational beyond reason, an expert marksman
and never have to pee. Then I'd simply survive, by instinct and raw badassness.
I'd suddenly become extremely circumspect, rational beyond reason, an expert marksman
and never have to pee. Then I'd simply survive, by instinct and raw badassness.
Well, hey, I can't do anything about fate, I can only say what I'd do.
And no, the whole damn point of this is to survive. What's this shit
about dying because "director's idea"? There's no director, this isn't
a movie damn it. Silly people... >.>
1.for me the first thing I would do is network. The more people I can put between me and death, the better. contacting friends to hoard as much ammunition as possible.
2.from there I would assign a safe and well known but least at threat location. probably well defended too. for me that would be the near by school which has a bomb shelter.
3.grab some weapons.
4. find a stealthy way to get to the safe lOcation. for me this means walking across my road into the jungle that is all around.
5. once you get to your safe house, assign duties defence tactics like hide and run away and flank. they shouldn't know we are in the shelter, no intrudes should know it exists.
6. stock pile. over 30% of deaths are a result of starvation and exposure to the elements.
if I truly believed it was the end of the world I would bring my rosary and bible.
if I couldn't make it out of my house. I would hide in the ceiling. preferably the garage ceiling because it's bricked.
if the school wasn't safe I guess I would have to rely on the friends who agreed to meet there. otherwise disappear into the jungle
If it was normal war, like the ones on earth, I would probably just pack my sack, and leave.
If it was some kind of appocalypse, I would go for Real life RPG well, its appocalypse, so you can have a good laugh before you die you know.
Nevertheless, I would shit myself twice over first, so I would have to find something to wear first.
So you made the thread that you wish the other thread (str/dex/int) had been. Good, I was expecting the first thread to be more like this one, and it was disappointing.
I would probably run for my life and try to find a gun. As soon as I found a gun, I would guage the situation. If it seems like we have a fighting chance, I would help, and probably die because I have no military training; I don't want to die, but I'd do it anyway. If it seems like we don't have a fighting chance, I would probably run and try to regroup with the survivors, where I would probably die protecting them.
I'm not saying I'm a hero; it's just a combination of valuing all others' lives (even people I don't like), and not knowing the value of my own life because I have no idea what my purpose is. It's easy to sacrifice your own life when you're not even sure what you're keeping it for.
To anyone that responds with "don't kill yourself!", I'm not depressed, and I'm not suicidal; I just don't have a clue why I exist. Hopefully I figure it out before I die.
I have to say now (even after my short comment) that the thread is too uninformative. Ok, it's war, but who's against who? Why did this happen? If it's a common war I may decide to side with the stronger team and destroy the weaker one. If it's just a free-for-all war (but it would be hard to explain why/how this started), then I'd just pick a gun and blast anybody in front of my face (except friends and relatives) until I secure the area around me. I'd give a more accurate answer if there's a more detailed description of this *war*.
I would tell myself to never drink again, but well actually it depends how the thing is. If they are only at my countries border then i guess im gonna have to deal with takeover, but if i would be like older i would take all my money and just flee my country to Sweden.. oh wait that place is at war already thanks to refugees. I guess i would just go somewhere safe from Russia. Im not Russia hater, but basically my country is in a such location that Russia is the only country that would actually oppose threat to my country.
I have to say now (even after my short comment) that the thread is too uninformative. Ok, it's war, but who's against who? Why did this happen? If it's a common war I may decide to side with the stronger team and destroy the weaker one. If it's just a free-for-all war (but it would be hard to explain why/how this started), then I'd just pick a gun and blast anybody in front of my face (except friends and relatives) until I secure the area around me. I'd give a more accurate answer if there's a more detailed description of this *war*.
Criticizing an original post for not being specific enough? That's pretty funny coming from you.
This thread is not intended to build a specific scenario that locks you into specific courses of action. Even if everyone perceives the war they are reacting to differently, this would be no differently than everyone in real life perceiving a war differently. Which side is right? Which side is wrong? Which side is going to win? Which side wants what's best for you? These are not things that can be stated as facts, because it is up to each person's perception and the majority will always be wrong.
Let's apply some realism here. A war is not an "on/off" state. There will be days in which you wouldn't even know that you are in a war, except maybe for seeing soldiers in the streets.
You won't hear bombs blowing up buildings everywhere or see countless dead bodies on the street. There will be times at which the airstrike alert goes off and nothing happens.
However, there will also be days in which you feel like you're part of a horror movie.
