Unit War v9

[Moderator]

21:58, 9th Jul 2014
Hell_Master: Map approved with a rating of 4/5 quoting SCN's detailed review:

Show

Official THW Review (UPDATED)
OLD VERSION REVIEW IS HERE IN SINGLE POST: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/maps-564/unit-war-254264/#post2552180

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RATINGS

Unit War (VERSION 3)

Gameplay: 15/20 (Up +3)
Terrain: 7/10 (Up +1)
Scenery: 7/10 (Up +2
Consistency: 3/5 (Up +1)
Presentation: 4/5
Total Score: 36/50 (Up +7 from version 0)

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FEEDBACK

Gameplay: Since the 2 updates, many questionable and unneeded units were removed, as there is an excess of them. RontoKing has done a better job in reducing the gameplay time where you pick units, and now focus on strategy more.

The game still holds 4 gold mines, which can trouble newcomers. In FFA it is a fierce fight for gold in the beginning, which would eliminate around half at the 15 minute mark. I team scenarios, only some will have the pleasure of actually earning money. You could eliminate this problem by players giving away gold, but that's just a hassle. My solution would be to have all players to have a steady income (via triggers). I really like the idea , as it will actually let some players still be in the fight, but not as close to how powerful the holder of the goldmine gets.

It would be really nice to put the only put a category of units in one. For example, I would put casters (if too much caster 1 & 2), siege, heavy melee, light melee (Or just melee 1 & 2), special (Builders, Air, etc), and standard range, in there own respective barracks with names, because I still haven't memorized where are the units are, causing me to waste a good 20-30 seconds finding a unit and choosing a unit. This is just my solution for if you want to organize the units more. Nevertheless, the gameplay is now a lot more fluent and a slightly more organized.

15/20


Terrain: The terrain is slightly more improved, with grass near the trees and a small design in the brick tiles. Tile variation is average.

7/10


Scenery: Doodads were placed carefully around the edges of the map, near the trees. Mainly flowers, many people just spam flowers all over the map. It looks a lot better, and they match with the grass.

The middle looks a lot more arsenic also. The cinematic helped put a theme on the map. Nice improvement here.

8/10


Consistency: Although you still don't have the hotkey indicators up, I'm raising a point because the map description does say the abilities use Q. This is still trouble if you haven't downloaded this from hive (I.E epic war, battle.net etc.).

Still no bugs detected or missing ability, unit, and building descriptions.

4/5


Presentation: Again, the description not using a template actually tells me what I'm going into, it's not one of the best descriptions, but it's done correctly. Versions shouldn't be 123, should be 1.2a -> 1.3c or some sort. I'm not taking a point off for it. Please also add the version when you type in the file and map to avoid confusion! It will also help if you want to find a specific version if you want to start over or some sort. Use save as and type it in.

4/5

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VERDICT

For the map to be put out for public, it must follow the http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/rules-information-710/map-submission-rules-228244/, lucky you, all rules are followed from update VERSION 3. I vote for APPROVAL

SCORE: 3.6/5.0
-Map Reviewer SCN

 

[StoPCampinGn00b]

Official THW Review (OLD)
NEW VERSION REVIEW IS HERE IN SINGLE POST: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/maps-564/unit-war-254264/#post2553394

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RATINGS

Unit War (VERSION 0)

A non footman wars arena strategy created by RontoKing


Gameplay: 12/20
Terrain: 6/10
Scenery: 5/10
Consistency: 2/5
Presentation: 4/5
Total Score: 29/50

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FEEDBACK

Gameplay: I will start with this, the game is entertainment! It's rather fun but very questionable at the same time. Some units are just very useless, while others will put you great position. The biggest problem with the gameplay is that there is just an excess of units on the field. Your 84 units do all have purposes, but many of them act for the same purpose, regardless of their abilities.

I tested every single unit myself after winning a match against my brother 1v1. Here is a list of units and groups of units that I feel have little worth compared to their "clone" unit.

Tank (Already have Catapults and Raiders)
Warder & Lookout (Ghost is the only invisible, I would think ghosts would like to see other ghosts)
Raider (Has the same purpose as robber, to attack buildings with melee. I suggest you fuse them together)
Chosen (There are lots of melee units out there, and mass divine shields are very OP)
Survivor (One of the weaker of the melee units with an ability that doesn't help all to much)
Warlord (One of the many basic melee units, low damage and fast attack speed compared to average/average does not make a difference.)
Type Changer (This one isn't too bad, but it is too hard to micro)
Warrior (Basic melee explanation, melee unit with crit)
Gargoyle (Similar to the eagle, just with stoneform. But also similar to flying machine. It's like a merger between those too.)
Cannibal (Basic melee unit, just with cannibalize)
Fighter (Same, just with evasion)
Various Aura generals (It's not forbidden, but it's a pain to get a bunch of aura generals with one aura stacked on them)
Various Healers (I counted 4, you don't need 4. 1 or 2 is fine, add the abilities to your favorites)

Those are the important ones that I really feel need to be taken out, or merged. There are many more, I didn't put much range because they do offer a little more variety. But keep in mind, don't make the same units with the tiniest variations. It's just waste of time for the player to look at all of them. It would also help to balance the units a lot more!

