DBZ - RoTs Pre-Beta 0.5

robot-dude · 11-01-2009, 10:32 PM

Campaign was put on halt roughly around 6 odd months ago.

RED BARON · 11-03-2009, 02:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robot-dude

Campaign was put on halt roughly around 6 odd months ago.

And will / might be taken up again at some point - unless (which is likely) that this map takes up all our workforce.. A shame though as we had implemented almost every figure from DBZ in the campaign. Tien, krillin and such included.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSJ2-Trunks

I see the flying system being abused. Since you're invulnerable, it's really easy to be annoying and to fly away cowardly. Perhaps have flying drain mana

It actually does drain mana, just too little to notice.. So yea we'll tweak around with it

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSJ2-Trunks

I dunno about everyone else, but I personally think the idea of being Garlic Jr or Turles is rather interesting and a nice change from most other DBZ maps. Perhaps you could add other less used characters, such as Krillin? Tien? Yamcha? Maybe Android 16, 17, and 18. The Ginyu Force. Even Janemba would be interesting to use. Personally, I think implementing Captain Ginyu and giving him a body change would be a great idea and something that hasn't been done in a DBZ map before. He'd have to learn how to use his new body. Maybe if he gets to low health in the new body, he auto switches back or something? Just a thought.

Great! One that are on the same mindset as us. That was actually the reason why we began making the now currently on hold campaign - and we fully intend to keep some of those elements if possible in the multi version.

After all how can we work for somewhat more then 2 years without doing at is best as possible, even if wc3 have died before

robot-dude · 11-03-2009, 01:56 PM

We can have 2 more Characters in the Multiplayer Version
1 For Z and 1 For Evil so you can get deciding who you wish to be able to play as:
I was thinking of adding either Krillin or Tien for the Z Fighters and for the Evil i'm not really sure.

campaign will be started up as soon as we get this to at leaet V1, and we've improved on alot of models and understandment of triggers, and i'm able to sit down properly and create our Game Caches to work with the current wc3 patch.

SasuhKun · 12-02-2009, 03:45 PM

YAY new version. Hope it is playable this time o/ Gonna test it as soon as I can, and then I'll come here and coment about it. Good job robot-dude.

RED BARON · 12-02-2009, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

YAY new version. Hope it is playable this time o/ Gonna test it as soon as I can, and then I'll come here and comment about it. Good job robot-dude.

Of course its playable this time - We tested it on several different comps this time

SasuhKun · 12-02-2009, 07:04 PM

Erm... not so playable. Mainly it is because of the lag, and I understand why we cannot use vegeta, etc. Second, it is incredibly unbalanced. By the way, the only thing bad in my PC is my processor, which is 1.8 GHZ. Aside from that everything is really good and of high quality. By the way, it is completely unbalanced, evils get powerful in question of minutes, they're all better in general. Maybe it is because of hell... And I still can only see boxes painted as checkers of purple and black as doodads. Maybe that is the reason of the memory leak? Maybe you could simplify the doodads a bit, I don't know. The video resolution is on the maximum...

edit: Turles and Babidi got DC in the beggining, and it is worthier kill lots of weak units then some strong units, cause they all give the same stat (+1) That's a good reason for why evils are so good... and I mean it, please, fix the memory leaks somehow..

Kl3sk · 12-02-2009, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

Erm... not so playable. Mainly it is because of the lag, and I understand why we cannot use vegeta, etc. Second, it is incredibly unbalanced. By the way, the only thing bad in my PC is my processor, which is 1.8 GHZ. Aside from that everything is really good and of high quality. By the way, it is completely unbalanced, evils get powerful in question of minutes, they're all better in general. Maybe it is because of hell... And I still can only see boxes painted as checkers of purple and black as doodads. Maybe that is the reason of the memory leak? Maybe you could simplify the doodads a bit, I don't know. The video resolution is on the maximum...

edit: Turles and Babidi got DC in the beggining, and it is worthier kill lots of weak units then some strong units, cause they all give the same stat (+1) That's a good reason for why evils are so good... and I mean it, please, fix the memory leaks somehow..

