Opinions on: Serbia v.s Albania football match

[knight26]

Heya everyone, as some of you may already know, I'm albanian, among the few in the site.
If you've followed sports recently, you might have heard of this little noisy disturbance in the Uefa champions league. Quite a lot has been unraveled as of today, with many videos on youtube, and pictures.
I'd really like to see a Serbians point of view of this event, but please let's keep racism/nationalism out of this, just clear, on point opinions.
I'd like to know the reaction of a non-racist, open-minded, out in the world Serbian to the recent event.

Why I care about this, you might ask?
Because if we're to ever have true compassion for one another, we'll need to understand each others perspectives, and make compromises where due.

 

[Animalpower]

I live in Serbia.
It didn't go unnoticed in the media. It is bad to mix football with politics.
As I watched this show, the flag was so offensive to Serbs because it shows the so called "Greater Albania" including the heart of Serbia which is Kosovo
to me such idea is created by delusional nationalists and megalomaniacs.
It is probably caused by albanians who want to humiliate serbian reputation.

 

[knight26]

I live in Serbia.
It didn't go unnoticed in the media. It is bad to mix football with politics.
As I watched this show, the flag was so offensive to Serbs because it shows the so called "Greater Albania" including the heart of Serbia which is Kosovo
to me such idea is created by delusional nationalists and megalomaniacs.
It is probably caused by albanians who want to humiliate serbian reputation.

^Thank you.
Well you see, we come to disagree in a few things. Although I do agree in that it may have appeared as offensive, and hit the nerve of every proud Serbian. But what bothered me more than anything is the following:
Was all the "Kill all the albanians, slaughter them, so there are no more" chanting necessary?. And those were prior to the flag being flown.
So I ask you this: Why harbor such hatred?

I felt disturbed, afraid, agitated. Just listening to thousands of voices (not only members of 'ultras' or 'grobari', but everyone, females, children) scream "slaughter every last albanian until there are no more" gave me all the reasons I lacked to have a bad opinion about Serbians.
Honestly, never before have I felt insulted. I knew it was bad, sometimes. But never to this extent. I can promise you this, had the things been the other way around, which you will have the chance to see in the return game. We wouldn't wish for your death, this I can assure you.
I hope you come to realize that it is our generation with the power in hand to change things as soon as possible. We need not hold hatred any longer, perhaps disagreement, but compassion.
And you say that this is over Kosovo?. That is not true at all, you never cared about Kosovo to begin with, even before independence. What changed after?

 

[Dr Super Good]

Who cares? It is football for crying out loud. I think being blind might be more interesting than watching it...

 

[knight26]

Who cares? It is football for crying out loud. I think being blind might be more interesting than watching it...

LOL, alright that's a nice point. But the thing is, what happened was everything but football that day. Unfortunately , I hoped for a nice, peaceful game...
You might not understand how tense things are between our countries, I wish it weren't so.

 

[Animalpower]

^Thank you.
Well you see, we come to disagree in a few things. Although I do agree in that it may have appeared as offensive, and hit the nerve of every proud Serbian. But what bothered me more than anything is the following:
Was all the "Kill all the albanians, slaughter them, so there are no more" chanting necessary?. And those were prior to the flag being flown.
So I ask you this: Why harbor such hatred?

I felt disturbed, afraid, agitated. Just listening to thousands of voices (not only members of 'ultras' or 'grobari', but everyone, females, children) scream "slaughter every last albanian until there are no more" gave me all the reasons I lacked to have a bad opinion about Serbians.
Honestly, never before have I felt insulted. I knew it was bad, sometimes. But never to this extent. I can promise you this, had the things been the other way around, which you will have the chance to see in the return game. We wouldn't wish for your death, this I can assure you.
I hope you come to realize that it is our generation with the power in hand to change things as soon as possible. We need not hold hatred any longer, perhaps disagreement, but compassion.
And you say that this is over Kosovo?. That is not true at all, you never cared about Kosovo to begin with, even before independence. What changed after?

I was not affected negatively by the football game. Both Serbs and Albanians have backward mentalities and are nationalistic people and I don't generalize that. I had predicted that the game will not end very well. Why do you think Serbs always say KOSOVO IS SERBIA? Its independent now thanks to the Tito and Milosevic regime. The idea of Greater Albania seems backward to me.