This is what real wars look like. Obviously, my first post was just a jokey hyperbole to attract some funnier responses. This thread is not about a possible armageddon (because we already have such a thread). It's about a war, let's just say a global scale war such as the WW2. A war you can't just simply escape by crossing a border, unless you go really far into isolation.
Also, this is not about who is your enemy and who is not. For the sake of exposition; this war also comes with a civil war component, so you can't know for sure who is friend and who is enemy.
For those who would simply flee, here's a thing to think about:
say, you are in a larger city hundreds of miles away from the border. Would you really take the risk to go there, not knowing what the country looks like at this place? Would you take the risk of getting shot by border patrols? Remember that parts of your country are in a state of civil war... you can not trust everyone.
Wouldn't you rather hide in your basement?
Sheesh, I really hate to do it, but since so many people asked questions about this, looks like I have to reveal my secret agenda here:
I want to spread a bit of awareness about what the world we live in really looks like. That there are countries, like Syria, in which a real war happens. I want you guys to open your minds and think about how you would react if you wouldn't know if you survive for another day, because at any day some insane mind might rush into your house and just shoot you for some canned food. Or a bomb will hit your shelter and you die in the rubble.
Or even better: how you would react if you see your friends and family getting killed, then arrive in a country that's green and prospering. A country where nobody gets killed by chance. And nobody has to starve. A country where everyone lives a wealthy life.
And then first thing that happens is that you are greeted by someone who screams about how refugees are destroying his country. You don't even know him. He hates you for no reason. You look around and see a country thats bright and friendly. You can not even imagine how your presence here could disturb anyone.
Now, this thread is not about refugees. But feel free to get a better person and accept refugees with open arms by thinking about this.
You guys should check out This War of Mine. It's a fantastic civilian war simulator. Not everyone is a solider, after all. You might find out that what you do, what you have to do, is much different from what you think you would.
You guys should check out This War of Mine. It's a fantastic civilian war simulator. Not everyone is a solider, after all. You might find out that what you do, what you have to do, is much different from what you think you would.
Wow, I didn't know this game. I'm gonna check it out asap. Though it looks a bit too "gamey" from my first look. A telltale style adventure would probably have been cooler.
you could always prostitute yourself off to the enemy. if they are defeated then our side would save you. if the enemy you sleep with wins, at least you survived annihilation.... although it seems you chose anal-hilation
Except for stuff like the liberation of France 1944 and collaboration horizontale. You know, the public beating and humiliation of french women who slept with (even professionally) German soldiers. Good stuff all around
Same thing happened the other way around 1923 when french troops occupied the Rhineland. I think citizenships for the kids and mothers were even revoked in some cases
For some strange reason, getting torn by the spears of the enemy doesnt please the motherland if it's in the shitter
Notice that there is a war.
Get something blunt like a chair, or maybe something sharp like a knife and wait at the door.
When a soldier or somebody with a gun comes, kill him and get the gun.
While there is a fucking armageddon outside, take cover and make sure you dont kill anybody unless they are a threat.
Be badass and shoot 36 enemy soldiers while running into your friends house.
Find a sniper.
360 noscope their leader in the middle of a gang.
Put a C4 and escape.
Watch as their asses explode.
Find a shotgun.
Explode 4 people's heads.
Do badass moves like sliding under a truck while fighting against waves of soldiers.
Get to your friends house and give your friend weapons and shit.
Be a team and defend yourselves from helicopters and waves of soldiers.
360 quickscope their leader in the middle of a fight.
Throw a lot of grenades.
Help the innocent.
Steal stuff that will help you and the innocent survive from somewhere.
Get information from an enemy leader.
Find their HQ and attack them.
Get information from a better leader.
Find where the main boss is.
360 quickscope the main boss while throwing 3 grenades and dodging a rocket in the middle of a fight and throw a C4 at the main core while doing that and escape.
Main HQ explodes.
War ends.
Interesting topic. I honestly don't know what I'd do. I'm lucky enough to have been born in a developed country with good welfare, so it's hard for me to even imagine being in situation like this.
Or even better: how you would react if you see your friends and family getting killed, then arrive in a country that's green and prospering. A country where nobody gets killed by chance. And nobody has to starve. A country where everyone lives a wealthy life.
And then first thing that happens is that you are greeted by someone who screams about how refugees are destroying his country. You don't even know him. He hates you for no reason. You look around and see a country thats bright and friendly. You can not even imagine how your presence here could disturb anyone.