Not only did you repeat the same things over and over again, but you managed the difficult task of writing so much and saying very little. I do agree,however, that the game is unbalanced...because it's a freaking "PRE-BETA" as stated in the map name,for Pete's sake! - The "balance" issue shouldn't even interest you right now. For one thing, this map right now is all about : triggers (events), models, icons, spells etc.
What we all need to do right now is give feed-back on how the map "behaves", as you mentioned the leaks, or purple-checkered boxes. - I played the map several times : nothing like that ever happened when I played, no lag either (you must be playing on one of them "Stone-henge" type of monsters,aren't you?)
Well, with that out of the way, there are some thing I did notice and I would like you guys (robot-dude, valkemiere,etc) to check out :

- Broly's Gigantic Meteor : should not be able to target self / neutral / or even friendly units (heroes)! - Although I must say it was really enjoyable to see the World getting pawned by that green splendor (nice effects guys)

- Heaven vs. Hell conflict : Anyone that ever played this map and killed Goku and Vegita, surely noticed this : they keep fighting in the "after-life" and I keep getting spammed with "Vegita was killed by Goku" etc etc messaged throughout the game.

- Sayian Space Pod bugs : Out of curiosity I flew over a crashed Space Pod somewhere near the middle of the map and that resulted into immediately transporting my hero (Turtles) on Namek. Things didn't look so bad, I got to explore the surroundings then decided it was time to revisit Earth...or not...I was (not so) surprised I got stuck on Namek with no Space Pod giving me a break.

[...] I guess those were all the bugs / glitches I found in this version.

- Rating (considering it's a PRE-BETA) 4/5 (Can't wait for future versions)

Assassins-Creed · 12-03-2009, 12:40 AM

I found a few things I think you should know if you don't already know.

When your Gohan and you use burst rush,it lags ALOT and makes teal's hero Gohan disapear,Gohan also has a very very long Masenko.Goku's Spirit Bomb lags so much that if it lagged anymore you would automatically crash,but the idea of a bunch of orbs coming to Goku while charging the Spirit Bomb was pretty cool,first I've ever seen,you guys think outside the box.
Keep up the GREAT work :D.

Edit:Nevermind it was just a glitch if Gohan didn't kill or hit the unit it was going to hit or kill it would disapear then if Gohan hits or kills his target he reapears.

RED BARON · 12-03-2009, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

Erm... not so playable. Mainly it is because of the lag, and I understand why we cannot use vegeta, etc. Second, it is incredibly unbalanced. By the way, the only thing bad in my PC is my processor, which is 1.8 GHZ. Aside from that everything is really good and of high quality. By the way, it is completely unbalanced, evils get powerful in question of minutes, they're all better in general. Maybe it is because of hell... And I still can only see boxes painted as checkers of purple and black as doodads. Maybe that is the reason of the memory leak? Maybe you could simplify the doodads a bit, I don't know. The video resolution is on the maximum...

edit: Turles and Babidi got DC in the beginning, and it is worthier kill lots of weak units then some strong units, cause they all give the same stat (+1) That's a good reason for why evils are so good... and I mean it, please, fix the memory leaks somehow..

I really wonder how you achieved that lag - We played around with several test on old comps and played for hours... only at the end after hours and tons of spells cast did we get some lag... And how did you manage to have trouble with evil... They have so far been the weakest thanks to how you train in heaven, so if you experienced the opposite effect that would be neat, as it could mean that we're doing something right with the balance issues. If you meant saga's then they are still having some trouble with their scaling according to player power... as going ss mode and similar might course the saga to grow a lot stronger..

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kl3sk

Hidden

- Broly's Gigantic Meteor : should not be able to target self / neutral / or even friendly units (heroes)! - Although I must say it was really enjoyable to see the World getting pawned by that green splendor (nice effects guys)

- Heaven vs. Hell conflict : Anyone that ever played this map and killed Goku and Vegita, surely noticed this : they keep fighting in the "after-life" and I keep getting spammed with "Vegita was killed by Goku" etc etc messaged throughout the game.