Words like "Kill all albanians, slaughter them" happened because the serbs felt provoked and humiliated. One serbian player tried to get the flag and a albanian player tried to attack him. I don't have anything against albanians and I never been to Kosovo, so I don't care.

 

[gorillabull]

they need to use gypsy for slave labor

 

[knight26]

I was not affected negatively by the football game. Both Serbs and Albanians have backward mentalities and are nationalistic people and I don't generalize that. I had predicted that the game will not end very well. Why do you think Serbs always say KOSOVO IS SERBIA? Its independent now thanks to the Tito and Milosevic regime. The idea of Greater Albania seems backward to me.

Words like "Kill all albanians, slaughter them" happened because the serbs felt provoked and humiliated. One serbian player tried to get the flag and a albanian player tried to attack him. I don't have anything against albanians and I never been to Kosovo, so I don't care.

Exactly, there's a nationalistic mentality on both sides, for reasons, I presume.
But isn't it about time we try to recover from that mentality instead of raising new generations with the same hatred?. This is my main point.
Let's not go to politics because I can assure you Milosevic didn't bode well for our nation. Tito on the other hand was a mastermind, had the same regime continued, things today would've been very differently.

That's how you see it, I suppose. And to an extent I agree that the albanian players shouldn't have moved to protect the flag, but that wasn't the reason people pouring into the stadium and throwing punches, it all started before the flag. With flares, objects, being thrown on the stadium. And hateful chanting throughout the entire game.

And one more thing, there is NO such thing as 'greater albania' project. It was a mere provocation, and the serbians fell for it... I suppose things would've been similar vice versa. It's left to be seen in the return game, here's hoping albanians to be a better host.

And lastly, I don't judge people by their national heritage, or other arbitrary things with little to no value to an individuals personality and character.

 

[Mechanical Man]

1. There is no place for a drone above football match. What if the controller loses control and the drone falls on the head of players? A drone must be registered to be allowed to fly above stadium and having precise tasks.
2. The flag was not even of Albania. Imagine if such flag of pre Ribbentrop-Molotov appeared above polish stadium. Or just a palestian flag with Israel playing. I would be a slaughter. I think that Serbians reacted quite cool. You must know that showing there this flag was worse than Nazi flag.
3. Albanian players aggressively rushed to take the flag hitting Mitrović, who just wanted to grab it and give it to officials, not tearing or burning it. Fortunately, there were no serious fighting. After that I understand the did not want to continue as they showed absolutely no professionality.

 

[VeljkoM]

That is not true at all, you never cared about Kosovo to begin with, even before independence. What changed after?

Can you really say this to the people that lived there and had to move out? Yes there actually were Serbs living in Kosovo, besides now those two small regions and ghetos. People who left from there obviously have no love for Albanians and then they spread their feelings to others and thus the hatred spreads. Yeah of course regular guy didn't care and had no reason to care but add nationalism and the 90s and you get the hatred. For Albanians it is just Kosovo, for Serbs it is systematic degradation of nation from fall of Yugo, Kosovo and if that was enough also the problems in Sandzak and Vojvodina. We are paranoid at this moment and bitter (and false information doesn't help). The hatred isn't unreasonable, but that doesn't mean it is right.

Anyway regarding match it is simple. Albanians shouldn't have provoked and Serbians shouldn't have responded the way they did. Though I didn't expect anything less from football fans. they are unreasonable regarding any matter. Heck each city has gangs that exist for sole reason to attack opponents of their football club (and side job criminal of course).

We wouldn't wish for your death

You personally wouldn't but some would, same as I don't ever chant while clearly many Serbs do. Like that message Albanians send to Bosnia and Serbia during the summer floods.

Image

 

[knight26]

I suppose there's two side of the coin on each story and both reasonably accurate at the same time.
@Mechanical Man, seriously? Didn't you see that the outrageous behavior was going on even before the drone being flown onto the field. There were literally objects and flares being thrown into the pitch from the beginning of the game, since 8-th second of the start to be precise.
And one player had a broken nose, you think that is low determination?.
As you failed to see the point, it was not only about the game. What concerns me is the overall hatred going on.