Now, this thread is not about refugees. But feel free to get a better person and accept refugees with open arms by thinking about this.
I'm sorry, but this sounds a bit too preachy to me. I don't know where you're from but in my country we have a huge problem with immigrants (including refugees) being vastly over-represented in violent crime statistics. That's not racism, it's simple statistics.
That's not to say all immigrants are criminals of course, and people who do accuse all immigrants of destroying their country are indeed assholes - but the way you put it you make it sound like it's poor peaceful immigrants vs rich hateful (white) racists. And it's not that simple at all.
You guys should check out This War of Mine. It's a fantastic civilian war simulator. Not everyone is a solider, after all. You might find out that what you do, what you have to do, is much different from what you think you would.
Wow, I didn't know this game. I'm gonna check it out asap. Though it looks a bit too "gamey" from my first look. A telltale style adventure would probably have been cooler.
Yeah, that's my problem with this game as well. It relies too much on the gameplay aspects on not enough on the narrative. It gets old quite quickly tbh. A Telltale-like narrative would've been amazing.
you could always prostitute yourself off to the enemy. if they are defeated then our side would save you. if the enemy you sleep with wins, at least you survived annihilation.... although it seems you chose anal-hilation
Yeah, tell that to the women who slept with German soldiers during WW2. They got beaten up, their heads shaved, forced to walk through towns naked and just all around humiliated after the war.
If you prostitute yourself to those who are invading to survive, your old self is already dead. Whoever emerges from the war in your body is a completely different person.
I'm sorry, but this sounds a bit too preachy to me. I don't know where you're from but in my country we have a huge problem with immigrants (including refugees) being vastly over-represented in violent crime statistics. That's not racism, it's simple statistics.
Then, I'm pretty sure you can actually show me these statistics. Because this is exactly the kind of thing that racists throw around and gullible people take as a fact (not saying that you are racist or gullible, just saying that this is a common misconception).
"Statistics back this up". No they don't.
Statistics show exactly one thing: that the majority of criminals is below the age of 30 and male, regardless of where they come from. And you know what most refugees are? Exactly; below 30 and male. They aren't more or less criminal than non-refugees. It's just that the majority of refugees is limited to this demographic.
Germany has a refugee problem. But this problem isn't the actual refugees. It's the general mentality here that a refugee will
a) rape your children
b) rob your home
c) steal your job
And do you know what the conclusion is? Putting them into ghettos. Instead of spreading the refugees equally, to allow them to actually live and get integrated, we keep them in secluded camps and prison-like refugee shelters. Not in my backyard! They aren't even allowed to work. They have no money, boredom makes up most of their day. They are young and male to boot. What do you think will happen, if you throw 300 jobless males into a prison environment in a 500 inhabitants village? Do you actually think that would be different if those men where from [insert whatever industry nation you like] instead?
It's not the refugees that are the problem. It's how we, as a society, deal with them. Refugees in most developed countries are just a glorified kind of prisoner. A thing we just keep for as long as we have to before returning it to the origin.
Why? Because the government failed to provide sufficient shelter or a working system to handle refugees.
And why that? Because the right wing parties are still going strong in germany.
Sheesh. I wanted this thread to not be about refugees...
Then, I'm pretty sure you can actually show me these statistics. Because this is exactly the kind of thing that racists throw around and gullible people take as a fact (not saying that you are racist or gullible, just saying that this is a common misconception).
"Statistics back this up". No they don't.
Statistics show exactly one thing: that the majority of criminals is below the age of 30 and male, regardless of where they come from. And you know what most refugees are? Exactly; below 30 and male. They aren't more or less criminal than non-refugees. It's just that the majority of refugees is limited to this demographic.
Germany has a refugee problem. But this problem isn't the actual refugees. It's the general mentality here that a refugee will
a) rape your children
b) rob your home
c) steal your job
And do you know what the conclusion is? Putting them into ghettos. Instead of spreading the refugees equally, to allow them to actually live and get integrated, we keep them in secluded camps and prison-like refugee shelters. Not in my backyard! They aren't even allowed to work. They have no money, boredom makes up most of their day. They are young and male to boot. What do you think will happen, if you throw 300 jobless males into a prison environment in a 500 inhabitants village? Do you actually think that would be different if those men where from [insert whatever industry nation you like] instead?
It's not the refugees that are the problem. It's how we, as a society, deal with them. Refugees in most developed countries are just a glorified kind of prisoner. A thing we just keep for as long as we have to before returning it to the origin.