The idea of the center is actually really cool. I'm not very fond of 12 players fighting over 4 gold mines, I understand teams can share gold, or it's because to eliminate the slower ones. But that will just make people leave so fast and workers will die every few seconds. The idea can stay, but I'm not a fan of it.

Towers aren't too strong, but a cap on how many towers would be really nice. 20 lumber is too cheap also.

The organization of the barracks is not very good though. I would really like it if the barracks were catagorized named different things, like special, caster, range, melee, air, workers, etc. But if that's too much work, I understand.

The gameplay is playable but very flawed. 12/20


Terrain: Since the map represents an arena like setting, the tiles don't have to be mixed as much. But in this arena, there is just too much cityscape brick. Designs around the middle would make it a lot less boring, black marble looks really good with brick. Under the trees should be grass. Cliffs in the bases look odd, but I'm not lowering the score from that.

As for the layout, it's balanced enough. The corners aren't actually as trapped in as I expected. The fight for the middle thing works!
6/10


Scenery: The feel and look of the map is kind of dull unless you're in a huge battle with the projectiles flying around. I know many doodads will get in the way, but you can add a few shrubs and flowers near the grass and trees.

It's also possible to decorate the middle. Maybe even give it a king of the hill like setting where it makes (or just makes it look like) whoever controls the middle controls a lot.

1/10 (Very plain and barren)


Consistency: No bugs. But, so many hotkeys are missing. I know they aren't mandatory but it was so rough microing casters and such. Good job on making the unit descriptions though.

2/5


Presentation: Your description actually shows me what I'm going into unlike others who just give random features. It may not be pretty, but it's a nice description.
4/5

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VERDICT

For the map to be put out for public, it must follow the http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/rules-information-710/map-submission-rules-228244/

SCORE: 2.9/5.0 Only three things standing in the way of approval.

1. You did not mention that the map is open source allowed to be edited, open source but need permission for edit or protected.
2. You need a version and changelog. For example: Version 0.01a: uploaded, 0.02b: major gameplay changes, sniper unit nerfed, etc.
3. Quality is very borderline. Some would say yes and some would say no. Gameplay has the biggest impact on a map's quality, I would think most would think that. If you have a low rating on scenery, that is okay.

Please notify me when you update or if you want to correct me on the review. +(2) Reputation for your hard work RontoKing! (http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/site-discussion-97/reputation-faq-94520/)
-SCN

[DISCLAIMER] I am not part of the Hive Workshop staff. Just one of the few map reviewers here on hive to help moderators! If you wish to become a map reviewer, have a chat with -kobas-

 

[RontoKing]

First of all, thank you for the very detailed and thought out review, StoPCampinGn00b.
I updated the map with some terrain changes and I added that changelog and mentioned that it's not protected.

I'm planning on changing the units but first I need your opinion about what I currently plan on changing.

The tank is meant to be more durable than the catapult at the cost of speed. If I further increase it's health do you think it would be viable?
I'm probably not going to remove the Warder but maybe the Lookout. Also, the Ghost Wizard is also invisible.
Fusing the robber and raider seems like a good idea, but he will need to have weaker stats than the Raider.
I will just decrease the shield duration of the Chosen. I hope that works.
If buffing the Survivor's ability doesn't help I'll just remove him.
About the Warlord, I specifically made him to have a good combo with the Offensive General and Shaman. I don't think he's useless.
I don't want to change the Type Changer.
The Warrior is supposed to be the one who does the most damage with auto attacks. I kind of want to keep him as a 'basic' unit like the Defender.
I will remove the Gargoyle.
I kind of like the Cannibal, he is good with the Corpse Keeper, so I'm not sure what to do with him.
I will probably remove the Fighter because there's already the Defender.
I imagined the generals so that there's only 1 in smaller groups and all 4 in larger ones. I didn't quite understand your complaint about them, sorry.
I will most likely remove the Healer and Witch Doctor. You're right, there are too many of them.
Also, I should probably nerf the Sniper!

I'm going to leave the Towers be. I think it's good to have a strategy where you can spam them because when someone is trying to use it it leaves them open to attack in the early game because they have Lumberjack(s) that are not good in battle. This also leaves time for the opponent to summon the Demonlord or an Undead Wizard.

So what do you think? I'm looking forward to your reply!

 

[StoPCampinGn00b]

Tank: It's not that it's weak, it's that you already have a long range siege and a 2 close range/melee units mean to attack buildings.
Ghost: I meant it would be nice for the player for it to have true sight instead of separating units.
Warlords: How does the warlord to better with those units?
Generals: In most games I play, units with auras are weaker and usually there is only 1 or 2, (Attack/Move Speed and Defense)

Turtle Basing is a thing, unless you have heaps of siege units to counter. I guess it can stay.