@Veljkom, This is exactly what I wanted to hear, a serious yet accurate comment from a Serbian, as a proud Serbian. It is very objective, I appreciate it.
This makes me understand the situation from a serbians perspective. And as I said before, it is the only way to come to true compassion and empathy if we're to ever have it.
And why should I concern myself with this so much? Well my profession is the most humane, and as such we've come to face and work together with many nations in my field of work, including serbians. It's safe to say that behind the curtain of old hatreds, we're much more alike than you'd agree. After all, we are neighbors.
In my opinion it is a waste of potential, and it is being controlled by the first world countries to their interests. As the recent visit of Putin in Serbia proved that there are two front being created, if war ever strikes, it will be here. BOTH sides will suffer the consequences, while the true evil minds hide safely. My only wish is to avoid such predicament...

 

[VeljkoM]

I have no doubt that Albanians are very similar to Serbians and if the history was kinder we would have been friends. In the middle ages as far as I know we didn't have the animosity at least nothing like now, heck in the Kosovo battle that Serbs like to talk about, Albanians fought on Serbian side while some Serbs were already with Turks. If I have to guess (I need facts to back up what comes next) it started when people converted to Islam and during the rebellions the Islam worshipers were treated same as Ottoman Turks which means as the enemy, a thing to be hated. This of course means that it was Serbians who first started the hatred against Slavic Muslim and Albanians. Naturally threatened by Serbs these groups that remained in now no longer Islam dominated lands felt scared and angry at Serbs. They were then exploited by outside forces like Austrians for the Bosnia (all Muslim there in general) and Italians for Albanians. After the World Wars have ended the relations were more civilized but then came 90s with the outbursts of nationalism (ALL of them) that ruined everything and even now manipulate all people on Balkans.

What I myself want is stop to nationalism and more united Balkan, a federation/confederation. All Balkans not just Slavs but also Albanians, Greeks and even Romanians. Instead we were and still are and probably will be puppets to world powers who don't give, shit about us (and why should they when we don't care about ourselves?).

As the current situation goes I am just waiting for all of us to become banana republics to EU since we are more busy being nationalist rather then fixing our nations we are soo proud of. Screw who owns Kosovo or who we play sports against when we can't earn money for basic human needs. Also sorry for bringing politics and nationalism in the topic but it can't be avoided.

 

[knight26]

I have no doubt that Albanians are very similar to Serbians and if the history was kinder we would have been friends. In the middle ages as far as I know we didn't have the animosity at least nothing like now, heck in the Kosovo battle that Serbs like to talk about, Albanians fought on Serbian side while some Serbs were already with Turks. If I have to guess (I need facts to back up what comes next) it started when people converted to Islam and during the rebellions the Islam worshipers were treated same as Ottoman Turks which means as the enemy, a thing to be hated. This of course means that it was Serbians who first started the hatred against Slavic Muslim and Albanians. Naturally threatened by Serbs these groups that remained in now no longer Islam dominated lands felt scared and angry at Serbs. They were then exploited by outside forces like Austrians for the Bosnia (all Muslim there in general) and Italians for Albanians. After the World Wars have ended the relations were more civilized but then came 90s with the outbursts of nationalism (ALL of them) that ruined everything and even now manipulate all people on Balkans.

What I myself want is stop to nationalism and more united Balkan, a federation/confederation. All Balkans not just Slavs but also Albanians, Greeks and even Romanians. Instead we were and still are and probably will be puppets to world powers who don't give, shit about us (and why should they when we don't care about ourselves?).

As the current situation goes I am just waiting for all of us to become banana republics to EU since we are more busy being nationalist rather then fixing our nations we are soo proud of. Screw who owns Kosovo or who we play sports against when we can't earn money for basic human needs. Also sorry for bringing politics and nationalism in the topic but it can't be avoided.

You're information is as accurate as it gets. In fact, our most notorious leader Skenderberg, who is also the 7-th ranked leader that history knows, had his son marry a Serbian duchess, to further tighten the alliance. I should also mention that the territories had no boundaries as they do today, they were simply called regions, and everyone did as they pleased. It was the battle of Niš, where the armies you mentioned battled against the Ottoman empire, and came victorious, with the ottoman full retreat.
It was many years later when Ottomans retake the territory, which triggered nations to be divided, especially by religion. <- A very clever plan of the Ottomans, to avoid another uprising like the last time. Effective? TO THIS DAY.
^ But that is all part of history, goes without saying how much people, on both sides, neglect. Only to justify their interchangeable hatred.