- Sayian Space Pod bugs : Out of curiosity I flew over a crashed Space Pod somewhere near the middle of the map and that resulted into immediately transporting my hero (Turtles) on Namek. Things didn't look so bad, I got to explore the surroundings then decided it was time to revisit Earth...or not...I was (not so) surprised I got stuck on Namek with no Space Pod giving me a break.

[...] I guess those were all the bugs / glitches I found in this version.

- Rating (considering it's a PRE-BETA) 4/5 (Can't wait for future versions)

Thanks for the review

I been wondering about the Namek issue and to my knowledge you will just simply have to move to the spaceship on namek to get back.

And yet again it seems like we got the Vegeta fighting going on, but it was also mentioned that he still had issues, but what else to expect issues is part of Vegeta's life

Hmm about the meteor then it is slightly on purpose that you can target neutral (the important ones shouldn't be able to die of it) and yourself... (To add some realism). But its troublesome if it can lead to misuse against other allied players... We'll look at it.

Btw: You forgot my name

Hehe

Kl3sk · 12-03-2009, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RED BARON

I really wonder how you achieved that lag - We played around with several test on old comps and played for hours... only at the end after hours and tons of spells cast did we get some lag... And how did you manage to have trouble with evil... They have so far been the weakest thanks to how you train in heaven, so if you experienced the opposite effect that would be neat, as it could mean that we're doing something right with the balance issues. If you meant saga's then they are still having some trouble with their scaling according to player power... as going ss mode and similar might course the saga to grow a lot stronger..

Thanks for the review

I been wondering about the Namek issue and to my knowledge you will just simply have to move to the spaceship on namek to get back.

And yet again it seems like we got the Vegeta fighting going on, but it was also mentioned that he still had issues, but what else to expect issues is part of Vegeta's life

Hmm about the meteor then it is slightly on purpose that you can target neutral (the important ones shouldn't be able to die of it) and yourself... (To add some realism). But its troublesome if it can lead to misuse against other allied players... We'll look at it.

Btw: You forgot my name

Hehe

XD Oh come on dude, you know I didn't forget you were on the project, it was just a little slip-up. P.S. - is WatcherKave on this as well? Can't remember. Well done with the multiplayer campaign so far, you guys are formidable modelers / map-makers, etc. ^^

SasuhKun · 12-03-2009, 11:53 AM

Kl3sk, sorry, I was just trying to help. I know it is pre-beta, and I'm pointing EVERYTHING that must be fixed, so they already know, even if it is too earlier for it. For example, again, hunting lots of small monsters is better than hunting few good creeps, since they give the same stat. And if I weren't trying to help I wouldn't either say something, or would call this project a shit or something, and it is not. So you should be more respectful with people around you.
Red Baron/robot-dude, this time I couldn't say anything about sagas since Broly did them all. And it just keeps lagging, I don't know how... maybe it is because of the doodads problem. Again, most doodads I see are purple-black checkered boxes. Maybe they are lagging. Could you try fixing it? And in heaven, yamcha and krillin are the guy, same attack and def, etc. All that changes is their size... or it is meant to be that? And it is a bit hard to hit kamehameha.. I don't know why. If I hit it a little bit to the side, it misses. Maybe you could increase the AoE a bit? And yes, Gohan said to me that his masenko wans't working... I still don't like the minimap being a radar... x-x And the terrain is repetitive, you should increase the variety. And the variety of monsters too. And Spirit Bomb is mortal to any creep, but it is easy to dodge. Very, very, easy. As well as similars spells (I think Broly have something like that too, but with faster channeling) So, suggestions: decrease the channeling to 5 seconds/increase AoE/Make the enemies in the area you chose be purged or something like that. Or all of it together. I reached lvl 60 with Goku, but still was weak and I left the game cause of massive lag. I will be able to give you more feedback if you can fix the lag problem (which is propably the doodads problem) Keep up the good work! You guys are doing a great job.

robot-dude · 12-03-2009, 12:15 PM

Well if you wish to leave namek you must go on the left hand side of the pod on namek,

I've been fixing a few bugs and thank you for the feedback i'll start fixing these bugs you've listed for the next release and for those who disapper due to a spell bug just type
either
-debug
or
debug

and it will fix the issue,

Yours Rd,

RED BARON · 12-03-2009, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kl3sk

XD Oh come on dude, you know I didn't forget you were on the project, it was just a little slip-up. P.S. - is WatcherKave on this as well? Can't remember. Well done with the multi player campaign so far, you guys are formidable modelers / map-makers, etc. ^^

Hehe yea I know - Just wanted to make sure

and ah we ain't that great... We just work a lot (when we work and aren't busy as hell with a lot of other stuff).