Why? Because the government failed to provide sufficient shelter or a working system to handle refugees.
And why that? Because the right wing parties are still going strong in germany.
Sheesh. I wanted this thread to not be about refugees...
My german is a bit rusty, so I'll have a hard time reading that
Again, I'm not sure about Germany but here are some statistics from Denmark:
Note that this is in Danish so you probably don't understand it. But it shows the crime rates of immigrants and their descendants vs ethnic "Danes" (I call it this because I don't know what else to call them. Immigrant/descendants are actually Danes as well if they have a Danish passport, but this is the only way I can define them) and immigrants are clearly overrepresented.
The first one shows % of actual prosecutions in 2010. Not per capita, but actual prosecutions. Since there are a lot more "Danes" than immigrants in Denmark I find it scary that 50% of rape cases are by immigrants and almost 40% of robberies and attempted manslaughter as well. This should be much lower. And the whole "most of them are young men" doesn't apply, since this is immigrants and their descendants. Even if it wasn't the numbers should still be much lower when you think about the ratio of immigrants vs "Danes".
The second one is crime rates for men. Gray line is ethnic "Danes". Dark green is descendants of western country immigrants. Dark blue is western country immigrants. Light blue is non-western country immigrants and finally light green is descendants of non western immigrants.
As you yourself point out most crime is by below 30 males. And immigrants/descendants are clearly over-represented within that demographic.
Of course this includes all immigrants, not only refugees. But many of the "immigrants" (again, they are technically Danish) we have now are refugees or descendants of refugees.
So I respectfully disagree. We, my country at least, do have a problem with immigrants. And ignoring the problem and calling people racists doesn't make it go away.
I apologize for going off-topic, my initial problem with what you wrote was that when a refugee comes to a western country everybody hates them for no reason. And this is simply not true.
I think people who straight up hate refugees are really in the minority. I know I don't. Rather we have a lot of people who think like I do, that this is an actual issue and we should do something about it. But whenever we bring it up we get accused of racism and hating refugees.
I know you didn't accuse me of this but some people do when discussing this topic, so I want to make something clear: I am not a racist. I have two younger sisters adopted from Vietnam and Ethiopia respectively and I am married to a Chinese woman. Calling me racist would imply that I see myself as superior to my sisters and my wife because I am white. This is quite frankly insulting.
The article you posted about that camp does indeed look awful. Can I ask, is that a refugee camp or do they actually live like that after they get a residence permit? Mostly the refugee camps in DK are for refugees whose residence permit application is being worked on or people who have acually been denied a residence permit.
Because that is not how anyone lives in Denmark. We have some of the best welfare in the world and anyone should feel lucky to be able to live there and enjoy that welfare. Anyone who gets a residence permit get exactly the same rights and welfare as a Dane would. Nothing is stopping immigrants from getting a free education and getting a job other than themselves. Certainly not the system.
Of course everyone is different. I've had friends who are immigrants and I've known immigrants who would beat someone up for looking at their shoes. And the same goes for ethnic "Danes". So saying that all immigrants are criminals is of course foolish. But so is denying that there is a problem. Ignoring it doesn't make it go away.
Sweden is another place that has this problem. Violent crimes has increased by 300% and it's been called the Rape Capital of the west. The increasing crime rates happens to coincide with the increase in immigration. It might be a coincidence, but I really don't think so.
Immigration
Reported crimes
Rapes
Attempted murder/manslaughter
Again, really sorry for going off-topic here. But to be fair you brought up the issue in the first place
Also thanks for being civil about this. Often when I have discussions like this the other party will call me racist, fascist, callous and all kinds of unpleasant adjectives.
Turn on the TV, turn on the radio, check the internet for any important news or instruction from the government.
Pack important belongs in ready-to-go bags so that I can be ready to go immediately if the government orders an evacuation of my area.
Draw some money from the ATM if possible so that I'll be able to trade later on if I lose access to electronic funds. Store some petrol if possible. Get some canned food and drink.
Further I'll go about my day as normal while taking into consideration all government advice.
From what I've seen in videos of war in Syria and Ukraine, besides it obviously being nothing like video games, the whole affair is rather slow. Two sides getting into safe locations across from each other and trading shots for a week. There's usually enough time for civilians to evacuate a combat zone before the fighting starts. And if you see soldiers barricading in your street, it's probably time for you to leave.