"and why should they when we don't care about ourselves?" -- this is where I was getting at. Blind, unproductive people. On both sides. THAT is the main issue here, nothing else.
Things remain as they are, in a constant loop. We always remain second world countries, only because we seek refugee from others, and not do something about it ourselves.
It's a gap that the first world countries know all too well, they brought this situation to begin with.
I suppose many years from now, into the far future, our nations will look back at this and laugh at how stupid their predecessors have been. Till then, let's blame each other for arbitrary things that belong to the past.

 

[Mechanical Man]

UEFA mafia bullshit, the match should be repeated, not this crap of awarding 3:0 and victorious team getting 0 points, I always wanted to see who is actually better, Serbia or Albania, Albania playing some good matches lately. Even though I prefer Serbia over Albania, I would congratulate with Albania if they won, but now I still do not know who is better. Now the worst happened to Albania, then Serbia, and the best to Portugal, Denmark and Armenia. It is sad for Albania for this immature provocation, which destroyed their chance to win over Serbia, just minutes before the incident, Albania had two excellent chances and Serbia was dropping in form. This will return like a boomerang, when they will need those points to reach third or even second place.

 

[knight26]

Mechanical Man, what's sad from this whole situation, it is that sport suffered the consequences of a few immature people. I'm very sorry likewise, it was the only moment we could compete and not be asshole about it. Let's hope the return game to be better

 

[Mechanical Man]

That game better to be without spectators if we want to hope at least one match.

 

[MasterHaosis]

Simple as is:
They came to our capital city showing disrespect with that drone and flag of great Albania (for those whose do not know, Great Albania is something when you took part of Montenegro, Macedonia, Serbia and Greece) and promoted it via drone.
When our players tried to catch drone, when they took that flag, Albanian players started to run aggressively towards our players in order to fight with them physically. That behavior annoyed our supporters (our own Serbian football fanatics, thanks to whose we got punished several times already, I actually call them morons because normal people just go to support their own team in civil manner, not trying to join in craps and bullshits), then they went aggressively into terrain to fight with Albanian players in turn.
They started to throw fireworks and other craps, as well yelling various nationalistic stuff, as expected from morons. Thats why I always watch our matches form home via television.
But, even crazier that could be, guy whose control drone was brother of Albanian premier, in VIP part. it was fully recorded how he is controlling that drone.
So knight26 is correct that our fools were yelling all time nationalistic stuff, but he forgot that actually his people, or at least giant part of them were celebrating in Kosovo and Albania, in their capitals how they managed to ,,trickĆ Serbia with that drone. it was public celebration on streets which is also moronic behavior. They could not beat them in match, but its not matter since they will find another reason to celebrate ,,that drone" which supposed to be pride of Albanian airforce. Believe me, it is fact that people did not send live man at first place in Moon, they sent animals and drones. So in this case, they must send drone to make sure that it can rich air. So in expect alive Albanian pilot in plane, they proved that this can be possible in near future. They just made themselves fools in world's eyes aswell with our own ,,fans". Those aren't Serbs. Real Serbs are watching football matches peaceful, only brainless monkeys would be hooligans where whole world can watch their behavior.
Overall, Albanians started it first, provoked, made shits, we overreacted in turn, created craps aswell in turn, therefore as result both of sides will suffer. That is for sure.

 

[Gilles]

Who cares? It is football for crying out loud. I think being blind might be more interesting than watching it...

Blasphemy. Someone ban this guy.



People take sports wayyyyy too seriously. It's a shame that FIFA is such a terrible organization. They have the opportunity to try and change things, but they're only interested in money.

 

[E.M.C]

I apologize in advance for not reading all of the replies as of typing this, anyway I have watched this game and boy, was it quite a show or what. Here's my two cents about it all, and a detailed analysis of all the events that transpired from a neutral point of view:

1. Before the controversial drone and a flag incident, supporters were already cheering some nasty stuff like "kill the Albanian" and "kill the Croat" (even though we had no involvement in this match whatsoever). Unfortunately, this kind of cheering has become commonplace around these parts so much that we stopped paying any attention to it (though it's peculiar how none of the Serbian media even mentioned it).

2. Let's not kid ourselves here, the hooligans in the stadium were waiting for any sort of excuse to charge. Do you really thing they knew what the flag said? It could have been the flag of Albania or Croatia or Kosovo, the outcome would have been the same.

3. The Albanian players acted deplorably, and they should have been punished for trying to start a fight. On the other hand Serbian players were very cool headed about the whole situation.