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

Kl3sk, sorry, I was just trying to help. I know it is pre-beta, and I'm pointing EVERYTHING that must be fixed, so they already know, even if it is too earlier for it. For example, again, hunting lots of small monsters is better than hunting few good creeps, since they give the same stat.

Thats correct and we are gratefull for the comments - The point with the creeps are correct. Although it should be considered that killing the larger creeps earns more xp. But yes at end game killing lots of weak units is best (by then all creeps will be weak though...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

And if I weren't trying to help I wouldn't either say something, or would call this project a shit or something, and it is not. So you should be more respectful with people around you.

Correct, although he weren't being that rude, he actually was correct that you did repeat the same thing and said very little, but even that helps. And we can only be happy that people are playing it

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

And it just keeps lagging, I don't know how... maybe it is because of the doodads problem. Again, most doodads I see are purple-black checkered boxes. Maybe they are lagging. Could you try fixing it?

Your computer settings or wc3 must be completely screwed up.. sorry to say, but all doodads shows up correctly and the lag is minimal.. and first shows after at least 1 hour of playing. There is no cubes... if there are it would mean either a texture fail (which it can't be as it shows correctly for others) or a fail in your graphic.. which would indicate that there might be a reason for the lag..

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

And in heaven, yamcha and krillin are the guy, same attack and def, etc. All that changes is their size... or it is meant to be that?

Nope, thats not done on purpose, thanks for the notice

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

And it is a bit hard to hit kamehameha.. I don't know why. If I hit it a little bit to the side, it misses. Maybe you could increase the AoE a bit?

Actually I consider kamahama one of the easiest to hit with spells... you just have to consider what the spell is... as it follows the real DBZ correctly, meaning that you can miss if you attack doesn't hit the target... rather obvious. And if you want to make a sure hit, just make it target the ground a few inches away from the intended target...

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

And yes, Gohan said to me that his masenko wasn't working...

Good thing to know - Thanks

Although I haven't had time to check if its correct and if not why.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

I still don't like the minimap being a radar... x-x

Thats a personal opinion... it being a radar serves a purpose in relating a minimap to the dz universe... But yes... some units will appear outside the radar area which can't be avoided unless we made it a circular map.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

And the terrain is repetitive, you should increase the variety.

We're trying, but we do have limited imports and increased amount of doodads/props increase the need for higher specs on the computers and could result in more lag... And the terrain ain't really that bland.. It have several distinctive zones and different doodads and destructible's for each zone. But yes... we are not using that many textures and doodads for above mentioned reason.. We are still working on making it even better of course and you will likely could enjoy better terrain in the campaign.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

And the variety of monsters too.

Again this is something that would increase the lag and performance required.. and as you already have lag issues that won't really be a good idea... But yes we too would like to have distinctively different creeps for all zones.. But that would require more models to keep the dbz feeling (equal even less space, increased download time). And it could result in more lag when the monsters are replaced due to saga's. Still yes, thats something we will consider.. and you will see that in the campaign as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

And Spirit Bomb is mortal to any creep, but it is easy to dodge. Very, very, easy. As well as similar spells (I think Broly have something like that too, but with faster channeling) So, suggestions: decrease the channeling to 5 seconds/increase AoE/Make the enemies in the area you chose be purged or something like that.

The whole purpose of those big spells are the point that they are easy to dodge - Goku always have trouble hitting the bad guy with it, and it takes time to create... So why be annoyed that we follow the DBZ world? Yes it makes it harder for the player and requires him to use some strategy... But hopefully that would only increase the entertainment

Same goes for the other ultimates..