I mostly agree/accept the other ideas you posted though.

 

[RontoKing]

I'll still keep the Tank, as it is. I will merge the Lookout with the Ghost. The Warlord has incredible attack speed and chaos damage but only around 3 damage. With the Offensive General he is attacking with 30+ chaos damage and high attack speed. With the Shaman's Bloodlust he has even higher damage per second (possibly the highest). But the combo is countered by the Banshee. The only reason I didn't just have 2 Generals is because I liked the idea of having 1 for each 'race', so, I will just let them be, maybe decrease their health because you mentioned that thy should be weak. I will update the map again soon.

 

[StoPCampinGn00b]

Remember to make the changelog while you're doing so. Also state if the map is open source.

 

[RontoKing]

Updated!
Also, forgot to mention, hotkeys for every ability are Q and W and E are for units that have more than 1 ability!

 

[StoPCampinGn00b]

Map voted for approval on my first post.

 

[RontoKing]

Version 3 is out, with an opening cinematic!

 

[StoPCampinGn00b]

Official THW Review (UPDATED)
OLD VERSION REVIEW IS HERE IN SINGLE POST: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/maps-564/unit-war-254264/#post2552180

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RATINGS

Unit War (VERSION 3)

Gameplay: 15/20 (Up +3)
Terrain: 7/10 (Up +1)
Scenery: 7/10 (Up +2
Consistency: 3/5 (Up +1)
Presentation: 4/5
Total Score: 36/50 (Up +7 from version 0)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

FEEDBACK

Gameplay: Since the 2 updates, many questionable and unneeded units were removed, as there is an excess of them. RontoKing has done a better job in reducing the gameplay time where you pick units, and now focus on strategy more.

The game still holds 4 gold mines, which can trouble newcomers. In FFA it is a fierce fight for gold in the beginning, which would eliminate around half at the 15 minute mark. I team scenarios, only some will have the pleasure of actually earning money. You could eliminate this problem by players giving away gold, but that's just a hassle. My solution would be to have all players to have a steady income (via triggers). I really like the idea , as it will actually let some players still be in the fight, but not as close to how powerful the holder of the goldmine gets.

It would be really nice to put the only put a category of units in one. For example, I would put casters (if too much caster 1 & 2), siege, heavy melee, light melee (Or just melee 1 & 2), special (Builders, Air, etc), and standard range, in there own respective barracks with names, because I still haven't memorized where are the units are, causing me to waste a good 20-30 seconds finding a unit and choosing a unit. This is just my solution for if you want to organize the units more. Nevertheless, the gameplay is now a lot more fluent and a slightly more organized.

15/20


Terrain: The terrain is slightly more improved, with grass near the trees and a small design in the brick tiles. Tile variation is average.

7/10


Scenery: Doodads were placed carefully around the edges of the map, near the trees. Mainly flowers, many people just spam flowers all over the map. It looks a lot better, and they match with the grass.

The middle looks a lot more arsenic also. The cinematic helped put a theme on the map. Nice improvement here.

8/10


Consistency: Although you still don't have the hotkey indicators up, I'm raising a point because the map description does say the abilities use Q. This is still trouble if you haven't downloaded this from hive (I.E epic war, battle.net etc.).

Still no bugs detected or missing ability, unit, and building descriptions.

4/5


Presentation: Again, the description not using a template actually tells me what I'm going into, it's not one of the best descriptions, but it's done correctly. Versions shouldn't be 123, should be 1.2a -> 1.3c or some sort. I'm not taking a point off for it. Please also add the version when you type in the file and map to avoid confusion! It will also help if you want to find a specific version if you want to start over or some sort. Use save as and type it in.

4/5

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

VERDICT

For the map to be put out for public, it must follow the http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/rules-information-710/map-submission-rules-228244/, lucky you, all rules are followed from update VERSION 3. I vote for APPROVAL

SCORE: 3.6/5.0
-Map Reviewer SCN

 

[RontoKing]

Version 4 is out and thank you for the approval!

 

[RontoKing]

Version 5 is out with some fixes and slight improvements.

 

[StoPCampinGn00b]

Awesome updates. I give the map 4 stars now. For people reading this check the changelog compared to my version 3 review. It changed some more.
EDIT: As of version 6, looks like the map is almost finalized and a lot easier for noobs to play.

 

[RontoKing]

Version 7 is out, with AI for computer players! In future versions I may add more AI strategies and combos.

 

[cleavinghammer]

Played against computer only and beat them all, but the game didn't end.

I got the impression some players start with extra units, is that the case?

You should add the shredder tooltip to say he doesn't harvest lumber at all.

 

[RontoKing]

I changed it so the game ends when you win, and also fixed up the shredder's tooltip. No, players don't start with extra units.
EDIT: The Demonlord was bugged last version(s) so I fixed him and updated the map, it's still called Version 9 because it was such a small fix.
EDIT #2: Fixed some more AI bugs, still considered version 9.