4. It is amazing how the breach managed to happen at all, given how much security were in the stadium, and given how everyone knew that this was going to be a high-risk event before it even began. This was a major fail for Serbia as the facilitator of the match. It was also a major fail on UEFA's part, for putting Albania and Serbia in the same group anyway, but separating the likes of Gibraltar and Spain which makes no sense whatsoever.

5. The Albanian side were just waiting for something like this to happen. They could have resumed the match, but didn't. The solomonic solution by UEFA is another thing that makes no sense. The fairest outcome would be for a rematch in a neutral location, while fining both parties like they did.

 

[Chaosy]

 

[knight26]

I apologize in advance for not reading all of the replies as of typing this, anyway I have watched this game and boy, was it quite a show or what. Here's my two cents about it all, and a detailed analysis of all the events that transpired from a neutral point of view:

1. Before the controversial drone and a flag incident, supporters were already cheering some nasty stuff like "kill the Albanian" and "kill the Croat" (even though we had no involvement in this match whatsoever). Unfortunately, this kind of cheering has become commonplace around these parts so much that we stopped paying any attention to it (though it's peculiar how none of the Serbian media even mentioned it).

2. Let's not kid ourselves here, the hooligans in the stadium were waiting for any sort of excuse to charge. Do you really thing they knew what the flag said? It could have been the flag of Albania or Croatia or Kosovo, the outcome would have been the same.

3. The Albanian players acted deplorably, and they should have been punished for trying to start a fight. On the other hand Serbian players were very cool headed about the whole situation.

4. It is amazing how the breach managed to happen at all, given how much security were in the stadium, and given how everyone knew that this was going to be a high-risk event before it even began. This was a major fail for Serbia as the facilitator of the match. It was also a major fail on UEFA's part, for putting Albania and Serbia in the same group anyway, but separating the likes of Gibraltar and Spain which makes no sense whatsoever.

5. The Albanian side were just waiting for something like this to happen. They could have resumed the match, but didn't. The solomonic solution by UEFA is another thing that makes no sense. The fairest outcome would be for a rematch in a neutral location, while fining both parties like they did.

That's an excellent view of the situation. Well said and thought.
After the situation has cooled down for a bit, I've also come to understand that the albanian players had no reason whatsoever to go ahead and act. They should've remained calm and ignorant to the hooligans.
The fairest outcome would be for a rematch in a neutral location <-- this is what I absolutely agree with.

 

[MasterHaosis]

After the situation has cooled down for a bit, I've also come to understand that the albanian players had no reason whatsoever to go ahead and act. They should've remained calm and ignorant to the hooligans.

Exactly! As I said before, because of those hooligans I do not go to stadium to watch football. They are always yelling against government, other nations, races etc etc...
Well, its not in Serbia's case, its in almost everyone's case. Hooligans are everywhere in each country more or less. But this is not excuse to my country, if everyone eats shits this will not justified me to eat it aswell, not even means that I should start eating.
I do not care if other countries have such problems, I want my place to be calmed and purged from them. I want to be peaceful.

With other side, about Albanian players. They act like completely villagers who have been living whole time on those high mountains and never ever seen city or anything else aside from animals. And you give them elegant suit, shave them, wash them, move them to city... and yet again, they will treat city as their mountain ,and behave like that. In Serbia we have old sentence for that ,,you can escape from village, but village cannot escape from you" They need to be educated how to behave on international matches.

knight26, look just at Serbian players, in past, due to their behavior and behavior of hooligans in past, our country have been punished and suspended several times hardly, thats why our players are civilized.
knight26, and no, its not just case of our representation, our national clubs also got punished many times, mostly because of hooligans, look just at Partizan and Crvena Zvezda.
And you should agree that not just our countries are problematic, but whole Balkan is problematic. We need to change our mentality if we want to have any improvements, or we are doomed.

The fairest outcome would be for a rematch in a neutral location <-- this is what I absolutely agree with.

I completely agree with that statement. Lets have match in Germany, France, UK, Italy, whatever EU country with their own security and protection and we will be fine. And as Gilles and some other people mentioned, corruption of UEF is big, I am not going even to talk about that.

 

[Misha]

uh.. that provocation was not something any of us needed.., i saw only the news footage for a bit before the TV station was 'scrambled' .. presuming by shiptar hackers.. so everyone in the news crew was looking stunned or something..

not much more that i can say tho.. because you know that i have been hostile towards you in quite a lot of occasions, Knight. A lot of you are just Bashi-bazouks to me. sorry that i cannot be unbiased