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

Or all of it together. I reached lvl 60 with Goku, but still was weak and I left the game cause of massive lag.

Besides the lag (which I consider an issue by your computer) Goku is by far the strongest of all the heroes in the game - If played correctly, and we can of course balance everything so no matter how you play you'll be able to own the others and they you.. but then whats the point about xp and skills... it would be just as fine to have 1 hp units fight each other.
So when played with skill every char can own... but there is due to the beta state still balance issues, one being that Goku owns.. which we of course will need to change.. As it should be a given thing that two heroes of almost equal lvl and stats then they should be able to have an equal fight with one another. So yes the balance will be checked upon, but not with the issue of Goku being weak.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SasuhKun

I will be able to give you more feedback if you can fix the lag problem (which is probably the doodads problem) Keep up the good work! You guys are doing a great job.

Thanks - Even though it doesn't lag

And thanks for the comments - Its always helpful when people comment on a map you spent ages making and therefore might not notice problems.

robot-dude · 12-03-2009, 03:21 PM

Well i tested our map on my brothers laptop *Lag Machine* he's barely able to play DBZ Tribute and he lags out on our map so those who are barely able to play DBZ Tribute sadly wont be able to play our map, and those who are having the "Purple Cubes" disapparing instead of the doodads to fix this close and re-open your wc3 before hosting or playing our map. Its because of the map protecter i've used i could easily change the settings for the next release which might fix this error sorry for the issues in playing the game, and hopefully it all should be balanced because i've gone through all the transformations, and creeps stat and xp gain and its all perfect and equal and even.

SasuhKun · 12-04-2009, 12:12 PM

I see, thanks for your... determination to help me understand some things and attention you gave to my posts. I will try that robot-dude (that map gotta be the 1st map you gotta play in wc3?) And my pc works just fine on DBZ Elite Tribute, it does not lag at all Oo''. Well, it is kinda of a mystery then. After all, my pc is good enough to play Counter Strike Source with no lag at all (with max resolution), so... maybe it is what you said Robot-dude. I'm gonna try it as you said (1st game to be played on wc3) to see what happens. If everything works fine, I'll try to host it on bnet, and then comment about my new try. If not, I'll come here and say again it is not working, just so you could know. Keep up the good work!

edit: By the way, how do you go to Namek again? You guys should point in the map all the important locations like: Fountains, places-to-get-a-improve (Guru which is on NAMEK, androids for cell to absorb, etc) the Lookout, etc. I'm gonna test all chars on single player mode, which I'm playing right now. As far as I am aware, on SINGLE PLAYER it is not lagging and I can't see any purple checkered boxes. (I exited wc3 since i was testing another map and entered again) Though it is a bit of irritating to keep going in and out of bnet/wc3 just to play the map (which is really good for pre-beta). +REP :D and 5/5 (For the current version, the game is just awesome)

edit 2: by the way, Red Baron, I gave you +rep in the wrong post.. ^^ but it's still rep, so..

Edit 3:

Overall: Finally, no purple checkered boxes. Not lagging anymore, only on ults. The game is pretty cool, but have nothing spicy on it (I mean, aside from the ultra models, ultra spells, ultra ideas and all). Sometimes the sagas are "doubled" if you ult them. You gain double gold, it says 2 times you defeated that saga, etc. And once it was triple lol. And most things were "based" on dbz tribute elite. Monster for example xD etc the turtles and the sabertooth. The only ults that have cinematic are ft's and broly's. Meh. Most icons are imported from DBZ Budokai Tenkaichi 3.. which I have for wii :O

Goku: You're right, he's the most strong character. As far as I know, he's the only one that can reach power level 3.5 (Or at least it looks like it is). But Solar Flare sucks. Hard. I mean, it stuns the enemy the time that goku have to stop channeling and attack. And it does not dmg. So please change the config of the spell, change THE spell, etc. After all, there are skills from other chars that dmg AND stun. So... Ss3 spirit bomb= pwns xD Since it is ONLY dbz, there ins't ss4 or gt characters... hmm. He is the only character on which I was patient enough to get to lvl 150.