I won't take a weapon with. The vast majority of people I'll meet will be chilled and scared like me, too scared to try to steal from another. The small minority of bandits that inevitably spawn in such a situation will be more of a natural disaster to avoid. If I meet them, a weapon won't save me. More likely a weapon will get me killed. Just surrender immediately, give them whatever they want and hopefully they'll let you go on your way.
But I'm lucky, since I'm male. Women are very likely to get raped in such a situation.
Anyway if the war drags on to the point where society and economy collapses entirely, I'll try to find a nearby war band and offer my services as a technician. Once again I'm rather lucky in that regard as I have skills most people don't. In a situation where money loses its value, skills have great worth.
Just my experience on the refugee issue in South Africa, where I Live:
Since Zimbabwe's (neighbouring country) economic issues about a decade ago, we've had a constant influx of Zimbabwean refugees. They, along with immigrants from other African countries, often get jobs and start shops. Local politicians like to blame them for "stealing jobs", and have fueled a massive xenophobia problem. Every few years it becomes a crisis where immigrants (both illegal and legal) get killed and assaulted just for being an immigrant.
But my experience of Zimbabwean immigrants: they are some of the nicest people I've ever met. Extremely hardworking, friendly, good command of the English language. Most violent crime is still done by locals, even though they love to blame immigration.
I think an immigrant that's been given a second chance in another country is more eager to work hard to stay there.
Just some anecdotal evidence of course, I don't have any links to stats.
Good idea to keep the immigrant discussion in hidden tags @ruleofiron!
This makes it optional for everyone else contributing here to the actual topic, but still allows us to discuss this (very related) topic!
@Tauer: thanks for actually showing statistics. This goes a long way in having a serious discussion about this. I appreciate that. And I have to admit if those statistics are true, then indeed there is a problem. However, it is so multi-layered, that we can't just reduce it to "throw them out as fast as possible". It's rather a problem of properly integrating refugees.
Again, I'm talking about germany here... the situation is probably a lot different to denmark, simply because germany is much larger than denmark and a number of several tenthousand refugees weights a lot stronger in your country than it would do for us.
But no matter what, I assume one thing is the same for both denmark and germany: refugees are held like prisoneers. And I'm not sure if this will actually encourage lawful behaviour, especially if you aren't even allowed to work, even if you wanted to.
The camp from the article is a temporary refugee camp that was formed because all regular refugee shelters (you know, those prison-like buildings with barb-wire walls) are currently at they limits. I suspect it's here to stay, as the government is literally doing nothing, riding it out until the EU immigration laws allow us to deport them back home.
The statistics you've shown are not about refugees, actually, if I understood it right. It's about (legal) immigrants and the origin of immigrants. And it actually shows something fundamentally different, if we read between the lines:
Think about this... why is it that the highest crime rates are actually not caused by immigrants, but by their children?
This is because there is a strong connection between the average wealth and crime rates. This shows a problem of bad integration, not actually a problem of mentality. Descendants of immigrants find themselves in poverty and unemployment. And while their immigrating parents are mostly thankful for actually being able to live in that country, their descendants grew up with the privilegued children, seeing the giant gap between the white middleclass and themselves.
The statistics from sweden you linked have not much value, imho. They are way too long-term to actually display anything but a change in politics. 2012 is just way too different from 1975. This is a change of two generations; it's hard to find any correlation between immigrants and crime there, especially seeing the enormous amount of fluctuation in immigrants since then. Feels like a statistic that got twisted by someone with an agenda to me.
The number of rape victims seems unnaturally high to me. So high in fact that I don't think this is related to anything that has to do with immigration or refugees. Rather, I suspect a difference in how the statistics are made or how the security system works. Remember that only registered rape cases are considered. There might be a system or law in place in this country that makes this more public or just enables the legislative to be more proactive.
Remember the following: a crime is only a crime if someone reports it. The expected dark figure for rape cases is very high (70-80%), as the majority of perpetrators are family members or neighbours, but a rape crime can only be persecuted if the victim itself reports the crime. Possibly, sweden has a system that allows anyone to report rape crimes, not only the victim; combined with a larger public awareness. It might be that the difference in numbers does not stem from an actual difference of crime cases, just from a difference in the dark figure.
At least this goes to show that I'd probably be killed by some of my own group if I looked out of my window and war had begun, they'd think I'd have went mad.
Seeing as my chance to accomplish my dreams is gone I would just go live in the mountains, if I can escape there, possibly, with my best friends and family and play D&D and Magic, build a house, farm crops, etc. Life will suck ass though. Not that it generally doesn't.
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