Gohan: Hmm. Namek is completely small. There should be more namekians! :D I believe that nail lied on the ground, with his hand at his heart (extremely poetic) is for piccolo. It is just a guess. Burst rush: VIEEEWWZZZOOOM boom. There should be something more adequate for a goddamn ult. I couldn't see ss2 cause I was really curious. And used Burst rush near (very near) Wheelo (XD). I can also see there are no cinematics for anything, you just get that thing and that's it.

Future Trunks: He has nothing of special at all compared to the others. Aside that he haves a ult with cinematic! :D (Which lags absurdely). There is needed more variation between characters... Nice spells though. Finish buster description was kamehameha description.

Turles: Meh, after Goku gets SS, every saiyan gets ss too... there should be ss for Turles. Which is pretty imbalanced (x5 with power ball and 2x the other stats, with no mana draining... people gotta die for it.) I didn't reach 60 to see what happens cause after using power ball turles was all buggy, and then he just got stuck behind a citizen.

Broly: I feel guilty using him. Not only he wins 2x in lvl 20, but Gigantic Meteor is just too evil to use... (NO, NOT THE EARTH ÇÇ) Best spell ever though. I stop using him with.... bah, I don't know, I just stopped.

Garlic Jr: Makyan blood gives you... the same thing Saiyan blood does. Meh. I had an excellent idea I'm gonna suggest later... I didn't reach lvl 60 cause I exited windows while I was laughing about stormreaver hermit walking (in the air!) Keep walking.. (in the air!) keeeeep walking.. (in the air!) xD

Conclusion: Still a long way to go, but before, it is already a great game. Add more variation somehow, aside from the spells. For example: Saiyan blood:ASIDE from the critical on all the "bloods", It says on the goddamn description... everytime you get red health or something, you get +100 stats (you could decrease some time after, but since 100 stats is shit later game, you should not. Like, second time is 50, third time is 100 again, something like that.) Namekian blood gives ability to heal somehow (Pic have a bit higher regen AND he have a healing ability) Makyan blood: You are IMORTAAAAL (Reincarnation) Idea for getting out of hell: Instead of tickets, you pay Garlic's (yes, GARLIC himself. Or Janemba, or something like that) to open a portal to the living world, which lasts 15 seconds. Since many evils can be rezzed at the same time, the cooldown is longer than the tickets. And it is costy. (Instead of 100, it is 300 or something) Krillin blood.. human, normal blood. We humans are lame :P I dunno... evasion or something? He gets his power level earlier? I have no idea for our lame, red blood. Cell genetic structure allows him to absorb people in towns for example (make cities bigger and with more people for the absorb guys) When goku goes to namek he should win 120 stats (Gravity Chamber) at lvl 20, and Vegeta should win 150 stats with Gravity Chamber (at lvl 30) by going at bulma or something. Mystic gives power level AND some additional stats, because of the training. Ah yes, the other guys. Turles.. is ok, I guess. Except... hmm... let me see... erm... give him 1.5 power at 20, power ball at 25, and (he deserves it) super saiyan at 40? then at lvl 80 he tree starting growing, and in 100 he finally eats the fruit. But why would he win power? He is fiercer than the other saiyans or something? hmm... Babidi have Dabura and all... buu absorbs... cell regen and absorb... Frieza (if he's gonna be the sixth player) since he's so evil, he gets extra stats for killing things? And all guys should have sense. And when are you adding tournament/ dballs? They're so kewl *-*. And I have a way better idea for Tourny: you are FORCED to enter the tournament. So we have 12 players fighting... ins't that cool? Also, add more 4 cpus to make it even (Uub, Roshi, Kami, Android 18, maybe Gotenks?) Hmm... Krillin or gotenks? >-< Also, add aside from the power level, the multiplier of stats between the power levels. So it is easier to compare and locate the power, balance things, etc. Also, write the formula of the dmg of the spells. And Garlic Jr ult almost never hit... And that's what I can remember. For now.